Anonymous get details to 90k Members of Staff in Military

[TommyWizard]

http://www.thetechgame.com/News/sid...-login-details-of-90k-military-personnel.html

Wow. Die Hard 4.0 for real anyone?

 

[The Bman]

What next? The U.S. Power Grid?!?!

Seriously, Anonymous should realise what would happen if a terrorist group found this out.

 

[CMvan46]

I'm sure they already know. Media should realize what could happen...

I'm not sure but could that not be considered a terrorist threat? I think they bit off more than they can chew with that one there.

 

[jjaisli]

I'm not sure but could that not be considered a terrorist threat? I think they bit off more than they can chew with that one there.

Indeed, they're treading on very thin ice. There has been all kinds of talk lately about treating cyber terrorists as enemy combatants. The next thing you know, a few are going to end up dead. I bet it won't be so funny anymore after that.

 

[Luminis]

The next thing you know, a few are going to end up dead. I bet it won't be so funny anymore after that.

Turning some of them into martyrs is probably going to just fan the flames... Personally, I think Anonymous kinda did this to make sure that the government knows fully well that even they are susceptile to their attacks. And, really, I wouldn't mind if someone was to drag all the dirty laundry they found there to the surface...

Especially if they're harder to shut up than Julian Assange.

 

[CMvan46]

Turning some of them into martyrs is probably going to just fan the flames... Personally, I think Anonymous kinda did this to make sure that the government knows fully well that even they are susceptile to their attacks. And, really, I wouldn't mind if someone was to drag all the dirty laundry they found there to the surface...

Especially if they're harder to shut up than Julian Assange.

They don't have enough brain cells in their head to think deeply enough. That IS NOT their decision to make and in my opinion should be seen as an attack on the American government and it's army. God why do I feel that strongly... I'm Canadian.

 

[Luminis]

They don't have enough brain cells in their head to think deeply enough. That IS NOT their decision to make and in my opinion should be seen as an attack on the American government and it's army. God why do I feel that strongly... I'm Canadian.

Dunno. If they are capable of braking into the military's IT systems, they can't be that stupid. Plus, I'm pretty certain that most governments have done enough immoral things themselves, so whether it's their decision to make or not, getting soome of that stuff dragged out for the general public to take notice of isn't something I'd be opposed to.

But I'm pretty sure the US will consider it an attack of some sort, sooner or later, I think that's out of the question. Thing is, will they be able to stop Anonymous?

 

[CaptainHarlock]

Dunno. If they are capable of braking into the military's IT systems, they can't be that stupid. Plus, I'm pretty certain that most governments have done enough immoral things themselves, so whether it's their decision to make or not, getting soome of that stuff dragged out for the general public to take notice of isn't something I'd be opposed to.

But I'm pretty sure the US will consider it an attack of some sort, sooner or later, I think that's out of the question. Thing is, will they be able to stop Anonymous?

Actually they ARE that stupid. What part of the brain does someone lack that would make them say "Let's break into the Department of Defense's computer system! That's a great idea!!". Reasonable people don't do this kind of thing. Why? Because they fear getting caught and going to prison. These people have no fear of incarceration, and they have no compunctions about what they're doing. That's indicative of sociopathic behavior. Justifying this type of thing by saying "it's okay, they did it just to let the government know they could" is not an excuse.

I wouldn't be surprised if members suddenly started to "disappear".

 

[Luminis]

Actually they ARE that stupid. What part of the brain does someone lack that would make them say "Let's break into the Department of Defense's computer system! That's a great idea!!". Reasonable people don't do this kind of thing. Why? Because they fear getting caught and going to prison. These people have no fear of incarceration, and they have no compunctions about what they're doing. That's indicative of sociopathic behavior.

Being sociopathic and unreasonable doesn't equal being stupid, does it?

Justifying this type of thing by saying "it's okay, they did it just to let the government know they could" is not an excuse.

I'm not trying to justify it, but I can see their motivation to do so. That's all there is to it.

