Aliens

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Is there extraterrestrial life?

  • Yes, and they are not Earth like creatures (non carbon based)

    Votes: 19 2.5%
  • Yes, and they are not Earth like creatures (carbon based)

    Votes: 25 3.3%
  • Yes, and they are not Earth like creatures (carbon and non carbon based)

    Votes: 82 10.8%
  • Yes, and they are humanoid creatures

    Votes: 39 5.1%
  • Yes, and they are those associated with abductions

    Votes: 19 2.5%
  • Yes, but I don't know what they'd be like

    Votes: 379 49.8%
  • Maybe

    Votes: 151 19.8%
  • No, they only exist in movies

    Votes: 47 6.2%

  • Total voters
    761
Very sobering news from those who study the Drake Equation and the Fermi Paradox.

Although their most refined new calculations indicate there should be ~36 communicating extraterrestrial civilizations at this time, the fact is we are finding none. Given their many assumptions are correct, that means that either we as a communicating species are alone in the galaxy, or the communicating period of existence for civilizations is terminated by extinction within a thousand or so years.

 
We could use some aliens right now to clean up the mess from China.
You would think that if there really are aliens or gods hovering above Earth and supervising our destiny, that they would intervene in such a thing as a global pandemic. Or you could think that the aliens or gods are engaged in reducing our numbers or even destroying us because we have offended them in some way. Either way, it would seem that neither aliens nor gods are here to serve us. Perhaps a better story is that global humanity has overflowed the Petri dish and is in the process of finding a better balance with nature and post-industrial economics.
 
The hardest part about being a god/all powerful is knowing when to not use your power. I'm not a religious person at all, not in the least. Think of it like being a parent. If you constantly get involved when the going gets tough then the child will never learn on their own. Gotta let things play out on their own and see where they go.
 
The hardest part about being a god/all powerful is knowing when to not use your power. I'm not a religious person at all, not in the least. Think of it like being a parent. If you constantly get involved when the going gets tough then the child will never learn on their own. Gotta let things play out on their own and see where they go.
This is likely a very good insight. This may be about the same thing as the term "free will" which recurs in theological discussions.
 
...if it does exist, it is probably not going to be anything like the stereotypes most people are familiar with. More specifically, I expect bacterial and non humanoid creatures to be the most common.

So, what do you think, is there something out there, or is it only in Hollywood. I think that there is, though I don't have solid evidence.
At length, it looks as though there is solid evidence of extraterrestrial life in the atmosphere of Venus. So the OP question can now be tentatively answered in the affirmative, at least with respect to microbial life.

 
The hardest part about being a god/all powerful is knowing when to not use your power. I'm not a religious person at all, not in the least. Think of it like being a parent. If you constantly get involved when the going gets tough then the child will never learn on their own. Gotta let things play out on their own and see where they go.
Well gods are also omniscient so from the moment they spring into existence they know everything that is going to happen anyway - so there is no need to get involved.
 
The Ariel School Encounter

Objects seen for days all over region of southern Africa

60+ up-close witnesses to unusual beings of widely different ages (5-12) and social backgrounds

35 made drawings immediately after the incident

Telepathic messages/visions was delivered - These were of a dystopian nature, both clear and ominous

In the decades that have passed, none of the witnesses have altered or disavowed their stories





Personally, I highly doubt the explanation is extraterrestrials. But whatever it was, the incident itself clearly occurred.
 
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Fossilized life is reported discovered in in Taurid stream meteorite. "Contamination is excluded". Notorious British fringe scientist Wickramasinghe is involved, so we must be skeptical.
 
Top military and political figures speak about contact between humans and alien lifeforms in the here and now. The former head of the Israeli Defense Ministry spoke of a Galactic Federation and a base on Mars. Obama's head of the CIA John Brennan was open to the idea of aliens but said he wasn't sure: “I think it’s a bit presumptuous and arrogant for us to believe that there’s no other form of life anywhere in the entire universe … Some of the phenomena we’re going to be seeing continues to be unexplained and might, in fact, be some type of phenomenon that is the result of something that we don’t yet understand and that could involve some type of activity that some might say constitutes a different form of life.”

Stories of a pact between the US and aliens go back to Eisenhower meeting with aliens at an Air Force base in Southern California.

