2008 Best Car Series (Round 2): Honda S2000 vs Audi R8

  • Thread starter Thread starter YSSMAN
  • 170 comments
  • 10,181 views

Axis Powers Face Off!


  • Total voters
    73
  • Poll closed .
Now that you mention it, I like the way Speak'n'Spell really accelerates through the last 4 levels, keeping the difficulty high.

:lol:

It's like some twisted sketch.
 
:lol:

It's like some twisted sketch.

Etch-A-Sketch_crash.jpg
 
The Audi R8 is okay to me. I just it doesn't feel Audish enough to me. That's why I like their iconic TT, it may not be fast but I think it represents Audi the best out all their models
 
Last edited:
Ah, you've only got Etch-a-Sketch with the 1.2 ROM Chip. You need at least a 2.0 to get it really cooking. If you install the 3.0 Kernel, it will go to over 9,000.
 
^in other words, it has good exhaust note, it turns heads, it turns well at almost any speed, it'll also kill you if you're complete tool and has the engine in the middle instead of in front of the headlights.. yeah, not very conservative like Audis usually are. And this is why it is so good.
 
The Audi R8 is okay to me. I just it doesn't feel Audish enough to me. That's why I like their iconic TT, it may not be fast but I think it represents Audi the best out all their models

Hang on. You think the Audi TT is Audi's best effort because a felt tip fairy draw a pretty shape and some donkey glued it to a Golf chassis?

Have you ever driven either car? The TT isn't bad, but it's not good either. The R8, however, is an unreal tool. You wouldn't believe what it can do. Some people don't like the styling but the layout, the cost, the engineering and balance it has are something else.

Unfortunately, I haven't driven an S2000 (sat in one, felt like a Honda alright.)
 
a felt tip fairy draw a pretty shape and some donkey glued it to a Golf chassis?

Hey, as donor chassis' go, you could do worse.
 
It's just that you would never expect Audi that makes luxurious cars to make a supercar
 
For being a wannabe porsche at a cut price?
Not at all. Try again.

The laptimes are there to show its not even all that fast these days. Half the hothatches on sale today are faster.
Your lists of lap times shows why you are wrong. The 986 Boxster was faster around most any track than the S2000 and handled about as well (if not better), yet lo and behold no one preferred the Boxster to the S2000 then. Ditto with the Z4, though that stacked up against the S2000 much closer.
Those lists of laptimes are, quite frankly, useless. You included cars in completely different performance brackets in each one (Audi TT-S, Cadillac XLR-v, Nissan 350Z Coupe, Elise 111R); and even if the lap times were somehow not meaningless, compared to the cars the S2000 actually competes with it didn't do bad at all.


70kgs is the weight of one person. And being FWD doesnt mean a car should be automatically light. Its not like the s200 itself requires heavy duty geartrain as it doesnt make much torque.
Did you just seriously imply that the lack of torque in the S2000 should somehow make its RWD drive train lighter than the FWD one in the Audi TT?

The TT is luxurious, the S2000 isnt, I wonder how much a TT would weigh if you removed all that sound deadening and heavy electric toys.
More irrelevant sidetracking!

No Not really
You posted a bunch of lap times and said "Lookie, the S2000 is wholly uncompetitive with everything in its class because it is slow around random tracks!"

So why exactly should I vote for it then? For being a great has been?
Like you were going to vote for it anyways. :rolleyes:
I defy you to find where I said you should vote for it.


It doesnt do anything the best, and it does imo get outstripped in most categories.
Which I said.

Its one thing is is famed for it doesnt do best anymore.
And what, pray tell, do you think it was famed for?

Once again I have to say the car is trading on its reputation of the past, as you seemingly cant understand just how far the game as moved on.
The game has moved very far forward. Previously, the S2000 was a distant speck on the horizon. Now its competitors are roughly equal to it, being better in some places and worse in others; with no competitor being better in every aspect.

