2015 General WEC/ELMS/AsLMS Discussion ThreadSports Cars 

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More speed requires more development equals more cost, keeping the speed down could be a key ingredient into bringing another 1 or manufacturers into the sport,
 
mustafur
When you already have F1 that are much faster being complained on for being too slow this is one thing you don't do.

I was looking forward to the gap between LMP1-H and F1 closing.
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+1, that would have been very nice.
 
TDZdave
More speed requires more development equals more cost, keeping the speed down could be a key ingredient into bringing another 1 or manufacturers into the sport,
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That could be taken both ways. A far more liberal rule book could also bring more manufacturers into WEC, since you are granting them freedom to develop whatever they want.

Personally, I just want them to find a formula that doesn't make the cars slower. Just hold the speeds at the current pace, it seems ideal.
 
wowbaggerBR
That could be taken both ways. A far more liberal rule book could also bring more manufacturers into WEC, since you are granting them freedom to develop whatever they want.

Personally, I just want them to find a formula that doesn't make the cars slower. Just hold the speeds at the current pace, it seems ideal.
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Yeah I agree, I don't think 350kph should be breached, its fast enough. Id like to see the cars a touch fatter and less aero dependant, get them capable of running a little closer to each other, they already are running closer then formula 1 but get them that extra 60cm of distance closer and we could see far more overtakes,
 
TDZdave
Yeah I agree, I don't think 350kph should be breached, its fast enough. Id like to see the cars a touch fatter and less aero dependant, get them capable of running a little closer to each other, they already are running closer then formula 1 but get them that extra 60cm of distance closer and we could see far more overtakes,
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Agree about the overall aspect of the cars. They seem too tiny. I like the LMP1 models that we had until 2013. Big, imposing cars as they should be.

But I don't know if there is much to do in aero. I mean, the first two races of this season were amazing with Porsche and Audi going at each other. If ain't broke (yet, as someone will eventually get couple of seconds ahead of others), don't fix it.
 
I'd like a redesign of the cars so that the drivers sit upright in the car. At the moment they are almost laying down. That causes frontal impact energy to travel along the spinal cord.

Two Toyota drivers have had serious back injuries since they came back at Le Mans 2012. It's only a matter of time until something that can't be fixed happens to the driver of an LMP1 car.

As a side affect, that would make the cars taller and that would slow them down a bit anyway.
 
The P2 changes had to be done to keep out the one-off SMP's of the world from spending millions on 2 cars with no real intention of selling them to customers. I would like to see 6 cars instead of 4. If 6 constructors can build P2 cars and have the business model to build a dozen cars and provide spare parts on time then they should be allowed and not locked out until 2020.

Current P2 grandfathered in WEC thru '17,ELMS thru '18. The Asian Le Mans series will be the place were all of the current P2 cars will end up since they be exclusive thru '18. Mixing the new 600hp cars with the current 475 ish hp cars will be interesting. Split standings maybe?

lmp2_8861.jpg
 
IforceV8
The P2 changes had to be done to keep out the one-off SMP's of the world from spending millions on 2 cars with no real intention of selling them to customers. I would like to see 6 cars instead of 4. If 6 constructors can build P2 cars and have the business model to build a dozen cars and provide spare parts on time then they should be allowed and not locked out until 2020.
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Sorry, what is wrong with promoting competition? That's there business and not the ACO's. It's a moot point if they build a car for themselves only - nothing in the regs about "you have to sell cars to people".
 
Furinkazen
Sorry, what is wrong with promoting competition? That's there business and not the ACO's. It's a moot point if they build a car for themselves only - nothing in the regs about "you have to sell cars to people".
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Competition with rules is needed or the class will be destroyed by guys with bags of cash building cars.
 
IforceV8
SMP-BR01Nissan.jpg


A car that was built with no desire to sell them to customers.
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Which is detrimental to the class how...? It hasn't priced anyone out, P2 regs forbid major manufacturer involvement... It's some guys who want to go racing in their own design. I fail to see how that is a bad thing. The whole 4 make P2 thing also makes LMP3 almost irrelevant.
 