Comment; I myself do not want to believe it, since proof is lacking and my premise is ET aliens don't exist. I'll take a different choice.

The following is from New York Magazine:

DEC. 17, 2020
Senior Government Officials Keep Saying That UFOs and Aliens Are Real
By Eve Peyser
408a1522d71d7a1045effe59855339f24f-ufo--.rsquare.w700.jpg

Photo: Bettmann Archive



Are we truly alone in the universe? You and I might not know the answer to that question, but a handful of people at the highest echelons of government have started to publicly talk about how seriously they take aliens. Former Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid has been particularly vocal about this. “The federal government all these years has covered up [important information about UFOs], put brake pads on everything, stopped it,” Reid said in The Phenomenon, a documentary that came out in October. “I think it’s very, very bad for our country.”

This month, Haim Eshed, who used to helm Israel’s Defense Ministry, came forth with even more jaw-dropping claims. He told Yediot Aharonot, an Israeli newspaper, that humans have made contact with aliens, and even formed a “galactic federation.”

“There is an agreement between the U.S. government and the aliens,” he said. “They signed a contract with us to do experiments here.” He also claimed that there’s an “underground base in the depths of Mars” that hosts both American astronauts and extraterrestrial representatives to the aforementioned galactic federation.

Eshed, who ran Israel’s space program for almost 30 years, is perhaps the highest-ranking official in the military-industrial complex to make the case that humans are in contact with aliens. In the United States, no top official has said definitively that aliens are among us, but John Brennan, who ran the CIA during the Obama administration, is asking some pointed questions. “Life is defined in many different ways,” John Brennan said in a conversation with economist (and podcaster) Tyler Cowen that was released Wednesday. “I think it’s a bit presumptuous and arrogant for us to believe that there’s no other form of life anywhere in the entire universe … Some of the phenomena we’re going to be seeing continues to be unexplained and might, in fact, be some type of phenomenon that is the result of something that we don’t yet understand and that could involve some type of activity that some might say constitutes a different form of life.” In other words, some of the UFO stuff could be aliens.

Brennan’s claims are far more tame than what Eshed is positing. But he does seem, at very least, open to the idea that alien civilizations might be behind some of the stranger phenomena in our skies. “I’ve seen some of those videos from Navy pilots, and I must tell you that they are quite eyebrow-raising when you look at them,” Brennan said. But he maintains that he doesn’t know anything for sure.

NASA is having none of this, though. In a statement given to NBC News in response to Eshed’s bombshell assertions, a spokesperson for the space agency said, “Although we have yet to find signs of extraterrestrial life, NASA is exploring the solar system and beyond to help us answer fundamental questions, including whether we are alone in the universe.” Make of that what you will.

Naturally, Donald Trump is part of Eshed’s story. Trump was, according tothe Israeli, “on the verge” of revealing the existence of aliens to the general public, but was stopped by the galactic federation in order to “prevent mass hysteria.” If so, we can only hope that one of Trump’s last acts as president — maybe after preemptively pardoning Ivanka’s pet hamster — would be to reveal the truth. I’m ready for it. Are you?

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/202...ior-government-officials-keep-saying-yes.html
 
Here is a very fun hypothesis: Ultra-terrestrials

They are native to Earth and live under the surface.

 
Just finished watching ET with my two young daughters.

They asked me if ET are real...

I would have loved to have been there to see you deal with that poignant moment. We all want what's best for our children, including protecting them from false, confusing or damaging information. On the other hand, we can't coddle them forever and they need to learn to deal with problems with which they will certainly be confronted in daily life.

Our response to the question of ET reality is modulated with even more issues:

- Our (but not the whole world's) prevailing worldview of scientific materialism cautions that there is zero evidence for ET either here on Earth or anywhere else. We don't want to fly in the face of our own dogma or undergo cognitive dissonance.

- In the quotidian world, the meme of ET is running loose on media for generations and is very firmly established in popular consciousness. That ship has sailed.

- Official information on the question is scarce, mostly classified, and even when released is full of redactions and remains inconclusive.

- The drip-drip of government and mainstream US media disclosure has accelerated sharply in recent years, yet the proof is always just around the next corner. One imagines that this process is managed by agencies such as the CIA and private contractors not subject to FOIA. Their mandate may be more about social stability than factual answers to cosmic level questions.

