"Daily" Race Discussion [Archive]

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darth_tails
What's going to happen about this glitching bug in races where cars simply pass through each other due to being in close proximity to each other?
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Not much probably. In the end to many people were complaining about the bad penalty system when if we could rewind the time the system was almost perfect when it first came out and adding that hit from the back thing. They had no idea what to do so they created this piece of unrealistic garbage ghosting.

ARTAsean
I'm not sure if they patched the clutch + shifter advantage, but that's worth a few tenths as well.
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I am not sure I like your post, as much as I understand it. It was not an advantage, it was simple realism. I hate it that PD is killing more and more realism. The clutch and shifter “advantage” as you call it was just how it should be driving a car. If the car has a clutch and no paddles, using paddles should be disadvantage a bit against using the game/car as intended. This is realism, instead of arcade games. When using a controller you gain advantage because in real cars you have no controller. Going so fast easily with controllers is something you should call an advantage. So to me personally it was not nice to see that “advantage” going away. In reward I would like it to be a bit more difficult to use the controller. Dont see that happen though.

Again: nothing wrong with using either thing. This is not a pro/contra discussion. But calling it an advantage whilst it is pure realism when at home you have a wheel and shifter and a clutch is just not something I find fair. And because of those people whining and complaining PD took away that last bit of realism and made it more arcade.

For all those people: enjoy the new arcade ghosting :)


@ARTAsean: I am not attacking you in any way. I understand where you come from and I am not shouting the messenger but the situation. For all I know you are also using the clutch etc.
 
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Apology to 2 cars I saw crashing spectacularly behind me.

This morning. Race B. I started P8. Lap 1. On the big bank turn on Maggiore.

I was looking at my rear view for a split second too long and had to turn awkwardly to keep on pavement. Car trying to overtake me on the inside tried to avoid me but lost traction and spun out taking out another car who was carefully trying to navigate the outside.

I feel bad. But I did gain 2 spots for the first time in ages.
 
Macboyilija
Not much probably. In the end to many people were complaining about the bad penalty system when if we could rewind the time the system was almost perfect when it first came out and adding that hit from the back thing. They had no idea what to do so they created this piece of unrealistic garbage ghosting.


I am not sure I like your post, as much as I understand it. It was not an advantage, it was simple realism. I hate it that PD is killing more and more realism. The clutch and shifter “advantage” as you call it was just how it should be driving a car. If the car has a clutch and no paddles, using paddles should be disadvantage a bit against using the game/car as intended. This is realism, instead of arcade games. When using a controller you gain advantage because in real cars you have no controller. Going so fast easily with controllers is something you should call an advantage. So to me personally it was not nice to see that “advantage” going away. In reward I would like it to be a bit more difficult to use the controller. Dont see that happen though.

Again: nothing wrong with using either thing. This is not a pro/contra discussion. But calling it an advantage whilst it is pure realism when at home you have a wheel and shifter and a clutch is just not something I find fair. And because of those people whining and complaining PD took away that last bit of realism and made it more arcade.

For all those people: enjoy the new arcade ghosting :)


@ARTAsean: I am not attacking you in any way. I understand where you come from and I am not shouting the messenger but the situation. For all I know you are also using the clutch etc.
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Actually I bought the shifter because I was tired of Sport Mode dumping me into the race at redline in 1st/2nd gear. The whole clutch + shifter speed boost thing was just a bonus to me that i really didn't care about.

My whole issue with the shifting is its unrealistically SLOW in GTS, I shift faster than that when im commuting to work.

You're right in that using a clutch + shifter is all about risk vs. reward, and those who risk it should be rewarded for it. But I could also argue that it's kind of unfair that people are forced to spend $200 on periphery to be equal with each other. I'm NOT taking either side on this argument, just saying, it's something to think about.

I hardly ever do the N class races anyway, so it's not an issue I have a stake in.
 
