Gran Turismo 5 vs. Forza 3 - AI comparison Debunked

[otago]

I'm sorry, but I am calling BS on this one. Post some video, or quit blowing smoke.

Dude, are you blind or what?

So far I've seen only a couple GT5 races which reminds something like races, the rest 95% is all about half of AI cars overtaking me on straight and then in the first turn I hit the wall of barely moving AI idiots.

Go to Supercars event, High speed ring race for example, I was 5-th with first try beating Veyron by far with 80-th Mugen Civic (214 hp). I could easily beat 4-th Zonda C12 if I defended a bit (cause I passed this Zonda in every turn during the whole race).

Do you see this as anything even barely close to normal?

 

[HBR-Roadhog]

Having played both games a great deal I can honestly say that I have saw the cars in GT5 and GT5P try to avoid contact and I have been smashed in Forza just like happens in GT. I have been pitted and punted by the AI in both games as well as have the AI try to avoid contact. Neither AI is that good and both are easy to beat. Forza even moreso as it has an easy and easier setting and to make it even easier rewind and autobrake. Even on the hardest settings the only way most races are a challenge is when you pick an inferior car. Sadly the same is true in GT5 in most races but there are a few that actually make you drive.

 

[Chunk]

I haven't noticed this very much. Perhaps a clip showing this kind of behavior?

I don't have any video handy to show this behavior, but I remember it particularly during the Miata championship race at Tsukuba. My B-Spec driver would back off when he saw opposing cars, particularly in the esses after the first hairpin, and the right bend and left kink after the inner hairpin. Where my driver would normally tap the brakes in (roughly) the proper turn in points, when trailing another car my driver would brake early.

I don't really have this problem so much anymore, because I have tired of watching my B-Spec driver acting the fool, and I now just give him a car that outclasses the competition.

 

[MowTin]

Having played both games a great deal I can honestly say that I have saw the cars in GT5 and GT5P try to avoid contact and I have been smashed in Forza just like happens in GT. I have been pitted and punted by the AI in both games as well as have the AI try to avoid contact. Neither AI is that good and both are easy to beat. Forza even moreso as it has an easy and easier setting and to make it even easier rewind and autobrake. Even on the hardest settings the only way most races are a challenge is when you pick an inferior car. Sadly the same is true in GT5 in most races but there are a few that actually make you drive.

Exactly! Same experience here. I got run into and punted by AI in Forza but then I would just hit the rewind button and go on like it never happened. Maybe that's why those who played Forza forgot about those punts. It much more frustrating if you get punted and have to restart the race.

But Forza's races were boring because you could always rewind.

The AI in racing games have always sucked. That's why there is online racing...so you can get punted by an even more retarded human intelligence.

 

[Lap_KingZ_Feed]

I can't ****ing believe it is 2010 and we are comparing Forza.. ****ing Forza to Gran Turismo 5...

Nothing compares to Gran Turismo...

Whoever compares the two games are RETARDS.

THIS IS A PREMIUM SIMULATION RACING GAME NOT A ****ING SUBURB BOY FAST AND THE FURIOUS CUSTOM 22INCH RIMS AUDI R8 OMFGZ GAME

 

[RedSuinit]

I can't ****ing believe it is 2010 and we are comparing Forza.. ****ing Forza to Gran Turismo 5...

Nothing compares to Gran Turismo...

Whoever compares the two games are RETARDS.

THIS IS A PREMIUM SIMULATION RACING GAME NOT A ****ING SUBURB BOY FAST AND THE FURIOUS CUSTOM 22INCH RIMS AUDI R8 OMFGZ GAME

Really? I mean really, really? Chill out bro.

 

[Ryan81]

What I find amazing is how many people claim that GT5's AI simply chooses a racing line and never makes any mistakes and the AI cars do not battle for positions, they simply just stay behind one another. This is false. I have been playing GT5 for a while now and the AI cars are constantly jostling for positions, overtaking each other, etc.

