Your thoughts about "standard" vs. "premium"

[JDMKING13]

Just so I'm clear here (since the pro-Standard side of this discussion is notoriously black-and-white on every issue), I've never said I've written the entire game, as a whole, off. It's the two tiers I take issue with, and the varying levels of quality they entail. Though how important that is in the grand scheme of things varies between all of us. It's basically the only huge qualm I have, out of what we currently know about the game.

Slip I was not talking to you buddy Even though you do not like the standard car issue, i have not once read you putting this game as a disappointed. You don't like the standard car issues and you are 100% entitled to your opinion. Knowing that i know i still will see some great pictures of standard cars in your gallery for GT5. 👍

 

[Captain Roh]

Why do people overreact like this?

Besides, the point of Gran Turismo is that these are your cars to do with as you see fit. This is the first and most important point.

Second is sneering at everyone who puts a nose splitter and tail wing on their car to race, and maybe even a racing number and some decals. You know, this is actually what people do to cars to make them more competitive.

I disagree. The racing modification in GT1 and GT2 has always been a great feature, and personally my favorite. It was disappointing not to see it in GT3 and GT4. Part of the reason why I loved the first two games is because it allowed you to take a car and make it look like a competitive racing machine. Because personally, having a stock looking 700 HP Viper GTS never seemed right to me. I don't see how racing modification is "ricey" considering it's all done for you by the game instead of allowing you to do those things you mentioned to the car like in Forza or NFS. Let's say the Ferrari F40 is a premium car. What's the problem with the game automatically taking a regular F40 and turning it into something like this?

I think that having the options to put wheels on your cars and spoilers and stickers, just means that everyones happy, who cares if you see a ricer online? Atleast ill be able to show them up in my eurostyle golf with 3 piece bbs wheels, and for people that like the factory look of cars, you can be the breezers? These options will simply make the game more realistic and fun.

I think I came across wrong. Basically I was wondering out loud, wether the car manufacturers who have cars in GT, would have a say in how their cars are customised. Especially the premiums, as they're up until now the best car models on a computer game you can get. Lets not forget that in previous installments they wouldnt allow damage. I doubt in all their premium splendor they would want 'ricey' modifications either. I dont mind, but do you think ferrari would enjoy seeing a representation of a 458 on 24" pink wheels!?

I do agree though, that turning a production car into a race preped monster would be excellent. And if it were handled by PD as it were in GT1&2... even better in my opinion.

 

[II IVORBIGUN II]

What's remotely surprising about people who will stand behind anything PD-related, unquestioning, saying the pictures are amazing?

Im going to respond to you because your quote above is referring to my post I made after TD posted those excellent pics.

Let me get something straight and for the last time I hope this sinks in because its getting on my t*ts having to repeat myself.

It isn't a case that I stand behind anything PD-related. Im just happy with the whole package that GT5 offers as im not obsessed with this standard/premium debate. Some of you carry on as though the only important feature of GT5 is how pretty the cars look and unfortunately 200 isn't enough for you. Guess what there are many other important features in GT5 and because im delighted with these it outweighs any disappointment I may have with regards to the standard/premium cars. I read some silly comment saying "what have PD being doing these past 5yrs". Well again the above answers the question because PD have more than just the cars to model when developing GT5.

I've been playing racing games since Pole position in the arcades in the 1980s. Over recent years i've wanted a racing game that consists of 16 online, weather, damage, day/night, track editor, excellent physics, and finally it looks as though GT5 is going to be the first console racing game that has all of these. So forgive me for being excited and delighted with what PD are providing.


Im noticing a pattern on this thread. When the likes of myself and others give replies like the above they are ignored. They are ignored because some of you don't like our answers. Someone called Strittan wanted an answer and as soon as I provided this it was quickly ignored!

 

[twisteddeeds]

^^^ +1 👍

 

[JDMKING13]

Im going to respond to you because your quote above is referring to my post I made after TD posted those excellent pics.

Let me get something straight and for the last time I hope this sinks in because its getting on my t*ts having to repeat myself.

It isn't a case that I stand behind anything PD-related. Im just happy with the whole package that GT5 offers as im not obsessed with this standard/premium debate. Some of you carry on as though the only important feature of GT5 is how pretty the cars look and unfortunately 200 isn't enough for you. Guess what there are many other important features in GT5 and because im delighted with these it outweighs any disappointment I may have with regards to the standard/premium cars. I read some silly comment saying "what have PD being doing these past 5yrs". Well again the above answers the question because PD have more than just the cars to model when developing GT5.

