Grand Theft Auto IV

[Digital-Nitrate]

PS2 came out with DVD and again the 1st few games could of fitted on a CD, but by the end not only did they fill DVD but they went dual layer. GTA wasnt even the game that used up the most space either. I have no doubt that while the games now wont come close to 50gb on a dual layer Blue ray, give it time and we will definelty exeed the ~9gb limit of Dual layer DVD

Good observations, just a couple key points though, for game data, only 7 GB can be used on a dual-layer DVD-9, the rest is sued for formating and XB360 system files.

Th other thing is, developers have already exceed well past the capacity of DVD including a title that was available the day the PS3 was launched - Resistence: FOM is 16GB (would need three DVDs).

In addition, the creator and director of MGS4, Hideo Kojima has already said in interviews that they expect to use far more capacity than RFOM, and may even need to release it on a dual layer 50GB BD-ROM. So at launch, there was already a game that far exceeded DVD capacity, and several titles coming out in the near future will likely be even larger than RFOM.

Keeping the standard DVD is xbox's biggest mistake.

I couldn't garee more, and I wouldn't be surprised if MS is betting on XB fans to pony up for yet another future version of the XB360 with a Blu-ray player sometime next year, now that HD DVD appears to be on life support, and sales of their add-on HD DVD player continue to falter.


Back on topic... so how do you think the majority of GTA fans might feel if the violence level is brought down a notch?

 

[Tornado]

Good observations, just a couple key points though, for game data, only 7 GB can be used on a dual-layer DVD-9, the rest is sued for formating and XB360 system files.

Is there anything stopping Microsoft from releasing a triple layer DVD? I read Toshiba was tinkering with a triple layer HD-DVD, so is there anything preventing the same use for normal DVDs (remember, this is coming from someone with only a vague understanding of either Blu-Ray or HD-DVD. Or even DVD for that matter)?

Back on topic... so how do you think the majority of GTA fans might feel if the violence level is brought down a notch?

So long as the do-anything ability isn't limited (and it shouldn't be, because other games of similar design had the same idea without as much violence), I don't think there would be any backlash.

 

[Dave A]

If they can produce a triple layer DVD that works with existing lasers then no, as long as the laser in the XB360 reads it. But it's not that simple and the development costs may be too high to bother when theres higher format disks already available that arn't much more to manufacture than standard DVD's.

 

[land sea air]

what about using the HD DVD add on, can that be used to read games? Even if that works though you still have the problem of telling people who want the game that they need a 200$ add on first...

 

[Digital-Nitrate]

what about using the HD DVD add on, can that be used to read games? Even if that works though you still have the problem of telling people who want the game that they need a 200$ add on first...

No, the XB360 doesn't have the hardware neccessary to read game data off the HD DVD add-on player. It is for watching HD DVD movies only.

Is there anything stopping Microsoft from releasing a triple layer DVD? I read Toshiba was tinkering with a triple layer HD-DVD, so is there anything preventing the same use for normal DVDs (remember, this is coming from someone with only a vague understanding of either Blu-Ray or HD-DVD. Or even DVD for that matter)?

It is actually a very good question but unfortunately the answer in both cases (DVD & HD DVD) is not good. There are a few reasons why this can't happen without replacing the current DVD drives in XB360s, or replacing all HD DVD drives is that both the red laser pickup in DVD and the blue laser pickup in HD DVD are only capable of reading single and dual layer discs.

Making this even more complicated is that HD DVD has already finalized their specs, and while Toshiba is, at least in the media, suggesting that they may have a 51 GB triple layer HD DVD disc ready for standardized submissions, it would mean an entirely new HD DVD design, and all current HD DVD players would not be able to read those discs.

More to the point, engineers have been trying to develop triple layer DVDs for more than ten years now without any reasonable measure of success in regards to something that could be used by consumers, and not just lab prototypes. Seeing as from a design and manufacturing stand point, DVDs are basically identical to HD DVD, it appears Toshiba is not at all being realistic in their suggestion that they may be able to offer triple layer HD DVDs.