I cannot fathom how you justify your reasoning that old = dated and bad. Hell, since the Audi R8 came out last year, many of its competitors (barring the 911) have moved forward as well. So why vote for the R8? Its old and dated compared to the fixed Gallardo, Ferrari F430, GT-R, Corvette ZR-1, Viper ACR, etc. How do I know this? Well, those cars are all faster around a track, so they all must be better.


gator of kana
It's just that you would never expect Audi that makes luxurious cars to make a supercar
250px-BMW_M1_1.jpg
 
Last edited:
Toronado... Firefox 3.0.1 doesn't like your font and renders it at 6.45 pts. or something, making it impossible to read. Any other Firefox users having this issue?

@ M-Spec: I stand corrected, but still refuse to acknowledge the idea that the S2000 is a out of date relic just because it is old. Whether or not the S2000 can outright win tests against everything it competes with like it used to is different from saying that it a dinosaur with no chance of coming near any of its competitors, which is what forza was contending. And then there is price...

To say the S2000 is an out of date relic is another colorful exaggeration. I agree; it's still a good car and good value.

But one note: The 350Z Roadster still sucks.

Well I might be inclined to agree based on it's curb weight and compromised body structure. But it came in 2nd in that C/D comparo you posted, so it can't be all that bad. I've driven a couple Zs, but no Roadsters, so I can't comment on that. As an aside, the TT is the only other in this group I haven't driven.

I don't outright disagree with you, the competition has gotten better, but on the same token, it doesn't exactly push the S2000 to the outside either. Its still competitive in performance and price (especially price against the Germans), which still makes it one helluva sweetheart for me.

It's competitive against it's peers. But how does that make it more impressive than something like the R8, which is better than it's peers?

If this poll was taken 8 years ago and some random XYZ supercar was on the opposing side, I'd vote S2000. But it's 2008 and the Stook, while still a very good car, doesn't move the game forward.


Germans do what Germans do best... Make cars that are good all the way around. Thing is, when I'm buying a roadster, I'm prepared to make the sacrifices that the S2000 comes with.

Yes, I know I'm crazy.

Age 15 years. Get married. Have children. Work a 16 hour day at your high-pressure job and walk to the parking lot at midnight, where it is 15 degrees and beginning to snow.

If you're still prepared to say that, then I'll be impressed.

Well, I hadn't really thought about it. They seem to be at the core of quite a few frontline children's learning devices, so I suppose they're pretty good.



I hope I'm not the only one who watches that show occasionally...


M
 
Toronado... Firefox 3.0.1 doesn't like your font and renders it at 6.45 pts. or something, making it impossible to read. Any other Firefox users having this issue?
I was changing the font and leaving the size because the awesome screen on my laptop was making it look larger than it actually was. Sorry all, for hurting your eyes, and thanks everyone for the heads up.

Well I might be inclined to agree based on it's curb weight and compromised body structure. But it came in 2nd in that C/D comparo you posted, so it can't be all that bad. I've driven a couple Zs, but no Roadsters, so I can't comment on that. As an aside, the TT is the only other in this group I haven't driven.
That's just my reaction because of how great the 350Z Coupe is. And the fact that you can land helicopters on the boot.
 
Last edited:
For being a wannabe porsche at a cut price?

How on Earth is it a "wannabe Porsche"? The only remotely similar thing about it to any Porsche is that it possesses four wheels, and it has a fabric hood like a Boxter.

The laptimes are there to show its not even all that fast these days. Half the hothatches on sale today are faster.

Lap times between road cars really, really don't matter.

70kgs is the weight of one person.

Yeah that's quite a bit still... think of it is 70 bags of sugar. Where would you put those 70 bags in your car? In the boot? If you were half awake you'd notice 70kgs on the rear axle. Around the car? That's a lot of sugars scattered about the car. Alternatively, think of it as a washing machine. I used to heft them about for a living, and trust me, they aren't light things to heft about. If one landed on your foot you'd know about it (I certainly did!).