- Probably the world's foremost published authority on the question, French astronomer and computer scientist Jacques Vallee, has in numerous media advanced the view that ET is not the source of the unexplained phenomena, but involves even more complexity such as dimensions.
 
Scientists attempt to justify speculation about alien life already here on Earth.
I prefer other explanations, but can't deny it's possible.

Scientists theorize that space aliens may already be here, but we don’t recognize them


Stargazing scientists have recently begun to focus on the prospect of encountering intelligent extraterrestrials, and the more they think about it the more they realize the first meeting probably won’t be with little green men in flying saucers.

What aliens might look like is a growing question among astrobiologists, who are increasingly conjuring up creatures more Lilliputian than mega-brained or reptilian.

“The intriguing possibility is they are, in fact, here, but we just don’t know it,” said Andrew Fraknoi, the emeritus chairman of the astronomy department at Foothill College who recently taught a course on aliens at the University of San Francisco’s Fromm Institute and believes space aliens could very well be microscopic or unrecognizable as a life-form.

Fraknoi is on the board of the Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence, known as the SETI Institute, based in Mountain View, where questions about alien civilizations are often discussed. He has long speculated that members of a civilization billions of years old might by now have evolved into a mechanical-biological mix, like a robot with a brain, capable of living for thousands of years as they travel through space.

But it is also possible, he said, that advanced civilizations would have sent into space thousands of tiny canisters holding the germs of life programmed to incubate and grow when they encounter suitable conditions around a star.

“In all the mathematical models, a species that started early in the history of the galaxy and had the will and resources to diffuse could by now have filled many parts of the galaxy with its artifacts or biological spores,” Fraknoi said.

The otherworldly speculation comes after the recent discovery of two interstellar objects zipping past Earth prompted a surge of interest among scientists in space travel and alien civilizations.

A spinning, red, cigar-shaped object called 1I/Oumuamua was spotted in 2017, followed by the sighting last year of a comet named 2I/Borisov. They were the first verified sightings in human history of objects speeding by from outside our solar system.

The objects, by their very existence, brought home to many astronomers the reality that rocks or vessels potentially carrying biological spores from other solar systems could actually reach Earth.

The notion got a major boost from Avi Loeb, the chair of Harvard University’s astronomy department. He co-wrote a scientific paper suggesting that Oumuamua’s odd, elongated shape and peculiar nongravitational acceleration could mean it is a mechanical probe — a light sail driven by sunshine — sent by an alien civilization.

The object, first spotted by the University of Hawaii’s Institute for Astronomy, was, by all accounts, strange. Observations from Earth as it shot past the sun on Sept. 9, 2017, at a speed of 196,000 mph showed that it was slowly spinning, like a bottle on its side, and that it was missing the tail of gas or dust that would signify a comet.

Astronomers around the world immediately attacked Loeb’s hypothesis, and a subsequent study published in Nature Astronomy last year concluded that Oumuamua was a rocky conglomeration, not a space ship.

But Loeb said his point was that objects like Oumuamua and Borisov could have been synthetic and that humans would be well served by developing techniques for determining if such visitors were constructed. He believes the possibility of extraterrestrial life is too important for humans to discount without investigation, especially considering how useful it would be in figuring out the origin of life.

“Intelligent life is more recent in the Earth’s history, but at the same time, given that it happened here, there is the possibility that it exists elsewhere,” Loeb said. “I don’t think we should pretend that we are the only ones — the smartest kid on the block — because very likely we aren’t the smartest kid on the block.”

The questions about what form alien beings might take are rooted in what is known as the Fermi paradox, named after Italian American physicist Enrico Fermi, who created the first nuclear reactor. He asked during a casual lunchtime conversation in 1950 why aliens have never been spotted, given the high probability of their existence.

SETI has been searching the skies for radio signals or some other sign of life beyond Earth for nearly four decades without a single peep.

Despite the failure, belief in the existence of extraterrestrial civilizations has only increased since Fermi’s time. That’s largely because powerful telescopes have recently detected numerous planets orbiting their stars at a habitable distance, known as the Goldilocks zone. Calculations indicate there are habitable planets around at least a quarter of the tens of billions of stars in the Milky Way Galaxy, possibly including the closest star, Proxima Centauri, 4.2 light-years from Earth.

