2010 Gulf Air Bahrain Grand Prix

[Prince.M5]

The Beige Grand Prix!

No colour! just beige sand!

No spectators at the track!

No overtaking really!

Just beige sand?? Of course, the track is in the middle of a desert. No spectators (I hope you meant on the side of the track)?? I have no problem with it. No overtaking?? Owh you got it really wrong mate...

EDIT: Owh, what about one day, they're going to make a race in Norway or such, and all you got to see is white Really i'ts just a climate and condition at certain places... I really have nothing wrong with it

Think again, and for sure Australia will be better..

 

[niky]

Red Bull in Vettel's hands was strong. A class driver at a 'Good' car but I feel it's a bit off the pace of the Ferraris and maybe even the Mclaren.

After clinching pole by being fastest in the last two quali sessions and maintaining a healthy lead over Alonso before the car started to go... and then clicking off 2:00:xx laps in a car that had lost power? That's plenty of beans in that car. It's conceivable that he may have even been pacing himself early on because he knew there was no way Alonso could pass him if things stayed status quo.

-

RE: Refueling, tires: Again... I hate the no refueling rule. Just as I hated the no-tire-change rule. It doesn't only remove passing in the pits... it removes passing on the track.

A lot of the dynamic in F1 races is people passing people because they're too heavy or on tires that are too worn... the weight of the fuel between stops plays an important part in race strategy.

Yes, you can return a small part of that strategy with fuel trim adjustments from the cockpit, but not much... not with the FIA-spec ECUs and engines they have right now. Maybe if we go back to the turbo days, you can sacrifice two or three laps of fuel for a ten second boost of an extra 100 horsepower...

The only adjustment to this I can agree with? Make the tires even softer. Design them to last maybe twenty laps on a short circuit, fifteen here at Bahrain. Even with the heat at Bahrain and the incredibly dusty conditions, a lot of the good teams were on one stoppers. Which doesn't bode well for excitement in the next few races.

 

[The Outlaw]

Alonso was really in another league today. I was really looking forward to seeing how the Vettel/Alonso battle would have played out had Vettel not had his issues, but hopefully we will get a better taste in the following races Being a big Ferrari fan, it was great to see them get off to a perfect start to the 2010 season, with the F10 and both drivers looking very strong.

Bahrain Grand Prix fastest laps

Rank Driver Car Fastest lap Deficit to fastest lap

1 Fernando Alonso Ferrari 1′58.287
2 Adrian Sutil Force India-Mercedes 1′59.393 1.106
3 Mark Webber Red Bull-Renault 1′59.487 1.200
4 Lewis Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1′59.560 1.273
5 Felipe Massa Ferrari 1′59.732 1.445
6 Rubens Barrichello Williams-Cosworth 1′59.833 1.546
7 Vitantonio Liuzzi Force India-Mercedes 1′59.906 1.619
8 Jaime Alguersuari Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1′59.964 1.677
9 Jenson Button McLaren-Mercedes 1′59.970 1.683
10 Sebastien Buemi Toro Rosso-Ferrari 2′00.080 1.793
11 Michael Schumacher Mercedes 2′00.204 1.917
12 Sebastian Vettel Red Bull-Renault 2′00.218 1.931
13 Nico Rosberg Mercedes 2′00.236 1.949
14 Robert Kubica Renault 2′00.474 2.187
15 Nico Hülkenberg Williams-Cosworth 2′01.401 3.114
16 Pedro de la Rosa Sauber-Ferrari 2′01.650 3.363
17 Heikki Kovalainen Lotus-Cosworth 2′02.701 4.414
18 Jarno Trulli Lotus-Cosworth 2′02.930 4.643
19 Vitaly Petrov Renault 2′04.307 6.020
20 Kamui Kobyashi Sauber-Ferrari 2′05.044 6.757
21 Timo Glock Virgin-Cosworth 2′07.062 8.775
22 Bruno Senna HRT-Cosworth 2′09.127 10.840
23 Lucas di Grassi Virgin-Cosworth 2′09.361 11.074
24 Karun Chandhok HRT-Cosworth 2′34.479 36.192

I think no refuelling is the way to go but only in combination with a more dramatic aero change, because its still a major problem. Also we need Bridgestone to provide basically crappier tyres, as the current ones are too good!
Imagine if we had the softs wearing out after a few laps in that race? The top 10 would have been in a heated battle with people like Barrichello and Sutil on the hards -this is what I and others were expecting to happen but it didn't.

