Forza Horizon 5: General Discussion

[Famine]

They have a Polestar 1 in NFS Unbound

I know. It's also in NFS Heat. I also know why and why they're not in any other games - and have explained it on GTP before - which is why I know that, unless it's changed its approach, it's not going to be in Forza.

 

[Cinek156]

The ID4 is probably the most boring one in the lineup

I would be more pleased with the Arteon R but, of course, they could not do without some EV.

 

[Famine]

The ID 4, Fulvia, DS3 and the 500E are all middle of the road cars for a FH title.

I'd not have said that. The average car is high B; the ID.4 and 500E might be there (ID.4 might be low-A), but the Fulvia and DS3 are dead-cert D Class. Doku as well, with the Esprit and SL63 mid-A, and the AMR obviously S2 998.

 

[Cinek156]

They have a Polestar 1 in NFS Unbound

I also envy NFS that they have a Maybach

 

[Edax 76]

I'd not have said that. The average car is high B; the ID.4 and 500E might be there (ID.4 might be low-A), but the Fulvia and DS3 are dead-cert D Class. Doku as well, with the Esprit and SL63 mid-A, and the AMR obviously S2 998.

Fair one, bad choice of words on my side. I think what I'm trying to say is that I'm glad we're not just getting hyper/super cars and the cars we are getting are regular (if that's a better description) cars.

Yes they're not regular as in any one can go drive one in real life but deliver a more regular driving experience in game. They also I think offer the player more variety in ways of use. For example you could build competitive rally, drift,drag and road variants of a Fulvia or DS23, not something I'd say you could do with Jesko or Rimac (although having said that watch someone on here prove me wrong 😂😂).

I hope I'm making sense. I'm that full of a cold bug right now.

 

[skazz]

This is one series where I will take a different view than most. They gave me the Project 8, so everything else is a bonus

 

[Digolgrin]

Yes they're not regular as in any one can go drive one in real life but deliver a more regular driving experience in game. They also I think offer the player more variety in ways of use. For example you could build competitive rally, drift,drag and road variants of a Fulvia or DS23, not something I'd say you could do with Jesko or Rimac (although having said that watch someone on here prove me wrong 😂😂).

I like to throw a lot of **** at Horizon Customs, Extreme E and Donut Media Part 1 for this sorta thing--but the truth is, this is exactly the point of Forza Horizon, compared to Gran Turismo. D-class and maybe C-class cars exist precisely because they're meant to be the baseline for upgrade builds; once you get into B and A class, and especially S1, you start seeing cars that are already pretty great at what they're designed to do, so you don't need to upgrade them nearly as much. With a D-class car, you have a crappy car that can become literally anything you want, so something like the Fulvia can easily become, say, a Group B rally car or a GT legend with enough imagination and time investment.

If GT7 added the Fulvia, for example, it could only be tuned for asphalt racing. FH offers these quirky D-class cars as upgrade templates more than anything else.

 

[Edax 76]

I like to throw a lot of **** at Horizon Customs, Extreme E and Donut Media Part 1 for this sorta thing--but the truth is, this is exactly the point of Forza Horizon, compared to Gran Turismo. D-class and maybe C-class cars exist precisely because they're meant to be the baseline for upgrade builds; once you get into B and A class, and especially S1, you start seeing cars that are already pretty great at what they're designed to do, so you don't need to upgrade them nearly as much. With a D-class car, you have a crappy car that can become literally anything you want, so something like the Fulvia can easily become, say, a Group B rally car or a GT legend with enough imagination and time investment.

If GT7 added the Fulvia, for example, it could only be tuned for asphalt racing. FH offers these quirky D-class cars as upgrade templates more than anything else.

⬆️⬆️⬆️⬆️ What @Digolgrin said. They put it far better than I could and did do. This is why I'm happy with this update.

Thank you @Digolgrin 👍👍

 

[RazorSharkz]

I was kind of afraid this update would be a Hypercar parade. I do hope the MC20 comes soon (and brings the MC12 and the 97 Ghibli with it). Also sadly I think the playlist cars appeal to me more than the cars in the pack.

 

[Famine]

If GT7 added the Fulvia, for example, it could only be tuned for asphalt racing.

Why?

Forza Motorsport, sure - there's zero offroad in that for now - but GT's pretty famously had offroad tracks in every game since GT2, and indeed the most recent track addition is an ice circuit... There's no reason you can't build a car for off-road in GT7 at all.

Unless you want to do an AWD swap, which is of course what will happen with probably 95% of FH5 builds...

 

[Digolgrin]

Why?

