FITT-Hot Hatch Tuning Challenge - Final Results are in!

BTW, before I discovered the transmission glitch, I had tested 3 cars with unintentional wrong gearings, brian wolf's, DaBomm4's and krenkme's. After setting the gearbox right, with intended gearing, your cars gone more than 0.5s faster as a result. Now that's a lot - on current GT-A Nissan Leaf 0.5s would jump you up several thousand places.
 
Thanks for more detail, much appreciated! I used the 7/7 ARB settings cos i left the ride height quite high cos of the nasty curbs at Autumn Ring. I found it quicker to ride them than to avoid them. I`ll give that `hybrid` car you suggest a go later!
Cheers again
BW

I forgot to mention LSD, yous was the best also. It gave a great corner entry and also optimal traction to drive the fronts out. To drive the nose inward the car has to have enough traction - 5/5/5 won't do the job. 5/30/5 is where I'd go at.

edit: sorry for the double post
 
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I forgot to mention LSD, yous was the best also. It gave a great corner entry and also optimal traction to drive the fronts out. To drive the nose inward the car has to have enough traction - 5/5/5 won't do the job. 5/30/5 is where I'd go at.
Thats good to know. I used the data logger to help set the LSD! PD did something usefull giving us that, even if they cant keep gear ratios the same on a fixed gearbox!!:)
 
Thats good to know. I used the data logger to help set the LSD! PD did something usefull giving us that, even if they cant keep gear ratios the same on a fixed gearbox!!:)
what information did you use to tune the LSD if you don't mind sharing? I want to use the data logger more than I am but only i've figured out how to use it for dampers and springs.
 
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@DolHaus that ws my tought as well but I found the data to be unreliable. I pulled a lap off SSRX and my tires where going 20 kmh faster than my car at 400 km/h :confused:
 
@DolHaus that ws my tought as well but I found the data to be unreliable. I pulled a lap off SSRX and my tires where going 20 kmh faster than my car at 400 km/h :confused:
I've heard similar things, not looked at it myself much (keep forgetting to save replays). I remember hearing there was an answer for why but I can't remember where I saw it, will have a look though.
 
@DolHaus thank you sir. good read. so they modeled tire slip....hmm good to know will help with TS tunes for sure. now that i know that I think I can use it better :)
 
@DolHaus thank you sir. good read. so they modeled tire slip....hmm good to know will help with TS tunes for sure. now that i know that I think I can use it better :)
No problem, hope it helps.
The data logger is throwing up all sorts of things that would indicate the tyres are more complicated than first thought, evidence of slip and tire wall flex. Still no explanation for the camber issues but it shows that the rabbit hole goes deeper than first thought.
 
Thanks for more detail, much appreciated! I used the 7/7 ARB settings cos i left the ride height quite high cos of the nasty curbs at Autumn Ring. I found it quicker to ride them than to avoid them. I`ll give that `hybrid` car you suggest a go later!
Cheers again
BW
Congrats Brian. Sounds like you might be on a winner there.
Let us know how the test of the hybrid goes.
 
I just finished my 1st round of Hot Hatch testing :boggled:. Quite a diverse group of hot hatches. I think I've finally got turn 1 down pretty consistently which I'm pretty proud about. Now if only I could say the same for turn 2 through.... the rest of them. Also, some of your tuners are either completely insane I think :lol: . I'm doing 16 laps for each tune but I'm splitting it up
 
I just finished my 1st round of Hot Hatch testing :boggled:. Quite a diverse group of hot hatches. I think I've finally got turn 1 down pretty consistently which I'm pretty proud about. Now if only I could say the same for turn 2 through.... the rest of them. Also, some of your tuners are either completely insane I think :lol: . I'm doing 16 laps for each tune but I'm splitting it up
I'm only doing 10 laps per thats it, but some will get a second try of 3 only because they were the early ones tested. Have 2 cars left and have been quite surprised already.
@Otaliema when you are done it is safe to post your results as I have tested yours and graded already;)

**Special note being added to Base Model in the tester list.**
 
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@Bowtie-muscle I'm running up to16 laps per car, depending on how far I learn the tune and how long it takes to get a clean lap good lap, turn 1, 6, 8 and 13 are killer for me.
 
