Calling all track designers, show off your work!

[Jimlaad43]

The one thing I can’t figure out a good solution to is pit entry, I’m a bit stuck on how to make a safe one.

The best thing to do for a pitlane like Willow Springs where you have to come off the racing line is to have it start right on the exit of the corner, but have a long run before the chicane/pit limiter line to give cars the chance to leave the circuit at racing speed, and then slow down off the line.

 

[twitcher]

The best thing to do for a pitlane like Willow Springs where you have to come off the racing line is to have it start right on the exit of the corner, but have a long run before the chicane/pit limiter line to give cars the chance to leave the circuit at racing speed, and then slow down off the line.

Are you suggesting to have the start of pit entry to be on the outside of the final corner? So cars continuing on a lap would turn right, while cars going to the pits would go in a more straight direction?

I had thought of something like that, similar to Buriram in Thailand. My issue with the idea is that in Thailand, that final corner is much sharper, and has a slower approach speed. At Willow, that final corner is wicked fast, so I assuming it would need a lot of runoff. If the pit entry were to be as you’re proposing (I think), would it not be an issue that the pit entry would have to be really really long, in order to go all the way around the runoff for the final corner?

I’m picturing it would be like the way pit lane rejoins the track at Zolder, with that looong left handed that goes around the runoff for T1, but opposite since we’re talking about pit entry.


The other idea I had thought of was to have pit lane leave the circuit on the inside before the final corner, and then cross under the circuit to end up on the proper side. From a “flow” perspective, I think it works better. The obvious downside is a gimmicky tunnel that can easily get blocked and cause all kinds of chaos.

I’ll try to draw up a couple pictures later tonight to illustrate what I’m talking about, if it’s not clear with my rambles

 

[DesertPenguin]

I say leave Willow Springs alone and let it die. It's the only track car shows (that film in California) go to and it's awful to look at it. just a strip of pavement in the desert. Sonoma or Laguna Seca would be a million times more entertaining to watch. But also it's not great for racing. Maybe it was in the 50s and 60s but has anyone raced there recently? Why is it still in games then, and with GT Sport lacking so many tracks they chose that above so many others? Really?

/end rant

 

[twitcher]

I say leave Willow Springs alone and let it die. It's the only track car shows (that film in California) go to and it's awful to look at it. just a strip of pavement in the desert. Sonoma or Laguna Seca would be a million times more entertaining to watch. But also it's not great for racing. Maybe it was in the 50s and 60s but has anyone raced there recently? Why is it still in games then, and with GT Sport lacking so many tracks they chose that above so many others? Really?

/end rant

That’s the whole appeal of it, that it’s a strip of tarmac in the middle of the desert. Leguna and Sonoma are cramped, there’s no room to grow. At Willow Springs, there’s room to build massive pit facilities, grand stands, camping, a brand spanking new paddock, and because it’s in the middle of the desert, noise is not an issue. Can have races at pretty much any hour, concerts after the race, etc. And it’s only 2 hours from LA, with multiple multi lane roads servicing it.

As far as not great for racing, I beg to differ. I’ve had some incredible online races there, either in GT3 cars or LMP cars in pCARS.

As far as “why is it in games” or why do people care about it. Drive it. Then tell me what other circuit in the world has that kind of flow, those kind of high speed sweepers with elevation change. Spa is the only circuit that comes close.

Willow Springs and Mosport in Canada are 2 of the last, classical, “flowy” circuits left. There used to be circuits like them all over the place, and all of them save these two have been chopped up, butchered, and littered with chicanes.


My other reasoning behind focusing on Willow Springs is to give car culture in SoCal a home. Right now, it’s a hub of car culture, but there are no good circuits in SoCal. Leguna Seca is the closest, but it’s still quite a drive. On top of that, Willow Springs is a compound, Big Willow being one of 5 or 6 individual circuits and skid pads. If Big Willow hosting GPs and other major races could turn a profit for Willow Springs, some of that revenue could be used to enhance the facilities at Streets of Willow and Horse Theif Mile.

I agree that Willow Springs is nothing much at the moment. What I see with Willow is potential, not something that’s turn key ready to host an F1 event.

Keep in mind that Willow Springs is also the oldest permanent road course in North America, so it has a lot of heritage to it. If someone could modernize the facilities, modernize track safety, lengthen the lap, BUT keep as much of the old circuit in tact as possible, you could have something really special - a true home for motorsport on the West Coast.

Edit: also, as far as bad for racing...my revised layout isn’t quite the same as the current layout, adding 3 heavy braking zones to help create overtaking chances for modern racecars.