And as said before, even if by some remarkable feat of engineering that allows them to make one outside the lab, it would still mean they would have to release an entirely new kind of HD DVD player in order to read it.


Blu-ray players are in a slightly better position for future multi-layer discs. While Blu-ray specs currently limit film and game content to dual layer 50 GB BD-ROMs, because of the unique design of Blu-ray discs, they can have as much as 8 layers per disc. It is this same unique disc structure that also allows them to have nearly twice as much data per layer than HD DVD, and transfer speeds at about 50% faster than HD DVD.

Blu-ray disc manufacturers have had 4-layer 100 GB Blu-ray discs demoed now for a few years, and TDK is currently working on a 200 GB Blu-ray disc - which is likely a candidate for DVR's and media storage solution and will likely never be used for films or games.


OK… talk about getting way of topic… sorry all who found that boring. If you want to discuss this more, I’ll be glad to participate in a more appropriate thread for all those interested.

 

[KieranMurphy]

Is there anything stopping Microsoft from releasing a triple layer DVD?

It may or may not be possible, but the hard fact is that there's already 10 million Xbox 360s on the market with basic dual-layer DVD drives (like mine!). Games companies have to make games that can work on the most basic Xbox out there. Rockstar can't really release a game on a disc format that the average Xbox user out the can't use. So they're stuck with either trying to squeeze the game onto a DVD or issuing games on multiple DVDs (which is an obvious no-no for GTA).

I can't see Rockstar releasing GTAIV on HD-DVD or triple-layer DVD when there's hardly any actual Xbox360 users with those systems. Like it or not, they've gotta deal with the 7Gb Xbox DVD storage limit.

edit: Off topic and wrong forum, but just out of curiosity, can the PS3 read dual-layer 50Gb Blu-Ray discs or is it limited to the 25Gb discs? What out the potential 4-layer 100Gb and 8-layer 200Gb discs or are they still out of touch for consumer electronics?


KM.

 

[Digital-Nitrate]

edit: Off topic and wrong forum, but just out of curiosity, can the PS3 read dual-layer 50Gb Blu-Ray discs or is it limited to the 25Gb discs? What out the potential 4-layer 100Gb and 8-layer 200Gb discs or are they still out of touch for consumer electronics?

Yes (to first question), and covered in more detail above.

 

[Rue]

New York (LC) + Eastern Bloc Mafia? Should be fun. Hope the graphics in the trailer were in game and not pre-rendered, because it looks great!

 

[Richardrfo]

Something for those who've not seen it yet:

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=161126

 

[McLaren]

New York (LC) + Eastern Bloc Mafia? Should be fun. Hope the graphics in the trailer were in game and not pre-rendered, because it looks great!

What you saw was the RAGE engine, and yes, it was all real. Fascinating stuff.

 

[McLaren]

I've just being looking on one of the GTAForum.com's GTA4 threads and come across a poster called 'deepthroatgta4' who's been posting some weird stories about coming across some GTA4 footage hinting that it will be set in NYC - this was days before the trailer was shown. It would appear that he's a Rockstar insider releasing snipits of info to boost media coverage. It might be worth checking his posts out every now and then!

http://www.gtaforums.com/index.php?showtopic=269166&st=0

D*mn, if that is a R* employee, they are certainly sneaker little b*stards.

 

[donbenni]

http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200703/N07.0330.1112.19632.htm

Can't wait, looks like more info is coming soon 👍

 

[McLaren]

http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200703/N07.0330.1112.19632.htm

Can't wait, looks like more info is coming soon 👍

The caption at the bottom brings up a good point.

GOW has become X360's greatest hit. Halo 3 will undoubtedly do it too.

But now that the ultimate Sandbox game is coming, and looking better than both, does anyone but me think that Rockstar might just have both GOW and Halo 3 right where they want them now?

 

[land sea air]

meh, Halo's pretty freaking big. IMO they are about = hype wise.