@Bowtie-muscle I'm running up to16 laps per car, depending on how far I learn the tune and how long it takes to get a clean lap good lap, turn 1, 6, 8 and 13 are killer for me.
Yeah had the same issue with same turns I think, time is an issue for me as I have to share PS3 with daughter who just bumped me off for the night:lol:...With all the laps I've done on this track, I will be glad when it's over. Did alot of prep at Brands Hatch getting ready and even more tuning. Then I'm going to test the Base Models:banghead::banghead::banghead:, that should be fun.
 
I reckon I know Brands Hatch by now & the most important corner would be turn 4, the long left hander & the run out of it up the hill. A good run through there is vital for top speed & good lap time.
 
I reckon I know Brands Hatch by now & the most important corner would be turn 4, the long left hander & the run out of it up the hill. A good run through there is vital for top speed & good lap time.
Technically that's turn 6 I think, there are 6 course changes that require driver input to navigate with out going off track.
But yes that turn is good for half a second on a lap, same with turn 1.
 
:dunce: Just spend 18 laps testing @Ridox2JZGTE car and couldn't figure out for the of me why I couldn't get close to his times I saw in the online room.....:dunce:
🤬 Game changed the tires to CS on me!!!🤬🤬🤬🤬 Still handled great and could take some of the turns at the same speed as SH tires. Nicely done.
 
:dunce: Just spend 18 laps testing @Ridox2JZGTE car and couldn't figure out for the of me why I couldn't get close to his times I saw in the online room.....:dunce:
🤬 Game changed the tires to CS on me!!!🤬🤬🤬🤬 Still handled great and could take some of the turns at the same speed as SH tires. Nicely done.
When I tested yours, I thought...WOW LOOSE IS RIGHT, then I checked tires and realized I never changed:banghead:. Good thing it was only 2 laps. Better with sports hards.
 
:dunce: Just spend 18 laps testing @Ridox2JZGTE car and couldn't figure out for the of me why I couldn't get close to his times I saw in the online room.....:dunce:
🤬 Game changed the tires to CS on me!!!🤬🤬🤬🤬 Still handled great and could take some of the turns at the same speed as SH tires. Nicely done.

I tuned the car for online as well :P maybe it made the offline handling worse :eek:
 
When I tested yours, I thought...WOW LOOSE IS RIGHT, then I checked tires and realized I never changed:banghead:. Good thing it was only 2 laps. Better with sports hards.
O_o well good to see i'm not the only one who is blind sometimes :P
I tuned the car for online as well :P maybe it made the offline handling worse :eek:
Na it handled great, just an odd duck so to speak it.
 
what information did you use to tune the LSD if you don't mind sharing? I want to use the data logger more than I am but only i've figured out how to use it for dampers and springs.
I have left and right wheel speeds on driven wheels and ride height on same wheels also accelerator position as my 5 things on screen. You can tell at what point of throttle input the diff locks at and how tight it is. Ride height is there for when at apex on a curb it might be damper settings upsetting wheel speed values. I`m no expert tho!
 
I have left and right wheel speeds on driven wheels and ride height on same wheels also accelerator position as my 5 things on screen. You can tell at what point of throttle input the diff locks at and how tight it is. Ride height is there for when at apex on a curb it might be damper settings upsetting wheel speed values. I`m no expert tho!

That sounds like pretty advanced thinking to me. I like the thought of adding ride height to see apex and throttle position to see if it is an on throttle or off throttle issue.
 
That sounds like pretty advanced thinking to me. I like the thought of adding ride height to see apex and throttle position to see if it is an on throttle or off throttle issue.
Thanks! The LSD seems more complex to me than in GT5. I`ve found it difficult to get accurate data from booting it in 2nd gear corners. The inside wheel seems very reluctant to spin up on a lot of cars. When i tuned the MiTo`s LSD on track i had an accel setting of 19 but with info from the data logger that ended up at 30!
 
