Feel of driving in GT5(P) vs. Previous GTs

[Custer85]

Agree. Specially if you play Shift for a while and then comeback to Prologue - you'll notice immediately the difference. Shift gives a more realistic feedback of traction and grip, tire-road contact, than Prologue. I expect (wish) GT5 would be at Shift's level on this specific issue.

I hope it doesn't and i really like Shift. Its no simulation and its overexagurated physics model combined with the heavy use of blur make it very entertaining and fun for an arcade game. Shift is basicly the game that Grid should have been.

 

[Gejost]

Also I was thinking about the inclusion of NASCAR and WRC. I think that will change the experience of racing drastically. What do you guys think of it? Do you think it will make the experience better or worse for Gran Turismo?

The more the better, if it's done right. But i'm sure PD will take care of that. 👍

 

[Perkel]

no feel of grip ? comeone, I feel every bump every loose of grip on my g25...

learn a car and you don't even need to feel it, you just counter it when is about to spin.

I drive myself also rfactor and i think gt5p is preaty much close to rfactor in therms of physic, but there are problem with heel & toe in gt5p, in real life this is must , in gt5p i can drive very fast lap without that..

Hope physic will get better with gt5

sry for my eng..//

 

[Leadfoot53]

I have driven rFactor, Richard Burns Rally, iRacing, every game in the GTR/Race series, NASCAR Simracing, and NASCAR Racing 2003 Season on PC with the Logitech Momo, Logitech DFGT and the G25. In GT5P, I can feel the tires lose grip and the oversteer/understeer.

 

[Zer0]

Look for yourself.

We have some game with telemetry, which shows how grip changes at every tire and a lot of other different stuff in real time. From the other side we have game which shows nothing.

Games are different, which one you will trust?

You are asuming that if is not show then no exists and that is a nonsense.

GT4P MTRC demo version:

Video:
http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/driving...rismo-4-gameplay-movie-24?tag=videos;title;17

Same car on GT4 didn't have all the on screen stuff but drive the same.

 

[Nomino]

A car that somersaults into space, while dispensing chocolate ice cream from the exhaust. Too much to ask?

Yes

Some decent racing AI - that would be useful, so you know, we had a decent racing game too instead of just driving around a track in a precession...

 

[haubi]

Maybe.

I just don't understand how you are going to prevent sliding if there is no any feel of grip or limits? Memorize the speed for each turn?

And how you are going to make perfect racing lines if all cars want to go round instead diving inside?

Prologue is very different from all other games. All this LFS/Forza/rFactor/GTL feels like very close relatives, GT5P is completely different and stands alone. Skills from all other sims don't work here

gotta disagree with you on this one.
I started drifting in LFS and I was pretty decent drifting in Gt5p right away.
Forza 3 Demo is a different story though. It has like 2000 times the grip that lfs or even gt5p have. I really don't get why you would think they were similar at all.

 

[devildog666]

In Standard mode, sliding is the fastest way around the track... but nobody plays standard mode.

Just so you know, the vast majority of people who play GT5P, play in standard mode.

 

[Stotty]

More immersion and a less clinical feel would be nice.

GT clearly has the most detailed physics engine for a console game, but the way the game interacts with the user is weak... there's too little FF effects, all the track surfaces are 100% smooth, plus the absurd lack of traction (note, I say traction, not grip) needs to be fixed... road cars do not spin their wheels to the red line in a straight line in 1st, 2nd and 3rd gears, even on road (N) tyres.

I want to feel the track surface through the wheel like I do in my own car.

 

[DRambo]

If GT PSP is anything to go by, I think GT5 will address wheel spin.

 

[Tenacious D]

Prologue is very different from all other games. All this LFS/Forza/rFactor/GTL feels like very close relatives, GT5P is completely different and stands alone. Skills from all other sims don't work here

Yeah, I have to disagree with this too. One of these things doesn't belong here.

I think a big part of the effect of Forza is the sound. Why people are attracted to those flatulent tire noises in FM2 and 3 is beyond me, but I get the impression that a roaring engine covers a multitude of sins. Since I'm not an engine note fiend, all of my focus is on the feel of the cars in every game I play. Forza has this kind of real, kind of "not" sensation to it, the way otago reacts to GT4. But for me, going from Live for Speed or GTR to Prologue is a very familiar experience.

I just spent some time last night in FM2 doing some quick races to get some photos for the livery editor thread, and was appalled at the incessant oversteer and the bots who ramed me to use as an extra set of brakes. I know the bots have all assists on, but they won't avoid you hardly at all. The jump from F2 to the F3 demo was negligible as far as feel, and darn if the graphics really do look a lot better in FM2!

 

[Seismica]

I think the physics on standard mode are horrible, theres way too much grip, no cars understeer, oversteer can be controlled very easily, you can come out of corners with your foot down in a Corvette and there is no oversteer/wheelspin.