Most astrophysicists believe life must have sprung up somewhere, some time, in the 13.5 billion years since the galaxy was formed. Given that our sun is 4.6 billion years old, Fraknoi said civilizations in other parts of the galaxy could have been using robotics, artificial intelligence and tapping the energy from their stars as many as 8 billion years before our solar system was created.

“In other words,” Fraknoi said, “there has been ample time for a civilization to become advanced enough to send alien microbes or micro-artifacts around the galaxy, including to our solar system.”

Astronomers have even concocted a sciency name, “directed panspermia,” to describe the act by an alien civilization of planting the seeds of life in another world.

Samantha Rolfe, a lecturer in astrobiology at Bayfordbury Observatory at the University of Hertfordshire in England, suggested recently that such organisms could be hidden inside what she called a microscopic “shadow biosphere” that is so different from ours that we don’t even recognize it as biological in origin.

“So why haven’t we found it? We have limited ways of studying the microscopic world as only a small percentage of microbes can be cultured in a lab,” she wrote in an article for the Conversation website. “We do now have the ability to sequence the DNA of unculturable strains of microbes, but this can only detect life as we know it — that contain DNA.”

Some have suggested that these alien life-forms could be small inactive spores floating in our solar system waiting for the right conditions to grow or as active monitors — transmitters — used by alien civilizations to determine whether Earthlings are a threat and might need to be eliminated.

Then again, a growing number of astronomers speculate that humanity itself might have originated somewhere else, possibly clinging to a chunk of rock ejected from a planet that was hit by a giant meteor.

“We know there are rocks on Earth that came from Mars, so you could imagine that microbes could have potentially survived the journey,” Loeb said. “So it’s possible we are all Martians. If you can do it from Mars, you can potentially bring life from other planets in other galaxies.”

https://www.sfchronicle.com/science...ze-that-space-aliens-may-already-15061387.php
 
I do not believe extraterrestrial aliens are visiting Earth, although I can't deny it may be possible someday. We've never detected them, but now we have a new tool to search with. The very recent technological development of gravity wave observatories gives us a new ability to listen to the universe as well as see it.
"The 2016 discovery of gravity waves and our newfound ability to detect them passed without the deserved fanfare. Gravity wave observatories literally give us a brand new way to observe the universe. Now is an incredibly exciting time in astronomy. We literally have no idea what we might discover! Among the possibilities, is discovering signs of intelligent extraterrestrial life."


 
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I do not believe ET is responsible for the UAP phenomena, it's more complicated than that. Nevertheless, major media is discussing the reality of it, what we should feel about it, and how we should respond to it. I get it that most people on GTP don't want to think about. It's okay. But some of the working people in media, military and government are having to take increased interest, whether they want to or not.


From the Washington Post:

The hard-working staff here at Spoiler Alerts has probably written close to 2,000 columns since coming to The Washington Post. Among those that generated a steady stream of responses was one from 2019 headlined UFOs exist and everyone needs to adjust to that fact.” That column did not say that aliens have visited Earth. Among the things it did say was that there literally are objects flying around that no one, including U.S. Navy pilots, can identify, and we have to puzzle out what that means.

In the two years since that column appeared, the U.S. government continues to tiptoe toward the normalization of the idea of unidentified flying objects (UFOs). Last year the Department of Defense released three videos (one recorded in 2004 and the other two in 2015) of U.S. Navy pilots seeing something and having no idea what it was. In its news release, the Pentagon said, “the aerial phenomena observed in the videos remain characterized as ‘unidentified,’” putting the U in UFO.

The Pentagon went further in August 2020, announcing the establishment of an Unidentified Aerial Phenomena (UAP) Task Force. Beyond developing a new abbreviation that is less loaded than UFO, the Pentagon explained, “The mission of the task force is to detect, analyze and catalog UAPs that could potentially pose a threat to U.S. national security.”

