Field of View (FOV aka why does that track look so wide?)

Johnnypenso
A real racing driver can turn his head:lol:. I kind of do similar to what @nepal road does in that I eliminate the wheel/driver animation and try to place my real wheel where it would be in the car with my proper FOV, but I often move towards the middle of the car to eliminate the lost vision due to some of the massive pillars on some cars. I also like to bring the rear view mirror into play as covers a wide area behind the car and lets me know if someone is about to overtake without having to glance left or right to see the mirrors.
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Actually a virtual racing driver can turn his head too nowadays
teach.gif

Don't they have kinect/eye toy like compatibility for PCARS so you can look to the left and right? Problem solved :D
 
mister dog
Actually a virtual racing driver can turn his head too nowadays
teach.gif

Don't they have kinect/eye toy like compatibility for PCARS so you can look to the left and right? Problem solved :D
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I've thought about getting the TrackiR system but I'm not sure I'd like it. I think a "look to the apex" feature would probably suffice for me. I'll probably get the Oculus Rift when it's finished but mostly for fun racing seeing as how you can't see the shifter or any buttons or any external HUD.
 
mister dog
Actually a virtual racing driver can turn his head too nowadays
teach.gif

Don't they have kinect/eye toy like compatibility for PCARS so you can look to the left and right? Problem solved :D
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For it to work properly you would need your screen to move with your eyes. If you move your head to the left but have to keep your eyes looking straight ahead to see the screen it's quite confusing for the brain. It was the same with the PS3 camera and GT5 in arcade mode. A cool toy to try but from a practical point no good for racing. As @Johnnypenso said the look to the apex settings are enough for me for now.

If you map look left and right to buttons the view change should be rapid. If the game tracks left and right slower then the feature can be very off putting too. Flick to the left, release button, almost instantly back to straight ahead. In this respect I think Gran Turismo has it about right. Some Sims don't move the view left or right either rapidly enough or positionally enough eg GTR2 (although this could be amended in config files using a text editor).

If Project Morpheus/Oculus Rift get released then I'll certainly want one if they get good reviews for racing. I think I would get used to where the buttons were on the wheel without seeing them and I'm sure the immersion would outweigh the loss of 2nd / 3rd screen apps.
 
Following my post earlier today in this thread and reading the various ideas about setting the FoV, I decided to take another look at this (pun intended) and try some different settings, so I still move the drivers eyes to the furthest point forward in the cockpit view, but now to experiment I changed the FoV from 63 to which I had become quite accustomed, to the 40 suggested by @Johnnypenso. The most immediate difference noticed was how much greater the side to side movement on corners had become and movements of the wheel were much more exaggerated too. I didn't really notice any loss of the sense of speed either and in a fast race car like an LMP1, fast felt fast, I always felt hurried and on edge, exactly what I want to feel from a sim! :D
I think we've gone a bit OT here, it is a PCars forum after all...

Edit, I wanted to add that with the new position within the cockpit the balance of what the four corners of the car are doing is like I had it before only slightly more central and gives a great sense of the dynamic movement of the car. I'll have to try this change on more cars to get a more general sense of this change, but it certainly feels good right now. :D
Edit 2, just to be precise, the top of my wheel is 25 inches away from the screen.
 
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nepal road
Following my post earlier today in this thread and reading the various ideas about setting the FoV, I decided to take another look at this (pun intended) and try some different settings, so I still move the drivers eyes to the furthest point forward in the cockpit view, but now to experiment I changed the FoV from 63 to which I had become quite accustomed, to the 40 suggested by @Johnnypenso. The most immediate difference noticed was how much greater the side to side movement on corners had become and movements of the wheel were much more exaggerated too. I didn't really notice any loss of the sense of speed either and in a fast race car like an LMP1, fast felt fast, I always felt hurried and on edge, exactly what I want to feel from a sim! :D
I think we've gone a bit OT here, it is a PCars forum after all...

