Buttkicker worth it?

[jswilli1]

Other guys with Buttkickers can confrim if they get more Bass with "SMALL" room setting over the larger one.
It easier to determine a difference with a Buttkicker than it is with a normal subwoofer etc as you feel the small difference the room settings can make.

.

It has been many moons since I played GT5P but If I recall I use the large room setup. I will have to pop it in and recheck my settings, I will retry the small and large room settings and see if there is a noticable difference.

 

[Mr Latte]

It has been many moons since I played GT5P but If I recall I use the large room setup. I will have to pop it in and recheck my settings, I will retry the small and large room settings and see if there is a noticable difference.

Okay let me know, I used the menu music as an easy way to determine.
The beats just felt a bit deeper, mind you not much, I think its only a small difference.

Just ordered my 2nd and 3rd Buttkickers for my d.i.y cockpit....
(Mini LFE Models for pedals and wheel platforms)

 

[Powerslave.]

.Boss429.
I noticed the "gamer" is actually very limited in its power with only 90 watts.
Thats quite a difference to the mini models supporting upto 250 watts of amplification and the BKA 300 model supporting upto 400 watts.
Gamer works upto a max of 200Hz so Id recommend a cut off on your AV amplifier to this at max or even 150HZ this will give enough mid range rumble as too much is when these units bottom out or can sound/feel bad.

So what your saying is set my crossover at 150?

The new one did arrive today. The knob was bad on the other one. Before when I was in GT5P and I turned the menu music to 100 I couldnt dial it out with the knob. I can do that with the new one.

I think now its just the process of getting everything set-up to work right. Thats going to be the hard part for me. I am about worthless when it comes to adjusting receivers.

 

[jswilli1]

So what your saying is set my crossover at 150?

The new one did arrive today. The knob was bad on the other one. Before when I was in GT5P and I turned the menu music to 100 I couldnt dial it out with the knob. I can do that with the new one.

I think now its just the process of getting everything set-up to work right. Thats going to be the hard part for me. I am about worthless when it comes to adjusting receivers.

What Mr. Latte is saying is set the reciever crossover at 150hz, the freq range of the gamer transducer/amp is 5hz to 200hz. The reciever will only pass frequencies at or below 150hz to your gamer amp thus reproducing the 5-150hz ranges. With the menu music at 100 you should feel a thump in the chair while you navigate in GT5P.

 

[Powerslave.]

What Mr. Latte is saying is set the reciever crossover at 150hz, the freq range of the gamer transducer/amp is 5hz to 200hz. The reciever will only pass frequencies at or below 150hz to your gamer amp thus reproducing the 5-150hz ranges. With the menu music at 100 you should feel a thump in the chair while you navigate in GT5P.

Thanks.

One little device can sure make you learn a lot about different things

 

[jswilli1]

Thanks.

One little device can sure make you learn a lot about different things

Does your Onkyo 501 support the HD codecs? I am referring to any Lossless format such as DTS-MA or True HD. I use Mutlichannel on my Onkyo 805 and I believe the 501 too has Multichannel? I have found with the BKA300 that while watching movies or even games that use these codecs (DTS or Dolby Digital) in particular that I have to decrease my gain to the transducer amp as it causes the ButtKicker to "bottom out" or "rumble" rather violently. My actual subwoofer/LFE setting on my amp is at -12db, this is so I don't have to adjust the Buttkicker everytime I watch a movie, play a game, or listen to music. When I do play a game I just adjust the setting manually to optimize the transducer for gameplay on that particular title. For instance while playing BBC2 I have been changing it to ~-10.5db. I plan on breaking out GT5P and I will redo and record my settings for comparison and post in the user group section.👍

 

[Powerslave.]

Does your Onkyo 501 support the HD codecs? I am referring to any Lossless format such as DTS-MA or True HD.

I dont think it does. Its about 5 years old and was the entry level one at the time.

I use Mutlichannel on my Onkyo 805 and I believe the 501 too has Multichannel?