I've been playing racing games since Pole position in the arcades in the 1980s. Over recent years i've wanted a racing game that consists of 16 online, weather, damage, day/night, track editor, excellent physics, and finally it looks as though GT5 is going to be the first console racing game that has all of these. So forgive me for being excited and delighted with what PD are providing.


Im noticing a pattern on this thread. When the likes of myself and others give replies like the above they are ignored. They are ignored because some of you don't like our answers. Someone called Strittan wanted an answer and as soon as I provided this it was quickly ignored!

👍= bold. This is how I feel man the standard car issue was a blow to me but, I still will enjoy the hell out of them because GT5 features are going to be real good making my experience with the standard cars an enjoyable one!

 

[Luminis]

Have you played the game? Is that the final product?

It does not bother me that he feels this way about the standard cars, but it does bother me that he and other have passed standard cars as unacceptable, and none of them have played the game yet.

So, he's not entiteld to form a negative opinion without playing the game, but you are entitled to form a positive opinion without playing the game?

Yeah right

Im noticing a pattern on this thread. When the likes of myself and others give replies like the above they are ignored. They are ignored because some of you don't like our answers. Someone called Strittan wanted an answer and as soon as I provided this it was quickly ignored!

This goes both ways. As soon as someone mentions that it's not only the graphics that makes him dislike the standard cars, but the features they're lacking (or rather, a combination of having second rate graphics and features when compared to the premiums), it's instantly ignored as well.

 

[II IVORBIGUN II]

👍= bold. This is how I feel man the standard car issue was a blow to me but, I still will enjoy the hell out of them because GT5 features are going to be real good making my experience with the standard cars an enjoyable one!

Like i've just said in the other thread I feel some haven't moved with the times and don't grasp how important these other features are.

I don't mean to be rude but im curious of the percentage of those who complain about this standard/premium issue didn't play Forza 1 or 2 and didn't own a Xbox or 360.

If this was 10yrs ago I would probably be moaning aswell. However Forza 1 & 2 introduced me to the wonderful world of online racing/features. Now if I hadn't played these games I would still be ignorant to the possiblities of online racing. Some will say "well I played GT5P online" but this doesn't even come close to what Forza 2 offered.

I bet in 6 months time many people who are complaining will be having such a blast into this new gaming world that they will forget about these 200 premiums!

 

[gtracedriver]

actually there's only one version, that's the unfinished one.

The game has more content than any other video games ever made. It will arguably the best looking game too. I think they have got the best of both worlds really. Disparity between standard and premium is the only thing that might hurt them little bit.

 

[analog]

Im noticing a pattern on this thread. When the likes of myself and others give replies like the above they are ignored. They are ignored because some of you don't like our answers.

They're probably being ignored or considered irrelevant in this discussion not for denying or acknowledging many people feel the same way you do but simply for the fact all your wishes have already been granted as the game you want is probably what you're gonna get.
I'm really happy for you and all those who feel like that ( and I really wish I could look out for the game with a simular amount of enthusiasm without any hesitation, as I do still look out for it, no mistake ) but why try to persuade or complain about those who think differently about it?

If you're getting tired of this discussion, you don't have to participate in it as there are plenty of other threads covering different topics to discuss.
This is the first issue in any GT-game I express concern about as all previous games have been nothing but pure enjoyment for me.
Sure there were some small niggles but nothing that really bothered me to an extend of expressing concern or possible criticism like this whole issue does.
We all still have to play the game and make up our own final judgement regarding each aspect but the current available info doesn't make me go Halleluja just yet.

If I knew I was going to get the game I wanted I would probably feel smug and content but I wouldn't rub in into the noses of, or try to persuade those ( who for whatever reason are concerned it may not be what they were wishing for ) otherwise.
Great that this whole issue doesn't bother you, and sure a large amount of people aren't bothered by it, but how is that relevant to how people like me should debate or look at this whole issue?
Are we spoiling the fun for those who already get what they wanted?
Is it really that simple we're just killjoys, partypoopers or buzzkillers?

 

[Dravonic]

Are we spoiling the fun for those who already get what they wanted?
Is it really that simple we're just killjoys, partypoopers or buzzkillers?

I think this is precisely the problem for some around here. Apparently they like the game and/or PD so much they can't stand anyone criticizing it.

