2009 American Le Mans Series Thread

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*McLaren*
Is it me, or does the R10 have small changes in its livery?
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Yeah, though they aren't as noticeable as the others I 've shown.


And JohnBM01, You might be surprised to know that LG motorsports, The team running the GT2 Corvette, is a texas team based in Dallas. Looks like our home state has abit more representation.
 
So I've looked at the field and thought of my own FACT OR FICTION statments. You know the drill- FACT if it's very likely to happen, FICTION if it's very unlikely to happen and too good to be true.





The 2008 Mobil 1 12 Hours of Sebring - Fact or Fiction?

1.) The only Lola in P1 (J. Field/C. Field/Berry) will manage to finish on the overall podium (meaning 3rd or better overall).

2.) The Creation Judd will finish.

3.) The P2 podium will see at least one Acura in the final finishing order.

4.) Of the Porsches in P2, the Porsche RS Spyder raced by the tandem of Chris Dyson and Andy Lally will not finish.


Ben Devlin is one of my friends in my Myspace friends list, but...

5.) The lone Mazda-powered P2 entry will finish 5th or higher in P2.

6.) The only Aston Martin in GT1 will not finish.

7.) Of the Porches in GT2, the highest-finishing Porsche in GT2 will be the Porsche 911 GT3 RSR with the tandem of Bergmeister/Henzler/Lieb.

8.) At least one American car will finish in the top 3 in GT2 (meaning either a Corvette, the lone Panoz, or even the Ford GT-R).

9.) The Ferrari F430GT of Jamie Melo, Mika Salo, and Gianmaria Bruni will win the race in GT2.

10.) (granted the car doesn't win outright) The Peugeot 908 HDI FAP will finish the race no less than two laps down.

11.) At least one of the Audis will not finish or finish lapped. (inspired by Audi's performance at Le Mans last year)

12.) No more than five cautions will be displayed.

13.) The highest-finishing Porsche will be the Porsche RS Spyder of Maassen/Long/Briscoe.

14.) The Corvette of Fellows/O'Connell/Magnussen will finish better than the Corvette of Beretta/Gavin/Papis.

15.) The Ford GT-R of A. Robertson/D. Robertson/Murry will finish.




I checked out the qualifying order and stuff, and I didn't know that Lou Gigliotti was from Dallas. I am proud of Texas representation. Even back in the days of Caroll Shelby racing his heart out and when Chaparral was running circles against the competition, nothing like some Lone Star pride in sportscar racing. Maybe I should have added him to my "Texans in Racing" thread. How about it, people?
 
So, no ECO Racing Radical, but expect them to be back in Utah.

I listened to Radio Le Mans and observed live timing during qualifying. It's a shame about the BK Motorsports Lola-Mazda. I'm not happy that they scrapped the qualifying times because I would have loved to see the Penske Porsches battle their way from the very back during the opening laps. (Not to mention a Dyson 1-2 to start in LMP2 ;))
 
No Corsa Motorsports Ferrari either. The team has withdrawn over concerns with their Hankook tires.
 
Live Timing And Scoring

At the moment, Its Mike Rockenfeller That leads P1, Emmanuel Collard Leads P2, Jan Magnussen Leads GT1, and Gianmaira Bruni Leads GT2.
 
This race will be rembered as the beginning of the end of Audi Sports Car Racing domination.

Peugeot has proven they can be considerably quicker, even in race trim, they just need to work out all these rediculous reliability problems

The only thing ugly about the GT40 is the dull paint scheme
 
I love that they are forcing all the prototypes to be closed cockpit by 2010. maybe they'll at least look decent then.
 
V1P3R
I love that they are forcing all the prototypes to be closed cockpit by 2010. maybe they'll at least look decent then.
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Don't tell me you don't find the LMPs good looking either.

And you just made a rhyme:D
 
I didn't expect Dyson to be so strong. Impressive race and congratulations to Penske for finally getting that Sebring win with their Spyder.
 