It does have multichannel, but I have no clue how to get it do that. Right now I am running it in, NEO:CIN (DTS). Not sure what that means. It says NEO:CIN in big letters, then in small red letters above it, says DTS.

I have found with the BKA300 that while watching movies or even games that use these codecs (DTS or Dolby Digital) in particular that I have to decrease my gain to the transducer amp as it causes it to "bottom out" or "rumble" rather violently. My actual subwoofer/LFE setting on my amp is at -12db, this is so I don't have to adjust the Buttkicker everytime I watch a movie, play a game, or listen to music. When I do play a game I just adjust the setting manually to optimize the transducer for gameplay on that particular title. For instance while playing BBC2 I have been changing it to ~-10.5db. I plan on breaking out GT5P and I will redo and record my settings for comparison and post in the user group section.👍

Cool, thanks for that info. I have mine at +12 right now, I guess I will back that down a little and see if it helps. That is if your talking about where it has the bass and treble settings?

Cool on posting your settings, I will definitely check them out and try them.
Thanks for all your help.

 

[jswilli1]

Boss,

Check your audio settings on the PS3, if your 501 has multichannel you should be able to select it. YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO SELECT MULTICHANNEL ON THE 501 IF THE PS3 IS NOT OUTPUTTING THE CORRECT SIGNAL TO THE RECEIVER. Are you using HDMI, optical, or RCA for your audio connection? You will only be able to utilize multichannel on your receiver if using HDMI. Secondly on the PS3 audio should be set to Linear NOT BIT STREAM. I honestly believe your are really missing out on the audio spectrum and this may be part of your issue with adjusting the BK. We will get it figured out and you will be off and running.

Here is the link for your Onkyo 501: http://www.us.onkyo.com/searchResults.cfm?searchItem=TX-SR501

***Update - I reviewed the manual for your 501. You do not have HDMI inputs therefore Multichannel is out of the question and you don't have this soundfield on the reciever anyways. I am hoping you are using optical cables for your audio from the PS3? This will allow for Dolby Digital and DTS and RCA connections will not work in this application. I recommend sticking with the setting NEO:Cinema DTS setting you previously mentioned, I would also recommend trying the DTS, DTS-ES, and Dolby D fields that are on the receiver. Is your Samsung reciever newer or older and does it have HDMI inputs? DO NOT PUT the PS3 in Linear if using optical it will have to be in bit steam (unless you are using a PS3 slim i don't think it matters).

 

[Powerslave.]

Boss,

Check your audio settings on the PS3, if your 501 has multichannel you should be able to select it. YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO SELECT MULTICHANNEL ON THE 501 IF THE PS3 IS NOT OUTPUTTING THE CORRECT SIGNAL TO THE RECEIVER. Are you using HDMI, optical, or RCA for your audio connection? You will only be able to utilize multichannel on your receiver if using HDMI. Secondly on the PS3 audio should be set to Linear NOT BIT STREAM. I honestly believe your are really missing out on the audio spectrum and this may be part of your issue with adjusting the BK. We will get it figured out and you will be off and running.

Here is the link for your Onkyo 501: http://www.us.onkyo.com/searchResults.cfm?searchItem=TX-SR501

***Update - I reviewed the manual for your 501. You do not have HDMI inputs therefore Multichannel is out of the question and you don't have this soundfield on the reciever anyways. I am hoping you are using optical cables for your audio from the PS3? This will allow for Dolby Digital and DTS and RCA connections will not work in this application. I recommend sticking with the setting NEO:Cinema DTS setting you previously mentioned, I would also recommend trying the DTS, DTS-ES, and Dolby D fields that are on the receiver. Is your Samsung reciever newer or older and does it have HDMI inputs? DO NOT PUT the PS3 in Linear if using optical it will have to be in bit steam (unless you are using a PS3 slim i don't think it matters).

Yeah I dont have HDMI on the receiver. I can bring something up on the thing that says MultiChannel on the screen, but I get no sound.