 

[yellowclone]

So, he's not entiteld to form a negative opinion without playing the game, but you are entitled to form a positive opinion without playing the game?

Yeah right

I have never formed a positive opinion of the game. I said that I will enjoy it when it comes Nov 2. I will enjoy it even if the standards are not above GT4 quality, because I still get to drive my favorites from GT4 with the new features. I kinda of think of this game as GT4 "completed", and GT5 together in one game. So this is not taking out of context, I mean that the standards are what GT4 should have been, and we also get the glory of premiums. Maybe if they changed the name to GT4.5, people would all be happier (doubt it).

 

[maxpontiac]

Why do people overreact like this?

Besides, the point of Gran Turismo is that these are your cars to do with as you see fit. This is the first and most important point.

I'm still hopeful that there will be race modding of Standard cars, but we'll see in a couple of months, by TGS at the latest.

I am not overreacting one bit. All I did was post a simple question.

It's been a few games since the Race conversion was in GT. I was just asking a hypothetical question.

 

[C_Raccoon23]

I am not overreacting one bit. All I did was post a simple question.

I think he was just talking about Captain Roh's post, not yours.

 

[maxpontiac]

I think he was just talking about Captain Roh's post, not yours.

Hard to tell being how I was quoted.

 

[Griffith500]

The concept of being able to race Standard cars alongside Premiums is completely incomprehensible to my mind. Gran Turismo Classic mode was mentioned in an announcement about (the now defunct) GT HD years back. Do you genuinely believe Polyphony would decide to throw in what Yamauchi-san himself described as being "Gran Turismo 4 models" amongst the freshly modeled car selection, and announce it to the world on the official Gran Turismo website?

Now with less hyperbole / drama-queen-style emotionally-charged language / troll-stench.

I repeat: the truth is, danielwhite74, you know nothing more than we do. At least until the game arrives, or somebody of authority (clue: not you) tells us more.

...
Are we spoiling the fun for those who already get what they wanted?
Is it really that simple we're just killjoys, partypoopers or buzzkillers?

I don't think of it that way at all; the people saying that the game shouldn't have the extra cars (the 800 standards) are (potentially) being selfish killjoys, though.
And we know that PD "shoulda coulda woulda", but the fact is, we have 200+ bespoke "PS3-spec" cars to play with - that's it. I personally would rather have the extra (standard) cars in the game. Full-stop. If they don't support all the new features, so what? We might not have been able to enjoy them (again) in the first place; what have we lost out on, exactly? (See "shoulda coulda woulda", above).

 

[McLaren]

The game has more content than any other video games ever made. It will arguably the best looking game too. I think they have got the best of both worlds really. Disparity between standard and premium is the only thing that might hurt them little bit.

I highly doubt it truly has more content than any other game made just because it has 1,000 cars seeing as there will be 1 Skyline & then 5-6 other ones of that generation where the only way to tell the difference between each one is to look it up (some of these are mostly interior details we can't see to begin with).

IMO, the games that truly have the most content are the ones where the engines are left open to the public to expand, i.e. LittleBigPlanet & nearly any Source-based game.

 

[gtracedriver]

^^^

Well obviously LBP has more because of community. We do not know exactly how many different cars GT5 will have and I do not have too much problem with different variants. But still retail version will have more content than any other game

 

[Akira AC]

I highly doubt it truly has more content than any other game made just because it has 1,000 cars seeing as there will be 1 Skyline & then 5-6 other ones of that generation where the only way to tell the difference between each one is to look it up (some of these are mostly interior details we can't see to begin with).

IMO, the games that truly have the most content are the ones where the engines are left open to the public to expand, i.e. LittleBigPlanet & nearly any Source-based game.

Disagree because the number of usable 3D models is(counting the 100+ different versions of the same car)almost 850-900,which is quite a lot,no game has come close,maybe just cause but that only has like 90 playable vehicles,which are compensated with the environment,in the case LittleBigPlanet the number of 3D elements are predefined,but the replay value that GT5 will have is quite impressive,it may not be the most content on a game(maybe an MMO will be)but is the most content that we can get on a racing game and maybe consoles.

I got your point but a base model that is mod is not a new element,just a variation of the original which is different from a complete model.

 

[analog]

I don't think of it that way at all; the people saying that the game shouldn't have the extra cars (the 800 standards) are (potentially) being selfish killjoys, though.
And we know that PD "shoulda coulda woulda", but the fact is, we have 200+ bespoke "PS3-spec" cars to play with - that's it. I personally would rather have the extra (standard) cars in the game. Full-stop. If they don't support all the new features, so what? We might not have been able to enjoy them (again) in the first place; what have we lost out on, exactly? (See "shoulda coulda woulda", above).