I'll provide my full comments in a future post. For now, here is a question up for debate.



John's Debate! - For the Fans and P2 Power!
(1) I've been watching and listening to a lot of what Speed and the ALMS are offering. The inclusion of stuff like the videos from fans as well as the amazing turnout of sportscar racing fans was completely unreal. So I ask... do you think more American racing fans have embraced sportscar racing (much less the ALMS)? Or do you think there still aren't enough casual racing fans that have accepted and embraced sportscar racing?

(2) I tried to get up early to see as much of the race as possible. However, I fell asleep at the absolute wrong time- a half-hour away from race completion. Seeing the P2s win over Audi was an absolute upset. Is this P2 beatdown of Audi good for sportscar racing? What have we learned from the success P2 drivers had today at Sebring vs. some of the tougher P1 competitors? Do you consider this P2 performance to be a sensational result for P2 competition, or one of the biggest sportscar racing farces since a Porsche 911 GT3 RSR won the 24 Hours of Daytona in (the other series) in 2003? Should Porsche consider a P1 program or at least step up to P1?


Bonus question: would you want to see Ferrari push towards returning to prototype racing since my dearly beloved (tears in eyes) 333SP?




While I'm at it, I'll offer an editorial I'd like to share. To be unique, I call them "John-itorials." So let's do this.


John-itorial: A Win for ALMS Racing?, Does Anyone Want to Compete in Highest-Tier Divisions?

One thing I think is amazing about this field is not so much the variety of competition. But to me, I think it's nice to see lower-level teams campaign in the ALMS. As many as 33 cars took the green flag. Seeing cars like the Ford GT and the LG Corvette are signs of teams setting up their cars and going racing. I just wish more GT1 competitors would step up. Even if your GT1 entry is completely outmatched, more competition is needed in some of the classes that don't have good numbers of teams. GT1 is the worst with the two Corvettes and maybe an Aston Martin. It's expensive to field an entry in this series, but I don't think it's seriously expensive. No worries too if you have a GT1-spec car that's outmatched. I'm personally disappointed that GT1's taken such a whack in ALMS competition because I always believed in an lower-tier class and an upper-tier class in both GT and Prototype.

The trend I've seen was more about prototypes and high-end GT cars seeing lower-tier competition get more competitive. Perhaps entry-level racing provides the best thrills as opposed to higher-tier classes of racing. Maybe there aren't as many makers trying to come up with the most dominating cars in either GT and/or Prototype. And to think some people though Prototype 2 wouldn't succeed... we've seen Porsche and Acura really go blow for blow. We've seen GT2 really come alive with plenty of entries and great racing. I think there are an average of maybe 11 to 14 GT2 cars in the ALMS followed by just three GT1 entries. An average number of prototypes would be 7-9 P2s and maybe 5-7 P1 entrants. I get the feeling that the Audis in Prototypes and the Corvettes in GT are running out the competition. I think even if the R10 TDIs and Corvettes are the dominant cars in the two classes of ALMS competition, don't you at least want to field an entry just to go out and compete. Here's an example a lot of you are more familiar with than me: the 24 Hours at the Nürburgring. You have GT cars and DTM race cars competing around Green Hell. But does the fact that these cars should make other competitors in lower-class cars want to think twice about competing? Hell no. Since when was the last time a Lexus RX330 outran a GT car or a DTM race car? I think more people and teams need to field interest in competing in the ALMS. If there's an issue about paying to put two dozen or three dozen cars onto the starting grid for races, that may just be another story altogether. More teams need to take part in ALMS competition to compete among the higher-class teams. It isn't likely you'll win, but at least you're competing for exposure and to enjoy the ALMS experience. The best-case scenario for some of thees non-competitive teams is if a nobody team wins a race over a highly-favored team or car? Can it happen? Sure. Did the University of Virgina beat Chaminade University in the 1980s? More competition is needed in tiers of ALMS competition that don't usually have lots of cars competiting. So are any of you sportscar racing teams out there in the 'States or abroad want to give some classes (namely P1 and GT1) a boost?