 

[RikkiGT-R]

You said that you are only halfway through GT5, well, wait til you get to the expert/extreme/endurance races, and get a car comparable to the competition (and i don't mean underpowered, i just mean completely overpowered).
There's some real competition there. Something that even Mr. M.Rossi can even get near to top

Well, 55% complete or something like that. Completed everything up to the super GT 'championship' in Extreme Series.

I waited what seemed like forever for a touring car to appear in the UCD - last night I finally got my hands on an Abt Audi TT-R Touring Car (the only one available), then went and raced in the touring car 'Championship' (I keep saying 'championship' because it annoys me that there appear to be only a couple of actual multi-race events where we win points and form a leaderboard of sorts).

Anyway, while practically dozing at the wheel, I won the Cape Ring race by about 25 seconds, the Nurburgring (GP) race by about 15 seconds and the Nordschleife 'race' (one lap ffs) by another 15 seconds.

These were not races, certainly not races as I understand the definition. Where is the competition? Should I have went slower so the AI could keep up? Should I have fitted comfort tyres to make it more challenging?

My point is - I used the only car available for those races and breezed to victory. *sigh*

 

[Ramosis]

Here's one! http://n4g.com/news/662428/the-media-lies-about-gt5-ai/com

Nice! Hahaha The Pinocchio image illustrates the news.

 

[Zoom!Zoom!]

Exactly! Same experience here. I got run into and punted by AI in Forza but then I would just hit the rewind button and go on like it never happened. Maybe that's why those who played Forza forgot about those punts. It much more frustrating if you get punted and have to restart the race.

But Forza's races were boring because you could always rewind.

The AI in racing games have always sucked. That's why there is online racing...so you can get punted by an even more retarded human intelligence.

I tried not to use the rewind feature in Forza 3 as it's basically a cheat but I found myself do it anyways for that very reason.

 

[Chunk]

What I find amazing is how many people claim that GT5's AI simply chooses a racing line and never makes any mistakes and the AI cars do not battle for positions, they simply just stay behind one another. This is false. I have been playing GT5 for a while now and the AI cars are constantly jostling for positions, overtaking each other, etc.

I notice GT5's AI making a lot more mistakes than in prior versions. The mistakes seem to be limited to throttle-induced oversteer on corner exit from what I've seen so far, but this is definitely a plus over older GT games. I wish they made more and different mistakes depending on an adjustable AI level (from their current "braindead but consistent" to "sloppy", "average human racer", and "RoboSchumacher"). That feature added replayability to Forza, because with the difficulty cranked up, unmodified spec races were wicked-hard, but the game was still fun when you ran up against a race you had problems with.

I guess I should revise my former statement that the AI is no different from GT1 to GT5. This is a definite improvement.

 

[JackC8]

You don't need a carefully fabricated ruse to make the AI in GT5 look bad - just play it. You could probably never make a game with perfect AI, but that doesn't mean some aren't significantly better or worse than others, and GT5 is easily the worst I've ever seen in a non-arcade racing game this gen.

I restarted a race at Monaco at least 15 times last night just to make it through the first corner without getting spun out, and when I finally accomplished that, I got to the chicane and saw that another car was sitting sideways in front of it. I had to stop, and the entire field piled into me at full throttle.

Fail 👎

It certainly doesn't help that no matter the severity of the collision, the AI cars are only momentarily knocked off course, and then continue on as if nothing had happened. While I - almost always - am left with the nose of my car stuffed in a guard rail.

 

[RikkiGT-R]

It certainly doesn't help that no matter the severity of the collision, the AI cars are only momentarily knocked off course, and then continue on as if nothing had happened. While I - almost always - am left with the nose of my car stuffed in a guard rail.

This. I have never once since starting GT5 managed to spin out an AI car, but I am myself continually spun out at the slightest touch from them.

 

[warpspeed2slow]

I can't ****ing believe it is 2010 and we are comparing Forza.. ****ing Forza to Gran Turismo 5...

Nothing compares to Gran Turismo...

Whoever compares the two games are RETARDS.

THIS IS A PREMIUM SIMULATION RACING GAME NOT A ****ING SUBURB BOY FAST AND THE FURIOUS CUSTOM 22INCH RIMS AUDI R8 OMFGZ GAME

You forget to take your meds?