Oh, right, that's a good point, I should have amended--D-class cars like the Fulvia can be pushed farther in FH than it would be able to in GT7. With the right engine swap and drivetrain swap (not that I'd ever do this sort of thing because I like to keep my cars bone-stock if possible) it could easily reach the levels of a Group B car, if not a full-on supercar, but with GT7's emphasis on closed circuit racing, even on dirt, there's more restrictions in place as to how the car can be built to assure some semblance of viability. In FH5, there's not only a whole host of point-to-point races, there's also cross-country events, meaning you have more opportunity to build the car out however you need it--even a "bad" rally build can have a place in FH meta, so to speak.

Again, I am not the first guy you'd ask to defend PG's choices, but I can see the logic.

 

[notsofast]

I was kind of afraid this update would be a Hypercar parade. I do hope the MC20 comes soon (and brings the MC12 and the 97 Ghibli with it). Also sadly I think the playlist cars appeal to me more than the cars in the pack.

I was kinda hoping it would be (a Hypercar parade) but it’s not and I’m not disappointed at all. The update is different to what I initially expected but this isn’t a bad thing at all

Love the new car pack. Bentley convertible, AMG Hammer wagon is just sub zero cool. I’ve always loved the Project 8 so that’s a welcome inclusion. The Battista isn’t something I know much about but it looks nice. Well it is a Pinanfarina after all.

For the playlist cars I’m happy the Valkeyrie AMR appears given that I’ve run out of patience with the mess that is the latest Forza Motorsport game. I’m glad also that the Audi RS6 2021 reappears given that I’ve missed out on it the first time around. The Fulvia SL63 Ascari Esprit V8 etc are all cars that have their own appeal in one way or another. Not to mention the 500E. That is a gem. Can’t wait to drive that.

All in all I’m very happy with this update.

 

[Populuxe]

View attachment 1331888

Double Double Cab

Quadruple Cab?

Looks like someone finally noticed the mistake.

 

[YoungRhombus]

Something fishy must be up with the MC20 licensing considering the Battista supposedly replaced it as a last-minute shoe-in Spotlight car in FM23. I wonder if the Battista was supposed to be the MC20 here too, considering it's the only car that's paid DLC that's technically been in another Forza game already (besides the 911 Sport Classic).

 

[The_Greaser]

It's quite an impressive list of cars, but it's too bad I chose to uninstall FH5 because of stability problems posed on my aging Series S.

 

[UKMikey]

I only needed the 20 points this week so I did the #Forzathon and attempted the Korea trial. Managed to scrape 1st place so that our team of mostly stock Velosters won by 50 points on my second attempt to my surprise and astonishment.

The racing was a bit rough so I wasn't looking forward to reading the message I received from a fellow racer. Luckily he was thanking me for clinching the win. Can't say that happens every day. 👍🏽

 

[-Fred-]

And yet another monetised four-car pack which is... what the sixth or seventh month in a row? I forget. Still feels icky.

That used to be the way it was before FM7. I can't remember if the original Motorsport did, but every game from FM2 up to FH3 had paid DLCs every month up until the newest game came out. And it was much pricier, 10$ for 6-7 cars usually. I'm not against it as long as they don't fill them with cars from previous titles like they did in FM5.

 

[Digolgrin]

Something fishy must be up with the MC20 licensing considering the Battista supposedly replaced it as a last-minute shoe-in Spotlight car in FM23. I wonder if the Battista was supposed to be the MC20 here too, considering it's the only car that's paid DLC that's technically been in another Forza game already (besides the 911 Sport Classic).

We have no way of knowing for certain, but I'm betting what happened was that Turn 10 decided it actually wanted to get the MC20 first at the last minute. We'll have to see what happens with Update 6's cars to know for certain but if the MC20 pops up there that's probably what happened.

 

[INEEDNAWZZZ]

Knowing PG, we'll see the MC20 appear in a random thumbnail icon and never again after that.

 

[FoxMulder]

That used to be the way it was before FM7. I can't remember if the original Motorsport did, but every game from FM2 up to FH3 had paid DLCs every month up until the newest game came out. And it was much pricier, 10$ for 6-7 cars usually. I'm not against it as long as they don't fill them with cars from previous titles like they did in FM5.

Yeah it was the norm in the old games and we’re in an era where kids ask for Fortnite currency instead of toys for Christmas. A whole generation grew up with Shark cards in GTA 5. It’s just how things are and Forza is still pretty tame in extra monetization compared to stuff like The Crew or even Gran Turismo.