Full race commentary in a future post. Comment on.
 
Complete Finishing order from the Monil 12 HOurs At Sebring:

Code: 
[Color=Red]P1[/Color]
1. (1) Rinaldo Capello, Italy; Tom Kristensen, Denmark; Allan McNish, Scotland; Audi AG R10/TDI (1, P1), 351.
2. (3) Marco Werner, Germany; Lucas Luhr, Germany; Mike Rockenfeller, Germany; Audi AG R10/TDI (2, P1), 333.
3. (9) Jon Field, Dublin, OH; Clint Field, Dublin, OH; Richard Berry, Evergreen, CO; Lola B06/10 AER (3, P1), 327.
4. (2) Nicola Minassian, England; Stephane Sarrazin, France; Pedro Lamy, Lisbon Portugal; Peugeot 908 (4, P1), 318.
5. (15) Chris McMurry, Phoenix, AZ; Bryan Willman, Kirkland, WA; Tony Burgess, Canada; Creation CA07-002 Judd (5, P1), 250, Mechanical.
 
[Color=Blue]P2[/Color]
1. (4) Timo Bernhard, Germany; Romain Dumas, France; Emmanuel Collard, France; Porsche RS Spyder (1, P2), 351.
2. (6) Luis Diaz, Mexico; Adrian Fernandez, Mexico; Acura ARX-01B (2, P2), 351.
3. (7) Butch Leitzinger, State College, PA; Marino Franchitti, Scotland; Andy Lally, New York, NY; Porsche RS Spyder (3, P2), 351.
4. (10) Chris Dyson, Pleasant Valley, NY; Guy Smith, England; Porsche RS Spyder (4, P2), 350.
5. (11) David Brabham, Australia; Scott Sharp, Jupiter, FL; Stefan Johansson, Sweden; Acura ARX-01B (5, P2), 349.
6. (12) Jan Lammers, The Netherlands; Fredy Lienhard Sr., Switzerland; Didier Theys, Belgium; Porsche RS Spyder (6, P2), 333.
7. (8) Marco Andretti, Nazareth, PA; Bryan Herta, Valencia, CA; Christian Fittipaldi, Miami, FL; Acura ARX-01B (7, P2), 287, Overheating.
8. (13) Michael Vergers, England; Jean Ravier, France; Juan Barazi, Switzerland; Zytek 07S (8, P2), 88, Accident.
9. (5) Ryan Briscoe, Australia; Sascha Maassen, Germany; Patrick Long, Oak Park, CA; Porsche RS Spyder (9, P2), 29, Overheating.
10. (14) Ben Devlin, England; Gerardo Bonilla, Orlando, FL; Raphael Matos, Brazil; Lola B07 46 Mazda (10, P2), 0, Excluded.

[Color=Green]GT1[/Color]
1. (16) Jan Magnussen, Denmark; Ron Fellows, Canada; Johnny O'Connell, Flowery Branch, GA; Corvette C6.R (1, GT1), 328.
2. (17) Oliver Gavin, England; Max Papis, Italy; Olivier Beretta, Monaco; Corvette C6.R (2, GT1), 320.
3. (18) Antonio Garcia, Spain; Terry Borcheller, Vero Beach, FL; Chapman Ducote, Miami, FL; Aston Martin DBR 9 (3, GT1), 299.

