Beater or Sleeper? GT6 Car of the Week Thread

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo 6' started by McClarenDesign, Dec 29, 2013.

  1. McClarenDesign

    McClarenDesign Premium

    Messages:
    5,785
    Location:
    United States
    There's a common misconception that FWD cars don't need spoilers. That assumption is false.

    Even though it's dragging the rear end (as opposed to RWD pushing the front end), wings still can aid in keeping the rear of the car compliant with the road. At higher speeds (100+), wings can also alleviate pressure behind the car, decreasing drag and making the car more aerodynamically slippery.

    If you have any questions, have a look at the British Touring Car Series.
     
    photonrider and Baron Blitz Red like this.
  2. NixxxoN

    NixxxoN (Banned)

    Messages:
    2,712
    Location:
    Spain
    But this mazda has a lot of front weight bias, something like 63-37. I would put the spoiler on a Focus RS which is 50-50 and its a rare tail happy FF car, for example, but not on this mazda.
     
    KinLM and Baron Blitz Red like this.
  3. McClarenDesign

    McClarenDesign Premium

    Messages:
    5,785
    Location:
    United States
    The pressure at the rear equalizes the balance, but only up to a point. Below 50 mph, you're just pulling extra weight. If the majority of turns are above that, like Spa for instance, then it makes sense.
     
    photonrider and Baron Blitz Red like this.
  4. nickg07

    nickg07

    Messages:
    1,367
    I had a mazda 323f 1.5i as my first car and always wanted a 2.0 zxi v6 (uk spec was 150 bhp i think).

    It was a decent ish handling car but the zxi was said to be very capable.
     
  5. McClarenDesign

    McClarenDesign Premium

    Messages:
    5,785
    Location:
    United States
    Your moment of Zen.

    [​IMG]
     
    C-ZETA, Kurei, SuzukaStar and 3 others like this.
  6. Niku Driver HC

    Niku Driver HC

    Messages:
    9,232
    Location:
    Portugal
    Now that's the find you have there, sir. At first I thought they were Galants, but they are actually Colts, right? A one-make series featuring Colts... An interesting sight.
     
    Baron Blitz Red likes this.
  7. photonrider

    photonrider

    Messages:
    7,417
    Location:
    Canada
    It sounds rather odd for sure - I tried with and without a spoiler and found the car more stable with it - and since it also looked a little 'hotter' - and since this is a sim - and we can simululate the strangest stuff in experimenting what would happen, I went ahead and tried.
    Give me some advice as to how to take that spoiler off (therefore making it look more 'real' of course) and yet keep the rear from swinging around - because that was what it was doing when I was playing around with the tuning.
    TBH - I rarely 'tune' my cars - usually only upgrading them - such as adding a better clutch, intake tuning, grippier tyres, computer, etc.

    I've heard that IRL manufacturers don't put even the smallest spoiler on an FF car - how far is this true?

    Some racers tell me that cars need downforce on both the front and rear ends and that front wheel drive does not mean it does not need rear downforce. Taking a corner hard at high speed - say at 100 mph can make the rear swing around and a rear spoiler (or 'wing') as some call it provides just the amount of downforce needed in such a situation to keep those wheels down, especially in a lighter car.


    Also in racing (not talking about going to the groceries for milk) FWD cars might use high rear spring rates to reduce understeer in low to medium speed corners. A small (hopefully unnoticeable :D) rear wing counteracts the rear lift and keeps the car balanced. An adjustable wing, I've heard, is also great for tuning balance in high speed corners.
    But having a wing on a low speed FF though would be . . . well . . . useless, for sure, or as you say - even detrimental.

    Technically, engineers must facepalm when seeing a car like this, though if they keep in mind Enzo Ferrari's quip about aerodynamics versus engines they may understand the 'other' engineers who throw rules engraved in stone to the wind and take chances in experimenting with the physics involved.

    Having said that - I rarely do this - I don't like the wings provided by PD, though there is vast improvement in the selection of wings because of the custom wing option.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2014
    Baron Blitz Red likes this.
  8. McClarenDesign

    McClarenDesign Premium

    Messages:
    5,785
    Location:
    United States
    Ford Escort ZX2 had a spoiler, as did the Integra, the Neon, and dozens others.
     
  9. nickg07

    nickg07

    Messages:
    1,367
    My current fwd has an adjustable rear aerofoil.

    [​IMG]

    This is a factory fit on the uk limited edition GT model from the TRD parts bin.