I never claimed the 800 Standard cars included should be removed ( that would be pointless whatever you think of them ), I did say I'd rather have a more coherent and consistent game with equally detailed cars even when that means the total number is reduced.
I can see that would be impossible to do with double the amount of Premium cars as they apparantly take up too much time and resources.
Was just expecting ( crazy I know ) PS3 models in a PS3 game, not PS4 models and upscaled PS2 models ( yes I know this probably isn't fully accurate either but you get the drift ).

What have we lost out on? Cockpit view being only available on Premium and not on the Standard cars mostly in my opinion.
I know you don't use it anyway but one feature ( which I got used to using all the time stupid me ) being available on 200 cars and not on the majority of cars I also really like which is a fact not going away whether I'm getting used to it now or not ( once I fire up the game I will be constantly reminded by it ).
We still have 200 cars which will have cockpit view ( great ) but every time I get into a Standard car I will have to readjust again.
And even if I somehow demanded those 800 cars being removed, how would that be regarded as selfish in the context of knowing it won't happen anyway, self-delusional would be more appropriate.

 

[Luminis]

I have never formed a positive opinion of the game. I said that I will enjoy it when it comes Nov 2. I will enjoy it even if the standards are not above GT4 quality, because I still get to drive my favorites from GT4 with the new features. I kinda of think of this game as GT4 "completed", and GT5 together in one game. So this is not taking out of context, I mean that the standards are what GT4 should have been, and we also get the glory of premiums. Maybe if they changed the name to GT4.5, people would all be happier (doubt it).

Well...

I for one, welcome standard cars. [...] Having said that, I think the standard cars will look great with the new lighting along with other things they have given them to bring them up to above GT4 cars. The new physics are also welcome to drive our old cars with, along with some new tracks. I love some of the GT4 cars, and if standard is the only way to get them in GT5, I welcome them.

This is the best analogy I can come up with to explain why I will enjoy the standard cars in GT5. Maybe not as much as the premiums, but I will still race with them.

I also think standard car will look fine next to premiums racing.

I would call that forming a positive opinion about the standard cars. If you want to call it 'forming an opnion', but then again, it's pretty much the same as what those who dislike the standards are saying in terms of what they will or won't do, and the like.

IMO, the games that truly have the most content are the ones where the engines are left open to the public to expand, i.e. LittleBigPlanet & nearly any Source-based game.

Well, to be fair, a game that the community can create content for will always have more content than a game that doesn't have such a feature. But you're right, of course.

 

[Griffith500]

I never claimed the 800 Standard cars included should be removed ( that would be pointless whatever you think of them ), I did say I'd rather have a more coherent and consistent game with equally detailed cars even when that means the total number is reduced.
I can see that would be impossible to do with double the amount of Premium cars as they apparantly take up too much time and resources.
Was just expecting ( crazy I know ) PS3 models in a PS3 game, not PS4 models and upscaled PS2 models ( yes I know this probably isn't fully accurate either but you get the drift ).

I never said you did But, as I did say, things are as they are and it's time to start accepting that and getting into the mindset that GT5 isn't going to be some all-conquering holy-grail of gaming nirvana - it actually will have flaws. (Again, not aimed at you specifically.)

What have we lost out on? Cockpit view being only available on Premium and not on the Standard cars mostly in my opinion.
I know you don't use it anyway but one feature ( which I got used to using all the time stupid me ) being available on 200 cars and not on the majority of cars I also really like which is a fact not going away whether I'm getting used to it now or not ( once I fire up the game I will be constantly reminded by it ).
We still have 200 cars which will have cockpit view ( great ) but every time I get into a Standard car I will have to readjust again.
And even if I somehow demanded those 800 cars being removed, how would that be regarded as selfish in the context of knowing it won't happen anyway, self-delusional would be more appropriate.

Well, without the standard cars there would be no standard cars to not have cockpit view with.
I would use cockpit view if it "worked" for me - I do (exclusively) in other games.

I understand about having to re-adjust to the view for each car - it is a valid point. However, if you're that serious about the driving, then do you not think that you'd have to re-adjust to each car in general, too, in order to get the most out of it? Unless, of course, you're the type to set all your cars up in such a way that they drive identically... (now, there's a challenge!)

