GT 6 pre-orders very low

  • Thread starter bigspleen
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BURIAL
There's only one reputable website for these numbers and it's listed several times in this thread and in the results provided, use your head.

And i wouldn't say it's that far off considering you still haven't seemed to figure out where to go to find these facts, here i'll help you out http://www.vgchartz.com/ now do you need me to hold your hand while you do your research?
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The hand-holding might need to take place, since you apparently didn't read the Acceptable Use Policy you agreed to when joining. So here, let me help you:

You will not knowingly post any material that is false, misleading, or inaccurate.
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So, as others have said, if you are making claims, feel free to back them up with actual stats, not random numbers tossed out to aid your own personal viewpoint. That's how these things work; if you make a claim, you back it up, don't accuse others of laziness when you yourself have so little faith in your own statements.

Oh, and drop the attitude.
 
SlipZtrEm
The hand-holding might need to take place, since you apparently didn't read the Acceptable Use Policy you agreed to when joining. So here, let me help you:



So, as others have said, if you are making claims, feel free to back them up with actual stats, not random numbers tossed out to aid your own personal viewpoint. That's how these things work; if you make a claim, you back it up, don't accuse others of laziness when you yourself have so little faith in your own statements.

Oh, and drop the attitude.
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Thanks dad, and what exactly is random about the numbers? Do you believe they were pulled out of thin air, and if so what purpose would that serve? We know preorder numbers for GT6 are unusually low for a GT game, that's not up for debate, you wanted numbers so i provided them, you're on your own from there.
 
BURIAL
Thanks dad, and what exactly is random about the numbers? Do you believe they were pulled out of thin air, and if so what purpose would that serve? We know preorder numbers for GT6 are unusually low for a GT game, that's not up for debate, you wanted numbers so i provided them, you're on your own from there.
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The numbers in this post have sources, then? Yes, I see you used some from VGChartz, a company where the owner himself even says this much about their methods:

The figures on VG Chartz represent the entire market. I obviously don’t collect data for 100 percent of the market, but with the help of a few others behind the scenes we collect a sample of data and use scaling factors derived from analyzing historical data and estimating the extent and bias of our market coverage to arrive at our final figures.
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(source - or just read their methodology page)

The other numbers? Just guessing. So far, there is still no solid source proving that GT6's pre-orders are massively lower than GT5's.

Again, lose the attitude.
 
SlipZtrEm
The numbers in this post have sources, then? Yes, I see you used some from VGChartz, a company where the owner himself even says this much about their methods:



(source - or just read their methodology page)

The other numbers? Just guessing. So far, there is still no solid source proving that GT6's pre-orders are massively lower than GT5's.

Again, lose the attitude.
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I guess it comes down to how much you trust the factual data, honestly would it surprise anyone if the numbers were low? It looks pretty mediocre even by PD standards, a GT5 rehash or better yet what GT5 should have been in the first place.
 
BURIAL
I guess it comes down to how much you trust the factual data, honestly would it surprise anyone if the numbers were low? It looks pretty mediocre even by PD standards, a GT5 rehash or better yet what GT5 should have been in the first place.
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The problem is you've been trying to knock down PD out of spite, when there is plenty to knock PD down for already. Just like many things with GT6, we don't know and it's easier to predict other things but sales do tend to be lower for the follow up edition to the core so I might agree with you that sales could be low, especially when you couple in people afraid to pre-order due to GT5 being horrid.http://www.polyphony.co.jp/english/list.html
 
I think GT6 looks like a good game to play. I plan to get it for christmas.

I personally really liked GT5. I drove third-person view so I can't really hear the bad engine sounds and I loved the driving. I was really enjoying myself. Though I still preferred GT4.

I hope GT6 becomes a success in both Game itself and Sales :).
 
VGChartz can be millions off lifetime sales for some games so it is quite a varied guessing website. Anyway going by figures on there, it is doing quite well. Ahead of Titanfall (Yes I know it comes out a few months later), and Driveclub not even in VGChartz's top 40 USA Pre-Order.