I agree.

 

[hellnback]

People should remember whilst passing is always preferable in a race, everything done in the weekend preceeding the race is contrary to it.

Qualifying: The Goal: To rank each car in order of quickness.

Therefore, theoretically, no passing should occur. Only ever increasing margins between each car...

Of course, many variables in reality come into the equation which allow overtaking to happen, of which human error, or mechanical problems are to the fore.

I believe what they need to try achieve is have/design/allow an aero package that either allows the car to follow very close behind. My preference would be an reversed thought and see if an aero package can be designed whereby the airflow is channelled in such as way that the following car has a downforce or super-slipstream advantage...

 

[Louie_Schumii]

...............I believe what they need to try achieve is have/design/allow an aero package that either allows the car to follow very close behind. My preference would be an reversed thought and see if an aero package can be designed whereby the airflow is channelled in such as way that the following car has a downforce or super-slipstream advantage...

Just like Gran Turismo

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I believe what they need to try achieve is have/design/allow an aero package that either allows the car to follow very close behind. My preference would be an reversed thought and see if an aero package can be designed whereby the airflow is channelled in such as way that the following car has a downforce or super-slipstream advantage...

Here's a possible idea: a spec diffuser. Very simple, very easy to predict its effects. Other parts, like the rear wing and the last part of the underside of the car would either have to be heavily regulated (because they couldn't be spec parts themselves). Designers would then be able to develop their cars around the wake produced by the spec diffuser, therefore allowing cars to run closer to one another.

 

[Stotty]

*Sigh

Once again I convince myself that I should invest some of my weekend time in to watching the GP and once again I come away feeling 'there's 2 hours of my life I'll never get back'.

Can F1 get anymore boring?

Roll on the MotoGP.

 

[PeterJB]

Goddammit!! That was such an anti-climax! And for Vettel's car to break again makes it worse! This better not be another regular thing with him that'll cost him the championship again!

 

[daan]

Christian Horner - Seb? You've got a broken exhaust.
Sebvet -

 

[SUPER NUMBBER]

Have they though about handicapping? I don't know if it's been done before, but I figured they might've though of that already.

 

[Bram Turismo]

Have they though about handicapping? I don't know if it's been done before, but I figured they might've though of that already.

You mean like the DTM weight handicap system? I don't know if that would work since the cars are not as equal on performance as the DTM cars. If you'd given Alonso some extra ballast, he still would've smashed the lap times table

 

[sems4arsenal]

so you are saying that it is Ok for teams with no F1 experience at all to enter the championship and setting their aims to just finish the race even if they got lapped 5 or 6 times C'mon guys this is unacceptable if a team is not going to compete then they are only using F1 for advertising only .

 

[Bram Turismo]

so you are saying that it is Ok for teams with no F1 experience at all to enter the championship and setting their aims to just finish the race even if they got lapped 5 or 6 times C'mon guys this is unacceptable if a team is not going to compete then they are only using F1 for advertising only .

As Trulli said "We aren't competing, we are just driving along with the pack"

You cannot expect your cars to be off only a second off the leaders in your first year. You have a brand-new team started form scratch, a car build from scratch, everything is completely new. What Lotus are doing in 2010 is gathering data and info rather competing for points from race 1. Finishing the race is a huge accomplishment because you have 49X2 laps to analyze and work with, whereas Virgin and HRT now have nearly nothing to analyze. It's all about learning in your first year. Just watch Lotus in 2011, that's where their actual campaign starts.

 

[niky]

Best case scenario for new teams is Force India. Takes three to four years to get your car to the sharpish end of the grid.