 

[Darla Starch]

Because I wanted to revive the thread for funsies:

Extremely rough doodle of a Baltimore street circuit. Start/stop is somewhere between the traffic circle at Katyn Circle and Kaiser Permenante, flows clockwise, views of the Inner Harbor had to happen.

 

[Carbonox]

Here's something I drafted for Lausanne out of boredom. I suppose Rue des Cotes-de-Montbenon will have to act as the pit lane.

Also, offtopic, but has anyone else kinda lost their inspiration for course creating now that the site's undergone all those drastic changes? Even when I wasn't making tracks, I liked using it over Google Maps for being like a lighter version of it. Now, we have to make do without street views and with lower quality satellite images (at least in that town's case, that is).

 

[mwoodski]

I say leave Willow Springs alone and let it die. It's the only track car shows (that film in California) go to and it's awful to look at it. just a strip of pavement in the desert. Sonoma or Laguna Seca would be a million times more entertaining to watch. But also it's not great for racing. Maybe it was in the 50s and 60s but has anyone raced there recently? Why is it still in games then, and with GT Sport lacking so many tracks they chose that above so many others? Really?

/end rant

I know this is old, but if you repaved/widened big Willow and gave it a modern pitlane, it would be an incredible track for IMSA and Indycar to go to.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Maybe they could plant some grass seeds too

 

[Carbonox]

Newry, NI

Quite a pain to make as most roads didn't tolerate automatic paths. All the more reason why we need a race track preset on that site.

 

[ShiftingGears]

Willow Springs is great for racing online. Fast and flowing. I wouldn't want it changed because then it just becomes more like any other track.

 

[ShiftingGears]

Here's some of mine I doodled this week.

 

[AbsoluteBarstool]

Having played a bot of F1 2020 tonight, I thought about all the things that feel wrong in Russia, besides the obvious lacking corner variety and topographical blankness. I thought that the existing overtaking opportunities could be exaggerated a little bit and all of the needlessly-awkward corners replaced with something that flows a little better.

Turn 1 remains unchanged as this layout really wouldn't benefit from any kind of reprofiling here. After the same journey around turn 2, turn 3 becomes a wide hairpin after a few more metres of straight road. This gives cars more of a chance to line themselves up before trying to stick an overtake on what is now a heavier braking zone than before.

Turn 4 eases on to a curve that leads to a 3-turn chicane, which does a classical job of keeping drivers busy. Turns 8 and 9 have been loosened and pushed a bit faster because there really wasn't much drivers could get away with there in the first place.

Turn 10 has been widened into an irregular curve, leading into an exaggerated turn 11. A right-hand curve down the back straight brakes heavily into a hairpin that was inspired by the one at the end of Suzuka - a ballsy wedge-job waiting to be done by anyone who dares try one on there.

Turns 14 and 15 have been softened and given more of a sense of flow because what we have in place today is just dreadful - and a wide, Nürburgringish final hairpin rounds out the lap.

 

[DG_Silva]

Shortening things down does change the profile a fair bit.

View attachment 706700

I'd think that following the SuperPrix route is basically unavoidable in the interests of logistics, but the back-roads do offer a few good options.

I would say that Birmingham suits a longer layout as this seems to allow for the inclusion of a good number of turns. This would balance it similarly to Mexico for periods of time spent accelerating and Buenos Aires for overall technical challenge.

Though I do get the impression that I'll never reach Hermann Tilke's level for the ability to design facilities that host motorsports events.

The idea of a Birmingham e-Prix sounds intriguing, and trying to find a route which doesn't take in the previous Superprix track was tough, especially with Brum being a permanent building site, but I think this looks interesting, especially with going through the tunnel under the Rotunda roundabout (although this could be changed to go around it).

http://www.gmap-pedometer.com/?r=7530027

 

[AbsoluteBarstool]

I looked at Imola today, after digesting the things I wasn't a fan of seeing in the broadcast and thinking about changes that I'd make in the interests of improving the driving experience.

So, I started by trying to conceive a change to Tamburello that would bring back that old-school sense of pure risk without having to pave over the river. It manifested itself as a mid-speed flick left, into a longer straight that makes Villeneuve a more cut-and-shut overtaking point that is rounded at the exit. This should leave entry speed into Tosa unaffected and therefore make no difference to the run toward Piratella.

After Piratella, I put a chicane back in front of Acque Minerali because I think it's quite a fun chicane. On the other side of things, I think that Variante Alta is the worst chicane on any circuit - so I softened it into a double-kink.

Then, to avoid demolishing people's houses, I moved Rivazza up the track slightly and sharpened it.

So now it's either old-school and better, or oversimplified and ruined.