    The FTO and civics type r also have rear wings from the factory.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2014
  10. turismoslayer

    turismoslayer

    Messages:
    467
    Location:
    United States
    @McClarenDesign, have you thought that with the new community and club feature to create a COTW club?
     
  11. Baron Blitz Red

    Baron Blitz Red

    Messages:
    2,175
    Location:
    Canada
    Nowadays, the only time you'll see that many Marlboro's together is in a pack of smokes! :sly:

    Cheers
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2014
  12. photonrider

    photonrider

    Messages:
    7,417
    Location:
    Canada
    I believe there was an Integra series where all the cars sported wings . . . can't remember which one now.
    I didn't see your responses since I waltzed in via the alerts and addressed the concern right away - or else I wouldn't have gone to such lengths explaining. :lol:

    I just so much want to get into that now.
    My PS3 has been taken over for a while . . . so I have to wait. :(
    Gives me time to browse GTPlanet, though.

    Seems like they still do advertise - in retrospect. Dang - those LMs looked good in the Marlboro livery.
    We need to get Marlboro to make some other product. Oil seals? Exhausts?
    They don't need to talk tobacco at all. Just give us the money, Marlboro. Work around the problem!!

    Talking about colts - here's one that's no foal:

    [​IMG]

    In fact it's a bit of a mirage:

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2014
    Baron Blitz Red likes this.
  13. Niku Driver HC

    Niku Driver HC

    Messages:
    9,232
    Location:
    Portugal
    It's funny you mention the Mirage\Colt, considering our conversation about small V6s a few pages ago. You know, since the Mirage could be bought with an amazingly small 1.6 V6 (how do they do it!?) one time... :crazy: What a feat for such a small car. :bowdown:
     
    Baron Blitz Red and SuzukaStar like this.
  14. MidFieldMaven

    MidFieldMaven

    Messages:
    3,407
    Location:
    United States
    You ever read the info screen for that Mirage? It mentions something like 22,000 horsepower.

    Picture of 1.6L V6 6A10 engine
    [​IMG]
     
    Niku Driver HC likes this.
  15. Niku Driver HC

    Niku Driver HC

    Messages:
    9,232
    Location:
    Portugal
    Hey, that car is a Proton, right? That badge doesn't look like a Mitsubishi badge...

    (Yes, I know Proton used Mitsubishi machinery and engines to make their cars, just wondering. ;) )
     
  16. MidFieldMaven

    MidFieldMaven

    Messages:
    3,407
    Location:
    United States
    Yep it's a Proton Satria with the 1.6 V6 swap.
     
    Niku Driver HC likes this.
  17. Niku Driver HC

    Niku Driver HC

    Messages:
    9,232
    Location:
    Portugal
    Considering the Protons share platforms with Mitsubishi cars, it's no surprise, eh?
     
    SuzukaStar likes this.
  18. Baron Blitz Red

    Baron Blitz Red

    Messages:
    2,175
    Location:
    Canada
    Oh I can see the ads now...

    "Have your car smoking less with Marlboro!"

    Cheers
     
    photonrider and Vic Reign93 like this.
  19. McClarenDesign

    McClarenDesign Premium

    Messages:
    5,785
    Location:
    United States
    Cheeky devil. Congratulations, photonrider!

    I wonder, could our next Car of the Week be...

    [​IMG]

    ... the 1997 Mitsubishi Mirage Cyborg ZR!!!







     
  20. Niku Driver HC

    Niku Driver HC

    Messages:
    9,232
    Location:
    Portugal
    Another FF car!? Surely you must be getting tired of those, Mr. Mcclaren... :sly: Anywho, the Mirage\Colt, eh? Time to bust out the comparison tape!

    And by "comparison tape" I mean Honda Civic...:cool: :lol:
     
    Baron Blitz Red likes this.
  21. McClarenDesign

    McClarenDesign Premium

    Messages:
    5,785
    Location:
    United States
    Don't blame me, this wasn't my choice. Besides, I beat Vic, I'm content with whatever does that.
     
  22. Niku Driver HC

    Niku Driver HC

    Messages:
    9,232
    Location:
    Portugal
    Bragging rights, eh? I'm ok with that. And I was speaking in a joke tone, I don't mind FF cars as long as they are fun to drive. That's half the fun, right? :):tup:
     
  23. MidFieldMaven

    MidFieldMaven

    Messages:
    3,407
    Location:
    United States


    1.6L
    171 hp / 7,500 rpm
    123 ft-lb / 7,000 rpm
    1,060 kg (2,337 lb)
    387 pp
    Top speed achieved at Suzuka - 121 mph

    Keeps up with a 1997 Honda Civic Type R, probably its main rival.