To quote someone on this forum: "Professional mode is a whole different ball game".

You only get the true experience from a wheel in my opinion. But i guess this shows flaws in the controller more than the game. You can't regulate the throttle or steering properly with the sixaxis, it doesn't feel right. And this leads to a poor driving experience.

 

[yeti]

You only get the true experience from a wheel in my opinion. But i guess this shows flaws in the controller more than the game. You can't regulate the throttle or steering properly with the sixaxis, it doesn't feel right. And this leads to a poor driving experience.

I have to disagree - the Sixaxis is just as accurate if not more so than the xBox controller - as all of the buttons are analogue... if you can't do it with the X button - then change to the R2 button...

I agree, however, that the wheel offers much better feel - but that is obvious - the pedals have much more travel than the buttons on the sixaxis.

More travel = more accuracy (potentially)

C.

 

[TorqueHappenS08]

I know with this GT, since i bought a wheel, i just cant pick up the controller any more,
The difference was night and day for this game, Cant say that much for GT4 though.
Every thing comes alive, it's like it turn's into a PC sim. You can exacute the apex with professionalism as well as smooth through turns, it's just real and great fun.
I can feel the road, the tires hit the road, It's like i'm one with the car in the game, like it connects straight to my soul, Almost like when i go out and drive a real car, Except the sense of danger is not there.

 

[Seismica]

I have to disagree - the Sixaxis is just as accurate if not more so than the xBox controller - as all of the buttons are analogue... if you can't do it with the X button - then change to the R2 button...

I agree, however, that the wheel offers much better feel - but that is obvious - the pedals have much more travel than the buttons on the sixaxis.

More travel = more accuracy (potentially)

C.

The Triggers on the Xbox are better, but still arn't good enough for driving sims. I think you are right, the amount of travel on the pedal enables much better control. The R2 button isn't quite so good either. I think the analogue stick would be good with a bit of practice though.

 

[socomkiller59]

I'be been trying the analog buttons lately, and they're a lot better imo- also I was kinda forced to since my R2 trigger likes to get stuck when fully pressed. You have more control on how much gas/brake you want to put on with the car, thus more control of the car.

 

[Kryz11]

A car that somersaults into space, while dispensing chocolate ice cream from the exhaust. Too much to ask?

 

[NBH]

The control and style of racing has changed alot in my opinion. In gt1 it seemed to be more about drifting the cars around the corners and controlling the slides. It changed for me in gt3. It was much more about smooth driving and the pressure sensitive buttons on the ps2 controllers allowed this. In gt5p the smoothness remains but trying to steer with the d pad and accelerate with the x button is very difficult. I tried putting it on r2 but it's still so sensitive. I'm hoping to get a wheel as I feel that's going to be the best way to play the game, the more precise you can be on the power and steering must improve lap times compared to struggling with a controller.

 

[otago]

Yeah, I have to disagree with this too. One of these things doesn't belong here.

LOL. Forza has better physics than LFS and LFS physics is the best on PC so far.

Not surprisingly consider Turn 10 uses real life data for grip and tire physics, not just calculating some formula like LFS. They both feels very similar but when traction plays the main role like hard braking I put Forza on top.

So again this is impossible to check in real life cause all LFS cars are from parallel world. You can put on track real cars and compare GT vs Forza, with PC simulators it's impossible. They don't have money to license real stock cars

 

[sumbrownkid]

That's way beyond current gen capacity. I don't think GT5 physics can incorporate a coffee maker.

 

[Seismica]

That's way beyond current gen capacity. I don't think GT5 physics can incorporate a coffee maker.

Yes they so will. How else will B-spec bob do that 24hr race on his own?

 

[chepe371]

To quote someone on this forum: "Professional mode is a whole different ball game".

Yup only Professional for me, DS3 or wheel.

How it compares to GT4, well the cars have more weight to them, they swing it around more, if that makes sense.

G-force effects are better. Gas and Brake are much more "detailed" allowing broader range of control.

i found steering with the DS3 to be much too sensitive, maybe an adjustment for it in the menus in future. and i found the powertrain really comes through on Prologue vs GT4, you really get that mid-engine feel with the NSX and Ferraris.

 

[Smoke&Slide]

Quick question, does your wheel vibrate with the engine idle & become more pronounced when revving ?.I know a gentle vibration happens with the DS2 & WRC 4.

 

[Seismica]

i found steering with the DS3 to be much too sensitive, maybe an adjustment for it in the menus in future. and i found the powertrain really comes through on Prologue vs GT4, you really get that mid-engine feel with the NSX and Ferraris.

