Field of View (FOV aka why does that track look so wide?)

CSLACR
The driver is indeed real, and unfortunately as such, must abide by our laws of physics, and cannot sit behind himself and watch himself drive. 💡
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The video you guys are talking about is showing a real player playing the game with the view he uses (with correct FoW/DoF). It is NOT a camera view that is set behind the driver in game. In this video you are seeing the player and his screen, not just what is on his screen.
 
How far away from the screen do you reckon this guy is?



Got my GT Omega stand built but reckon im to far away at 4ft on a 51" screen and cannot get closer due to the TV stand.
 
The option is there in PCars and FoV is still a non forcable user preference i think. Once the Oculus Rift/Morpheus is available, it will have a fixed, huge FoV and will certainly become my dedicated "Racing Screen".
 
Pseudopod
I had a thought. What if games just came with a fov wizard? It would ask you how big your display is and how far away you're sitting, then apply the correct fov based on that. There should also be a way to freely adjust it in degrees, for those who prefer doing it that way.
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I'd like that if it included a base or default setting that provides as close to a Real Life View as possible (i.e. it is not based on where you are sitting, but actually determines where you are to sit to get a proper view.) And it would be especially nice if this scale were named The Sim/Arcade View Scale because the more you move away from Reality the more Arcade it becomes and visa versa.
 
But the game can't know where you should sit unless it knows your monitor size as well. It is also usually easier to change your game's fov than it is to rearrange your living room :P, as long as the game supports fov changes by the user.

I don't really think the fov makes a game arcade or not. Not everyone can afford to fill their entire physical field of view with monitors, and wanting to be able to see what's on the side of your car isn't unreasonable either.

It's kind of a dick move to shame people for not being able to afford the ultimate sim setup.
 
As long as you can't cover your whole natural FoV (180° Horizontal, 130° Vertical) by a display, the recommendation from this function will always be: Get closer to the screen dude!
 
Pseudopod
But the game can't know where you should sit unless it knows your monitor size as well. It is also usually easier to change your game's fov than it is to rearrange your living room :P, as long as the game supports fov changes by the user.

I don't really think the fov makes a game arcade or not. Not everyone can afford to fill their entire physical field of view with monitors, and wanting to be able to see what's on the side of your car isn't unreasonable either.
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sorry to say but it doesn't matter what you think about FoV, it is a matter of our physical universe Laws and the simulation of them.

It's kind of a dick move to shame people for not being able to afford the ultimate sim setup.
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Where exactly did I do that? No, there is no direct or implied dissing in my post, I'm just trying to get the actual distinction clearly pointed out because there is one. Sorry if this disturbs people's delusions.
 
The universe isn't less realistic just because you view it through binoculars, or in this case, the opposite of binoculars.

I'm not saying you're shaming anyone, but with a sim - arcade slider for fov, the game would be implying that people who can't afford the gear to fill their field of view (and also find it uncomfortable to view their pc monitor at a 2 inch distance) are more arcade players that those who can. It's better to just use the neutral term 'field of view'.

People who wear strong glasses can actually get a bigger field of view than what is natural. Are they simming the real world less than those with perfect eyesight? :P
 
Pseudopod
The universe isn't less realistic just because you view it through binoculars, or in this case, the opposite of binoculars.

I'm not saying you're shaming anyone, but with a sim - arcade slider for fov, the game would be implying that people who can't afford the gear to fill their field of view (and also find it uncomfortable to view their pc monitor at a 2 inch distance) are more arcade players that those who can. It's better to just use the neutral term 'field of view'.

People who wear strong glasses can actually get a bigger field of view than what is natural. Are they simming the real world less than those with perfect eyesight? :P
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Correct, if the player is a fish or chameleon extreme goggle eyed view would be a perfect representation. See WMD/SMS have thought of everything.

I'm sure making a change like this would be extremely low priority. People can easily just use one of the field of view calculators online while setting up their game/rig/sofa/bed. Maybe a quick word on how to calculate it in the help screens would be enough.
 
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It is important to not discriminate against fish and chameleons. They are people too.

And yes, I agree that a built in fov calculator is pretty low priority, but I also don't imagine it would be a difficult thing to add. You could just use web based ones, but I think having it in the game will make more players aware of the importance of a fov that is close to reality.