I am using optical cable for the sound.

The Samsung is only about 4 months old. Its a lot newer. It does have HDMI inputs and 1 out. For some reason I was never able to get the PS3 video signal through it. I could get sound but no video. Cable box and 360 got both sound and video through its HDMI in/out.

When I go to the sound settings on the PS3, it has
Linear PCM 2ch. 44.1khz
Linear PCM 2ch. 48khz
Hard checked, I cant disable them.

I have the option to enable
Dolby Digital 5.1 Ch.
DTS 5.1ch
AAC

Think I would be better off with the Samsung?
Here is the manual for the Samsung.

 

[jswilli1]

Yeah I dont have HDMI on the receiver. I can bring something up on the thing that says MultiChannel on the screen, but I get no sound.

I am using optical cable for the sound.

The Samsung is only about 4 months old. Its a lot newer. It does have HDMI inputs and 1 out. For some reason I was never able to get the PS3 video signal through it. I could get sound but no video. Cable box and 360 got both sound and video through its HDMI in/out.

When I go to the sound settings on the PS3, it has
Linear PCM 2ch. 44.1khz
Linear PCM 2ch. 48khz
Hard checked, I cant disable them.

I have the option to enable
Dolby Digital 5.1 Ch.
DTS 5.1ch
AAC

Think I would be better off with the Samsung?
Here is the manual for the Samsung.

Definetely switch to the Samsung and utilize the HDMI, your sound field will be far better and ultimately your ButtKicker will rock. I would try reseting the PS3 after you connect the Samsung and your TV via HDMI. the PS3 should detect the HDMI and you should have a picture. I think you hold the power button 5 seconds on the front the PS3 turns off, hold for 5 seconds to turn on and reset the video output on the PS3. When connecting to the Samsung ensure you change from Bit Stream to Linear for your Audio.

Link to Sony for resetting video output on PS3: http://us.playstation.com/support/answer/index.htm?a_id=1039

 

[Powerslave.]

I still cant get the HDMI to work on the Samsung. I just spent the last 1.5hrs unhooking and hooking back up and it still doesnt work. After searching the internet, seems to be a known problem with these and HDMI not working.

If I thought it would make that much of a difference I would go spend $500 on a Yamaha RXV655, but I would be really upset if that didnt make much of a difference.

 

[jswilli1]

I still cant get the HDMI to work on the Samsung. I just spent the last 1.5hrs unhooking and hooking back up and it still doesnt work. After searching the internet, seems to be a known problem with these and HDMI not working.

If I thought it would make that much of a difference I would go spend $500 on a Yamaha RXV655, but I would be really upset if that didnt make much of a difference.

I wonder if there is an online firmware upgrade for your Samsung? Through your internet searchs did they mention a fix?

 

[Powerslave.]

I wonder if there is an online firmware upgrade for your Samsung? Through your internet searchs did they mention a fix?

According to everything I have found, no firmware update for it.

EDIT-
I seem to be making some headway here. I finally got a signal through the Samsung Receiver other than sound. I now have video. I went in and under the BD settings and changed all the sound to Linear (I think there were 2 different ones), went and changed the sound settings tab for multichannel.

Time to go to my mother in-laws birthday party. Will report back later with how it works out.
Anything else I might want to change or set?

 

[jswilli1]

According to everything I have found, no firmware update for it.

EDIT-
I seem to be making some headway here. I finally got a signal through the Samsung Receiver other than sound. I now have video. I went in and under the BD settings and changed all the sound to Linear (I think there were 2 different ones), went and changed the sound settings tab for multichannel.

Time to go to my mother in-laws birthday party. Will report back later with how it works out.
Anything else I might want to change or set?

Great! I thought it might be a setting within the PS3. I think you will be pleased with your hardwork in getting the Samsung receiver working. I looked at the online manual and the Neo:6 soundfield or Dolby should work great. There is a table ~page49 for sound fields, use it to help pick the correct sound field when you start adjusting your BK (1st two rows in the table). I am onshift (12hrs) again tomorrow so I can help you troubleshoot again.