In terms of the D-pad i think that it isn't, tap and full lock. I think even though the button itself isn't analogue, the game itself allows greater control by making the turning gradual when the direction is pressed. Thats what i think is happening when i use the D-pad, the turning isn't as rapid with a light tap, as it is if you hold it for a second.

Quick question, does your wheel vibrate with the engine idle & become more pronounced when revving ?.I know a gentle vibration happens with the DS2 & WRC 4.

Well if you buy a decent wheel, they have force feedback so i'm assuming they have some rumble. Maybe someone who actually has a wheel should reply to that

 

[otago]

Quick question, does your wheel vibrate with the engine idle & become more pronounced when revving ?

Well, usually vibrations are the most pronounced when idle. When engine does 5000 rpm even not too good balanced engine shouldn't vibrate.

Also it depends on construction. Opposite and row (BMW) engines are the most balanced, V type engines need some additional balancers

 

[Devedander]

LOL. Forza has better physics than LFS and LFS physics is the best on PC so far.

Not surprisingly consider Turn 10 uses real life data for grip and tire physics, not just calculating some formula like LFS. They both feels very similar but when traction plays the main role like hard braking I put Forza on top.

So again this is impossible to check in real life cause all LFS cars are from parallel world. You can put on track real cars and compare GT vs Forza, with PC simulators it's impossible. They don't have money to license real stock cars

I have always wondered how people decide what is more accurate... I mean it seems a lot of it is based on what people think a car should do in ceratin circumstances... even if you had actually driven in that real car, how would you compare it a controller or even a little wheel with no g forces and body roll effecting you?

 

[otago]

even if you had actually driven in that real car, how would you compare it a controller or even a little wheel with no g forces and body roll effecting you?

But any good driver drives based on car reactions. You apply control input just enough to make the car doing right things, not just turning wheel at 90 degrees or press throttle exactly 1/4. So it's not big deal if steering wheel 360 or 900 degrees.

If you don't listen what the car tells you, you can drive to work or nearest Wallmart, no problems, but you will lose the car in the very first spin on icy road.

The problem is in games you always drive on edge and beyond limits, something which impossible to do on public roads. So even if you have exactly same car, you have no idea is it real in game or not until you bring on track and make it dance

 

[niky]

So... have you? From the cars I've actually driven in real life and driven in GT4 and GT5P, I'm perfectly happy with the way they behave in game. Except for the eerie, skittish feel of the cars on the grass, they behave much as they do in real life... Enter a corner hot and you understeer... get on the power early and you understeer... the amount of grip you get from the tires is the same (as proven in Scaff's experiments on GT4) and the speed is similar (expecting absolutely the same top speed given non-dynamic airflow and vortex modelling... a stretch to expect on the PS2... is insane). This is all on the racetrack, I might add... comparing in-game to on-the-road is frustrating... and it's only at the limit on a proper track that you start to appreciate how faithful the games actually are to real life. The only black marks are that neither has quite the amount of snap oversteer you can generate in real life (due to a physics modelling that's geared towards preventing the car from lifting tires), throttle modulation is extremely difficult with a pad, and tire deformation and physics aren't quite as detailed as PC sims.

Again... in GT4... you could feel the difference between an Acura RSX and a Honda Integra... and it wasn't just the weight... you could feel the difference in tire grip and suspension calibration.... and these are (according to the whiners who complain about GT's car lists) ostensibly the same car. GT4 and GT5P are some of the few games you can pop into your console and pick a couple of random cars and spend hours driving just to get a feel for the differences in how they behave.

Hey i play shift aswell, you just have to take it for what it is, an entertaining arcade racer.

I do. And I think it does that quite excellently. Unfortunately, unlike in GT5P, you can't turn the "arcade" part completely off... which makes realistic driving annoying, especially if you're prone to accidentally inducing 4-wheel drifts (I swear... I was trying to race clean! ).

Just so you know, the vast majority of people who play GT5P, play in standard mode.

Now they have Shift. Which they should buy. Because Shift is a lot better than GT5P Standard. It's a shame... with the basic physics engine it has, with a few gameplay tweaks and the elimination of the "Shift bounce", Shift could be a contender against both Forza3 and GT5 as one of the "big guns" in the console sim market.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Yes they so will. How else will B-spec bob do that 24hr race on his own?

Bob will take 5 Hour Energy every time a pit stop is on the five hour mark (It will be an option after fuel and tires). The Cell can handle that. It can't handle the "Homer Simpson's I've got every appliance in my car" car.

Homer Simpson is too epic for GT at the moment.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

So again this is impossible to check in real life cause all LFS cars are from parallel world.

Many of the cars in LFS are fictional, but not all of them. The Formula BMW, MTR5, Raceabout, BMW F1.06 (and soon the Volkswagen Scirocco) all exist in real life. Most people wont get the chance to drive these cars, but it's not impossible to get some real life comparisons.