It will be interesting to see how well GT6 does, GT5 did amazingly well. If it can surpass that then that would be quite a feat. I think GT6 would have done really well on PS4 but being on PS3 maximises revenue. Also going on to PS4 won't take so long as foundations have been already built so they can maximise revenue from new platform earlier on than before.

Hopefully the profits from the game and also PS4 being a strong platform for Sony, let PDI grow and achieve great things. Don't think GT series will ever struggle. Only things I can think of is long way into the future if it did struggle, game might have already so much features, quality and content that people will bother less about buying a new one if it is more of the same. That could go for a lot of other games too. Also interests of things like cars and racing might go down in future. Last one I can think of is a crisis situation where all their assets are destroyed. Game quality wise, GT series should be in a very competitive position given how much more resources and high quality assets they already have than most of their competition and that gap will likely grow. Also main competitor is on a weaker platform, should be easier to look a lot better at same resolution and framerate.
 
If we look at the numbers here:

http://www.vgchartz.com/preorders/40076/USA/

and set the dates to 6 weeks before the release of each title we get this result (for the US market):
(P.O. = pre orders)

preorders.jpg


While GT6 has a lot fewer pre orders than GT5 had at the same period, it's also worth noting that it's 1,24x more than FM3 had.

FM3, in turn, had only 0,24x the pre orders of GT5.

Looking at the sales figures in the spreadsheet further down, FM3 actually ended up outselling GT5, and had a sales factor of 54,3 times the pre order numbers, while GT5 had a rather low factor of 12.

FM4 had a lot more pre orders than FM3, but ended up worse than it's predecessor.

What does this mean?

1. We can't really tell much about the final sales from pre order numbers alone.
2. Pre order numbers are probably more of an indicator on pre release hype (which was massive for GT5)
 
One of the reasons why people pre-order is to guarantee that they get some limited edition of the game. Gt5 for example came out not just with one edition but 3. You had the normal game, the signature edition and the collector's edition. I'd imagine lots of people pre-ordered the signature and collector's edition. Not to mention there are not even any special cars for the special packages this time around. Only liveries. I could not find any numbers for how many of the sold gt5 versions were special editions though. But regardless it is probably very safe to say the majority of the sold gt5 copies were standard versions.

Other reason to pre-order is so you can get the game as soon as possible to see what it is like. With gt6 we already know pretty well it is very much like gt5. Instead of getting the game fast to see what it looks like we are now really just looking to see what has small things changed.

I'd be absolutely amazed if gt6 sold well. When even the hardcore fans are still not decided whether they even get the game or not I'd be a lot more cautious when trying to predict the sales. If the hardcore fans are undecided then what are the masses thinking? Even the game news sites have barely registered the coming release of gt6.
 
Farrow
They would be lower if it was a PS4-only game.

As made evident by GT6 being higher up the Amazon sales than FM5.
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Battlefield 4 (Playstation 4 version) has 5x as many preorders as GT6 and is ahead at amazon. I can only imagine GT6's numbers if it were a PS4 title.

Being a launch title for a next gen system wont hurt a game in the long run, especially a system seller like GT that can be bundled with the console down the road.

I still dont understand completely the reasoning for releasing the game on PS3 this late

But one thing is for sure, GT6 is not generating as much hype among the consumers as GT5, and thats reflected in the preorders. Meanwhile Battefield 4 is promoting itself like crazy, with the 'only in battlefield' videos etc, so its rewarded in big preorder numbers. Meanwhile GT6 fans are told to watch a PS advertisement 5m times to see a replay of a car drive around a track.

Also the Forza 3 life time sales have to be misleading. Im sure it was bundled at some point after release, spiking its numbers. Outside of one year GT5 outsold it 2:1 in the US
 
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Earth
Also the Forza 3 life time sales have to be misleading. Im sure it was bundled at some point after release, spiking its numbers. Outside of one year GT5 outsold it 2:1 in the US
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Well, they were released in different years, so they weren't really selling against each other. FM3 had sold the main portion of its copies before GT5 was even released, and then FM4 was released in 2011.
 
bigspleen
Looking at the pre-order charts, gt6 is scary low. Sony will end up regretting putting this on PS3, people wanted to see a marked improvement from GT5, but simply are not seeing it with gt5. Sony would have been better off letting PD take 1-2 years and really put out a killer next gen racer. instead, people are just seeing it as what it is, what GT5 should have been, which is not good enough.