 

[Captain Roh]

Buttkicker? Do you actually sit on it!? Sounds fun..

My 5.1 setup has a Yamaha YST FSW050, powered by a Denon 1610. I bought the Yamaha because of the shape, no other reason, and I cut a hole under my sofa to house it. I feel the bass 'kick my butt' whenever I play games, watch movies, listen to music.. Really improves the emersion. Wish I had a play seat like you guys to sit in though Its the final piece in my puzzle. Well, bar the clutch of course. Why didnt PD develop the DFGT to incorporate one!? Yargg

 

[jswilli1]

Buttkicker? Do you actually sit on it!? Sounds fun..

My 5.1 setup has a Yamaha YST FSW050, powered by a Denon 1610. I bought the Yamaha because of the shape, no other reason, and I cut a hole under my sofa to house it. I feel the bass 'kick my butt' whenever I play games, watch movies, listen to music.. Really improves the emersion. Wish I had a play seat like you guys to sit in though Its the final piece in my puzzle. Well, bar the clutch of course. Why didnt PD develop the DFGT to incorporate one!? Yargg

ButtKicker is a Tactile Transducer or silent subwoofer. It uses your subwoofer or LFE output on your receiver to send a signal to an amp that powers the transducer. The transducer is attached to a chair, couch, or racing cockpit. The transducer itself is a motor that creates a vibration that replicates explosions, gunshots, etc while watching movies, playing games, or listing to music. The setups range from $125 U.S to $400 depending on what you want to do. I created a Buttkicker User group in the Groups/Clubs section of the forum that has some links and pictures. I just created it last week so its a work in progress.

 

[Powerslave.]

I think I finally got it. It took a lot of fine tuning, but I am not sure if its where I am gonna keep it. Its so close I hate to mess with it.

Thanks so much, jswilli1 and Mr Latte for your help. Without your guys knowledge and willingness to help, I would have gotten nowhere and probably just unhooked it. I learned a lot about setting up audio stuff. Just by getting some decent settings in there by getting the Buttkicker to work. My sound system even sounds better.

jswilli1, I would still be interested in seeing your settings if you get them done. If nothing else, just to compare them with what I got. I done some MAJOR changes from what I originally had. I am running in MultiChannel on the receiver but I am at the mercy of what it gives me. I cant change what its at, or atleast I havent figured it out yet. Here is a pic of what the display is telling me:
Orange says HDMI, below that is Digital and the letters above the - are L.PCM

Off the top of my head my settings are:
PS3 Sound - Large Theater
Crossover 180
Treble - +5
Bass - 0
Fronts - -10
Center - -4
Rear - -10
Sub - -2
Front Speakers set to Large
Center Speaker set to Small
Rear Speakers set to Large

 

[jswilli1]

I think I finally got it. It took a lot of fine tuning, but I am not sure if its where I am gonna keep it. Its so close I hate to mess with it.

Thanks so much, jswilli1 and Mr Latte for your help. Without your guys knowledge and willingness to help, I would have gotten nowhere and probably just unhooked it. I learned a lot about setting up audio stuff. Just by getting some decent settings in there by getting the Buttkicker to work. My sound system even sounds better.

jswilli1, I would still be interested in seeing your settings if you get them done. If nothing else, just to compare them with what I got. I done some MAJOR changes from what I originally had. I am running in MultiChannel on the receiver but I am at the mercy of what it gives me. I cant change what its at, or atleast I havent figured it out yet. Here is a pic of what the display is telling me:
Orange says HDMI, below that is Digital and the letters above the - are L.PCM

Off the top of my head my settings are:
PS3 Sound - Large Theater
Crossover 180
Treble - +5
Bass - 0
Fronts - -10
Center - -4
Rear - -10
Sub - -2
Front Speakers set to Large
Center Speaker set to Small
Rear Speakers set to Large