GT5 demonstrates this nicely. Each cockpit view is different; each car drives differently (granted some are easier to transition between than others) and nobody has any problems, well, not outside those they would naturally attribute to an "adjustment phase".

 

[eSZee]

Have you played the game? Is that the final product?

It does not bother me that he feels this way about the standard cars, but it does bother me that he and other have passed standard cars as unacceptable, and none of them have played the game yet.

Ok, and?
Yes, the cars in the "standard vid" are the final product.
Again, why does it bother you how people feel about a game? Does it affect you somehow that joe schmo won't enjoy some aspect of a video game?

 

[analog]

I understand about having to re-adjust to the view for each car - it is a valid point. However, if you're that serious about the driving, then do you not think that you'd have to re-adjust to each car in general, too, in order to get the most out of it? Unless, of course, you're the type to set all your cars up in such a way that they drive identically... (now, there's a challenge!)

GT5 demonstrates this nicely. Each cockpit view is different; each car drives differently (granted some are easier to transition between than others) and nobody has any problems, well, not outside those they would naturally attribute to an "adjustment phase".

Sorry but re-adjusting to each car ( which indeed is one of the things I enjoy about the variety, if they all drove the same way why even bother switching apart from having a new picture on the screen perhaps ) has nothing to do with re-adjusting to a viewpoint.
It's a totally seperate way of re-adjusting and you should know that, one has to do with the character and handling aspects of the car itself, the other is a game option which does affect the way you experience the character and handling aspects ( at least to me it does, sure the physics are the same but the rest of the visual info provided isn't ).

And no I don't set-up all my cars to handle the same , although I do sometimes against better knowledge in some cases try to make 4WD and FF cars handle more like RWD cars with often questionable results.

 

[yellowclone]

Well...

I would call that forming a positive opinion about the standard cars. If you want to call it 'forming an opnion', but then again, it's pretty much the same as what those who dislike the standards are saying in terms of what they will or won't do, and the like.

I simply stated that I think they will look good in the new lighting and graphics engine. I didn't say they look terrific or anything to that effect, afterall, I haven't seen them on my TV yet. Some people are saying they look horrible, they don't say they think they will look horrible. All I am trying to say is that we should not make a final judgement on what we think of a certain model until we see it for ourselves on our TV.

I also stated what I will enjoy what has been confirmed with the game.

Ok, and?
Yes, the cars in the "standard vid" are the final product.
Again, why does it bother you how people feel about a game? Does it affect you somehow that joe schmo won't enjoy some aspect of a video game?

How do you know that it is the final product? Do you work for PD? Have you played it on your TV? If so, please post a video of game play on your TV of standard cars, and I will eat my words.

It does not bother me or offend me about the game, I just think it is unfair to pass judgement on something you have not experienced. Why does it bother you about what I say? Does it affect you that I will enjoy GT5? I might not like everything about it, and I do not praise everything PD does, but does that matter? NO

 

[Griffith500]

Sorry but re-adjusting to each car ( which indeed is one of the things I enjoy about the variety, if they all drove the same way why even bother switching apart from having a new picture on the screen perhaps ) has nothing to do with re-adjusting to a viewpoint.
It's a totally seperate way of re-adjusting and you should know that, one has to do with the character and handling aspects of the car itself, the other is a game option which does affect the way you experience the character and handling aspects ( at least to me it does, sure the physics are the same but the rest of the visual info provided isn't ).

And no I don't set-up all my cars to handle the same , although I do sometimes against better knowledge in some cases try to make 4WD and FF cars handle more like RWD cars with often questionable results.

I'm guilty of the same...

Regarding adjusting: I was also referring to the fact that each car has a different viewpoint, owing to their shape and "driver" placement. I honestly have just as much of a task adjusting to the car's dynamics as I do to a new view; in many cases, I do only consider the combined effect. It always annoyed me when certain cars in certain games had the wheel on the "wrong" side, since I'd have a harder time adjusting to the car because of the change in perspective - maybe this is also why I don't get on with GT5's cockpit view in general. After all, the viewpoint is what we use to interpret the dynamics and handling of a car in the game (oh, coupled with vibration / "Force Feedback", of course.)