RBR and Brawn GP don't count. They were continuations of previous efforts, and furthermore, RBR had their cars designed by Adrian Newey, while Ross Brawn is 50% of the reason Michael Schumacher won several world titles.

Starting completely from the ground-up, just finishing the race is an achievement. Force India didn't even finish their first race.

Heck.. come to think of it... Force India doesn't count, either... since they bought out Spyker/Midlands/Jordan.

 

[SUPER NUMBBER]

You mean like the DTM weight handicap system? I don't know if that would work since the cars are not as equal on performance as the DTM cars. If you'd given Alonso some extra ballast, he still would've smashed the lap times table

It's precisely the difference in performance that the handicap counters. More weight=challenge. And these engineers are counting every milligram on the car; I'm sure Alonso would mind if he had extra weight.

 

[niky]

Half-full Ferrari: 2:01-2:02.

Nearly-empty Ferrari: 1:58-1:59.

I'd say half-a-tank's worth of ballast would really hurt...

 

[Arkano5]

so you are saying that it is Ok for teams with no F1 experience at all to enter the championship and setting their aims to just finish the race even if they got lapped 5 or 6 times C'mon guys this is unacceptable if a team is not going to compete then they are only using F1 for advertising only .

Yes.

When a new team enters F1 they wont have the funding, data or experience to be a top contender. What the new teams are doing is collecting data on where they need to improve the car and what they need to do in terms of strategy ect..

Watch Lotus in 2011, all I have to say.

Force India are a great example, started off badly and now they're finishing in the midfield.

 

[Ardius]

Best case scenario for new teams is Force India. Takes three to four years to get your car to the sharpish end of the grid.

RBR and Brawn GP don't count. They were continuations of previous efforts, and furthermore, RBR had their cars designed by Adrian Newey, while Ross Brawn is 50% of the reason Michael Schumacher won several world titles.

Starting completely from the ground-up, just finishing the race is an achievement. Force India didn't even finish their first race.

Heck.. come to think of it... Force India doesn't count, either... since they bought out Spyker/Midlands/Jordan.

The last true new teams were Toyota, Stewart, Super Aguri and BAR, and two of those operations existed a long time before entering F1.
The last "from scratch" operation was probably BAR, and I think its safe to say Lotus and probably HRT and Virgin are going to beat BAR's first season.

 

[Bram Turismo]

Half-full Ferrari: 2:01-2:02.

Nearly-empty Ferrari: 1:58-1:59.

I'd say half-a-tank's worth of ballast would really hurt...

New weight penalties; If yo win a race, you need to carry 1.5 full tanks during the next race

 

[sems4arsenal]

Completely agree with all of you except Force India and maybe even Minardi(spelling) or Super Aguri these teams were new teams and all of them were alot better in their first seasons than all of the teams I mentioned .Finally Yes Lotus and maybe Virgin might just have good seasons later on but still there are now four useless teams this season and In my honest opinion I don't excpect half of them to be competing next year.
All in all I hope I hope I haven't upset anyone I know how most fans are loving the return of Lotus but it is only my honest opinion so I agree with Mark Webber .

 

[Ardius]

Completely agree with all of you except Force India and maybe even Minardi(spelling) or Super Aguri these teams were new teams and all of them were alot better in their first seasons than all of the teams I mentioned .Finally Yes Lotus and maybe Virgin might just have good seasons later on but still there are now four useless teams this season and In my honest opinion I don't excpect half of them to be competing next year.
All in all I hope I hope I haven't upset anyone I know how most fans are loving the return of Lotus but it is only my honest opinion so I agree with Mark Webber .

Toyota = ex-Rally team, developed a car for 2001, spent a lot of time preparing for their debut season. Massive budgets too and had their own engine and gearbox. Not a fair comparison.
Stewart = long time F3 level team, progressed through the ranks and made it to F1 with Ford backing. Perhaps a fair comparison, but they were prepared for the season quite a bit in advance and had a fair bit of Ford backing.
Super Aguri = long time JGTC/Formula Nippon team, massive in Japan but no experience in any other series. Bought the 2002 Arrows chassis to run with intially and they had a little bit of Honda backing.
BAR = ex-Tyrrell team, though very few Tyrrell men stayed on. Almost a complete restructure from Tyrrell, Reynard-designed chassis, lots of sponsorship from BAT and 555.

