2014 Grand Prix de Monaco

[TenEightyOne]

Except he went over a bump and then started trying to correct it. The bump down that straight is so big everyone swerves round it. Maybe he just caught it wrong trying to position the car back for the corner?
Anyway you all seem to miss the issue. He didn't spin or anything he locked up which could be nothing to do with it. That lock up is enough to miss the corner as we saw with Magnuson at turn 1.

How many posts have you read? Few, one imagines, for you to conclude this.

I've already said it looks legit as have plenty of other people... I think the fascinating part of the incident is how Rosberg's conducting himself, he seems to be fighting fire with fire

 

[Lizard]

And that shows what?
He turns in, whilst doing so locks up and the car straight lines as he locked up.

You all is a figure of speech referring to those doubting the legitimacy.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

And that shows what?
He turns in, whilst doing so locks up and the car straight lines as he locked up.

It shows the quali lap and his lock up lap, that's why people think there is something fishy. I'm just showing you were people are getting it from. Also I don't see any upset of the car from a bump like you claim. Also I doubt you read the entire thread based on your post, you might wanna attempt that before throwing your hat in the ring.

 

[TenEightyOne]

You all is a figure of speech referring to those doubting the legitimacy.

No, it's a piece of speech that means "you all". "Some of" is something different, neither represent the other figuratively.

As @LMSCorvetteGT2 says, there's some confusing "evidence" being presented in support of the Bad Nico camp. Every single person in the world knows Nico did it*

*Figuratively, I mean "some think"

 

[ScottPuss20]

Today's race should be interesting because the Red Bulls are very good at low speed tracks.

 

[Spurgy 777]

Except he went over a bump and then started trying to correct it. The bump down that straight is so big everyone swerves round it. Maybe he just caught it wrong trying to position the car back for the corner?
Anyway you all seem to miss the issue. He didn't spin or anything he locked up which could be nothing to do with it. That lock up is enough to miss the corner as we saw with Magnuson at turn 1.

Not only did the car seem completely settled, but you don't catch the car by sawing the steering wheel from side to side. And I fail to see how I miss the issue? Yes, a lock up is enough for him to miss the corner, but I'm saying he locked up on purpose.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Not only did the car seem completely settled

It didn't by any means... are you looking at the right clip?

but you don't catch the car by sawing the steering wheel from side to side

You're right about that, it's no way to control a car on overhard tyres around Monaco. I mean, look at THIS fool hacking the wheel like a nooob

Seriously, it's called "the limit", it's not a constant line, especially at Monaco.

 

[Furinkazen]

It didn't by any means... are you looking at the right clip?



You're right about that, it's no way to control a car on overhard tyres around Monaco. I mean, look at THIS fool hacking the wheel like a nooob

Seriously, it's called "the limit", it's not a constant line, especially at Monaco.

This is Ayrton Senna in a McLaren. Thin tyres, manual gears and tons of HP. Much harder to drive than a current F1 car.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

This is Ayrton Senna in a McLaren. Thin tyres, manual gears and tons of HP. Much harder to drive than a current F1 car.

And let's not even get started on the aero advantages of today compared to then.

 

[niky]

Then again, you guys are apparently saying the track would go green again with him deep down in that alley ... hmmm

Theoretically. Or maybe not. As you've said, it's possible the race director would have kept the yellow out until he was out.

I won't be surprised if there's discussion about suspending qualifying timers during yellows, as they do for reds, after this. Because it really is a shame to have a good qualifying shootout scuppered by even a partial course yellow.

 

[Lizard]

Not only did the car seem completely settled, but you don't catch the car by sawing the steering wheel from side to side. And I fail to see how I miss the issue? Yes, a lock up is enough for him to miss the corner, but I'm saying he locked up on purpose.

Well lets see how you handle an undulating track.


Oh wait. Maybe he did lose it. Maybe the lock up was separate or if it was connected the whole thing might have been a mistake.

 

[Spurgy 777]

It didn't by any means... are you looking at the right clip?

Yes, and if you thought that was unsettled, you don't know what you're looking at, that was quite controlled.

You're right about that, it's no way to control a car on overhard tyres around Monaco. I mean, look at THIS fool hacking the wheel like a nooob

Seriously, it's called "the limit", it's not a constant line, especially at Monaco.

Senna's car was much more of a handful, and he wasn't sawing at the wheel to anywhere near the extent Rosberg did in the quali incident, especially under braking, thanks for proving my point

Still don't see what I mean, Rosberg made corrections of around 70-90 degrees on the steering wheel, Senna in that video didn't do any more than 10-20 degrees apart from when he was countersteering big slides under acceleration, but in those cases he only moved the wheel once, not 6-7 times.