[Color=Yellow]GT2[/Color]
1. (21) Wolf Henzler, Germany; Marc Lieb, Germany; Jorg Bergmeister, Germany; Porsche 911 GT3 RSR (1, GT2), 314.
2. (28) Darren Law, Phoenix, AZ; Seth Neiman, Burlingame, CA; Alex Davison, Australia; Porsche 911 GT3 RSR (2, GT2), 311.
3. (29) Nic Jonsson, Sweden; Eric van de Poele, Belgium; Tracy Krohn, Houston, TX; Ferrari F430 GT (3, GT2), 308.
4. (22) Allan Simonsen, Australia; Jim Tafel, Alpharetta, GA; Pierre Ehret, Santa Rosa, CA; Ferrari F430 GT (4, GT2), 305.
5. (32) Joel Feinberg, Ft. Lauderdale, FL; Chris Hall, Daytona, FL; Dodge Viper Competiton Coupe (5, GT2), 295.
6. (26) Craig Stanton, Long Beach, CA; Nathan Swartzbaugh, La Habra Heights, LA; Uwe Alzen, Germany; Porsche 911 GT3 RSR (6, GT2), 286.
7. (20) Dirk Mueller, Germany; Robert Bell, UK; Dominik Farnbacher, Germany; Ferrari F430 GT (7, GT2), 280.
8. (23) Johannes van Overbeek, San Francisco, CA; Patrick Pilet, France; Richard Lietz, Austria; Porsche 911 GT3 RSR (8, GT2), 280.
9. (27) Tom Milner, Leesburg, VA; Tom Sutherland, Los Gatos, CA; Joey Hand, Sacramento, CA; Panoz Esperante Ford (9, GT2), 200, Mechanical.
10. (34) David Murry, Cumming, GA; Andrea Robertson, Ray, MI; David Robertson, Ray, MI; Doran Ford GT-R (10, GT2), 186, Accident.
11. (33) Miroslav Konopka, Slovakia; Mauro Casadei, Italy; Miroslav Hornak, Slovakia; Porsche 911 GT3 RSR (11, GT2), 173.
12. (19) Jaime Melo, Brazil; Mika Salo, Finland; Gianmaria Bruni, Italy; Ferrari F430 GT (12, GT2), 137, Accident.
13. (24) Dirk Werner, Germany; Marc Basseng, Germany; Bryce Miller, Hoboken, NJ; Porsche 911 GT3 RSR (13, GT2), 136, Accident.
14. (25) Marc Goosens, Belgium; Lou Gigliotti, Dallas, TX; Doug Peterson, Bonita Springs, FL; Chevrolet Riley Corvette C6 (14, GT2), 99, Overheating.
15. (30) Paul Drayson, London, UK; Jonny Cocker, UK; Tim Sudgen, England; Aston Martin DBRS 9 (15, GT2), 70, Accident.
16. (31) Gunnar Jeannette, Palm Beach Gardens, FL; Johnny Mowlem, England; Ralf Kelleners, Germany; Ferrari F430 GT (16, GT2), 0.


I'm still stunned at what I witnessed. Here we are thinking Peugeot vs. Audi and we completely forgot about the P2 cars. And notibly, The Lowes Acura finishes second in class once again but overall as well. I thinking a win is possibly coming their way. And in GT1, Its about damn time the #3 car won! Those guys have been way overdue and they finally get it. And GT2, I'm just gutted at what happened to the texas triple threat. The Krohn-Racing entry finishes on the podium so I guess thats good. On to St.Pete we go.
 
Yeah. I think Houston's own Risi Competizione went in too hot. We go back to discipline in traffic. I think Melo (I think it was Jamie Melo in the car at the time) was hoping to overtake both the Porsche as well as a prototype. However, it was game over. The LG Corvette had overheating troubles. Tough break for the boys from Dallas. The Risi-Krohn entry did establish some solidarity among Texas sportscar teams at Sebring. Even if all sportscar teams from my home state all go out early, they are all still winners for representing our state's teams as well as campaigning them in America and around the world.


For the first time, ALMS coverage will be on the ESPN/ABC networks (ABC). I wonder who'll be doing play-by-play and stuff for the ABC coverage. Still no Houston action this year, but we do get to see St. Petersburg (FL) and Long Beach on there before Speed Channel shows off ALMS action from Miller Motorsports Park. Should be a fun season.
 
Fernandez Racing is disqualified for failing the air restrictor stall test. They cracked the air inlet, which allowed an excess of air to be able to enter the engine.
 