Toyota scored on debut but really had a horrible season, scoring very few points and only finishing ahead of a dying Arrows team. Massive budget and preparation got them nowhere.
Stewart got a lucky podium in their first season but otherwise retired from almost from every race.
Super Aguri scored no points in their debut season and finished last in almost every race they didn't retire from.
BAR also scored no points and almost retired from every race, Villenueve had a remarkable 11 race retirement streak!

You don't think any of the 3 new teams can beat these debuts? I think Lotus have a chance to beat all 4, and Virgin and HRT merely have to finish races to beat all except Toyota, which is no bad thing considering the massive difference in budgets...
And considering the massive retirement streaks of those 4 old teams, do you still think it silly that new teams aim to just finish? You can't win races without finishing

 

[parker_125]

My opinion is that the race was a little on the less-exciting side of things.. But I also think that anyone who is a true F1 fan, understands that is expected in the first race of the season, especially with being at Bahrain. The overall "want" from all the teams in the first race is just to finish, even Ferrari. Noone, not Vettel, not Alonso, Schumi, noone was going to give it everything they had.

I personally think no other motorsport is more thrilling and dramatic. I love everything about it! I can not wait for Round 2 where I think things will get a little more aggressive. I want to see Schumacher get a podium finish!!! VVvvvvvvvrrrrraaaaaaaahhhhhmmmmmm lol

Parker


PS: Congrats Ferrari.....

 

[sems4arsenal]

Toyota = ex-Rally team, developed a car for 2001, spent a lot of time preparing for their debut season. Massive budgets too and had their own engine and gearbox. Not a fair comparison.
Stewart = long time F3 level team, progressed through the ranks and made it to F1 with Ford backing. Perhaps a fair comparison, but they were prepared for the season quite a bit in advance and had a fair bit of Ford backing.
Super Aguri = long time JGTC/Formula Nippon team, massive in Japan but no experience in any other series. Bought the 2002 Arrows chassis to run with intially and they had a little bit of Honda backing.
BAR = ex-Tyrrell team, though very few Tyrrell men stayed on. Almost a complete restructure from Tyrrell, Reynard-designed chassis, lots of sponsorship from BAT and 555.

Toyota scored on debut but really had a horrible season, scoring very few points and only finishing ahead of a dying Arrows team. Massive budget and preparation got them nowhere.

I do think it is harsh to compare those teams to Toyota (thats why I didn't mention them although they were my favourite team but you know what I think HSR will not finish have their races this season and USF1 as well already have a 4 straight retirment streak as for Lotus and Virgin well time will tell but again I have never seen such bad teams in one season but I guess we will see how the season unfolds.
Stewart got a lucky podium in their first season but otherwise retired from almost from every race.
Super Aguri scored no points in their debut season and finished last in almost every race they didn't retire from.
BAR also scored no points and almost retired from every race, Villenueve had a remarkable 11 race retirement streak!

You don't think any of the 3 new teams can beat these debuts? I think Lotus have a chance to beat all 4, and Virgin and HRT merely have to finish races to beat all except Toyota, which is no bad thing considering the massive difference in budgets...
And considering the massive retirement streaks of those 4 old teams, do you still think it silly that new teams aim to just finish? You can't win races without finishing

Well yes you are correct regarding what you said but excpect HSR and USF1 to break the number of straight retirments this season

also that brings to my point almost all the teams you mentioned have racing or indeed F1 experience so why will 4 teams all of a sudden compete in F1 with only a slight or no F1 experience ,I bet aside from Lotus all the new teams will struggle to finish have of this years grandprixs.

Finally I wanted to ask if Bridgestone is walking away then how are manufactures going to proceed in developing the 2011 season's cars without Tyres?