 

[Zoom!Zoom!]

This. I have never once since starting GT5 managed to spin out an AI car, but I am myself continually spun out at the slightest touch from them.

I can spin out the AI car yet they do try to correct from oversteering. If I continue to press they will spin around. I some times do it just fun.

 

[Big Ron]

I don´t know what you guys try to prove with those videos.

Should we all scream "Hurra" for a AI, which can dodge a standing car?

There is nothing you can do, which can convince a serious video gamer, that the AI is smart or racing against the AI is fun.

Because most of us do not park their car on the track to be happy about dodging AI...most of us are (forced to) racing against them and they are dumb like hell.

 

[Zoom!Zoom!]

Of course the AI is dumb which it why it's called AI. The same AI which dodges a park car also dodges you while racing yet they do make mistakes. I've seen the AI do some serious oversteering in the corners with the RUF cars.

 

[Mugenjin]

I don´t know what you guys try to prove with those videos.

Should we all scream "Hurra" for a AI, which can dodge a standing car?

There is nothing you can do, which can convince a serious video gamer, that the AI is smart or racing against the AI is fun.

Because most of us do not park their car on the track to be happy about dodging AI...most of us are (forced to) racing against them and they are dumb like hell.

I refer to the very first post of this thread as to why that video was created.

 

[Big Ron]

Of course the AI is dumb which it why it's called AI. The same AI which dodges a park car also dodges you while racing yet they do make mistakes. I've seen the AI do some serious oversteering in the corners with the RUF cars.

Sorry, but I don´t know where you´ve seen serious overtaking (of course it could happen), but most times the AI brakes too early or bumps your rear while you try to brake.

And it is not caused by "realistic mistakes" by the AI, but just by stupid following their race line and not care often enough about letting space for overtaking.

I refer to the very first post of this thread as to why that video was created.

I know, that this video was just made to keep going on the never ending battle between Forza and GT.

Now we know, that the AI of Forza is dumber than the GT-AI....but really....it does not make it better

 

[RikkiGT-R]

I can spin out the AI car yet they do try to correct from oversteering. If I continue to press they will spin around. I some times do it just fun.

:lolasaurus:

 

[RedSuinit]

Sorry, but I don´t know where you´ve seen serious overtaking (of course it could happen), but most times the AI brakes too early or bumps your rear while you try to brake.

And it is not caused by "realistic mistakes" by the AI, but just by stupid following their race line and not care often enough about letting space for overtaking.



I know, that this video was just made to keep going on the never ending battle between Forza and GT.

Now we know, that the AI of Forza is dumber than the GT-AI....but really....it does not make it better

It was simply made to prove that the GT5 vs Forza 3 AI video circulating the net was a fraud. That's all.

 

[Big Ron]

It was simply made to prove that the GT5 vs Forza 3 AI video circulating the net was a fraud. That's all.

I think the video was made, because someone was frustrated because GT5 looked worse than Forza3...that´s all

 

[RedSuinit]

I think the video was made, because someone was frustrated because GT5 looked worse than Forza3...that´s all

Now you're just being a troll, and trying to make people angry. But hey, you're the one wasting your time on a forum for a game you apparently don't like. Added to block list.

 

[SavageEvil]

Sorry, but I don´t know where you´ve seen serious overtaking (of course it could happen), but most times the AI brakes too early or bumps your rear while you try to brake.

And it is not caused by "realistic mistakes" by the AI, but just by stupid following their race line and not care often enough about letting space for overtaking.



I know, that this video was just made to keep going on the never ending battle between Forza and GT.

Now we know, that the AI of Forza is dumber than the GT-AI....but really....it does not make it better

The part in bold is what I am trying to understand, AI braking to early or bumping your rear while you try to brake? Braking too early I understand, but bumping your rear when you brake? That part I really have issues with as I know that the AI brakes better than we do, you are probably someone who goes into a corner hot and has to brake a lot to correct himself and the AI has to adjust to your mistake and may bump you since cars do not travel in a vacuum. Bring a video of the AI rear ending you where it wasn't supposed to happen and where it wasn't your fault.

