Dear PD, please bring GT7 back to DAY 1 physics and ffb

[RacinLei]

The only way to adress Pad and wheel users gap was to give an option to filter matchmaking, wheel users against wheel users and Pad users against pad users, and the option of course to not use filters just like it works now .

The nature of the hardware dont allow to make such changes and trying to balance for both only limits game development..., Pad users have already plenty of help going on, and actually GT its one of the best if not the best racing game with Pad support, like the motion sensor that after a lot of pratice its way more fun and intuitive compared to stick people just need to figure how to use it in a confortable manner.

I dont ask for much and it is possible.
1 to 1 steering to tire movement like on wheel. And thats not a hardware limit. It is a desicion from PD

 

[Theufcveteran]

I dont ask for much and it is possible.
1 to 1 steering to tire movement like on wheel. And thats not a hardware limit. It is a desicion from PD

PD must be very careful when changing how the controller inputs work. I’m sure they are, and they’ve got it down as one of, if not, the best of all sims, as far as I know.

I’ve not played AC, ACC, or PCARS 2 or 3, but I have heard that the controller handling in AC isn’t great. ACC may be better, but I believe I’ve read that it’s still not as good as GT.

If you go the wrong way with controller inputs, you can end up with Project CARS 1, which was legitimately uncontrollable unless you were going at 50%, or tinkered for a while to get the right settings. I never found them, I tried a few setups, they were all super hard to control. I can’t say for sure whether a good setup existed for the game, but many people had issues with the controller in PCARS.

I heard PCARS 2 was better, and 3 is the best of the series. But regarding GT, they’re very much in a “if it’s not broke, don’t fix it” kind of place.

With that said, PD know how to make a sim work on a controller, so if they did change something, it would likely still feel good to play. But 1:1 movement could cause some problems with the limited range on the controller.

If they were to do this, I’d hope that it would be an option and not the new default, as right now, for me, it’s in a great place. Not that I don’t want it to be great for others, but an option instead, so the experience that exists now, isn’t changed.

 

[sonnyboychris]

I'm fine with them evolving physics but better FFB is a must-have. It's singularly the weakest part of the game for me... I hope that it's on their to-do list.

 

[RacinLei]

@Theufcveteran

They are good yes, but compare to wheel speed i would say its a 3rd of them. Double the speed would be a good start.
But its the same problem like the broken ffb. Something happen with patch 1.14 and since then there not able to fix it. Last time the controller was good was with patch 1.21. since 1.24 it felt wrong again specialy with these wierd bop decision for sf19.

Hopefully they fix 🙏

 

[GOTMAXPOWER]

Pad users have already plenty of help going on

Help is great if it is helpful, the "help" on GT7 has made certain cars undrivable in competitive races. Splitting pads and wheels this week would make the races fair but doesn't solve how utterly miserable some of these cars are to drive at the minute.

 

[Pigems]

Some people/posters have consistent bad takes.

GT7 is much more realistic now than before, even though it was fun correcting your car and feeling like you were on the limit easier. It was more hardcore if you will.

A pity that physics system was not close to real life so it got changed for the better now. Always better when it's more realistic.

It’s not more realistic now though, that’s the thing, is just “easy” now, and “boring”.

Does astonish me how many people still believe "realism is when spin"

GT7 isn't perfect, for sure, but if reality was like some of the sims from the late 2000's/early 2010's - every second person would be spinning out when getting groceries or picking their kids up from school.

Yup, because every person that’s out there getting groceries and running errands, is driving their road car at the absolute limit of grip, whether it’s cornering or breaking. That makes a lot of sense.🤣

 

[Nebuc72]

Yup, because every person that’s out there getting groceries and running errands, is driving their road car at the absolute limit of grip, whether it’s cornering or breaking. That makes a lot of sense.🤣

Well that's exactly my point lol, these sims have such odd physics that in some of them even going 30mph is enough to kick the rear wheels out of something and make it go round. A lot of them were nonsensically hard for the sake of realism, where the cars are much more difficult to control than they should be.

Even Assetto Corsa has bizarre low-speed physics that would have every real road car understeering off into a wall whenever they made a turn - and making contact gives you an insane amount of traction loss, even if it's just a light tap.

It's been greatly improved in a lot of sims since then. iRacing has come a long way, and continues to progress - and ACC is also very solid.

 

[Pigems]

Well that's exactly my point lol, these sims have such odd physics that in some of them even going 30mph is enough to kick the rear wheels out of something and make it go round. A lot of them were nonsensically hard for the sake of realism, where the cars are much more difficult to control than they should be.