It's all inconsequential, really; after a couple of laps I'm back to chasing (fractions of) tenths instead of whole seconds... that's what a warm-up session is for


Incidentally, I've just remembered my thoughts on cockpit view I had prior to GT4 appearing on our shelves. I remember thinking that PD would have too much work on their hands to give us proper, consistent interiors for the full complement of GT4's car roster.
When it was announced for GT5 (and GT5) I was a little bit disbelieving, and somewhat skeptical of their announced plan. Once I'd seen proof, I was worried for the car count: 800 was being banded about back then, and I was still skeptical.
Turns out my skepticism was justified.

 

[Tornado]

Gran Turismo Classic mode was confirmed years back.

Nearly half a decade ago. For a different game. Whose entire point of existence was to be GT4HD. That was promptly canceled.

And we have absolutely no idea what features from that game, if any, will actually end up in the final version of Gran Turismo 5. Since you are so centered on the "fact" that we "know" that the cars list would be split, I'll point you towards Gran Turismo 2000, which was essentially GT2HD before it was canceled and reworked from the ground up into GT3. That game was stated by Kaz himself to be loaded with features that GT3 never saw one iota of.

 

[analog]

I'm guilty of the same...

Regarding adjusting: I was also referring to the fact that each car has a different viewpoint, owing to their shape and "driver" placement. I honestly have just as much of a task adjusting to the car's dynamics as I do to a new view; in many cases, I do only consider the combined effect. It always annoyed me when certain cars in certain games had the wheel on the "wrong" side, since I'd have a harder time adjusting to the car because of the change in perspective - maybe this is also why I don't get on with GT5's cockpit view in general. After all, the viewpoint is what we use to interpret the dynamics and handling of a car in the game (oh, coupled with vibration / "Force Feedback", of course.)

I was actually surprised by how easily I adjusted to the steering wheel being at the "other" side in cockpit view, I specifically refer to "other" and not "right" or "wrong" as in some circumstances ( read a certain corner on a given track ) it actually makes a huge difference on which side the steering wheel is placed when in cockpit view ( with the A-pillar blocking some view or not ) which can be both an advantage as a disadvantage ( although in an ideal world you should have the option to choose either RHD or LHD in a game ).

About adjusting your viewpoint as in the shape/contours/design of the interior, that's the whole reason I want those interiors so much, if they all looked the same why even bother.

 

[Griffith500]

I was actually surprised by how easily I adjusted to the steering wheel being at the "other" side in cockpit view, I specifically refer to "other" and not "right" or "wrong" as in some circumstances ( read a certain corner on a given track ) it actually makes a huge difference on which side the steering wheel is placed when in cockpit view ( with the A-pillar blocking some view or not ) which can be both an advantage as a disadvantage ( although in an ideal world you should have the option to choose either RHD or LHD in a game ).

About adjusting your viewpoint as in the shape/contours/design of the interior, that's the whole reason I want those interiors so much, if they all looked the same why even bother.

That's why I'd be in favour of a "black-frame" (PSP-style) "cockpit" instead of a generic, fully featured one, for the standard cars.
(yes, ideally we'd have bespoke, fully featured interiors for every car, but that's not happening at launch)

 

[Earth]

GT took around 36 months to develop
GT2 was released 24 months after GT
GT3 was released 16 months after GT2
GT4 was released 41 months after GT3
GT5 will be released 74 months after GT4

I like this game! My turn again:
What did GT2 bring over GT? What did GT3 bring over GT2? What did GT4 bring over GT3?

What do we expect GT5 will bring over GT4?


It doesn't matter when the platform was released, since first party developers get to play with it well in advance.
Let's also factor in the "exponential content explosion" problem (not really an issue with GT3 ) and pretty much all of the extra development time is accounted for.

GT5's is a scratch-built environment. Even GT4 was full of legacy code from the original (e.g. tuning system, race championships etc.)

Why are there so many GT apologists?

Kaz and co screwed up. That's it. He aimed too high and admitted it.

He should have released a fully functioning GT5 2 years ago (Fall '08) with 100+ premium cars and 10-15 tracks with full online and full features. Then he should have released DLC packs of cars and tracks along the way. If you don't have online then you can buy these packs in bundles at the store for around $20 to install to your HDD.

Nobody wants to wait 4 years for a new game. Even Flight Simulator games come out bi-yearly. And they have to model the entire world not just a few cars.

I understand it takes longer to create games with this gen's level of detail, but expecting your fans to wait 4+ years for the next game is wrong. We are owed an apology.

 

[AleksandarSRB]

I will use all car not just premium!!! I have a lot of standard car's that I like and I can wait to drive 'em with new physics...