I have left and right wheel speeds on driven wheels and ride height on same wheels also accelerator position as my 5 things on screen. You can tell at what point of throttle input the diff locks at and how tight it is. Ride height is there for when at apex on a curb it might be damper settings upsetting wheel speed values. I`m no expert tho!

Thank you, didn't even think about the ride height and throttle use for testing the LSD in the logger.
Just an observation I've made with the tuning i'e been doing the ride height on the drives also seems to impact the LSD setting and which wheel spins out first. Maybe with this logger we can tell why.

@Motor City Hami I agree with ya that is some advanced thinking on Brian's part.

Hallelujah! I'm done with testing. I'm going to double post here unless I get tree'd, But i refuse to post a reply and the test results in the same post it just clutters it up.
 
List order is the same as the order posted by @Bowtie-muscle found here.

All testing done in arcade mode grip=Real ABS=1 only aid active. All cars received the same treatment for laps. 5 laps to learn the tune. Brands Hatch GP is a devil track for me, So after the 5 lap learning period I gave each car up to 10 laps, till I put a good lap together on this one. So some may get 4 laps some may get 10. The 1st, 6th and 13th corners are my testers if the car takes them turns like a champ it’s solid, if I have continuous problems with them there I deem something amiss with the tune. * barring me knowing it’s not driver error lol* For FF cars is use the term TLOR throttle lift off rotation in place of BLOR as BLOR not as much of a factor in FF cars.


@backnfourth - Golf V GTi '05

Fastest Lap;1:39.842 Drivers Choice; 8

Impressions of the tune;This car was solid from the get go. It was balanced, great grip at entry and mid corner and for a FF excellent grip at exit. I felt confident in this car. I knew I could throw it in a corner lay on the gas and it would stick. Not sure why I couldn't get a faster time with this car I just couldn't make it go faster.


Bobby Steel - Golf IV GTi '01

Fastest Lap;1:42.438 Drivers Choice; 5

Impressions of the tune; Well balanced, great turn in. It just has low grip throughout the corner. The acceleration is very good,early shifting definitely helped this car get up and go. I just couldn’t make it go faster, it felt like a semi-drift tune where it’s in it element with a driver that could slide the car through the corners but I don’t got the skill to do that with any reliability.


@Bowtie-muscle - Scirocco R '10

Fastest Lap;1:39.580 Drivers Choice; 8.5

Impressions of the tune; This car was light on it’s feet so to speak, almost to light, it had great turn in and grip on entry-mid corner, I found exit grip a little on the light side. I did find that this car didn't like having it’s tail tapped on curbs. I had more than a few great laps go out the window cause I tapped the tail on a curb. I found the TLOR hard to control in this car, it either didn't happen or happened so fast I spun the car. I could tell there was more in this car I just couldn't find it, maybe a better driver will. The LSD was done very with this car, allowed for great turn in and control on exit. But caused mid corner understeer.


@brian wolf - Ibiza Cupra '04

Fastest Lap;1:40.711 Drivers Choice; 6

Impressions of the tune; Try as I might I could not keep the tail on check with this car. It was stable in the slides but it would slide into every corner costing speed and time. The LSD was tuned very well helped pull the car outta the slides and drive it out of corners very well. The transmission was spot on for the car. I just could not keep the tail from flying out in turns 1, 8 and 12 which are the ones at the ends of the high speed straights.


@DigitalBaka - Scirocco R '10

Fastest Lap;1:39.980 Drivers Choice; 6.5

Impressions of the tune; Well rounded tune, great rotation, excellent balance. I found corner entry had to be cautious due to low entry-mid corner grip, exit grip was fantastic and I could really attack the corners from just after the apex. No matter what I tried the low entry grip slowed this car down and I couldn’t find anymore time in this car. The LSD was set up to allow for great exit and turn in but caused understeer if the throttle was used too soon after the apex.