Perfect! Glad you got the Samsung up and running. This will be a huge improvement not just to your gaming experience but also if you watch movies. Multichannel is good news because the PS3 being in Linear PCM which is indicated on your receiver L.PCM will decode the HD codecs automatically for you (DTS-MA, Tru-HD, etc) while watching Blu-Ray movies. Another advantage with Multichannel is you will be able to experience the full audio with games that utilize Dolby Digital! Looks like you have a great baseline to start with in your adjustments. As you play GT5P (or any game) and get some time behind the wheel, you will be able to tweak your adjustments as needed. I plan on breaking out GT5P next week when I am off shift, I will check out my settings both in GT5P and my 805 and post them. Enjoy your ButtKicker now that you have spent a few hours with your AV receiver troubleshooting to get everything properly working.👍

 

[Mr Latte]

A good to see you guys got this sorted so your getting the best from your amplifer.

Nice work jswilli1

 

[jswilli1]

I created another thread in the Buttkicker User Group: Adding a ButtKicker to your AV Receiver. In post #36 in this thread, I had completely forgot about how the folllowing greatly affect the BK: AV Receiver soundfields, audio connections and PS3 audio settings.

 

[crazedmodder]

I know I'm a bit late to this thread lol. I don't know much about Buttkickers but I do know about receivers/audio so I want to clear a few things up. These misconceptions are pretty common.

Your amps speaker config settings has nothing to do with this "Room" mode in game. If your speakers are full range speakers set them all to large.

You should always set your speakers to small in your receiver settings if you have a subwoofer. If you don't have a subwoofer then keep them large.

With speakers on large:
bass is sent to the front speakers, LFE (the .1 channel in audio) is sent to the subwoofer.

With speakers on small:
bass is sent to the subwoofer (if it is under your crossover frequency), LFE is sent to the subwoofer.

So unless your speakers are better at reproducing <200Hz or 150Hz frequencies than your subwoofer then you should keep it on small. These types of speakers are the real full-range speakers with a subwoofer, mid-range and tweeter in the enclosure and are the types you can't find at retail stores.

My Klipsch F2s are "full-range" and can reproduce frequencies down to 39Hz. Maybe they can, but they definitely don't do it well. They are good speakers don't get me wrong, but they just can't match my subwoofer. These marketing teams work hard at their theoretical limits.

Now that's not saying everyone will like the way it sounds better but generally it is better to have your subwoofer do all the low-frequency work.

The setting in the game likely just sets a small + / - of a few DB to the games output.
They may be concerned people with large systems and rooms dont damage their hearing etc.

I actually think their setting does the opposite to what you think, by giving a small boost in SMALL room setting and a slight reduction in LARGE room setting.

-snip-

Also with GT5P the games audio cant be full uncompressed PCM as its also a downloadable title of only approx 4 gig.
Some PS3 games that use fully uncompressed audio have audio using 20Gigs + of disc space.

What the living room/small theater/large theater setting does is alter the audio compression. What you are thinking of is data compression (MP3, WMA, OGG, etc). Audio compression is quite different. I can't go in depth on how it works because I'm no pro but the basic idea is that more compression makes the difference between loud sounds and quiet sounds less, effectively "compressing" the audio. So if you've ever used night mode on any audio device, that is compression.

Off the top of my head my settings are:
PS3 Sound - Large Theater
Crossover 180
Treble - +5
Bass - 0
Fronts - -10
Center - -4
Rear - -10
Sub - -2
Front Speakers set to Large
Center Speaker set to Small
Rear Speakers set to Large

Do you have a sub? Try setting your speakers all to small in your receiver and see if you like it. If you only have the buttkicker though I don't know if it would work well (you'll get more buttkick but less bass). If you have a sub then you should get more bass and more buttkick with the speakers set to small.

 

[Mr Latte]

I know I'm a bit late to this thread lol. I don't know much about Buttkickers but I do know about receivers/audio so I want to clear a few things up. These misconceptions are pretty common.