Even Assetto Corsa has bizarre low-speed physics that would have every real road car understeering off into a wall whenever they made a turn - and making contact gives you an insane amount of traction loss, even if it's just a light tap.

It's been greatly improved in a lot of sims since then. iRacing has come a long way, and continues to progress - and ACC is also very solid.

How was that your point? You said people getting groceries would be spinning? Why would someone who’s out getting groceries, be driving like it’s a race car, on a race track? They wouldn’t be, period, so that point makes zero sense. Maybe if you said people who take their road cars to track days, would be spinning out a lot, and I’d imagine they do, a lot. My 92 S10 barely had 100hp, and it could break the tires free super easily, if you wanted them too, especially at low speeds. The RX7 was no different, and still barely had 200hp, but people expect to break able to floor it in a 500hp sports car, and get zero wheel spin somehow? 🙄

 

[Nebuc72]

How was that your point? You said people getting groceries would be spinning? Why would someone who’s out getting groceries, be driving like it’s a race car, on a race track? They wouldn’t be, period, so that point makes zero sense. Maybe if you said people who take their road cars to track days, would be spinning out a lot, and I’d imagine they do, a lot. My 92 S10 barely had 100hp, and it could break the tires free super easily, if you wanted them too, especially at low speeds. The RX7 was no different, and still barely had 200hp, but people expect to break able to remap it in a 500hp sports car, and get zero wheel spin somehow? 🙄

I mean if you're just going to completely ignore the rest of my comment so you can double down on what I didn't say, is there any point of us having this discussion?

 

[Pigems]

I mean if you're just going to completely ignore the rest of my comment so you can double down on what I didn't say, is there any point of us having this discussion?

Not really, no, but go ahead and continue to argue a point that makes no sense all you like. 👍

 

[Imari]

I dont ask for much and it is possible.
1 to 1 steering to tire movement like on wheel. And thats not a hardware limit. It is a desicion from PD

It could be an option, but it would only be usable by a tiny number of very dedicated pad users. I remember playing a pCARS alpha build with controller input that was 1:1. It was drivable, but only barely. Most people would assume their game or controller were broken if it played like that. I get why PD doesn't waste their time.

I think if this was to be viable you'd want something like Trackmania action keys that you can toggle to limit max steering angle. That gives the driver full control still. Otherwise it's always going to be a nightmare trying to feather the stick at high speed. You can't drive predictably and consistently at 200mph when half an inch of analogue travel is equivalent to full lock.

 

[RacinLei]

It could be an option, but it would only be usable by a tiny number of very dedicated pad users. I remember playing a pCARS alpha build with controller input that was 1:1. It was drivable, but only barely. Most people would assume their game or controller were broken if it played like that. I get why PD doesn't waste their time.

I think if this was to be viable you'd want something like Trackmania action keys that you can toggle to limit max steering angle. That gives the driver full control still. Otherwise it's always going to be a nightmare trying to feather the stick at high speed. You can't drive predictably and consistently at 200mph when half an inch of analogue travel is equivalent to full lock.

True, but something hase to be done. 1st sector suzuka sf19 BOP with controller is horrible and my biggest timeloss. Feels like snailing arround compare to wheel user.
For all non high downforce cars it is nearly perfect.
Hopes are low for a change…

 

[KaiB]

Help is great if it is helpful, the "help" on GT7 has made certain cars undrivable in competitive races. Splitting pads and wheels this week would make the races fair but doesn't solve how utterly miserable some of these cars are to drive at the minute.

I dont know if you own a wheel.., or if you drived the super formula on a wheel...

It´s very hard to control the trajectories compared to low downforce cars cause the FFB its always trying to fight you, a easy way its to lower FFB/sensitivity so the effect its less pronounced, im my case i´m using VR which make it twice harder cause some tracks you need to really know from memory how to approach some sectors cause tracks in VR feel complettly diferent, Road Atlanta for example and many others tracks with huge elevations/curbs that you cant see the entire track compared to 2D.

It needs a lot of pratice even for wheel users do drive the super formula in a consistent way, but yes i kinda imagine on a controller its a very particular case.

 

[Magog]

The physics are way better now but I do miss the extreme dust and rain/tire spray that was present in the day 1 build. Also they need to bring back the dynamic replay option. The standard one doesn't have enough variety of angles.

 

[EbrahimX7]

day1 physics were not realistic but it was just a few fixes from being close. My main issue currently is with throttle smashing almost every single corner with most cars.. its so ugggh!

I can literally switch the input from pedal to an X button lol.