    Typo in the info screen. Apparently this beast has 1,229.5 ft-lbs of torque!

    [​IMG]
     
  24. Vic Reign93

    Vic Reign93 Premium

    Messages:
    2,458
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    The Chronicles of Teddick

    Last weeks events had an eerie feeling of spookiness and a certain name kept being brought up more than a broken record, a certain "Ted Thomas".

    Let me take a step back and give some context.

    We were testing the V6 powered Mazda 323F/Lantis Type R in our weekly bouts of wit, humor and occasionl racing, then our good friend @photonrider had his HUD disappear on him. :confused:

    I thought nothing of it at first, but what happened next made me reconsider that.

    Earlier, I used myself, MC, Jack and Baron as examples of what we run driving assist wise at COTW.

    Baron then won a race, then MC and then Jack. :eek:

    I left that morning with 4 questions burning in my mind, Was I getting slower? Was everyone else getting faster?
    What do I call the 323F?
    Was Ted messing with the set dressing? :p

    2 of those got anwsered, they were improving in consistency and the 323F was a Beater. A fun beater mind. :)

    Afterwards, I unorignally called the 323F 'Turbo Ted'. :D

    Now on to the Cyborg, as MC modestly said,:sly: he beat me in a close race at Laguna. The former COTW choice, the Front wheel drive Levin/Sprinter was an surprising rival to the Cyborg.

    Having said that, It'll be fun finding out what happens next time out.

    Will Baron run away from the pack again?
    Will McClaren end up in another duel with me?
    Will Jack take another win at COTW? :lol:

    Watch this thread.;)
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2014
  25. Kurei

    Kurei

    Messages:
    2,741
    Location:
    United States
    34 pages, and now I finally decide to poke my head in :odd:

    Looks like I've missed a bit of good times and some vintage photos (Marlboro Colts, why do I want one ? :lol:)

    I'll have to start giving some of these cars test-drives, no tuning/stock means less financial investment, and you don't have a billion rules to follow like a lot of racing leagues I've looked into.

    Plus, @SuzukaStar makes it look like an interesting drive.

    Just to check, what's considered the 'week' in here ? - Sunday to following Saturday night?, or Monday to Sunday ?. I should be able to get to this sometime this week, if no issues arise.
     
  26. Vic Reign93

    Vic Reign93 Premium

    Messages:
    2,458
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    We normally race on Tuesday at 10PM CST ( roughly 4am on Wedsnday here in Blighty.) ;)

    Sometimes there'll be small relax events around the weekend.
     
    Baron Blitz Red likes this.
  27. McClarenDesign

    McClarenDesign Premium

    Messages:
    5,785
    Location:
    United States
    The answers you seek are in the Original Post. Welcome to the party!

    Very, very tragic tale. Ghost-in-the-machine, if you will.

    Lucas Ordonez never told you about what happened at the original GT Academy, did he? He never told you about Ted Thomas?!
     
    Vic Reign93 likes this.
  28. Baron Blitz Red

    Baron Blitz Red

    Messages:
    2,175
    Location:
    Canada
    Well I for one, was completely lost in this conversation! I never heard of him. So please, clue me in!

    Cheers
     
  29. Niku Driver HC

    Niku Driver HC

    Messages:
    9,232
    Location:
    Portugal
    Man, too bad that the time for racing is far too early for me (I'm usually sleeping at 4 A.M., go figure :lol:), apparently I am missing some freaky stuff... :scared: And fun racing to boot.

    Anywho, I had a quick drive with the Cyborg. It drives better than the Lantis, that much I can tell you. But it is still not enough to beat the king of '90's hot hatches (you could call it a civic radical service :sly:). I still think a FTO is a better FF Mitsu to drive, but I don't hate the Mirage. It does a decent job, all things considered.
     
    no1pal likes this.
  30. nickg07

    nickg07

    Messages:
    1,367
    Hnm i always wanted a colt cyborg but it didn't happen in the end, i got a Primera GT instead. I love their alternativeness to a civic ek. Sadly time has passed by but i always use it in GT for fwd hatch if eligible!
     
    McClarenDesign and photonrider like this.