Also, as I said earlier, I'd rather see them hack the government's systems than, say, PSN. Basically, because I think our political leaders are some of the biggest crooks there are, especially after the whole WikiLeaks ordeal.

I wouldn't be surprised if members suddenly started to "disappear".

And I wouldn't be suprised if that would start to cause even more mayhem, for the reasons mentioned above.

 

[Bigbazz]

Personally, given what they have been able to do they are likely far more intelligent than those responsible for protecting said data. Because they do something that is not what you consider "reasonable/good/rational" does not make them stupid.

What they have done on pretty much assures you that they are more intelligent than your average joe. Though, if they get caught they are pretty screwed.

 

[jjaisli]

Also, as I said earlier, I'd rather see them hack the government's systems than, say, PSN. Basically, because I think our political leaders are some of the biggest crooks there are, especially after the whole WikiLeaks ordeal.

Luminis, think about what they did. They didn't post details of 'secret deals' where some apparently clean politicians were taking bribes or involved in scandals or illicit activity. They weren't releasing information that could get political leaders impeached or at least, embarrass them. They released email addresses and passwords for the Marines, the State Department and, worse still, Homeland Security. That information in the wrong hands could get a lot of innocent people killed.

If they broke in, one thing. If they broke in, then contacted the organizations to tell them, Hey, nitwits, you need to beef up your security, look what we were able to do, more power to them. But to break in, and post all this information to the public? Are you kidding? There's nothing to defend or justify.

 

[Luminis]

Personally, given what they have been able to do they are likely far more intelligent than those responsible for protecting said data. Because they do something that is not what you consider "reasonable/good/rational" does not make them stupid.

What they have done on pretty much assures you that they are more intelligent than your average joe.

Pretty much what I was saying, yes.

Though, if they get caught they are pretty screwed.

Yup. Still, as far as I know, Anonymous is more of a collective, really, so there's more than your five to ten people to dispose off. Also, a few members of Anonymous have already been arrested, at least according to Wikipedia. Didn't really do anything to stop the rest of them, though.

Luminis, think about what they did. They didn't post details of 'secret deals' where some apparently clean politicians were taking bribes or involved in scandals or illicit activity. They weren't releasing information that could get political leaders impeached or at least, embarrass them. They released email addresses and passwords for the Marines, the State Department and, worse still, Homeland Security. That information in the wrong hands could get a lot of innocent people killed.

Aren't you a bit melodramatic here? I for one am not sure what kind of information has been snatched by the hackers, but from what the article stated, it doesn't seem like something that you'd be able to use to outright kill people.
Sure, I don't think it's right to people that haven't done anything wrong through hardship by releasing their personal info to the web, but, really, I don't think that's much different from what happened to PSN.

It just appears that for some people, their patriotic spirit kicks in when it's about the military.

If they broke in, one thing. If they broke in, then contacted the organizations to tell them, Hey, nitwits, you need to beef up your security, look what we were able to do, more power to them. But to break in, and post all this information to the public? Are you kidding? There's nothing to defend or justify.

I'm neither defending nor justifing this, I just can see where they are coming from. I don't think it's right to do what they're doing, but I think that various governments (not just the US's) have brought such behaviour upon themselves by their own actions.

It's a bad thing that this is causing 'collateral damage', though.

 

[DromeGT]

I hope these kids get caught, hacking doesn't make you cool. They only do this because they can "hide" behind a computer.

 

[CaptainHarlock]

Being sociopathic and unreasonable doesn't equal being stupid, does it?


I'm not trying to justify it, but I can see their motivation to do so. That's all there is to it.

Also, as I said earlier, I'd rather see them hack the government's systems than, say, PSN. Basically, because I think our political leaders are some of the biggest crooks there are, especially after the whole WikiLeaks ordeal.


And I wouldn't be suprised if that would start to cause even more mayhem, for the reasons mentioned above.

Yes, because a black van pulling up with men in suits and glasses asking you to "please get in the van, sir" would make front page news every where. You don't mess with these guys. They have more resources than you can possibly know.