I had an absolute blast with Race A last night at the changeover, I've never driven the GRMN GT-86 but it was just clicking with me. I never thought I'd see it but I actually got my name in the top 10 (albeit a very early ~40 minutes into the day, and it only stayed there for a few minutes):

Gran Turismo®SPORT_20180709003759.jpg


Every race I did was a good one, and at least half of them I've been neck-and-neck with one or more other players for multiple laps. I don't remember having such an adrenaline rush since very early in the beta in an N300 Nordschleife race, absolutely rad.
 
ARTAsean
You're right in that using a clutch + shifter is all about risk vs. reward, and those who risk it should be rewarded for it. But I could also argue that it's kind of unfair that people are forced to spend $200 on periphery to be equal with each other.
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Very understandable positioned argument. It just seems to deny there is nothing realistic about using a controller when driving a car. Still, people can be fast or even (much) faster with a controller than with a wheel. Most people need to “learn” to go as fast with the wheel as with the controller. That seems fair enough ?

So when you have not much money to spend you can instantly go fast with the game. So PD is already making it possible for people to compete against people who spend hundreds or thousands dollars in gear. That does not seem unfair does it ? So it would be fair for those who do spend a bit more to actually gain just a tiny advantage. And what about CSA ? Is that not unfair advantage against those who use the wheel ?

Also do not forget that this clutch/shifter “advantage” does not work in all the Group race classes where the cars all have paddles in real life. So its more about some cool N-class cars and not the most online races in sport mode. So it really was a tiny “advantage” used in some backdoor parts of the game not changing anything big and important. There is no clutch advantage in FIA for example.

Pretty good example of some whining and crying players that led up to this unfortunately. GT was always about controller racing. No need to change that. But going from realism to more arcade is always a bad thing in a game that takes itself as serious as PD does.


@Quakebass: grats ! Nice to hear ! Have encountered the same thing last week seeing my name in the top 10 again for some hours before going down the drane later the day. Still feels special.
 
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darth_tails
One simple question for today's Race A - How the heck are you all getting 1:07-1:10's as I can't get below 1:11.

What's the best brake balance for the 86 GRMN?
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I was in the 1:08s this morning, and I was at -1. It's a well-balanced car, but since it's a front-engine car, and the load will shift to the front anyways, upon deceleration, I'll slow down more rapidly, therefore I'll be able to out-brake someone with all their braking power in the rear. Others prefer rear brake bias to help spin the back end around. Whatever's more comfortable for the individual.
 
sturk0167
I was in the 1:08s this morning, and I was at -1. It's a well-balanced car, but since it's a front-engine car, and the load will shift to the front anyways, upon deceleration, I'll slow down more rapidly, therefore I'll be able to out-brake someone with all their braking power in the rear. Others prefer rear brake bias to help spin the back end around. Whatever's more comfortable for the individual.
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Except that's not how brake balance works in GTS.
 
ARTAsean
Except that's not how brake balance works in GTS.
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I'm certainly no GTS expert, by any means. How does the GTS brake balance differ from what I was thinking? I have never really looked into it. I just always assumed PD used physics in the game design.
 
I raced in race A today i had the best time since i got the game really nice stuff ! i got 2 penalty's (1 second in total) in like 10 races & i got a new record of clean races (6 or 7) to top it of my rank is back to B-S.
 
sturk0167
I was in the 1:08s this morning, and I was at -1. It's a well-balanced car, but since it's a front-engine car, and the load will shift to the front anyways, upon deceleration, I'll slow down more rapidly, therefore I'll be able to out-brake someone with all their braking power in the rear. Others prefer rear brake bias to help spin the back end around. Whatever's more comfortable for the individual.
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Thanks, just did an attempt with BB 5 and got a 1:10:033 so will try this and see if it's better but will work on BB and see if I can get a 1:09. 👍
 
sturk0167
I'm certainly no GTS expert, by any means. How does the GTS brake balance differ from what I was thinking? I have never really looked into it. I just always assumed PD used physics in the game design.
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If putting the slider forward (negative) decreased the braking distance, people would be running -5 in all cars all the time right?