Then, 10 days ago, former director of national intelligence John Ratcliffe went on Fox News and made a whole bunch of claims about what the U.S. intelligence community knew about UAPs, including that a Pentagon report would soon be released revealing even more information. According to the New York Post’s Tamar Lapin and Jackie Salo:

“There are a lot more sightings than have been made public,” he told host Maria Bartiromo. “Some of those have been declassified.”
“And when we talk about sightings,” Ratcliffe continued, “we are talking about objects that have been seen by Navy or Air Force pilots, or have been picked up by satellite imagery that frankly engage in actions that are difficult to explain.”
“Movements that are hard to replicate that we don’t have the technology for. Or traveling at speeds that exceed the sound barrier without a sonic boom.”

Still, it would appear that in June there will be an official U.S. government report acknowledging the existence of UFOs or UAPs or whatever you want to call them.

It is increasingly respectable to acknowledge that unidentified aerial phenomena are a thing. But this leads to a few follow-up questions. Does this evidence point toward the prospect of extraterrestrial observation of our planet? If so, how should we feel about that?


I am not going to speculate on the first question beyond noting that if Harvard astrophysicists are making that suggestion about interstellar phenomena, perhaps we need at least to consider the possibility that these UAPs might also be extraterrestrial in origin.

The more interesting question is how we should respond to this.
There has been increasing apprehension on the part of some very smart people about contacting extraterrestrials. In 2010, Stephen Hawking told the Discovery Channel, “If aliens visit us, the outcome would be much as when Columbus landed in America, which didn’t turn out well for the Native Americans.” Similarly, physicist Mark Buchanan argued in 2016, “Any civilization detecting our presence is likely to be technologically very advanced, and may not be disposed to treat us nicely. At the very least, the idea seems morally questionable.”

If UAPs are extraterrestrials, however, this is a different scenario: It is not humans contacting extraterrestrials but rather those extraterrestrials actively observing us. Furthermore, they seem to be doing so in a way that is not destructive.

That is promising
! Observation without the intent to destroy suggests a civilization that is much less violent than, say, Spanish conquistadors.

Furthermore, it might be better for U.S. national security if these UAPs turn out to be ETs.
Sen. Marco Rubio (R-Fla.) told the New York Post, “Frankly, that if it’s something from outside this planet — that might actually be better than the fact that we’ve seen some technological leap on behalf of the Chinese or the Russians or some other adversary that allows them to conduct this activity.”

I get the concern from physicists that technologically advanced extraterrestrials might behave as powerful human civilizations have in the past. But maybe the concerned physicists should engage a little more with social scientists. The assumption is that powerful, technologically advanced civilizations will act in a destructive manner. That is possible, but perhaps civilizations that reward destructive entrepreneurship are less likely to generate the technological wherewithal for interstellar travel. And if those UAPs are ETs, maybe there is more hope for interstellar relations than either scientists or science fiction envision.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/04/01/we-need-talk-about-ufos-again/
 
Pentagon confirms latest military photos and videos as authentic, i.e., taken by Navy personnel. Included are photos of spheres, cylinders and "acorns", as well as video of trans-medium objects and flying pyramids.

Photos and video are linked from article.
This week, multiple photographs and a video, was “leaked” to the general public by George Knapp at MysteryWire.com and Jeremy Corbell from ExtraordinaryBeliefs.com. The Pentagon has now confirmed to The Black Vault via e-mail, that the photos and videos leaked this week, all were taken by Navy personnel.

“I can confirm that the referenced photos and videos were taken by Navy personnel. The UAPTF has included these incidents in their ongoing examinations,” said Susan Gough, Pentagon Spokesperson. “As we have said before, to maintain operations security and to avoid disclosing information that may be useful to potential adversaries, DOD does not discuss publicly the details of either the observations or the examinations of reported incursions into our training ranges or designated airspace, including those incursions initially designated as UAP.”

However, Gough refused to confirm whether they remain “unidentified,” or are used as training material for identifiable objects, or remain unknowns. “I have nothing further for you beyond what I provided,” Gough stated. No additional information was provided.


UFO-PICS-JELLYFISH-300x169.jpg

“The Sphere” – One of the leaked US Navy photographs, now confirmed as genuine.


https://www.theblackvault.com/documentarchive/pentagon-confirms-recent-uap-ufo-leaks-as-genuine/
 
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Have you ever heard of UAP? It is the name for UFOs used in Governments.


UAP = Unidentified Arial Phenomenon
 
Have you ever heard of UAP? It is the name for UFOs used in Governments.