Yes our leaders are crooks and liars, but these guys are not Robin Hood, and they shouldn't be built up into him.

 

[jjaisli]

Aren't you a bit melodramatic here?

I'm neither defending nor justifing this, I just can see where they are coming from. I don't think it's right to do what they're doing, but I think that various governments (not just the US's) have brought such behaviour upon themselves by their own actions.

No, I'm not. But neither am I naive enough to overlook the kind of potential damage this could do. Do you have any idea what sort of sensitive information could be going through state department emails? They could be talking about known gaps in security. Potential security breaches that need tightening. Internal lapses that need to be addressed. They could be discussing surveillance of groups about to plant a bomb in a crowded city and potentially alert them to scatter off and disappear and try again another day. I doubt anybody directly involved in the hacking would do something harmful with this information, but now that they've been nice enough to post this, who knows what kind of people had access to that information before it was shut down and passwords were changed.

It's one thing to be cynical about big government and the injustices created by policy dictated by money and greed. It's another to think opening up such sensitive information is just fine. Wake up. Would you think differently if Anonymous posted all passwords and and email accounts for Interpol, so that any criminal out there on the run could potentially see how close they are to being caught and use that information to elude capture?

Freedom of information is one thing. What they're doing is unconscionable.

 

[thepineapple1]

Do you have any idea what sort of sensitive information could be going through state department emails? They could be talking about known gaps in security. Potential security breaches that need tightening.

DO YOU?
Sensitive information is never discussed in something as accesable as emails.
That stuff is written on paper, memorised and dispossed of.

You've been watching too many movies, because the most 'secret' information they would discuss is wether or not to have a surprise bday party for Bob from the 3rd floor.

 

[jjaisli]

DO YOU?
Sensitive information is never discussed in something as accesable as emails.
That stuff is written on paper, memorised and dispossed of.

Really? Do they eat it too? And I'm the one watching too many movies.

 

[Luminis]

Yes, because a black van pulling up with men in suits and glasses asking you to "please get in the van, sir" would make front page news every where. You don't mess with these guys. They have more resources than you can possibly know.

You're acting like they know each and every of Anonymous' members. And, yes, it's not like they haven't been persecuted yet. Even Wikipedia states that some havee already been arested.

See, I'm not saying the individual members can't be caught, I'm saying that it's going to be hard to stop the whole group with just that.

Yes our leaders are crooks and liars, but these guys are not Robin Hood, and they shouldn't be built up into him.

Robin Hood? No, they aren't, I suppose. But they're not the new generation of Al Qaida, either.

No, I'm not. But neither am I naive enough to overlook the kind of potential damage this could do. Do you have any idea what sort of sensitive information could be going through state department emails?

Sensitive date? Do you really think they're using email to send some top secret stuff around? I kinda doubt that... See, I'm working at just a bank and I suppose that our security levels are nowhere near what a government related agency would incorporate, but even we wouldn't send truly sensitive informationa round using emails.

They could be talking about known gaps in security. Potential security breaches that need tightening. Internal lapses that need to be addressed. They could be discussing surveillance of groups about to plant a bomb in a crowded city and potentially alert them to scatter off and disappear and try again another day.

Who in their right mind would do that? I mean, would you risk sending info like that around in emails when enemies that truly mean harm are likely to employ hackers themselves? I can't believe the US military would be that stupid.

I doubt anybody directly involved in the hacking would do something harmful with this information, but now that they've been nice enough to post this, who knows what kind of people had access to that information before it was shut down and passwords were changed.

Since you're just making assumption, maybe I should, too? Hey, I assume that Anonymous made sure there were no email accounts of higher ups released, so that stuff like that can't happen. There, just as factual as your assumptions.

It's one thing to be cynical about big government and the injustices created by policy dictated by money and greed. It's another to think opening up such sensitive information is just fine. Wake up. Would you think differently if Anonymous posted all passwords and and email accounts for Interpol, so that any criminal out there on the run could potentially see how close they are to being caught and use that information to elude capture?