Edit, I wanted to add that with the new position within the cockpit the balance of what the four corners of the car are doing is like I had it before only slightly more central and gives a great sense of the dynamic movement of the car. I'll have to try this change on more cars to get a more general sense of this change, but it certainly feels good right now. :D
Edit 2, just to be precise, the top of my wheel is 25 inches away from the screen.
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The FOV experience is transferrable from game to game of course. Stick with the new FOV and you'll adjust and never go back I promise you. The first hurdle for me was the more limited view of the corners ahead, especially the hairpins, but after you run a track enough times you build up a memory of what to expect without seeing it and it becomes a non-issue. The biggest change for me beside the obvious visual element is that I am better able to hit my marks and my lap times are faster and more consistent. We ran some fun races in AC last night and I just discovered that @Wiz has some kind of app that measures consistency. I don't know how it works but this snippet here gives you the results from first to last in one race and look how the consistency level correlates to the results:

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WarriusZero
With my set up (32" tv around a meter away), the FOV calculator gives me a value of 39. That seems quite low, I may have to bump it up a bit so I can see better what's happening around me. I guess I'll be able to play with the settings to find the sweet spot.
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DrJustice
Like WarriousZero, MXHyland and others I also struggle with the dilemma of trading a narrow FOV for peripheral vision (preferably enough to see the mirrors in a single seater). I use a 37" TV about 45" away, for which 40° would be 'real'. I end up using 65° or so as a compromise.
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For the calculator to work you need to able to seat close to your screen, screen behind the wheel works best and you screen needs be big enough for you to drive. if you are too far or your screen is too small then you cannot take advantage of "proper" FOV. you can still try to use the narrowest FOV angle you are comfortable with and by that you will avoid the distortion on the side of the screen when using a wide FOV. good test is when at the starting grid look left and right at the other car and check how distorted they are. Same when approaching and about to pass another car, the car on the side of the screen will be much wider or longer than their normal proportion. That distortion is also what gives the fake sense of speed so popular with some gamer.

this is the disclaimer from the FOV calculator page:

"Disclaimer: This calculator provides you a means to see what your mathematically correct FOV should be within certain games/sims to represent a 1:1 view against real life as close as possible and works best with a large monitor (or multiple monitors) as close to you as possible (between 22" and 33" from eyes to centre of screen). If your monitor is more than 3ft (~1M) away or you have only a single small monitor (< 27" diagonal) or both, then FOV is not the first thing you should address to enhance your experience, immersion and enjoyment."
 
Cote Dazur
For the calculator to work you need to able to seat close to your screen, screen behind the wheel works best and you screen needs be big enough for you to drive. if you are too far or your screen is too small then you cannot take advantage of "proper" FOV.
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A FOV computation works no matter. The only issue is whether you're comfortable with the resulting view, which I'm not and therefore I simply use a setting I like :) BTW, I don't use an online FOV calculator...
 
wowbaggerBR
This one:

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I aked this before in another thread, again the car seems like it is weaving from left to right on the straights. Look carefully when he is on Mulsanne the whole time you see it going left/right/left/right instead of straight?
 
mister dog
I aked this before in another thread, again the car seems like it is weaving from left to right on the straights. Look carefully when he is on Mulsanne the whole time you see it going left/right/left/right instead of straight?
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I'm not a wheel user but it certainly looks like as if he has a way too strong FFB setting.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
DrJustice
A FOV computation works no matter. The only issue is whether you're comfortable with the resulting view, which I'm not and therefore I simply use a setting I like :) BTW, I don't use an online FOV calculator...
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Same here, I'm not worried at all about things appearing too wide/narrow. If I put it at the recommended value (playing from couch here on a 47" TV), the sense of speed is totally gone for me and I have a hard time figuring out what the car is doing, because I don't see anything. :lol: So I use a narrower setting so I can still have a sense of feel for the car. 👍 Not one bit bothered about things looking too wide or too narrow.
 
DrJustice
A FOV computation works no matter. The only issue is whether you're comfortable with the resulting view, which I'm not and therefore I simply use a setting I like :) BTW, I don't use an online FOV calculator...
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You are correct, the computation works no matter what, what I wanted to explain ( and what the disclaimer is about) is that the results, outside some parameters, in this case too far away or too small a screen are not usable, therefore if your screen is too small or you are too far , do not waste your time chasing something you cannot reach. As in no point coming here saying, my FOV degree angle should be 10 and I cannot drive like that.

If you give it a fair try sitting close enough with a decent size screen, you might find something you like very much, on the other hand if your experience is perfect as is and you feel totally immersed, why bother? Right?
Also some prefer to use a perfectly calculated FOV degree angle other find it more fun trying to guess one, to each his own, the goal is to have fun.
 
Cote Dazur
...no point coming here saying, my FOV degree angle should be 10 and I cannot drive like that.
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Wut? :odd: We're discussing FOV and it's effects - surely I can report on what my 'real' FOV would be and what I choose to use instead.