 

[TenEightyOne]

This is Ayrton Senna in a McLaren. Thin tyres, manual gears and tons of HP. Much harder to drive than a current F1 car.

I was responding particularly to "sawing the wheel is no way to control a car". There's actually quite a similarity in terms of how hard this years tyres are (you have been watching the thermal onboards, right? Terrifying :\) with a very peaky car. It's not in the crazy class of that McLaren but the effect's very much the same. The driver is continually crossing the wheel across the rack's centre to find optimum grip, exactly as Rosberg was doing.

I was pointing it out for the young'uns who only seem used to high-grip super sticky racing. Back in my day etc. etc.

Spurgy, watch again. Even in "settled corners" there's a huge amount of adjustment going on. Whenever I was in a singleseater I used to find the same effect on harder tyres, you do have to saw the wheel to find grip on crowned approaches, no two ways about it. Watch Senna's approach through the previous corner to the Rosberg Turnoff... 98 degrees of correction through the corner, by my measurement. Quite a bit of sawing too...

I can only think you're using different types of brain/eye to me if you don't see Rosberg's car as unsettled after it lands/compresses, but I can agree to differ

 

[Spurgy 777]

Well lets see how you handle an undulating track.


Oh wait. Maybe he did lose it. Maybe the lock up was separate or if it was connected the whole thing might have been a mistake.

The difference with my incident is that I lost traction on all 4 wheels due to taking a little too much speed, which I interpreted as a little bit of oversteer. So I then countersteered to correct the car, which meant that when the car landed, it suddenly gripped up and shot me off in the direction I was steering, ironically had I not made a correction and kept the wheel fairly straight I would have been fine. I suppose I learnt the hard way

 

[Bopop4]

The sawing wasn't him trying to catch the car, it was trying to decide whether to try and make the corner or not.

 

[Furinkazen]

I was responding particularly to "sawing the wheel is no way to control a car". There's actually quite a similarity in terms of how hard this years tyres are (you have been watching the thermal onboards, right? Terrifying :\) with a very peaky car. It's not in the crazy class of that McLaren but the effect's very much the same. The driver is continually crossing the wheel across the rack's centre to find optimum grip, exactly as Rosberg was doing.

I was pointing it out for the young'uns who only seem used to high-grip super sticky racing. Back in my day etc. etc.

Spurgy, watch again. Even in "settled corners" there's a huge amount of adjustment going on. Whenever I was in a singleseater I used to find the same effect on harder tyres, you do have to saw the wheel to find grip on crowned approaches, no two ways about it. Watch Senna's approach through the previous corner to the Rosberg Turnoff... 98 degrees of correction through the corner, by my measurement. Quite a bit of sawing too...

I can only think you're using different types of brain/eye to me if you don't see Rosberg's car as unsettled after it lands/compresses, but I can agree to differ

Unsettled like any other F1 car there. Making microscopic movements with your hands left and right however does not affect it. Pretty clearly deliberate.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Unsettled like any other F1 car there. Making microscopic movements with your hands left and right however does not affect it. Pretty clearly deliberate.

I disagree entirely, as it seems the experts at the track do. I can live with that though, I don't think it's clearly deliberate... I think people are retro-engineering it from Rosberg's attitude after the event. That attitude is to be expected in the face of comments from the other side of the garage, it's just how the sport's always worked

 

[niky]

The sawing wasn't him trying to catch the car, it was trying to decide whether to try and make the corner or not.

This. And...

I disagree entirely, as it seems the experts at the track do. I can live with that though, I don't think it's clearly deliberate... I think people are retro-engineering it from Rosberg's attitude after the event. That attitude is to be expected in the face of comments from the other side of the garage, it's just how the sport's always worked

That is likely it. If Nico's attitude weren't such post-quali, there would be little question. But his attitude can probably be traced back to what Lewis has been saying this weekend, and the accusatory tone and sullen demeanor Lewis has taken against him. Either way, there would still be an investigation, but having your team-mate come out and support you would help soften the blow.

If you're being accused of murder and your buddy says: Hey, maybe he DID do it... hell yes you will be frightfully pissed.

 

[Dodzzz]

I wonder why he didn't even try to turn right, instead he chose to go straight (to the wall) and lock the braking, and turn left.
It's clearly deliberate plan IMO.

 

[Earth]

Lots of people still think Sergio Perez going off course late at Malaysia in 2012 when closing on Alonso was a 'mistake'. Perez's punishment is he threw away the best chance at a win he ever had or will have in his career just to try and please Ferrari.

Two things these two 'mistakes' have in common: they happend at place where theres plenty of runoff room. And from the onboard there was bad acting by the drivers in the form of overdramatic steering corrections.