Again, I would raise the question as to whomever would be dumb enough to spread information this sensitive via email? That's why I'm thinking you're blowing this way out of proportion. Do you really think someone's going to make an .avi of a briefing session for a military operation and then send it around via email?

Freedom of information is one thing. What they're doing is unconscionable.

Oh, I don't claim otherwise, they obviously are willing to accept colleteral damage, which I don't like. But, the end justifies the means, if you're asking me, at least as long as they're not directly inflicting harm onto innocent people.

DO YOU?
Sensitive information is never discussed in something as accesable as emails.
That stuff is written on paper, memorised and dispossed of.

You've been watching too many movies, because the most 'secret' information they would discuss is wether or not to have a surprise bday party for Bob from the 3rd floor.

That is what they should've been doing, at the very least.

 

[CMvan46]

Yes actually they are stupid and yes all of these guys could be caught. They are stupid because as others have said you don't hack into the DOD without having a few screws loose.

It's not their decision to decide that the government is making the wrong moral choices. If you don't like how things are done do it the legal and rightful way. That's thee beauty of democracy and it's not a right everybody has. I really hope the US looks at this as an act of terrorism or atleast something similar and that these idiots are treated in that manor.

If these guys responsible are American would this not be seen as an act of treason? It is after all a cyber attack on the government and it's soldiers.

 

[Owen.C93]

I would rather see security ramped up than random people of anonymous prosecuted.

 

[Luminis]

Yes actually they are stupid and yes all of these guys could be caught. They are stupid because as others have said you don't hack into the DOD without having a few screws loose.

Again, how does being unreasonable equal being stupid? Where the guys that resisted against the Nazis before and during the Second World War stupid because they could've been caught for doing what they believed was the right thing to do? (Please note that I don't want to liken the American government to the Nazis, I'm just trying to make a point about doing something that's possibly endangering you.)

It's not their decision to decide that the government is making the wrong moral choices. If you don't like how things are done do it the legal and rightful way. That's thee beauty of democracy and it's not a right everybody has. I really hope the US looks at this as an act of terrorism or atleast something similar and that these idiots are treated in that manor.

Is it their decision? No, it's not. I don't see anything wrong with trying to actually enable us to judge our governments based on what they are really doing instead of the lies they're feeding us.

See, that's why I can agree with doing what they do,- to an extend. Blind faith in democracy is nice, but do you really think that by voting for a different party things are going to change? I've witnessed different parties reigning over Germany, in varying coalitions, for example. Now, do you think one single thing changed?

Also, remember the stuff they claimed about finding out about various corrupt politicians? Is that the democracy that you're willing to rely on? Last but not least, if the software that Anonymous supposedly found out about due to their attack (which they codenamed 'Metal Gear'), I'd really start to think twice about how effective those 'legal ways' are.

Edit: On the whole matter, read this. Anonymous actually explains themselves, to a degree. How can democracy work of the people don't even know what their government is doing?
THat's something I think they got right: It can't work that way.

If these guys responsible are American would this not be seen as an act of treason? It is after all a cyber attack on the government and it's soldiers.

Whether it is or not, I doubt the American government (or any government) will be able to get rid of all of Anonymous. I'd think they'd already have done so if they were able to. Let's face it, governments are not omnipotent.

But, yeah, it'd be oh so convenient to just deport them to, dunno, Guantanamo Bay, wouldn't it?

 

[CaptainHarlock]

Don't even equate hacking into the United States Department of Defense with fighting Nazi tyranny. That doesn't even come close, and I shouldn't even have to explain why.