So let's assume braking distance in GTS has a value of 100. No matter where you set the brake balance slider, the braking distance will always be 100 when braking in a straight line. Fact. This is either to simplify the physics model, or just because simcade.

So instead, I like to think of brake balance more of a "how good are you at trail braking" scale. Because that is the main benefit in running a rear brake balance. Sending more braking power to the rear wheels, takes more braking power away from the front, which increases front wheel grip that can instead be used for turning, while trail braking.

Since trail braking is the one motorsport technique that has arguably the biggest effect on lap times, it makes sense that the aliens all run +5.
 
ARTAsean
So let's assume braking distance in GTS has a value of 100. No matter where you set the brake balance slider, the braking distance will always be 100 when braking in a straight line. Fact. This is either to simplify the physics model, or just because simcade.
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This isnt true. The front tires do most of the braking always due to weight transfer. Even if you shift the balance to +5 you still have not changed the front bias only reduced it bit. The current thought is that the cars probably start with around the typical 60:40 balance and the adjuster lets you move a percent here or there. so in reality you never really should be less than 55% front even at +5
ARTAsean
So instead, I like to think of brake balance more of a "how good are you at trail braking" scale. Because that is the main benefit in running a rear brake balance. Sending more braking power to the rear wheels, takes more braking power away from the front, which increases front wheel grip that can instead be used for turning, while trail braking.

Since trail braking is the one motorsport technique that has arguably the biggest effect on lap times, it makes sense that the aliens all run +5.
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Except they dont. Usually, the car and the track dictate which balance you should use. If you have tire wear on in the race, then the balance should be adjusted accordingly
 
John Crellin
This isnt true. The front tires do most of the braking always due to weight transfer. Even if you shift the balance to +5 you still have not changed the front bias only reduced it bit. The current thought is that the cars probably start with around the typical 60:40 balance and the adjuster lets you move a percent here or there. so in reality you never really should be less than 55% front even at +5
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I'm not sure if you don't speak english natively or just didn't care to read what i said, I never even remotely addressed this... I said braking distance doesn't change no matter what braking balance is set to, and it doesn't... So yes, what i said is true.

John Crellin
Except they dont. Usually, the car and the track dictate which balance you should use. If you have tire wear on in the race, then the balance should be adjusted accordingly
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More nonsense attempting to ride my coat-tail expertise. I never said aliens use +5 in every situation did I? i said +5 allows the most out of trail braking. ****s sake, man
 
ARTAsean
No matter where you set the brake balance slider, the braking distance will always be 100 when braking in a straight line. Fact.
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It doesn't become a fact by you saying so. The braking distances are noticably different between brake balance settings and it differs between cars. For example the Ferrari 458 Gr.3 stops faster with a rearward balance but is a nightmare to drive with one, the Scirocco Gr.4 on the other hand stops better with a neutral setting.
ARTAsean
I never said aliens use +5 in every situation did I? i said +5 allows the most out of trail braking. ****s sake, man
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You seem to have a short memory.
ARTAsean
Since trail braking is the one motorsport technique that has arguably the biggest effect on lap times, it makes sense that the aliens all run +5.
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No conditions given. They all run +5, full stop.
 
It's not like @ARTAsean is known for being argumentative & defensive or anything.....as long as you don't disagree with him and his "expertise." Lolz. Take a walk bud.
 
ARTAsean
So let me get this right.

-Belittle my expertise

-be slower than me

You can't have both, dude
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Nobody is belittling your expertise you twit. It's your attitude that stinks and everyone smells it.

BUT, if you were such an expert you'd know that brake balance in this game can have an affect on braking distance. It's clear as day, just try it.
 
ARTAsean
I'm not sure if you don't speak english natively or just didn't care to read what i said, I never even remotely addressed this... I said braking distance doesn't change no matter what braking balance is set to, and it doesn't... So yes, what i said is true.