I’m fine buying dlc packs years into the game’s life after they’ve given out cars weekly in the festival playlist.

 

[Apple Slipper]

There are many cars from Forza Motorsport that could be contenders for the Forza Horizon 5 European Automotive Update:

• 1968 Aston Martin DBS Vantage
• 2022 Aston Martin Valkyrie AMR Pro (already revealed)
• 2001 Aston Martin Vanquish
• 2020 Audi R8 V10 performance
• 2020 BMW M2 F87 Competition
• 2021 Lamborghini Sián FKP37
• 2022 Maserati MC20 (originally leaked in a Forza Motorsport Italian Ingenuity event poster)
• 2021 McLaren Sabre
• 2019 McLaren Senna GTR
• 2020 Pininfarina Battista
• 2018 Volkswagen Golf GTI TCR

I got the Pininfarina Battista correct, as it is in the new car pack. I finally am correct in my guesses for once! 😂

 

[skazz]

It makes sense that the Pininfarina is a last minute replacement for the MC20. It became the only car in FM23 to be used as spotlight car despite already being in the game, and likewise the only car to be DLC in FH5 without being new to Forza as a whole.

Car Packs haven't been every month since summer 2023, however since FM23 released they have indeed been released once a month (October, November, December, January and February).

This is an overview of every single paid DLC car pack released so far. Dates of release as shown in steam:

 

[Famine]

It’s just how things are and Forza is still pretty tame in extra monetization compared to stuff like The Crew or even Gran Turismo.

Really?

I mean, I hate the fact that buying credits exists at all, and the prices in GT7 are ludicrous... but they're not required to access all of the game's content. In FH5 if you want all of the game's content, you're now apparently paying another £5+ a month for it.

Of course it's a slog in GT7 to earn the credits required to buy the cars, and the time period between Legends Cars appearances is a lot longer than most players play any one game before shelving it, but it can be done, the LCD rotation is relatively predictable rather than at whim, and there's no missing out because you didn't play a certain number of events in a specific time frame (although you may argue that the Auction House is a bypass for that, the number of players with that specific car remains the same until it comes round again) or fork over some additional cash.

Bear in mind here I've got every point on every FH5 playlist to date (about 8000 of them), and there's some Playlist Exclusive cars of which I only have two examples (I think there's a couple of which I only have one, but I'd have to check). There's several cars I only have one of in GT7 (and some I have none of yet!), but that's simply because I haven't taken every opportunity to buy more than one with the credits I've earned* in-game.

GT7's way of doing it just looks awful because the credit packs and the ten most expensive LCD cars are stupidly priced and the highest payout races are poor by comparison (the OTTs and GTWS bonuses mitigate that a little). The reality is you can own all the content without spending a penny more than the game cost you - and that's not less tame than having 130 cars as paid DLC.

Locking game content behind paywalls will always be worse for players than selling you gamebucks as a shortcut, and time-gating is crappy FOMO toss. For balance, so is GT7's "Invitation" system, which I detest. Nice idea, but boy does the execution blow (what's wrong with doing it the real-world way - own "x" Ferraris, get invited to buy an FXXK - if you must do it?).


I'll additionally note that we've also seen PG recently add a handful of previous exclusives to the Autoshow, That is, of course, no guarantee of them all making their way in but does, for those few cars, bypass the FOMO system. There was also the Backstage Pass mechanism in FH4 that has yet to appear in FH5 and which would do the same if it did.

On the flip side, FH5 now also has the Autoshow Car Voucher, which is... a paid way to bypass earning credits. It's cheaper than GT7's direct cash-for-credits, but the idea remains.


Don't know how The Crew does it, but I suspect it's awful. Having written about NFSU this morning, that looks more than a mite cynical too - although at least the actual cars are free, to get the wild cosmetics (and "NFS Legends") that the game is about you not only need to pay but also to play a certain amount inside a set timeframe.

Fundamentally though, there's no "good" way to monetise games from the player's point of view. I hate them all, I just hate some more - any that sees you possess the data but unable to access it without spending more money is the one I hate the most.

*I do have some paid credits, but that's from the 25AE bonus and I was given that as part of the review code anyway.

 

[GBalao888]

At some point, they could make a "second volume" of the Car Pass, but there's no clear indication of how many car packs they intend to produce, and that most of the packs anyway had four cars (five for the Fast X car pack and seven for the Italian Exotics car pack).

The roadmap of FH5 seems to be very unclear at this point, given they're focusing on live service stuff after the actual Car Pass has been completed, as well as both expansions.