Seriously though, they claim they are on the side of democracy, but what do they really accomplish? How does stealing the password of some Lance Corporal at Fort Hood accomplish anything? Or hacking into the account of some enlisted woman who's doing clerical work at the Pentagon? Or some poor guy over in Iraq, who didn't ask to be there mind you, who's sweating it out in the desert, and only wants to make it home to see his wife and kids? Those people have absolutely nothing to do with the "corrupt politicians". How is this serving the greater good that a career Sergeant at Fort Dix has to change his password? It seems it's, to paraphrase William Shakespeare, full of sound and fury signifying nothing. Unfortunately they leave a swath of destruction in their wake, and don't even realize it. A friend of mine once asked what's more destructive? The beetle that kills for singularly for survival? Or a stampeding elephant that destroys everything in it's path without knowing it does so? The latter seems to apply to these guys.

They want to expose corruption, that's all well and good, but this is the way to do it? Who's made a larger impact? Anonymous? Or Jon Stewart host of The Daily Show? He exposes corruption on a nightly basis, and has even influenced elections, and he didn't have to break the law to accomplish it. You can have an impact, and still remain within the confines of the law.

It may seem cliche', but I've often said that it's a shame that many of the "gamer" generation didn't grow up when I did. Why? Because when I grew up I was reading Marvel Comics, which you may look at with cynical disinterest, but they were actually lessons in morality. The one that stuck with me and still resonates to this day; With great power comes great responsibility. Something that's sorely needed in the 21st century.

 

[Luminis]

Don't even equate hacking into the United States Department of Defense with fighting Nazi tyranny. That doesn't even come close, and I shouldn't even have to explain why.

All I'm saying is that putting yourself at risk for something you believe in isn't neccesarily a sign of stupidity, as there are examples of when we can freely agree that it was the right thing to do.
This also goes hand in hand with the fact that history is written by the winners...

Seriously though, they claim they are on the side of democracy, but what do they really accomplish? How does stealing the password of some Lance Corporal at Fort Hood accomplish anything? Or hacking into the account of some enlisted woman who's doing clerical work at the Pentagon? Or some poor guy over in Iraq, who didn't ask to be there mind you, who's sweating it out in the desert, and only wants to make it home to see his wife and kids? Those people have absolutely nothing to do with the "corrupt politicians". How is this serving the greater good that a career Sergeant at Fort Dix has to change his password?

As I said, I don't agree with them inflicting hardship on those who are, in fact, not responsible for what Anonymous is supposedly trying to fight against (which I've said, like, three times already). Does that change a thing about their initial cuase and goals? Personally, I don't think.

It does prove one thing, though: They were there, and they got themselves some actual data. 90k login accounts and passwords, which are related to exisiting people, are somewhat of an evidence that they were succesful in hacking into the government's systems, as opposed to claims about, say, that 'Metal Gear' software alone.

I doubt anyone would've taken stuff like that remotely serious, especially if it was demented by the government, if it wasn't for that kind of 'proof' they were there.

It seems it's, to paraphrase William Shakespeare, full of sound and fury signifying nothing. Unfortunately they leave a swath of destruction in their wake, and don't even realize it. A friend of mine once asked what's more destructive? The beetle that kills for singularly for survival? Or a stampeding elephant that destroys everything in it's path without knowing it does so? The latter seems to apply to these guys.

A swath of destruction? Dunno about you, but a swath of destruction is, to me, a bit different than what we've seen happening hear. This isn't the same thing as in Die Hard 4.0.
Also, somehow, leaving a 'swath of destruction' was okay when bringing 'democracy' to Iraq, why wouldn't it be okay if you're trying to bring democracy to the US, or any other country? Just because people think there's already a working democracy in place there? Because it's not a nation that's acting this way, but a group of activists?

They want to expose corruption, that's all well and good, but this is the way to do it? Who's made a larger impact? Anonymous? Or Jon Stewart host of The Daily Show? He exposes corruption on a nightly basis, and has even influenced elections, and he didn't have to break the law to accomplish it. You can have an impact, and still remain within the confines of the law.

I'd say, depending on what you want to expose, yes, actions like these are a necessity. I for one am fairly certain that there's lots of government actions that most people would disagree with that wasn't brought to the attention of the public, and wouldn't be of it wasn't for the likes of Anonymous.