RACECAR
Don't tell me you don't find the LMPs good looking either.
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They all look like the same damn car... I mean geez... come on. It's why I miss old racing with cars like the McLaren F1 and hell even the Porsche GT1.
 
John, there is interest from privateers in LMP1, but very few LMP1 privateer packages that are reliably quick.

It's one thing to go out in your shiny new LMP1 and lose to the Audi Panzers, but let's face the cold hard reality that most customer LMP1's have a hard time being faster than the customer LMP2's!

It's a harsh thing to say, but let's be honest. If it was just the Penske Porsches doing the stomping, then we could chalk it up to Porsche North America's money and Roger Penske's keen understanding of motorsport. However, all three Acura teams and the Dyson Porsche all proved last year that they could outrun Autocon and Intersport's Judd-powered Creation CA06h's and Cytosport's AER-Lola B06/10.

There's a significant difference between the LMP2 field when it was Pilbeams, Courages, and Lolas chugging around with fragile little turbo-fours, barely keeping up with the GT1 cars when they weren't sitting broken behind tire walls, and today's LMP2 field made up of lightweight, aerodynamically clean, punchy V8 powered machines from top manufacturers.

The RS Spyder is the second-coming of the 962, and any privateer worth his large bags of money is going to plunk down for one of those and get in on the high overall finishing action instead of putting in a call to Oreca, Creation, Pescarolo, or Lola (of which only the Lola has proven competitive stateside) in order to build an LMP1 that'll get beat by the Spyders.
 
Yeah, but in the interest of adding new competitors to the grid, would you still want more competition in struggling fields even if the Independents and such don't stand a chance? I think it was Trans-Am struggling to add more cars. In essence, they added cars from the old ASA series to compete along with the Trans-Am cars. Would you still favor a fairly good independent/privateer to compete in the ALMS to exhance the grid? Perhaps money is an issue to be in even just one race?

Or let me ask this question in a different way... I don't care too much for car counts personally. However, are car counts a state of emergency in the ALMS that the ALMS may want to look into having other privateer entries try and add more cars to the respective grid positions? Or do you think more manufacturers and race constructors should be encouraged and enticed to create new teams to compete in the ALMS, even if on a limited schedule?

I'm not obligated to talk about other message boards that inspired this question. But, it came from some messages I've seen when I used to truly participate on the forums of "Speed Insider" (yes, the same Speed that's the Speed Channel). I've read certain posts about how the ALMS can't field a healthy total number of cars unlike the number of entrants in (the other series (hint: Rolex)). I don't buy car count arguments. Hell, the Japanese Le Mans Challenge series has 12 cars for their endurance racing with very few high-end race cars competing. So feel free to respond to my debate question from the previous page or respond to my editorial I posted on the previous page.
 
John, you're great to debate with, but I think you may have slightly missed my point....

The reason LMP1 car counts are down amongst privateers in the ALMS is because the same overall result can be achieved with an LMP2 car. Why buy a Creation, Lola, Pescarolo, or Oreca when a Porsche RS Spyder (or Acura, once the ARX-01b goes customer) will do the job better?

The incentive amongst privateers to build an LMP1 was that it was faster than an LMP2. This is not the case, and not necessarily because the RS Spyder or the ARX-01b are better cars, but because they're significantly more reliable and more driver friendly cars. Let's face it, the Creation CA06h was junk last year, and the Lola B06/10 was barely equal.

If I'm Joe Squillionaire, ready to nail grid girls and bathe in victory champagne, I'm not going to pay to get humiliated by the "lesser" LMP2 cars, I'm going to buy a Porsche and play Giant Killer instead.

Funny thing is, the ALMS isn't having trouble at all getting car counts (save for GT1, but that's a dead horse I really don't feel like whipping right now) it's just having trouble making a case for new teams to buy LMP1 cars and that comes down to generally uncompetitive LMP1 cars for sale, not any specific problem in the formula or race format.