 

[MagpieRacer]

Bottom line is the stewards have much more information than we do, more detailed information than we do, and they declared no wrong doing had taken place. That's where this debate should have ended. We aren't stewards and don't have the whole picture.

 

[Samus]

Indeed, can we move on? So as mentioned before, turn 1 is going to be very interesting. I'm pretty sure neither Merc will do something reckless or stupid, sleeping on it I'm sure Lewis will have calmed but he'll be very, very keen to take the win now.Will he put his car in a position that Rosberg has to cede? We'll see.

As for the rest of the grid well I'm not expecting anything but a procession, it is a dry Monaco race after all. Kvyat and Magnussen should be interesting, being rookies that both made a few mistakes throughout practice. Can they hold it together the full 78 laps?

 

[Akmuq]

Lots of people still think Sergio Perez going off course late at Malaysia in 2012 when closing on Alonso was a 'mistake'. Perez's punishment is he threw away the best chance at a win he ever had or will have in his career just to try and please Ferrari.

Two things these two 'mistakes' have in common: they happend at place where theres plenty of runoff room. And from the onboard there was bad acting by the drivers in the form of overdramatic steering corrections.

Your conspiricy theory would have a lot more weight to it had Perez not gone on to beat Alonso later that year.

It's also not even relevant.

 

[BHRxRacer]

Bad news I'm afraid. Just watched the opening to Sky's coverage and Brundle said Hamilton cheated at Spain to keep the lead in the race. Hamilton on the track parade bus brought up strategy as his tool to win. Could Mercedes be punishing Nico on purpose?? Brundle also said Rosberg had to changed the clutch. Maybe we're not going to see fireworks after all.


@LMSCorvetteGT2 did you see Hamilton's onboard?

Didn't think you were allowed to say you wanted to see a driver crash.

You really believe I did or you're nitpicking..?

I'm sorry but I don't understand one thing. The yellow flag came out when Rosberg got off track and entered the escape route /off track area. What you guys are saying is that the yellow flag would disappear with Rosberg staying put in that same escape route? In any other thread I would call rubbish to such a claim, but considering 99% of the posters here are saying that (some I do respect and read for years now), I'll have to assume it is true.

That being the case, Rosberg returning to the track was indeed a very wrong move.



However, let me state this. If a car goes out at Monaco and remains off the track but not BEHIND barriers, as it happened, I would call insane to the race director that goes back to green in such conditions. If one car can go there by late braking, there's nothing preventing a second car to do the exact same thing. This is more obvious at Sainte Devote but it is also true in that corner. A car stopped in the escape route is a yellow flag until it goes out or is removed.

In the end, and if the yellows (as I think is right) wouldn't be lifted unless Rosberg got out of there, he did what he had to do.

Then again, you guys are apparently saying the track would go green again with him deep down in that alley ... hmmm

Lying masochist! How dare you go against the upper 99%?

 

[MagpieRacer]

Indeed, can we move on? So as mentioned before, turn 1 is going to be very interesting. I'm pretty sure neither Merc will do something reckless or stupid, sleeping on it I'm sure Lewis will have calmed but he'll be very, very keen to take the win now.Will he put his car in a position that Rosberg has to cede? We'll see.

As for the rest of the grid well I'm not expecting anything but a procession, it is a dry Monaco race after all. Kvyat and Magnussen should be interesting, being rookies that both made a few mistakes throughout practice. Can they hold it together the full 78 laps?

I think your right, they won't do anything reckless but I can see Hamilton just putting his car in such a place that Rosberg has no option but to back out and go 2nd up to turn 2. I believe pole is on the right of the track but I still think Hamilton will get away well enough to come across Rosberg at turn 1.

 

[Roflwaffle]

I'm expecting a "Either I win or we both crash" mentality from Lewis, as either way, he'll still be in the lead of the championship.

 

[mister dog]

3 things i find weird, he carries way to much speed in there whilst he is experienced enough @ Monaco, then he doesn't try to turn in, makes some weird steering movements and locks up at the last moment.

Then he backs up towards the track instead of parking it, knowing full well the consequences of that action on the quali of the others.

And lastly; the over excited victory dances afterwards, which seemed a bit fake in itself.

Conclusion of mister dog: guilty as charged!

 

[sems4arsenal]

So no rain?

 

[Peasantslayer]

Brundle also said Rosberg had to changed the clutch. Maybe we're not going to see fireworks after all.

So Hamilton is a dead cert for victory, great news!

 

[Lizard]

Shame about the rain not coming. Still going to be a great race. I would bet on Lewis.

My final thought on quali. Why would Nico saw the wheel? If it was deliberate all he had to do was press the brake pedal too hard.