It may seem cliche', but I've often said that it's a shame that many of the "gamer" generation didn't grow up when I did. Why? Because when I grew up I was reading Marvel Comics, which you may look at with cynical disinterest, but they were actually lessons in morality. The one that stuck with me and still resonates to this day; With great power comes great responsibility. Something that's sorely needed in the 21st century.

So, reading Marvel Comics made you a better person then those who are younger than you?

For one thing, I welcome the attitude to not sit around and watch idly while the system is going down the drain. Because, responsibility also means to use once's power if needed. Isn't that something the Marvel Comics taught you as well?

 

[jjaisli]

As I said, I don't agree with them inflicting hardship on those who are, in fact, not responsible for what Anonymous is supposedly trying to fight against (which I've said, like, three times already). Does that change a thing about their initial cuase and goals? Personally, I don't think.

What goals? That load of tripe they write? And because of that, you buy into it, hook, line and sinker. Congratulations. They're not out there for democracy, Luminis. They're a bunch of feckless, lawless, twits that are out there using their hacking skills because they think they're above the law. They're criminals. And they should be treated as such. But they write a bunch of baloney and you're just caught up in the romanticism of it all and cheer them on. Ahh, youth today.

 

[CMvan46]

What goals? That load of tripe they write? And because of that, you buy into it, hook, line and sinker. Congratulations. They're not out there for democracy, Luminis. They're a bunch of feckless, lawless, twits that are out there using their hacking skills because they think they're above the law. They're criminals. And they should be treated as such. But they write a bunch of baloney and you're just caught up in the romanticism of it all and cheer them on. Ahh, youth today.

Thank you.

Luminis I don't rely on that democracy.... I'm Canadian. Even at such I don't care if your political system is as screwed up as you claim it to be. That very system made the US the single strongest political and warfare power in the world and if a bunch of hackers think they have the power to change that they are dead wrong.

I am not saying they are stupid intellectually, clearly they are not. They are stupid for thinking they can change democracy by doing this, would a majority of the American people support them? I think not. So by doing so they are circumventing they very cause they think they are standing up for. They are waging a fight against the American government and for that yes they are very very stupid.

 

[Luminis]

What goals? That load of tripe they write? And because of that, you buy into it, hook, line and sinker. Congratulations. They're not out there for democracy, Luminis. They're a bunch of feckless, lawless, twits that are out there using their hacking skills because they think they're above the law. They're criminals. And they should be treated as such. But they write a bunch of baloney and you're just caught up in the romanticism of it all and cheer them on. Ahh, youth today.

And you just chose to blindly follow whatever your government decides to tell you, whatever they deem is appropriate for you to think?

Hey, nothing wrong with that, I suppose. Gaddafi would've loved if more of his people followed that train of thought, people who are obedient and don't question what they're told 👍

Luminis I don't rely on that democracy.... I'm Canadian. Even at such I don't care if your political system is as screwed up as you claim it to be. That very system made the US the single strongest political and warfare power in the world and if a bunch of hackers think they have the power to change that they are dead wrong.

Are they? I think that'll remain to be seen. See, they're already having an impact on day to day life, don't they? Will they singlehandedly change the political system? No, I wouldn't think so. Might what they're doing be enough to cause people, dunno, think twice about what their government is supposed to do, what their government does and the disparity between the two? I don't know. But I wouldn't deem it suprising if it was.

I am not saying they are stupid intellectually, clearly they are not. They are stupid for thinking they can change democracy by doing this, would a majority of the American people support them? I think not. So by doing so they are circumventing they very cause they think they are standing up for. They are waging a fight against the American government and for that yes they are very very stupid.

First off, depending on what they publish, the position of the American people could change pretty fast, I guess.
Second, they aren't only waging war against the American government, there's a whole lot more they're waging war with. They've been a nuisance for a while, and they're still there. WikiLeaks was easy to shut down, but this, appearently, isn't.