70kg is a fairly big chunk of weight to be lighter than something.

Hell, since the Audi R8 came out last year, many of its competitors (barring the 911) have moved forward as well.

Even the 911 has moved forward now too 👍

Re: The appeal of the S2000

I found this article on MSN cars. Obviously, it's not the last word in motoring journalism, but the last paragraph is quite relevant to the discussion:

MSN Cars
Would we buy one?

Actually, yes. The S2000 - for all its flaws - has one quality so often engineered out of modern cars: character. It also challenges you to drive it properly and, with its new suspension set up, gets better the harder you push it - again rare qualities. The styling has aged well too and it remains one of the better looking roadsters on the market and, pound for pound, offers you some serious engineering for the money. But most people are more interested in image than mechanical purity and for them the S2000 is a rowdy, plasticky toy rather than a serious status symbol. It's their loss.

The last line is particularly telling. You question what you really need in a sports car. Fair enough, you'd like to be able to use it every day, but lets face it, this is a Honda so despite it's sporting pretentions it's as easy to drive as a Civic, albeit with a hard ride and a "cosy" cockpit. And it's not too likely to break down unless you're ignorant with servicing, but then anything will die eventually if you don't service it. In fact, it's come near the top (or at the top) of Auto Express's Driver Power survey for a number of years now.

No, you buy a sports car for the excitement. And the S2000 provides this in spades - any review from 1999 right up until now will tell you this. The last line in MSN's test sums up the way a lot of people think of cars like this - that just because something is a bit raw and not as luxurious, it's not as worth getting. In the meantime, the genuine enthusiasts will go for cars like the S2000, and damn the practicality.

@Forza - fair enough, you don't seem to think much of the car. But most of your arguements against it seem pretty weak, and you're not providing nearly enough evidence that the S2K isn't competitive, save for laptimes that mean next to nothing.
 
Last edited:
In the meantime, the genuine enthusiasts will go for cars like the S2000, and damn the practicality.

Well, if the willingness to sacrifice comfort and practicality is the rule by which 'true enthusiasts' are judged, then the only car we should be voting for is a Lotus 7. Compared to it, the S2000 is practically a Bentley.

That is why I dislike the 'a true enthusiast would only choose this...' argument. It's all relative.


M
 
Well, if the willingness to sacrifice comfort and practicality is the rule by which 'true enthusiasts' are judged, then the only car we should be voting for is a Lotus 7.

M

Or a sports bike...
 
That's why I'm not a car enthusiast because I give cars a chance to enspire me instead of saying that a car has no soul, I look at other factors of the car instead of the driving, I look at a car overall
 
That is why I dislike the 'a true enthusiast would only choose this...' argument. It's all relative.

Indeed it is relative, and the comparison is against the Z4, Boxter, 350Z et al.

Personally, I'd go for the Boxter in that class (well, really I'd go for the Cayman but we're discussing open cars), and really I'd prefer an Elise, but I'd suspect that of all the cars in that class, the S2000 is the one least bought on "image".
 
the S2000 is the one least bought on "image".

Of course, Honda is still struggling to establish itself as a premium brand. It's that very reason the new-and-quite-good Accord hasn't been nudged into the A4/C Class/3 Series fold. As Evo (I think, or it may have been TG) said, as accomplished as it is, it's still a Honda.

And in addition, the geriatric image still lingers. Thanks, messers Jazz and Civic.
 
Meaning more like Audi rather than Ford. They don't sell Acuras in Europe.
 
Last edited:
For me, the R8 wins because it's a better car period. I've driven the S2000 before, granted not hard, and while it's fun as a fun thing, I wouldn't consider it for everyday use. I'd do many bad, BAD things for an R8.
 
Of course, Honda is still struggling to establish itself as a premium brand. It's that very reason the new-and-quite-good Accord hasn't been nudged into the A4/C Class/3 Series fold. As Evo (I think, or it may have been TG) said, as accomplished as it is, it's still a Honda.