Going into Sebring, there were three question mark LMP1's that could've stood this situation on its ear: Eco Racing's Radical SR10, Intersport's Lola B06/10, and Creation Autosportif's CA07. All three of these cars which had announced intent to run Sebring had the potential to demonstrate that the new weights and air restrictors that the ACO had granted privateer LMP1's would give them a fighting chance.

Eco Racing and Creation Autosportif withdrew, and Intersport's Lola was not a direct threat to the LMP2's. Unfortunately, what it will take to get privateers back into LMP1 is a fast customer LMP1. Maybe the Lola B08/60, Epsilon-Euskadi, and Dome S102 coupes hold the answer?
 
I will likely agree that P2 and GT2 offer up some of the best competition. And on that accord, how can we enhance P1 and [especially] GT1?
 
John, LMP1 would be enhanced if there was a competitive privateer package available. As it stands now, there's nothing you can buy that will put you in a straight fight with Audi and Peugeot.

Intersport's result at Sebring was strong, but their Lola lacked the cornering ability of the LMP2's and this deficiency reared its ugly head as soon as the tires went away on the heavier LMP1. As such, even though it was marginally faster on the straightaways, it simply couldn't match the Porsches' and Acuras' ability to streak through turn 1 wide open.

Some suggest that slowing down the LMP2's is the only answer, and I strongly disagree. One of the hallmarks of Sports Car racing is the continued evolution of the cars through competition. The racing doesn't remain stagnant by freezing itself to one idea, but instead is fluid, changing with the on-track developments. The latest on-track development has been fast, reliable LMP2's that can out-corner, out-brake, and out-last the bigger LMP1's. It's not up to the sanctioning body to say "We have to fix the LMP1's!", it's up to the teams and the constructors to solve that problem in the natural way: building a fast car.

Give it time, throw in some rules stability (none of this "We're changing everything in four years for no good reason" bull****) and you'll see someone come up with the answer without legislation or incentives. Heck, that's where the 917 came from.
 
Some people talk about my interesting commentary in posts. Well, I honor your great commentary, Layla's Keeper. Anyone else want to take on my debate questions?
 
1) I don't think casual fans have embraced sportscar racing at least not in my neck of the woods. There is no mention of ALMS or Rolex series. Nothing in the local papers. Racing doesn't exist here if it is not NASCAR.

2) I don't think Porsche beating Audi is necessarily a bad thing. It shows that they are vunerable and can be beaten. I agree with Layla's Keeper that the privateer LMP1 are crap right now. Personally, I think the car manufacturers may follow th route of Prosche and Acura. Why invest money in P1 when you invets less in P2 and be competitive with the P1s. Personally I would love to Oreca get back to racing Vipers so they can battle the Corvettes and Aston Martins.
 
kjb
1) I don't think casual fans have embraced sportscar racing at least not in my neck of the woods. There is no mention of ALMS or Rolex series. Nothing in the local papers. Racing doesn't exist here if it is not NASCAR.
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I agree. Not even the fact that Diesel powered car won the 12 hours fo sebring was frontpage news. I can't look at the Dallas Morning News without Nascar being featured in the sports section. Seems like unless Nascar is gone, Sportscar racing period will never be front page news.

kjb
I don't think Porsche beating Audi is necessarily a bad thing. It shows that they are vunerable and can be beaten. I agree with Layla's Keeper that the privateer LMP1 are crap right now. Personally, I think the car manufacturers may follow th route of Prosche and Acura. Why invest money in P1 when you invets less in P2 and be competitive with the P1s. Personally I would love to Oreca get back to racing Vipers so they can battle the Corvettes and Aston Martins.
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Very true. Certainly seems to be the more wise and better decision and wit hthe way things are going (if nothing changes even after converting to closed cockpit prototypes), P1 just might as well die. It's worked for Mazda, Porsche, and Acura. And GT1's only way to thrive again would be to have only Priveteers. Now the ones in the LMS or FIA GT weren't technically factory efforts (At least not to me), whereas Corvette Racing is a permenant and primary factory.
 

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