UAP = Unidentified Arial Phenomenon
Aside from the term being in both of his previous two posts, he has an entire thread on it, which he bizarrely and resolutely refuses to use - despite attempting to make it a safe space, and repeatedly claiming he doesn't automatically link UFOs with extraterrestrial life.
 
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Have you ever heard of UAP? It is the name for UFOs used in Governments.


UAP = Unidentified Arial Phenomenon
Is that when someone refuses to use Comic Sans font?

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Note to myself, read before you post.
My apologies for the snark, at least you are fluent in two languages while I have enough problems with one. Anyone can make a typo.
 
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Have you ever heard of UAP? It is the name for UFOs used in Governments.


UAP = Unidentified Arial Phenomenon
Yes, sometimes UAP is unfortunately synonymous with UFO.

The term UFO came into usage in the 1940's, as US atomic energy facilities of all kinds noted their incursions. In WWII, my father was assigned to bombardment group that atom bombed Hiroshima, which was later assigned as the 509th to Roswell, New Mexico. So I heard all about UFOs starting in the 1950's. But the term became stigmatized over the years, as the military and CIA attempted to debunk the phenomena.

More recently, the US government has been unable to suppress military disclosure and public awareness of the phenomena, so chooses to use the term UAP, partly to avoid the stigma and association with aliens. Aliens of course have never been shown to exist anywhere in the universe. But the UAP phenomena are real and are under scrutiny by the government as potential threats, as they exhibit performance defying our current understanding of physics. Government scientists think they may be the key to advanced technology. By act of Congress, the government is now required to issue regular reports on the phenomena and what is causing it. But typically, the armed forces are resistant.

The phenomena goes back much further than the 1940's, possibly many thousands of years, raising the likelihood that it is native to our planet and not alien at all.

Because of the stigma and giggle factor associated with UFO and aliens, I made a thread which tries to take the UAP phenomena seriously without touching upon the alien question. When I come across significant UAP news that focuses or mentions aliens, I will post it here. When the news and discussion is more fact based and technical questions about UAP, I prefer to use that other thread.

Recent Director of the CIA, John Brennan, has said that "another form of life" may be involved. But that is certainly not necessarily alien.
 
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Sorry double post.

I have always found it suspicious that victims from alien abductions always report medical experiments with, what seems to be, simple medical instruments that cause excruciating pain. You would think that beings who have the technology to travel vast distances across the universe would have very complicated medical stuff to examine people without pain.

It is probably:
  1. People are hypnothised/drugged and illegally examined by other humans posing as aliens.
  2. I forgot what I wanted to say but it made sense (in my mind). :ouch:
 
I have always found it suspicious that victims from alien abductions always report medical experiments with, what seems to be, simple medical instruments that cause excruciating pain. You would think that beings who have the technology to travel vast distances across the universe would have very complicated medical stuff to examine people without pain.

You'd think so, but we can look at humans and note that we're not always particularly careful to avoid causing pain in what we consider to be lower life forms when we're studying them. There's no particular reason why we should expect advanced aliens to treat us better than we treat animals.

You might think that with higher technology might automatically come greater attentiveness to moral concerns, but again we can look at human history to see that's not necessarily the case. The US has been at the forefront of technology for the last century or more, but is still struggling with the idea that people with skin that isn't white should be treated the same as everyone else.

I agree that it's unlikely to be aliens, but the fact that "abductions" are regularly painful isn't really evidence against the idea.
 
You'd think so, but we can look at humans and note that we're not always particularly careful to avoid causing pain in what we consider to be lower life forms when we're studying them. There's no particular reason why we should expect advanced aliens to treat us better than we treat animals.

You might think that with higher technology might automatically come greater attentiveness to moral concerns, but again we can look at human history to see that's not necessarily the case. The US has been at the forefront of technology for the last century or more, but is still struggling with the idea that people with skin that isn't white should be treated the same as everyone else.

I agree that it's unlikely to be aliens, but the fact that "abductions" are regularly painful isn't really evidence against the idea.
Indeed. I didn't consider the moral part of this. But if you take out the moral part, don't you think that from a technical standpoint, these so called aliens should have much more advanced medical procedures?

I though like the idea of aliens, if they are benign, helpful and friendly. But as long as there is no real proof, it is only a belief.
 

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