Then again, players of this particular game might already be aware of this. A fov wizard might be more relevant for a game like gt or forza, where a much larger percentage of the players base might not have given it much thought.
 
Pseudopod
The universe isn't less realistic just because you view it through binoculars, or in this case, the opposite of binoculars.
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But I didn't say that, don't twist my words. Does the view the wrong way with binoculars look exactly like it does in real life? No it doesn't so don't be obtuse.

I'm not saying you're shaming anyone, but with a sim - arcade slider for fov, the game would be implying that people who can't afford the gear to fill their field of view (and also find it uncomfortable to view their pc monitor at a 2 inch distance) are more arcade players that those who can. It's better to just use the neutral term 'field of view'.
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No it isn't. If people are so weak minded that they assume such nonsense then too bad... Some of us want the view to be as accurate to real life as is possible, after all that is the idea of a Sim isn't it. (That isn't a question).

People who wear strong glasses can actually get a bigger field of view than what is natural. Are they simming the real world less than those with perfect eyesight? :P
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No they are seeing the world through the distortion of magnification a distortion from the Real.

And just in case you want to make something else up I have no where stated that I think people should do what I am suggesting, the view they choose is up to them. :P
 
UkHardcore23
How far away from the screen do you reckon this guy is?
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I would say less than 50cm from eyes to ecreen.
Yesterday I´ve mesure my rig and i´m at 77cm from the screen: TV to wheel base 10cm, wheel base (T500) 33cm, wheel to me arround 33-34 cm, but it looks like he has the screen over the wheel base so it would be something arround 50cm or less...
 
One thing I always wondered about Sim rigs is that with your TV/monitor being so close to your eyes, does the pixelation not bug the hell out of you?? It would me!

Is it just a case of getting used to it?
 
Goruk
I would say less than 50cm from eyes to ecreen.
Yesterday I´ve mesure my rig and i´m at 77cm from the screen: TV to wheel base 10cm, wheel base (T500) 33cm, wheel to me arround 33-34 cm, but it looks like he has the screen over the wheel base so it would be something arround 50cm or less...
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Do you think with me being 120cm away from the 51" screen is too far away? Before i had the stand i was around 100cm away which felt perfect.
 
UkHardcore23
Do you think with me being 120cm away from the 51" screen is too far away? Before i had the stand i was around 100cm away which felt perfect.
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There's no right answer, you have to do what works best for you. There are advantages and disadvantages to being accurate with the FOV or making it wider than recommended. My measurements are roughly close to yours and I find it works perfect for me to be a few degrees above the recommended setting, although I'm modifying my TV stand to allow me to slide it back and forth to get it even closer but keep the FOV the same. Experiment and find out what works for you.
 
nepal road
Some of us want the view to be as accurate to real life as is possible, after all that is the idea of a Sim isn't it. (That isn't a question).
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Yes, and in real life, I don't drive my car with a contraption over my head that limits my vision to a 20" frame three feet in front of my face.

There's already so much suspension of disbelief with any setup short of an expensive full-motion rig with an Oculus Rift, which still isn't just like the real thing. I've already trained my brain for more than 25 years to accept a 4:3 screen with little squares of colored light as a "window" looking into a virtual existence. In a racing sim, I have nothing to gain by restricting visibility and eliminating peripheral cues.

I don't care about geometric accuracy. To me, the idea of a sim isn't to create a mock setup of reality in physical space. The idea of a sim is to recreate a realistic driving experience in a virtual space. To that end, I want the most information I can get from the screen, the sort of information I would have in real life -- such as velocity and situational awareness, confirmation of virtual steering angle as indicated by the in-game wheel, or G-forces indicated by the motion of the A-pillar/dashboard as a frame of reference.

For my setup, I need a wider angle for those things, and that's OK with me. It's not just wider = better, either. In console games with hard-coded FOVs, I refuse to use cameras with too-wide FOVs as often as I do cameras with too-narrow FOVs. I run what works for me.

You're implying there's only one "right" way to play, and you're hiding behind the derisive "arcade" label to pretend that's not what you've done.
 