 

[tibiquera]

I can't remember when was the last time I was that bored with a race. Everybody were being overly cautious and everybody had exactly the same strategy.

But I'm thinking now, if the cars were 3 seconds slower on the race than on qualifying, would it mean that a 2-stop strategy would be better? Which makes me hope that next race we will see some people trying different and more aggressive strategies.

 

[parker_125]

I believe they have still not officially announced a tyre supplier for the 2011 season. And yes it was confirmed Bridgestone will not renew contract after 2010.

You guys have to check this vid out, very funny!!!
Great editing making it look like an F1 is competing in D1 lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cq9XW8tKDYE

 

[Ardius]

^ I actually commented when I saw that, that Alguesuari is entered in the wrong series haha.

 

[maximumattack]

 

[Interpol-007]

I was expecting Michael Schumacher to win.

 

[Pupik]

What many forget is that even the original Team Lotus was dog-slow in 1958, and they had quite a bit of experience in junior formulae/sports-cars. It took a few years for success.

HRT had no testing. Even though the old "107% rule" of qualifying is gone (it was created in 1996), they still were within those parameters to make it to the race. Brawn was basically a Honda team, and a success story at that, is anyone here seriously calling Mercedes GP a bona fide all-new F1 team, what with 17 consecutive years' of engine-supplying and experience in F1?

These new teams have had zero testing thanks to these silly "cost-cutting" anti-circuit testing measures which merely means teams have to funnel more money into simulations and computer modeling than ever before.

You can't make the comparison; few all-new teams succeed at all in their first year:

Toyota was one of the few, and pit-lane chatter in the 2001-2002 off seasons were that they were going to be mobile chicanes, and the team was a mid-pack entrant for most of its debut year. They had a whole year of testing, however; never mind the tremendous budget (and that they stayed mid-pack throughout most of their 8-year F1 binge).

BAR was mostly all-new, but Tyrrell had lost interest in this team before its final season; it was for all intents and purposes an all new team for 1999.

Sauber was another team that tested throughout all of 1992, but it was truly an all-new team. Peter had Mercedes-Benz's financial support to get into F1, after sports-prototype racing withered rapidly after 1991. Not bad, but a year of testing sure helps.

Prost was basically Ligier with less Guy Ligier and more Alain Prost. Their most successful year (1997, its first) was with Ligier's chassis and championship-winning Renault engines.

Stewart was Ford's aborted entry to F1, but lots of financial support to Stewart (and basically a mid-packer except for Barrichello's great run at Monaco in 1997).

Jordan followed the steps from F3 and F3000 into F1, and started up from nothing. It was a great first effort with some financial support. After some strained communication between Cosworth and Jordan (they basically felt that Andrea de Cesaris could have won the 1991 Belgian GP, had they been warned that their new-and-improved lump was going to consume twice as much oil...) they went though the doldrums for a few years.

Benetton was Team Toleman, with a new engine, chassis, and a lot of different personnel; mainly the team name change was in deference to its sponsor. Fifteen years later, it became Renault.

For the past thirty years, you had start-ups like Osella/Fondmetal [three mentions form me in one thread!], Spirit, RAM, Zakspeed, Minardi, AGS, Team March, Larrousse, Scuderia Italia, Coloni, Euro Brun, Rial (basically just the return of ATS), Brabham (kinda-sorta new), Life, Andrea Moda, Pacific, Simtek, Forti Corse, Matercard Lola (huh?), BAR, Super Aguri, and probably a few more I missed....they all did little to nothing in terms of success in F1.

 

[zed300]

I am hoping most of the teams were basically testing the tyre wear for data purposes. So much for more passing under the no fuel stops rule and the narrower fronts.
Red bull looked the most likely to lead with their race pace, but were held back with a couple of quite unusual occurances. Surely the bookie price went out a couple of points from right before the start when M.W. parked his car 1 metre over the grid position. WTF.
The rest of the lead teams looked solid.....everywhere.
One or two are going to have to take some type of risk/chance to gain the upper hand.
It is early days though.