You should always set your speakers to small in your receiver settings if you have a subwoofer. If you don't have a subwoofer then keep them large.

Thats not always the case many more high end models and including my own allow the .1 bass to go to BOTH the main speakers and the subwoofer.

My units options are:

MAIN
SUB
BOTH

 

[jswilli1]

What the living room/small theater/large theater setting does is alter the audio compression. What you are thinking of is data compression (MP3, WMA, OGG, etc). Audio compression is quite different. I can't go in depth on how it works because I'm no pro but the basic idea is that more compression makes the difference between loud sounds and quiet sounds less, effectively "compressing" the audio. So if you've ever used night mode on any audio device, that is compression.

What Mr. Latte is talking about here are the small and large living room settings found in the game audio adjustments within GT5P and not the sound fields found on a receiver.

You are correct about setting your speakers to small if you have a Subwoofer, unless you are a bass freak or have some huge Cerwin Vega's or Klipsch speakers for your front/rear channels 👍. By limiting the frequency range of the speakers in theory they don't have to work as hard to reproduce sound and work more efficiently. Since Bass is non directional it makes since to direct your low frequencies directly to your Subwoofer. I use the small speaker setting on my Onkyo 805 for my Bose AM7 and AM5 cubes (I bought back in 1995) and use a 10" Klipsch powered subwoofer in my HT.

 

[Powerslave.]

Do you have a sub? Try setting your speakers all to small in your receiver and see if you like it. If you only have the buttkicker though I don't know if it would work well (you'll get more buttkick but less bass). If you have a sub then you should get more bass and more buttkick with the speakers set to small.

Thanks for all your input. I know next to nothing about this stuff, so the more info the better for me.

I do have a sub. I tried all my speakers set to small when I was tweaking the settings, and I found the kicker was picking up to much stuff I didnt want it to (like wind noise, engine, ect..), and making it vibrate all the time, and couldnt really pick up the suttle stuff I was looking for. When I set the fronts/rears to large, a lot of this was tamed down and much more comfortable level, allowing for other stuff to be felt through the kicker. I am not saying this is right, but its what worked for me. Maybe with sometime using it and playing with the settings more, I can get this worked out to work with the speakers on small. My receiver is not very high quality (yet) so it might not be doing the best job either.

 

[crazedmodder]

Thats not always the case many more high end models and including my own allow the .1 bass to go to BOTH the main speakers and the subwoofer.

My units options are:

MAIN
SUB
BOTH

The .1 is ok, small/large speakers settings won't affect that. What I mean by bass will or won't go to the sub, I mean non-LFE bass (bass that is not part of the .1).

If you are listening to music (no LFE track) then your subwoofer won't do anything if your speakers are set to large even if you have deep bass in the song. Of course it doesn't only apply to music but other things as well. Let's say a DVD has a .1 track, not all the bass in the movie is assigned to the .1 track and that bass will only go to your sub if you have your speakers set to small.

If you set your crossover at say 150Hz then anything below 150hz will be sent to the subwoofer if you set your speakers to small.

I know I'm not good at explaining stuff I get a bit confused when I proofread it but hopefully everyone understands what I mean.

What Mr. Latte is talking about here are the small and large living room settings found in the game audio adjustments within GT5P and not the sound fields found on a receiver.

Yeah in what you quoted I was talking about GT5P settings, not the receiver settings. I just did not remember what the names were but I think they are living room/small theater/large theater. The in-game settings in GT5P adjust the audio compression level.

Thanks for all your input. I know next to nothing about this stuff, so the more info the better for me.

I do have a sub. I tried all my speakers set to small when I was tweaking the settings, and I found the kicker was picking up to much stuff I didnt want it to (like wind noise, engine, ect..), and making it vibrate all the time, and couldnt really pick up the suttle stuff I was looking for. When I set the fronts/rears to large, a lot of this was tamed down and much more comfortable level, allowing for other stuff to be felt through the kicker. I am not saying this is right, but its what worked for me. Maybe with sometime using it and playing with the settings more, I can get this worked out to work with the speakers on small. My receiver is not very high quality (yet) so it might not be doing the best job either.