 

[DuckRacer]

Hey, there's a big fanboy war coming on and I'm not in it?! Boo!

Anyway, without reading anything that has been posted here thus far, here's my prediction: GTA4 will have the cities from San Andreas, Liberty City, and Vice City. The PS3 version will have everything on one disc. The 360 version will have each city on a separate disc for a total of three DVD9s. Will it happen? Probably not, but it's still nice to speculate.

 

[Jay]

Anyway, without reading anything that has been posted here thus far, here's my prediction: GTA4 will have the cities from San Andreas, Liberty City, and Vice City. The PS3 version will have everything on one disc. The 360 version will have each city on a separate disc for a total of three DVD9s. Will it happen? Probably not, but it's still nice to speculate.

A billboard in the start of the trailer has "Vice city $300" written on it and FlyUS sign right next to it. Speculating possibly that Vice city in included ($300 airfare maybe?). Maybe GTAIV is like the original GTA which has three citys.


(I posted this earlier but as you hadn't read through the thread I thought I would post it again.)

 

[DuckRacer]

A billboard in the start of the trailer has "Vice city $300" written on it and FlyUS sign right next to it. Speculating possibly that Vice city in included ($300 airfare maybe?). Maybe GTAIV is like the original GTA which has three citys.

Yes, that's what has me speculating... plus, I also saw a sign that talked about a trip to "CA", presumably San Andreas. I'll try to dig it up tomorrow.

 

[Jay]

Yes, that's what has me speculating... plus, I also saw a sign that talked about a trip to "CA", presumably San Andreas. I'll try to dig it up tomorrow.

You mean the "FLEECA" sign? If not I will be interested to see it.

The "FLEECA" sign some say its a hint of FLorida and CAlifornia.

 

[harrytuttle]

Finally got a good look at the trailer (so I guess this makes me, what, 12 weeks late to this conversation? ), and I eagerly anticipate GTA-IV. I grew up in New York, so R* re-doing the five boroughs with exhaustive detail would be a real treat for me. Yes, Tokyo or London would be more original, and probably more challenging, but New York just has that great vibe (for me, at least) that's hard to replicate anywhere else.

The graphics look superb, the detail (like the front stoop on the row houses) is intense, and the lighting looks better than anything I've seen. That didn't look like Liberty City played as New York City, it looked exactly like NYC.

Is it just me or did the trailer have a very movie-trailer feeling to it? It reminded me of the first Matrix movie, or some other recent sci-fi movie, with the sped-up time and that damned familiar music....

 

[Jay]

and that damned familiar music....

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=161126

"Oldschool movie buffs will recognize the spoof reference in the GTA IV trailer straight away; the music is from Godfrey Reggio's Koyaanisqatsi, a dialogue-less documentary film from the early eighties that mixed landscape footage with a rolling soundtrack. The music, in case your wondering, is a piece from minimalist composer Philip Glass, who created the music for Koyaanisqatsi. "

 

[Christhedude]

What you saw was the RAGE engine, and yes, it was all real. Fascinating stuff.

it was indeed real fascinating

 

[Jay]

May edtion of Game Informer will have the next load of GTA IV pictures and news, should be in readers hands in 3 weeks or so.


http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200703/N07.0330.1112.19632.htm

 

[McLaren]

Can't wait for that issue. 10 pages! Man, maybe we can at least confirm that the shotgun is in.

 

[KieranMurphy]

May edtion of Game Informer will have the next load of GTA IV pictures and news, should be in readers hands in 3 weeks or so.

I wonder how accurate it will be? I remember some nonsense from computer magazines being posted months before San Andreas came out, which included an interview with Dan Houser where he claimed some bull**** about San Andreas, including that the game couldn't be completed in less than 150 hours and that it would include features like being able to own and operate a casino.

I think maybe Rockstar decided to cut out a lot of stuff from San Andreas rather than miss their publishing deadline.