More nonsense attempting to ride my coat-tail expertise. I never said aliens use +5 in every situation did I? i said +5 allows the most out of trail braking. ****s sake, man
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Hold on there killer,
The braking distance does tend to become shorter as you move the bias forward (some cars wash their front ends out under heavy braking with too much forward bias thus increasing the braking distance), you said the braking distance is constant and that is what i was disagreeing with.

You never said "they use +5 it in ALL situations" but you implied that with no further clarification (full stop) by saying "it makes sense that the aliens all run +5"
...and they don't. so there is that.

as for 'riding your coat-tail expertise' (meaning you are particularly knowledgeable about coat-tails) I think you meant 'riding on my coat-tails of expertise' which is an english idiom that i would expect a native speaker to get right
 
Stop talking nonsense, you can't set a brake balance at 2 3 or 5 all track long and be in optimal balance, you need to adjust it for each corner depending on the corner, or just find a happy medium for said given track, so for example long sweeping bends you can have +5 and tight hair pins - 5 ect, I'm not going to to tell you the exact sweet spot as it's really your own personal taste. And sometimes your just better leaving it alone because all the messing about could make you do a mistakes and makes the whole experience not worth it anyway.
 
*Sigh*

I cannot believe the harshness of the starts from the grid, one or maybe two contacts at most because I ended up in the sandwich with
a 2 minute penalty I end up rage quitting for the night with my DR dropped down to 14603 so only about 2000 points lost but my SR is down 28 points from 81 to 53 so SR B.

I know I will make it up tomorrow with Blue Moon Bay and the N300 race tomorrow as I will be making damn sure I qualify near top of the grid but why such a harsh penalty loss from minor penalties on Tsukuba today?
 
Had a few good runs earlier this morning on Tsukuba, two wins, four fastest laps.

Utter garbage in the later afternoon, after work, though. :lol:
 
darth_tails
I cannot believe the harshness of the starts from the grid, one or maybe two contacts at most because I ended up in the sandwich with a 2 minute penalty.
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Wow 2 mins is pretty harsh! The most I've had is 1min at Tokyo (that's why I don't do Tokyo, too many idiots ramming you into walls). I know what it's like to get stuck in the middle. You have no where to go and there's no way to avoid contact. Just hang in there and hope the next race is better 👍.
 
awaite85
These races would be more fun if I wasn't ran off the road by a Brazilian every race.
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Now that you mention Brazilians.....

I can't help but think of Helio spinning out at the Indy 500, everytime one spins out on the final turn. :lol:
 
Invisigoth
Wow 2 mins is pretty harsh! The most I've had is 1min at Tokyo (that's why I don't do Tokyo, too many idiots ramming you into walls). I know what it's like to get stuck in the middle. You have no where to go and there's no way to avoid contact. Just hang in there and hope the next race is better 👍.
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One time I completely missed the braking point at La Sarthe and flew through the first chicane after the long straight and I got one penalty for 1:30. A single penalty, 1.5 minutes. I couldn't believe it. I mean, I missed it REAL bad almost like it wasn't there, but I definitely didn't gain a minute of time. Fortunately it wasn't in a Sport Mode race.
 
Winnie847
One time I completely missed the braking point at La Sarthe and flew through the first chicane after the long straight and I got one penalty for 1:30. A single penalty, 1.5 minutes. I couldn't believe it. I mean, I missed it REAL bad almost like it wasn't there, but I definitely didn't gain a minute of time. Fortunately it wasn't in a Sport Mode race.
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Last time I missed my braking point there, I wasn't so lucky as to breeze through the chicane. I hit concrete blocks in a strait line with my foot still flat to the floor :lol:. Apparently they haven't added the no chicane version of the track yet....... :rolleyes:.
 
Last night I had some ******** penalties at Suzuka multiple times people using me as brakes at the hairpin and coming out with 1-3 second penalties and behind the guy that hit me who has no penalty???

Then following someone closely and get brake checked try to miss them and just the tiniest touch boom 10 second penalty for me and another one at the hairpin there was no visible or audio sign I even touched a guy and it gives me 10 seconds again.

Penalty system is still a joke and gives me the ***** more often than not
 
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