Yeah I just wanted to make sure people knew the difference between small and large speaker settings. Whatever sounds best to you is what you should go with 👍 And it's not your receiver, mine sends the wind noise to my sub as well so I'm guessing the frequency is low enough to go below the crossover point but is not actually part of the .1 track. Honestly I really find the wind noise annoying so I can't blame you it must be annoying with the buttkicker too.

BTW just to clarify .1 track = LFE track so if you see me use LFE you know what I mean.

 

[Mr Latte]

Crazy
You cant just say what happens perhaps on your own equipment is how it will be for everyone. Different amplifers will have different options.

Im aware of what your saying for small sub satellite speakers and using a crossover to redirect bass frequencies to a subwoofer. However on my unit if I select LARGE speakers then they get the full range of bass frequencies and so does my subwoofer, even with standard stereo audio. I regulary use a 7 Channel Stereo mode that sounds great giving each speaker the full range of audio frequencies. My amp also has TRI field processing which allows it to take anything from 2 channel or 5.1 mix and also combine that with a DSP settings and upscale this into a 7.1 output.

However when I reffered to set to BOTH that was referring only to the LFE bass channel. Some people may want full range audio to their main speakers but not the .1 from movies.
Therefore I can have my LARGE speakers also get the .1 bass and not just the subwoofer or I can just have my LARGE speakers get just standard audio bass and re-route the .1 only to the subwoofer.
The reason for this is some floorstanding speakers can also have internal subwoofers and means the user can get the best out of their own setup and requirmenets or preferrence.

Im not so certain that the PS3 changes the "compression" for the room settings as that would give someone an inferior coded sound effects. If that was the case surely then they may as well use the best setting their hardware can use and just turn their volume up/down accordingly. Assuming what your saying is like a Blu Ray moving switching between sound modes.

Large Theatre = Uncompressed PCM / Living room = DTS /Small Room = Dolby Digital

Also from memory my amplifer showed no signs of detecting a different bitrate when changing room settings in the game. If anything I really think its just s small audio boost or audio dampening they put in the settings and nothing that technical. I await to see if any other BK users find the "SMALL" room setting has a slight benifit in bass response rather than the largest setting giving that as we would assume it should.
If they do then thats a bit weird....

 

[crazedmodder]

Crazy
You cant just say what happens perhaps on your own equipment is how it will be for everyone. Different amplifers will have different options.

Fair enough. It is my understanding from my days at avs that most receivers handle small/large this way. Of course there are exceptions plus other settings on your receiver may also change that.

Im not so certain that the PS3 changes the "compression" for the room settings as that would give someone an inferior coded sound effects. If that was the case surely then they may as well use the best setting their hardware can use and just turn their volume up/down accordingly. Assuming what your saying is like a Blu Ray moving switching between sound modes.

Large Theatre = Uncompressed PCM / Living room = DTS /Small Room = Dolby Digital

Also from memory my amplifer showed no signs of detecting a different bitrate when changing room settings in the game. If anything I really think its just s small audio boost or audio dampening they put in the settings and nothing that technical. I await to see if any other BK users find the "SMALL" room setting has a slight benifit in bass response rather than the largest setting giving that as we would assume it should.
If they do then thats a bit weird....

It does change compression but you are thinking of the wrong compression. You are thinking of compression in terms of MP3/WMA/OGG/WAV/Dolby/PCM/etc but that is data compression because you are compressing the file (similar to zipping or raring it). The in game settings change dynamic range compression. Things like bitrate don't affect dynamic range compression.

Here a quote from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_range_compression which sums it up:

Dynamic range compression, also called DRC (often seen in DVD and car CD player settings) or simply compression, is a process that reduces the dynamic range of an audio signal, that is, narrows the difference between high and low audio levels or volumes.