With another six months to go, a lot of features will be dropped, others added, some tweaked, etc., so I'd take anything, including "exclusive" features about the game, with a hefty dose of salt.


KM.

 

[Robin]

I dont know why but im quite dissapointed that GTA IV is set New York again!... Could they not have gone to any other country!! Actually Japan sounded like a good idea... The graphics look ok but I was in a way expecting more, I hope thats just the bulid at the moment, the people look abit plastic.

hmmm... will wait and have to see more because it just looks like GTA3 with a facelift, but for all we know they could be doing the entire new york and the outskirts aswell (like a GTASA style vast game).

Robin

 

[Jay]

I wonder how accurate it will be? I remember some nonsense from computer magazines being posted months before San Andreas came out, which included an interview with Dan Houser where he claimed some bull**** about San Andreas, including that the game couldn't be completed in less than 150 hours and that it would include features like being able to own and operate a casino.

Hopefully Rockstar has learnt their lesson this time.

I have a feeling this game is much bigger than it appears so far, after all the small clues and a member of a GTA4 forum giving hints and details of the trailer 3 weeks before it came out which ended up completely correct, and the same member giving more subtle hints now, it appears GTAIV will be much more than just Liberty city. Although I don't want to believe it to much and get disappointed later

 

[TS]

Hey, there's a big fanboy war coming on and I'm not in it?! Boo!

Anyway, without reading anything that has been posted here thus far, here's my prediction: GTA4 will have the cities from San Andreas, Liberty City, and Vice City. The PS3 version will have everything on one disc. The 360 version will have each city on a separate disc for a total of three DVD9s. Will it happen? Probably not, but it's still nice to speculate.

I'm not sure Rockstar will include all the cities on the disc, but with the online capabilites of the Xbox 360 and the PS3, I wouldn't be surprised if they had Vice City and San Andreas (the cities) available for download as expansion packs.

I wonder how accurate it will be? I remember some nonsense from computer magazines being posted months before San Andreas came out, which included an interview with Dan Houser where he claimed some bull**** about San Andreas, including that the game couldn't be completed in less than 150 hours and that it would include features like being able to own and operate a casino.

That really pissed me off about SA, I was really looking foward to owning the casino and turns out you just end up robbing one. Hopefully Rockstar doesn't **** up this time and actually say what they're putting in the game and not make up stuff to add to the hype.

 

[Christhedude]

I dont know why but im quite dissapointed that GTA IV is set New York again!... Could they not have gone to any other country!! Actually Japan sounded like a good idea...

Robin

we share the same opinion! with the performance of the ps3 and blu ray disc's it could have been possible to actually create the marjor cities of the world into that game. Maybe New York is just the BEGINNING of the game and we're going to see more of the world maybe

 

[donbenni]

Maybe New York is just the BEGINNING of the game and we're going to see more of the world maybe

👍 That's what i'm thinking too.

In fact the ideal situation would be Liberty City, Vice City and San Andreas all in their updated, expanded, reskinned goodness with the story blowing right out into other countries.

It just seems a bit of a shame that GTA seems to revolve so strongly around 3 cities. GTA IV is a new start to the series so i'd really hope to see something different.

However considering how much nicer LC looks now, it would kick arse to see all 3 cities reworked to that level of detail and inter-weaved GTA 1 stylee.

 

[McLaren]

I dont know why but im quite dissapointed that GTA IV is set New York again!... Could they not have gone to any other country!! Actually Japan sounded like a good idea... The graphics look ok but I was in a way expecting more, I hope thats just the bulid at the moment, the people look abit plastic.

Robin

This isn't the same Liberty City you're thinking of Robin. As one of our members said, GTAIII was a generalization of NYC. There really wasn't that many things represented from NYC in it except the church, Times Squre, Central Park, Stauton Island (though the real name is different), and a little more. It didn't even represent NYC to its fullest in anything.

This one though, will. It's being rumoured (as many things) that we'll get all FIVE boroughs of NYC. I'm pretty sure we didn't even get 3 boroughs in GTAIII in a general form.