...the goal is to have fun.
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Exactly, which is why I wrote what I did. I didn't ask for or need schooling on this, thank you; don't worry, I've got this :)
 
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DrJustice
Wut? :odd: We're discussing FOV and it's effects - surely I can report on what my 'real' FOV would be and what I choose to use instead.


Exactly, which is why I wrote what I did. I didn't ask for or need schooling on this, thank you; don't worry, I've got this :)
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Sorry for the confusion, this was a general remark, not a comment about you. You absolutely can report on anything you want. I am not schooling any one here, just trying to help and share on the advantages of driving with a better FOV. I was quoting you on your remark that the calculator always compute the correct result, which we both agree upon.

In many other thread on that very subject, there are always a lot of gamers posting that they are sitting across the room from their TV and that when they calculate their FOV the number is too small.
What happen then is a confusion, as the calculator, in those cases, is often blamed when in fact it is used in the wrong set up. Expecting an immersive and realistic SIM driving experience from sitting across the room is misguided.
 
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The problem is how the calculated FOV is proclaimed to be the "proper" way, when it really only applies when you have the right setup for it, as we've established.
 
Project CARS has a dynamic FOV function (optional of course!). Where the FOV changes depending on your speed. So you can have the FOV narrowing as you go faster (and the other ways if you IIRC - it's highly configurable). This can perhaps be likened to the "tunnel" effect you get by going very fast, where you focus more on what's straight ahead, and the peripheral vision becomes "less usable".

"Test Drive: Ferrari Racing Legends" used a dynamic FOV like that. Funny enough, I didn't even notice at first, as in it didn't throw me off or feel unnatural. I didn't minds after the discovery either.

It's something to experiment with for those who are interested. Speaking of which, I might even try it myself while saving for that triple screen setup...
 
Wolfe
The problem is how the calculated FOV is proclaimed to be the "proper" way, when it really only applies when you have the right setup for it, as we've established.
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Yes, exactly if you try to drive a sim using a proper (calculated) FOV degree angle on a tablet screen from across the room it does not really matters, it will not feel natural and not be immersive. You got it.
 
^ I think we all got that, at far earlier points in out lives even. It has been the exact argument in many postings here, and as Wolfe says, it has been firmly established - you gotta give us a little credit and maybe not keep repeating that for the rest of the thread, OK? :)
 
I just tested out the FOV calculator on Race 07 (don't have PCARS yet. Getting a capable PC in March for it). And it really works, even as Empty Box said, it actually helped me go faster, and be more consistent. I did a test on Oschersleben in a Mini, and I very quickly started getting faster times, and was making far better use of the track. It makes everything seem a little slower, but that calms the mind down a little and allows you to focus on driving better. Well, it does for me at least.
 
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The biggest problem I think people have adapting to "proper" FOV is giving it enough time to adjust to it. A couple hours isn't going to do it, it could take days or even a week for you to adapt, but once you do you'll wonder how you ever raced with the zoomed FOV. But we all have our own tastes/desires/goals, if you want realism and immersion you go with a proper FOV, if you just want to play a game and be able to see out your side windows you use the zoomed FOV. But if you want realism/immersion the single best thing you can do is get your FOV dialed in correctly. When you do, this is the result:

 
BrandonW77
The biggest problem I think people have adapting to "proper" FOV is giving it enough time to adjust to it. A couple hours isn't going to do it, it could take days or even a week for you to adapt, but once you do you'll wonder how you ever raced with the zoomed FOV. But we all have our own tastes/desires/goals, if you want realism and immersion you go with a proper FOV, if you just want to play a game and be able to see out your side windows you use the zoomed FOV. But if you want realism/immersion the single best thing you can do is get your FOV dialed in correctly. When you do, this is the result:

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Just like me, the wheel should look like its part of the car, and animations (arms and wheel) disable, but you loose some sense of speed that way, i'm ok with it.
 
BrandonW77
The biggest problem I think people have adapting to "proper" FOV is giving it enough time to adjust to it. A couple hours isn't going to do it, it could take days or even a week for you to adapt, but once you do you'll wonder how you ever raced with the zoomed FOV. But we all have our own tastes/desires/goals, if you want realism and immersion you go with a proper FOV, if you just want to play a game and be able to see out your side windows you use the zoomed FOV. But if you want realism/immersion the single best thing you can do is get your FOV dialed in correctly. When you do, this is the result:

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That looks epic! Perfect FOV

Can that exact view be replicated in PCars?
 
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