So range compression changes the difference in volume between quiet and loud sounds. That means that if you have lower end speakers (or TV speakers) then using large theater will mean you will have crappy sound. Either you keep the volume low so the loud sounds come out well but you can't hear the quiet sounds, or you keep the volume high and you can hear the quiet sounds but the loud sounds are too much for your speaker and come out muddy.

To summarize:
- - Data Compression = MP3/WMA/OGG/FLAC/Dolby/ZIP/RAR anything that is used to make the file size smaller, lossy or lossless
- - Dynamic Range Compression (the setting in the game) = The volume difference between loud sounds and quiet sounds.
- - - Living Room = Most compression, the volume difference between loud and quiet sounds is minimal = Use this on TV speakers
- - - Small Theater = Middle compression, the volume difference between loud and quiet sounds is in the middle (don't really know another word for it ) = Use this on lower quality standalone speakers (home theater in a box, cheaper satellite speakers, etc)
- - - Large Theater = Least compression, the volume difference between loud and quiet sounds is the largest = Use this on decent or better standalone speakers (bookshelf speakers, tower speakers, etc)

Of course just because large theater is technically the best to use if your setup can handle it (volume differences are more realistic and more along the lines of what PD wants you to hear) doesn't mean it will sound the best to your ears or with your buttkicker so stick with whatever works best in your setups.

Do you have night-mode on any of your audio devices? MP3 player, speakers, receiver, etc? If you do then try it out, that is basically what compression is. It allows you to hear quieter sounds while still keeping the volume low enough that the loud sounds don't wake your parents/gf/wife/roommate.

And I know this may seem off-topic but I think it's relevant to buttkickers as it is technically an audio device, and understanding differences in the way audio devices/settings work could help setup. If anyone wants me to stop because you feel it is off-topic just ask and I will stop.

 

[Mr Latte]

Yeah Im with you now regards the compression

It was sometimes referred to "midnight mode" Dolby etc can be encoded to utilise this mode and reduce the loud sounds on the fly.
That however doesnt explain why I then felt more bass in a mode that should actually reduce the bass. Maybe needs more investigation from others to make sure Im not imagining it all.

I was hoping by now some other BK users would be able to test themselves.

 

[jswilli1]

Yeah Im with you now regards the compression

It was sometimes referred to "midnight mode" Dolby etc can be encoded to utilise this mode and reduce the loud sounds on the fly.
That however doesnt explain why I then felt more bass in a mode that should actually reduce the bass. Maybe needs more investigation from others to make sure Im not imagining it all.

I was hoping by now some other BK users would be able to test themselves.

I moved my BK from the couch to my game chair and played some Battlefield Bad Company 2 today. I haven't used my chair in many months and WOW, the BK on the couch is one thing but in the Chair I forgot how that felt. I plan on playing some GT5P this week and I will test out the small/Large room settings. Are we talking the in game audio fields or the small/large speaker settings on the AV receiver? My Onkyo 805 utilizes an Audyssey mic that I use to automatically setup my audio settings. If I recall all my settings are set at small speakers but I will verify that and post them.

 

[crazedmodder]

Yeah Im with you now regards the compression

It was sometimes referred to "midnight mode" Dolby etc can be encoded to utilise this mode and reduce the loud sounds on the fly.
That however doesnt explain why I then felt more bass in a mode that should actually reduce the bass. Maybe needs more investigation from others to make sure Im not imagining it all.

I was hoping by now some other BK users would be able to test themselves.

Maybe it's the way they do the compression. Also it might be because they didn't put a lot of bass in. I would guess while racing you wouldn't hear too many <150Hz frequencies (maybe feel it). So when you increase compression it takes the bass which is quite soft and boosts it up a little? Not really sure.

Are we talking the in game audio fields or the small/large speaker settings on the AV receiver? My Onkyo 805 utilizes an Audyssey mic that I use to automatically setup my audio settings. If I recall all my settings are set at small speakers but I will verify that and post them.

In-game audio field settings.