Right now, if you don't count any Forza editions or promotional vehicles, then FH5 has the largest car list in the entire series, at 796 cars (10 more than Motorsport 7 without any Forza editions). With Forza editions and promotional vehicles, it's around 15 cars short of FM7 (at 820 cars).

This could potentially mean that FH6 might still be a little bit far away, but who knows, I'd like to be wrong. But if ever FH6 is being worked on, licensing not withstanding, no car should be left behind, and no more come-and-go mechanics.

 

[nukleabomb]

The amount of car packs they have been blowing through in the last six months is very weird. They are also doing this while adding ~4 new cars every month too. What's also odd is that most of these car pack cars aren't even in FM. FM now has a huge disparity in cars (even if suvs/offroaders are excluded)
These cars aren't even in prior datamines/leaks.
Either their licensing department is on a spree or they are rushing though the planned dlc to cover for something.
I have a feeling that they are accelerating FH5 content because FH6 is going to launch late this year.

There is going to be another big loss of cars when FH6 drops, because it will lose a lot of cars like FH4->FH5 at launch or FH5->FM.

 

[skazz]

The amount of car packs they have been blowing through in the last six months is very weird. They are also doing this while adding ~4 new cars every month too. What's also odd is that most of these car pack cars aren't even in FM. FM now has a huge disparity in cars (even if suvs/offroaders are excluded)
These cars aren't even in prior datamines/leaks.
Either their licensing department is on a spree or they are rushing though the planned dlc to cover for something.
I have a feeling that they are accelerating FH5 content because FH6 is going to launch late this year.

There is going to be another big loss of cars when FH6 drops, because it will lose a lot of cars like FH4->FH5 at launch or FH5->FM.

There was news a while back that FH4 wouldn't be EOL even 4 years after release, implying that their method of licensing cars changed from FH4 onwards (presumably moving to a licensing structure to let them keep games in Gamepass longer?).

FH4 was released in September 2018, so it's 5 1/2 years old now.

So at the moment we really don't know what their plans for FH6 are, since they are still able to sell FH4 even today, implying that none of the licenses in that game have expired yet. This is in stark contrast to FM7 which was EOL a while ago.

 

[Digolgrin]

Perhaps this is where we'll see that leaked new Drag PR Stunt?

Or an overhaul to the Head-2-Head race mode possibly? That's what I'm gleaning from "Race-Off"

Especially if there is a community challenge - we'll have to complete a certain number of "Race-Offs" to unlock a car much like the Secret Santa events.


This was at the end of the FM.net article, definitely sounds like that leaked PR stunt/H2H mode from a while back.

Oh crap I just realized what this could be. This is probably exactly where the Drag PR stunt will be added--unless that turns out to be its own expansion or something--but this wasn't what I had in mind.

What if it works like Horizon World Cup? That was a community challenge-oriented season and it organized folks into different teams, albeit based on the nation of car you chose to drive for the first Weekly Challenge. There'll be a Weekly Challenge that determines what team you'd be on for the entire Series, possibly organized by type of car (maybe a four-way battle between muscle cars, supercars, EVs and rally cars?), and the more races you win with the type of car you picked out for that Challenge, the more points you score for that team. If your team wins, not only does that determine what cosmetics everyone gets for participating, it also determines what a future Series will be about. I don't think it's any coincidence that the first Automotive Excellence series was dedicated to Germany when Team Germany won that entire event.

 

[PJTierney]

That used to be the way it was before FM7. I can't remember if the original Motorsport did, but every game from FM2 up to FH3 had paid DLCs every month up until the newest game came out. And it was much pricier, 10$ for 6-7 cars usually. I'm not against it as long as they don't fill them with cars from previous titles like they did in FM5.

Packs like this often help greenlight and fund further updates, like a cycle. I imagine Playground only got the green light to do Year 3 of updates if they were going to bring in X amount of revenue in return. Otherwise the updates would dwindle and we'd be waiting however long for Forza Horizon 6.

Launch, Expansion and Game Pass revenue can only take you so far when the game is over 2 years old and not destined to be a "forever game" like Fortnite.

 

[UKMikey]

Packs like this often help greenlight and fund further updates, like a cycle.

Aw, no, don't tell me you want motorbikes in Forza games as well like that feller on the Motorsports thread?

(J/k )

 

[Nacho Libre]

When they introduced bikes in Project Gotham 4 I disliked them so much, they really felt out of place there. But when I tried The Crew 2, bikes felt more organic, because they have specific events for them and are fun to cruise around, even with very simplistic physics.

In FH we have ATV's (6, I believe) which are closer to dirt bikes than cars, anyways.