@DolHaus - C30 R-Design '09

Fastest Lap;1:42.398 Drivers Choice; 6

Impressions of the tune; Well balanced, turns well, just lacks entry-mid corner grip which slowed me down, exit grip was very good. Overall this car was very well tuned, I just couldn’t get it to go fast. It did suffer from short-transmission-ites I was hitting the redline with 50 yards to go on the back straight, the shorter transmission did make for some great acceleration out of the car but in the end I think it hurt the time.


@Motor City Hami - Scirocco R '10

Fastest Lap;1:39.250 Drivers Choice; 9

Impressions of the tune; This tune looked odd when I plugged it in, but man did it fly. Grip was fantastic throughout the corners. I did find a touch of understeer on entry but once I adjusted for it, it was no issue at all. I found the TLOR to be easily controlled and very helpful. The listed Final gear was a tad long, but still this car still ended up being the fastest at the end of the back straight by a couple km/h. The LSD set up on this car was done in a way that allowed for aggressive exit attack, it would cause understeer if too much throttle was used too soon.


@oppositelock - Clio R.S. '11

Fastest Lap;1:40.226 Drivers Choice; 8

Impressions of the tune; The question with this tune was how brave was I? the harder I pushed the faster it went. It was stable and consistent in the mid 1:40’s I could tell there was more in this I just couldn’t keep the lap together to get it. There a bit of understeer on entry otherwise it had great grip throughout the turn.


@Otaliema - Scirocco R '10

Fastest Lap;1:39.221 Drivers Choice; 9

Impressions of the tune; Stable good recovery, very good grip throughout the turn, late mid-exit grip was little light compared to some of the other tunes, this caused slower exit speeds, the TLOR was present and easy to control. The transmission was on the short side causing a large amount of shifting and hurt the time due to limiting the top speed to much. The LSD was set up to allow you to just stand on the gas in most turns and it would rotate around the turn.


@Ridox2JZGTE - Ibiza Cupra '04

Fastest Lap;1:40.864 Drivers Choice; 8.5

Impressions of the tune; Don’t ask me how or why but camber worked very well on this car, it helped it rotate and slip the corners. But ultimately it hurt the time as it caused a good amount of understeer that I couldn’t make up for. The transmission was spot on, the LSD was set great. The only place I found the tune to be struggling was mid corner, it would understeer heaviley under throttle.

Bonus testing; Removed the camber logged a time of 1:40.350


@shaunm80 - Mini Cooper S '11

Fastest Lap;1:40.141 Drivers Choice; 9.5

Impressions of the tune; Planted stable and consistent. All my laps were within a half second of each other. The only place this little car fell short was top speed and acceleration. I have a feeling if this had be a short track challenge this car would be first or right there with first place. I couldn’t do anything other than brake late to ruin a lap. This car and this tune have been moved to my Apec use due to it’s consistency and reliability to put out the same laps every time.


@Woodski_427 - Ibiza Cupra '04

Fastest Lap;1:41.525 Drivers Choice; 7

Impressions of the tune; Great race tune, very stable very consistent very reliable, just not fast. I had to coast into turns as I couldn’t use the brakes or throttle during turn in. So entry grip was very loose. Mid-exit grip was fantastic and I could power my way through the corners and come out of them like a bat outta *&$@ but the signifgantly reduced entrance speed hurt the time. If I drove it in deep it wouldn’t stick and I found myself spining or drifting out.


@xande1959 - Clio R.S. '11

Fastest Lap;1:40.345 Drivers Choice; 6

Impressions of the tune; This car at first was very stable took the corners like a champ then it got loose. I noticed that the rear tires went cold. Meaning the front of this car was doing all the work and the rear was just holding it off the ground. During the first two laps of a set the car was great, excellent in turns from entry to exit. I could stand on the gas and get around the corners, and it just stuck to the pavement. If I ran more than two laps the car developed major understeer the tail would slide unexpectedly, and I would frequently hit the dirt. The transmission was a bit long I never really used 6th gear.
 
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