I miss the feeling of traction loss and the ability to control it with the pedal. I just want at least some of that back 😭

 

[Dave A]

day1 physics were not realistic but it was just a few fixes from being close. My main issue currently is with throttle smashing almost every single corner with most cars.. its so ugggh!

I can literally switch the input from pedal to an X button lol.

I miss the feeling of traction loss and the ability to control it with the pedal. I just want at least some of that back 😭

The hyperbole is strong with this one.

It doesn't matter how many times you repeat similar statements, it doesn't make them true lol.

 

[EbrahimX7]

The hyperbole is strong with this one.

It doesn't matter how many times you repeat similar statements, it doesn't make them true lol.

😥

 

[kraftwerkd]

Scaff already illustrated the physics issue, so I won't repeat what he already mentioned.

As far as bringing back V1.0 FFB? Please no! The only thing remotely 'force'-ful about the old FFB was the way the Tomahawk wanted to tear your arms out of their sockets, and that was it. Kerb effects? What are those. Road feel? Lol. The most you'll get nowadays is some load under steering or load at high speeds, other than that the FFB in this game is next to non-existant.

If anything, the FFB should be re-built from the ground up. But that's just my silly opinion.

 

[BreakerOhio]

Compared to the day 1 physics, we’re basically playing GT Sport with slightly less understeer currently. It’s boring as hell, to be honest, and not very challenging at all.

....

3+ seconds a lap faster now, vs day 1 in CE’s, is just silly. Same car, track, tires, weather, but here have a free 3s now instead, because it was too “hard” before and people complained about it. 🙄

💯
I wish PD gave us an option to have day 1 physics back too.

 

[extreme car]

I'd rather drink castrol than go back to that god awful day 1 physics. the constant fear of losing rear traction on RWD cars while applying the throttle was worrying.

 

[Pigems]

And PD is finally admitting that they don’t want us to see how much faster/easier they have made the driving physics, they’re wiping all the CE leaderboards now, so people won’t be able to see that the game is 2-3s faster over a lap now, vs day 1. 🤣

 

[ShiftingGears]

Some people/posters have consistent bad takes.

GT7 is much more realistic now than before, even though it was fun correcting your car and feeling like you were on the limit easier. It was more hardcore if you will.

A pity that physics system was not close to real life so it got changed for the better now. Always better when it's more realistic.

I don't agree that it's more realistic...how can it be more realistic when the FFB doesn't have detail?

 

[Nebuc72]

I don't agree that it's more realistic...how can it be more realistic when the FFB doesn't have detail?

"more" is not an equivalent word to "most"

Something can be "more" realistic than it was, without it being the "most" realistic thing on the market.

 

[ShiftingGears]

"more" is not an equivalent word to "most"

Something can be "more" realistic than it was, without it being the "most" realistic thing on the market.

I wasn't comparing GT7 to the rest of the market though, I'm comparing GT7 today to how it was a year ago.

 

[Nebuc72]

I wasn't comparing GT7 to the rest of the market though, I'm comparing GT7 today to how it was a year ago.

My point still doesn't change. It can still be "more" realistic than it was without being the "most" realistic adaptation possible.

 

[ShiftingGears]

My point still doesn't change. It can still be "more" realistic than it was without being the "most" realistic adaptation possible.

Yes, I just don't agree that it is more realistic compared to v1.13.

 

[ScottPuss20]

The "day 1" physics were total trash and I never want PD to revert back to it.

 

[Galvston]

I don't agree that it's more realistic...how can it be more realistic when the FFB doesn't have detail?

People need to separate Physics simulation from Force Feedback. Physics are the same system if you're on a controller, wheel or a plastic 20$ thing

FFB seems bad in GT7, but that's not tied to the physics, it's the FFB that needs work. I was talking about how cars behave compared to real life, not how I perceive the cars behaving through my wheel

 

[John_Marsten]

FFB seems bad in GT7

It really is bad. I have been playing GT Sport again and even it has much better FFB than GT7, to the point that I am enjoying driving in it more than 7. Its still not up there with the PC sims, but its still way better than what 7 has to offer.

 

[RacinLei]

It really is bad. I have been playing GT Sport again and even it has much better FFB than GT7, to the point that I am enjoying driving in it more than 7. Its still not up there with the PC sims, but its still way better than what 7 has to offer.

Whats is wierd, the ps4 version of gt7 had a better response in terms of tire feedback and stronger rumble then the ps5 version.

Yes, I just don't agree that it is more realistic compared to v1.13.

yes up to patch 1.13 was all more or less good but since then they messed it up.
Hopefully the new patch brings back the goods for FFB on wheel and haptik feedback on dualsense 🙏