Last part, you might need to read the OP before you start assuming you know what he was speaking about, thank you.

 

[RedSuinit]

The part in bold is what I am trying to understand, AI braking to early or bumping your rear while you try to brake? Braking too early I understand, but bumping your rear when you brake? That part I really have issues with as I know that the AI brakes better than we do, you are probably someone who goes into a corner hot and has to brake a lot to correct himself and the AI has to adjust to your mistake and may bump you since cars do not travel in a vacuum. Bring a video of the AI rear ending you where it wasn't supposed to happen and where it wasn't your fault.

Last part, you might need to read the OP before you start assuming you know what he was speaking about, thank you.

Don't bother Savage, I explained it to him, and he completely ignored what the OP and myself were saying. He's being a troll.

 

[Big Ron]

The part in bold is what I am trying to understand, AI braking to early or bumping your rear while you try to brake? Braking too early I understand, but bumping your rear when you brake? That part I really have issues with as I know that the AI brakes better than we do, you are probably someone who goes into a corner hot and has to brake a lot to correct himself and the AI has to adjust to your mistake and may bump you since cars do not travel in a vacuum. Bring a video of the AI rear ending you where it wasn't supposed to happen and where it wasn't your fault.

Last part, you might need to read the OP before you start assuming you know what he was speaking about, thank you.

I mean not bumping my rear when I break out of high speed but driving in traffic in slow sectors (for example first sector of Nürburgring GP) and be carefull not to hit the car in front but behind me they do not care about.

I know, that the AI is way better as in GT4, but still not good enough to eliminate the "I drive for myself"-feeling.

Now you're just being a troll, and trying to make people angry. But hey, you're the one wasting your time on a forum for a game you apparently don't like. Added to block list.

I play GT5 nearly every day and I love it, so better don´t act me as a troll or like you would know me.

But I am still annoyed by the still terrible AI, which destroys every excitement during A-Spec-events.

You are just a GT-fanboy, who think, everyone is a troll by just criticizing sth. or saying something true about mistakes of the game....and that is what makes the difference between us....I play every GT-title but know, that it isn´t perfect....you play every GT-title and watch the "Gran Turismo 5 vs. Forza 3 - AI comparison"-video and think, that we have a good AI now.

 

[gtracedriver]

This is a fair comparision:

 

[RedSuinit]

I mean not bumping my rear when I break out of high speed but driving in traffic in slow sectors (for example first sector of Nürburgring GP) and be carefull not to hit the car in front but behind me they do not care about.

I know, that the AI is way better as in GT4, but still not good enough to eliminate the "I drive for myself"-feeling.




I play GT5 nearly every day and I love it, so better don´t act me as a troll or like you would know me.

But I am still annoyed by the still terrible AI, which destroys every excitement during A-Spec-events.

You are just a GT-fanboy, who think, everyone is a troll by just criticizing sth. or saying something true about mistakes of the game....and that is what makes the difference between us....I play every GT-title but know, that it isn´t perfect....you play every GT-title and watch the "Gran Turismo 5 vs. Forza 3 - AI comparison"-video and think, that we have a good AI now.

You clearly haven't seen this thread that I have started. Where everyone is welcome to show actual evidence of GT5's AI being dumb. But I have already posted PROOF, actual VIDEO FOOTAGE of the AI being intelligent and making good racing decisions. Along with some foolish ones. What do you have beside comments like "the AI still sucks! Duhurhurhur!" Please tell me. Oh, and you STILL disregard the point of this thread, only further proving that you have no understanding of what is going on here. Several people have tried to explain it to you, and yet you still do nothing but troll on about how the only reason it was made is because fan-boys can't stand to see GT painted in a negative light. How about Abriel was just revealing the truth about a fraudulent video? You are still being a troll, because you refuse to acknowledge that you have completely misunderstood this thread, and by continuing to do so, you only make yourself look more and more like a troll.

 

[Stune]

This is a fair comparision:

Not bad. The final GT5 one needed to be a little more to the right however

 

[eddiing]

Why don't someone try and park the car "SIDEWAYS" and see how the AI reacts in both games? hmmm.. I am going to try that right now!