The only thing i don't like, is some cars look bigger inside with the same FOV, and i don't think the devs our modelers have messed with scales.
Even if it's not real in interior view i think we should have an option to adjust the size, i don't know if you guys understand what i'm trying to say.
Maybe in the same resolution the size of the cockpit should be adaptable to the size of the screen of your monitor/TV.
Exemp: In AC if you grab a BMW M3 GT2 the motec it's huge compared to others in the same FOV
 
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MJRL
The only thing i don't like, is some cars look bigger inside with the same FOV, and i don't think the devs our modelers have messed with scales.
Even if it's not real in interior view i think we should have an option to adjust the size, i don't know if you guys understand what i'm trying to say.
Maybe in the same resolution the size of the cockpit should be adaptable to the size of the screen of your monitor/TV.
Exemp: In AC if you grab a BMW M3 GT2 the motec it's huge compared to others in the same FOV
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Can you take some screenshots to show us what you mean?
 
Wolfe
I have nothing to gain by restricting visibility and eliminating peripheral cues.
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The goal here is not to "minimize" your peripheral vision, a maxed out FoV is always the goal. There is no replacement for peripheral vision and some people prefer to use the screen estate they have to maximize focus vision then.

Using a realistic FoV enables your brain to calculate Speed and Distances just like it would in the real world. Essentially that makes it less stressful to play the game and improves your consistency because your Brain "feels" when it's time to slow down and that point comes to you at the correct speed.

Using a low FoV is basically a trade off or compromise many people are willing to accept for the reward of giving your brain the joy of seeing things as they are in RL.

To me, it is improving immersion because elevation changes are much more pronounced and essentially just like they are in reality. When you go through the Corkscrew at Laguna Seca, you can really see and feel how insane, dangerous and high that corner really is.

Outside of VR, FoV will always be a user preference, and this thread is here to explain what this is all about and not about elite vs. noob or sim vs. arcade.
 
Wolfe
Yes, and in real life, I don't drive my car with a contraption over my head that limits my vision to a 20" frame three feet in front of my face.

There's already so much suspension of disbelief with any setup short of an expensive full-motion rig with an Oculus Rift, which still isn't just like the real thing. I've already trained my brain for more than 25 years to accept a 4:3 screen with little squares of colored light as a "window" looking into a virtual existence. In a racing sim, I have nothing to gain by restricting visibility and eliminating peripheral cues.

I don't care about geometric accuracy. To me, the idea of a sim isn't to create a mock setup of reality in physical space. The idea of a sim is to recreate a realistic driving experience in a virtual space.
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Well said.

There's only so much that can be achieved right now. And the best way to get the information to your brain is via visual cues, sounds and how the wheel reacts in your hands when you drive. If you think about those things, really the best games that call themselves 'simulators' out there go beyond what you hear, see and feel through the wheel in real life... because we can't use our sense of motion whilst playing. As Wolfe said, we can't even really get a realistic interpretation of that with a full-motion rig.

Play how you want to play. Leave others to play how they want too.
 
blowfishrulez
Outside of VR, FoV will always be a user preference, and this thread is here to explain what this is all about and not about elite vs. noob or sim vs. arcade.
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It occurs to me, that those using a more realistic FOV are going to have a much easier time adapting to VR because everything will look basically the same, while those using the larger "console" type of FOV are going to have quite a long adjustment period.
 
Johnnypenso
It occurs to me, that those using a more realistic FOV are going to have a much easier time adapting to VR because everything will look basically the same, while those using the larger "console" type of FOV are going to have quite a long adjustment period.
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What's the reason console games have the FOV so far back?
 
Its not bound to consoles and i think it is just there to appeal to the general consumer who generally seems to prefer the "Need for Speed" look and wants to see much of the cokpit too. But its good know there is a option to properly adjust this to the own preference.
 
UkHardcore23
What's the reason console games have the FOV so far back?
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I have no factual information but sense of speed is my best guess. With an FOV closer to recommended, the sense of speed is far less and that doesn't appeal to a lot of people. They want the excitement of feeling like they are going reallly fast, even if the view is very distorted to what they would see in real life. I can dig that because it was the thing that made me resist going to a more accurate FOV for my setup. I kept looking at the screen thinking, "what the hell, I'm going 300 km/h and it feels like I'm out for a Sunday cruise":irked::guilty:. But like everything else, you adapt and then it becomes second nature, and then when you switch back to your old FOV, everything looks weird.
 

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