And in addition, the geriatric image still lingers. Thanks, messers Jazz and Civic.

honda and premium?

I would bunch honda as a sporty alternative to volvo, an alternative to saab, or alternative to mazda.

Whilst they still make cars like the s2000 and civic, they are hardly premium.

@Forza - fair enough, you don't seem to think much of the car. But most of your arguements against it seem pretty weak, and you're not providing nearly enough evidence that the S2K isn't competitive, save for laptimes that mean next to nothing.

Thats not what im saying though, the s2000 is great and id gladly have one its just nothing special anymore, its no where good enough anymore in 2008 to be granted car of the year, or to get the vote over the R8. And going by sales figures, neither do the people who buy roadsters, as the competition seems to be selling alot better, at a higher price.

No, you buy a sports car for the excitement. And the S2000 provides this in spades - any review from 1999 right up until now will tell you this.

Im young with no baggage and 2 seats wouldnt do it for me. A car like a s2000 would have to be a weekend toy, but if I was to get a weekend toy it would be something a little more hardcore and special. People rave on about how great the S2000 is at driving fast, but then dismiss lap times, so tell me where exactly are you meant to make use of what its great at, if not at the racetrack where hothatches will overtake me whilst having much lower running costs?

The 986 Boxster was faster around most any track than the S2000 and handled about as well (if not better), yet lo and behold no one preferred the Boxster to the S2000 then.

I would take the s2000 over the original boxster too. Namely due to price, power and its rather not so great interior. The new one sets all those things right though.
 
What do you mean premium?

honda and premium?

I would bunch honda as a sporty alternative to volvo, an alternative to saab, or alternative to mazda.

Whilst they still make cars like the s2000 and civic, they are hardly premium.

By premium, I mean towards the executive sector of the market, which is where they want to go with the new Accord and the Legend. The previous Accord was a pretty nice place to be, but the new model is leaps and bounds ahead of it. The cabin quality is right up there with the Germans, and the ride quality is even better. Honda would like the Accord to be considered a small executive car, rather than the family car it is now.

100.jpg
 
It looks fantastically technologicly advanced, I want that I can play with all those gadgets :drool:. I would definately call that luxurious/family/fun car in my book, I just can't wait to see how advanced technology cars will be 5 years from now.
 
By premium, I mean towards the executive sector of the market, which is where they want to go with the new Accord and the Legend. The previous Accord was a pretty nice place to be, but the new model is leaps and bounds ahead of it. The cabin quality is right up there with the Germans, and the ride quality is even better. Honda would like the Accord to be considered a small executive car, rather than the family car it is now.

100.jpg

interior doesnt look as good as you make out and i suppose you will have driven in the accord and all the german competitors to make such a bold statement.
 
interior doesnt look as good as you make out and i suppose you will have driven in the accord and all the german competitors to

What is going on!? Doesn't anybody like modern cars these days instead of hanging on to those obsolete cars of the 20th century, does anybody speak 21st here!?
 
interior doesnt look as good as you make out and i suppose you will have driven in the accord and all the german competitors to make such a bold statement.

1) Interior is objective, I wouldn't have expected you of all people to like it.
2) I haven't driven them all, but I'm going to trust the judgement of people who do it professionally. And I trust to disprove it, you yourself have driven them all.

What is going on!? Doesn't anybody like modern cars these days instead of hanging on to those obsolete cars of the 20th century, does anybody speak 21st here!?

Oh don't worry, he's just being awkward.
 
1) Interior is objective, I wouldn't have expected you of all people to like it.
2) I haven't driven them all, but I'm going to trust the judgement of people who do it professionally. And I trust to disprove it, you yourself have driven them all.

It is subjective, but the materials used doesnt look in that pic to be of as high a standard as some of the germans.

so one guy says the accord ride quality is better than all the germans and all of a sudden it must be true and gospel?
 
Back