See, I just feel more comfortable with a bunch of hackers causing some collateral damage while actually acting than a bunch of sheep just following whatever they are told.

 

[Bigbazz]

Personally I think they have a lot of balls and did something that was necessary to prove a point. Whether or not they had done this, the weakness in the security was always there. That there is the real issue, not these bunch of probable geniouses that pulled it off.

They pulled it off, so then it is not unreasonable to assume that they are not the only ones who could do it, which would mean it is not unreasonable to assume that real terrorists could also achieve the same goal.

Would you rather some terrorist extremists hacked into it, stole the details and used it for terrorist operations? I think not.

 

[jjaisli]

And you just chose to blindly follow whatever your government decides to tell you, whatever they deem is appropriate for you to think?

No Luminis, but I'm not going to put my faith in a bunch of children, who until five years ago were busy stealing music and trading Pokémon cards and have now moved on to 'bigger and better' things. I'm sure they think what they're doing is just "really cool". Apparently, you do to. I'm sure before long they'll move on to something else, assuming they're not caught. Perhaps robbing banks.

 

[Luminis]

No Luminis, but I'm not going to put my faith in a bunch of children, who until five years ago were busy stealing music and trading Pokémon cards and have now moved on to 'bigger and better' things. I'm sure they think what they're doing is just "really cool". Apparently, you do to. I'm sure before long they'll move on to something else, assuming they're not caught. Perhaps robbing banks.

You're quite full of baseless assumptions, you know? But, please, for all I care, hide behind your little assumptions and prejudices. I, for one, think those 'children' have had more of an impact than quite a lot of other political activists.

On the other hand, I don't know what your personal hopes for the political future are - maybe you like censorship? Maybe you liked it when the US government started to persecute Julian Assange and tryed to shut down WikiLeaks in an attempt to continue hiding their actions.
I, for one, didn't like that. I kinda like my free speech, I kinda like having access to uncensored media, I kinda like to know what's going on.

But, hey, if that's the 'democracy' you like, more power to you.

Sadly, I don't and since Anonymous probably had more impact on the whole matter than most other political activists do, I find it hard to disagree with their proclaimed intentions.

Oh, and while I'm at it: I don't think what they're doing is cool. Quite the opposite, I think it's a 🤬 shame when actions like these start to be taken because people feel that governments of self-proclaimed democratic countries aren't very democratic anymore. And it's an even bigger shame that I can see where they are coming from.

 

[jjaisli]

You're quite full of baseless assumptions, you know? But, please, for all I care, hide behind your little assumptions and prejudices. I, for one, think those 'children' have had more of an impact than quite a lot of other political activists.

On the other hand, I don't know what your personal hopes for the political future are - maybe you like censorship? Maybe you liked it when the US government started to persecute Julian Assange and tryed to shut down WikiLeaks in an attempt to continue hiding their actions.
I, for one, didn't like that. I kinda like my free speech, I kinda like having access to uncensored media, I kinda like to know what's going on.

But, hey, if that's the 'democracy' you like, more power to you.

Sadly, I don't and since Anonymous probably had more impact on the whole matter than most other political activists do, I find it hard to disagree with their proclaimed intentions.

Oh, and while I'm at it: I don't think what they're doing is cool. Quite the opposite, I think it's a 🤬 shame when actions like these start to be taken because people feel that governments of self-proclaimed democratic countries aren't very democratic anymore. And it's an even bigger shame that I can see where they are coming from.

>I'm< the one making baseless assumptions? Western democracies are barely that, or a popular vote in your own country would have likely turned down EU membership. The only 'true' (direct) democracy operating are your neighbors to the south in Switzerland. But the harsh reality is, money makes the world go round. And money and power go hand in hand. Big business, big money and government corruption are nothing new.

But if you really think giving a bunch of pricks like anonymous free reign is going to 'improve' the state of democracy or stop political corruption, than there's no point to discuss this further. They're NOT out for the greater good. They're out for themselves, as much or more than anybody. And doing a fine job of convincing people of their 'noble' goals, it seems.