Furinkazen
Which is detrimental to the class how...? It hasn't priced anyone out, P2 regs forbid major manufacturer involvement... It's some guys who want to go racing in their own design. I fail to see how that is a bad thing. The whole 4 make P2 thing also makes LMP3 almost irrelevant.
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Then he can go to P1 and race against Rebellion and the money launderer.
 
So? They have a LMP2 car. Why can't they race it?

I remember! Oreca can't sell them a car, that's why! They are the catalyst of the change. I won't be surprised if it turns out that the FIA/ACO have done a FIFA!
 
IforceV8
Competition with rules is needed or the class will be destroyed by guys with bags of cash building cars.
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Irrelevant. The ACO/WEC reserved the right to modify performance if required. Besides all they needed to do was make a rule that anyone making a LMP2 car had to sell it for the cost cap if anyone with the money wanted one.

This rule stinks of deals done behind closed doors.
 
Tired Tyres
Irrelevant. The ACO/WEC reserved the right to modify performance if required. Besides all they needed to do was make a rule that anyone making a LMP2 car had to sell it for the cost cap if anyone with the money wanted one.

This rule stinks of deals done behind closed doors.
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The cost cap is already in place. SMP built a car that basically ignored the cap because they can afford to.


SK8RBOI
So? They have a LMP2 car. Why can't they race it?

I remember! Oreca can't sell them a car, that's why! They are the catalyst of the change. I won't be surprised if it turns out that the FIA/ACO have done a FIFA!
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19 P2 24hr entries-9 Onroak's, 5 Oreca's, 2 Gibsons, 2 BR01's and a Dome.
 
IforceV8
The cost cap is already in place. SMP built a car that basically ignored the cap because they can afford to.


19 P2 24hr entries-9 Onroak's, 5 Oreca's, 2 Gibsons, 2 BR01's and a Dome.
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I see what you meen about SMP but your second point I don't understand.
 
IforceV8
What part of cost capped formula do you not understand? It has nothing to do with BOP.
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I think what he's getting at is that it doesn't matter if they spend a load of money on the car to make it faster because the ACO can negate it with BOP.
 
Furinkazen
If it wasn't compliant with the cost cap it wouldn't be eligible.
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Here lies the problem the FIA/ACO have/had. They have a cap but have no real ability to enforce it. Any schmo with money can hire some guys to build him a car that in theory can be mass produced but in reality they have no plan to sell them to anybody.

“With a 450,000 Euro [cost cap], a manufacturer doesn’t make money,” he said. “The only place possible is with spares. And you have to sell between eight to ten cars to start making money.

“BR Engineering hopes to sell cars but it’s not the primary goal.”
http://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/catone-br-engineering-the-br01-is-the-first-real-new-lmp2-car/

Limiting the constructors and making them to meet certain requirements makes the process fair to those people that their sole business is building race cars and are not part of Putin's inner circle and have $1.5 Billion in gas pipelines.
 
IforceV8
Here lies the problem the FIA/ACO have/had. They have a cap but have no real ability to enforce it. Any schmo with money can hire some guys to build him a car that in theory can be mass produced but in reality they have no plan to sell them to anybody.

“With a 450,000 Euro [cost cap], a manufacturer doesn’t make money,” he said. “The only place possible is with spares. And you have to sell between eight to ten cars to start making money.

“BR Engineering hopes to sell cars but it’s not the primary goal.”
http://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/catone-br-engineering-the-br01-is-the-first-real-new-lmp2-car/

Limiting the constructors and making them to meet certain requirements makes the process fair to those people that their sole business is building race cars and are not part of Putin's inner circle and have $1.5 Billion in gas pipelines.
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Still waiting to see the great effect this has had on LMP2, anyone else seen it yet? Thought not...
 
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