Sales of G6 will be by far the lowest in the series history. What was sony and PD thinking? They cannot do anymore with the PS3.
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This doesn't mean that GT 6 will have lower sales numbers, it's only a matter of time when people start buying this game. GT5 is old game today, and GT 6 is only a small improvement. From videos and pictures i can tell it's basically the same game with few new cars like Pagani Huayra and some new race tracks. Ill still buy it because platinum this game might be nice challenge.

GT5 sure was a challenge so ill hope Sony won't screw this up by unlocking rare rewards like carbon X2010 for golding Vettel Challenges. I'm counting for less bad decision's from sony.
 
How can you see GT6 as a same game? Did you even try the demo? It felt different yet it was only a demo, the menus are faster, graphics are better, new cars, new suspension system, improved online, new tracks, wow how it can be the "same" game?

PD supported GT5 more than any other game I've seen, even if they released the game early it's Sony's fault. I can see them supporting GT6 the same way they did with 5. If you see GT6 as the same game don't even think about spending 60$ on a game
 
ussr
GT5 sure was a challenge so ill hope Sony won't screw this up by unlocking rare rewards like carbon X2010 for golding Vettel Challenges. I'm counting for less bad decision's from sony.
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It's incredibly unlikely Sony had any say in that particular decision - one which you'll find plenty of people that don't agree with it being a poor one, either.
 
ussr
GT5 sure was a challenge so ill hope Sony won't screw this up by unlocking rare rewards like carbon X2010 for golding Vettel Challenges. I'm counting for less bad decision's from sony.
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I can understand an issue with the free X cars they sent out but how is giving a rare reward for completely a very hard challenge (unless you cheat) an issue, exactly?
 
Waheed
How can you see GT6 as a same game? Did you even try the demo? It felt different yet it was only a demo, the menus are faster, graphics are better, new cars, new suspension system, improved online, new tracks, wow how it can be the "same" game?
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The question evidently becomes just how much better. We already have a pretty good assumption the sounds are still going to be horrible. Ai probably sucks really bad still as well.

Also I'd not be so believing about pd claims to have completely redone with physics. Sure the academy demo drove better than gt5 but to me it wasn't a night and day difference and it is not that gt5 was even bad. It wasn't bad at all. But in the end the change between gt5 and gt6 does seem more like fine tuning. Better yes but not really that much if they have really done new physics for it like they make their marketing claim.

It is fine to already think gt6 is the greatest game ever. I don''t care if you think that way. But if really don't see gt6 as being just more polished gt5 then I don't really know why? I think gt6 being so close to gt5 in every way is a major problem for gt6 and it will show in the sales as well.

Waheed
If you see GT6 as the same game don't even think about spending 60$ on a game
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This is pretty much what some of us are thinking. And the topic being the pre-orders of gt6 then surely that suspicion will also affect the amount of pre-orders.
 
I'm trying to convince my dad to pre-order. I want that SRT Viper and that C7 bad :drool:

The game has most of my needs covered, jaggie smoke is supposedly fixed, it looks prettier, making shots in photomode better than last time, more accurate depiction of machine dynamics and interesting new courses.
 
hyyperactive
Also I'd not be so believing about pd claims to have completely redone with physics. Sure the academy demo drove better than gt5 but to me it wasn't a night and day difference and it is not that gt5 was even bad. It wasn't bad at all. But in the end the change between gt5 and gt6 does seem more like fine tuning. Better yes but not really that much if they have really done new physics for it like they make their marketing claim.
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Wait what? Did you really play the same demo as I did? The new physics was massively different to the point that I had to completely rethink my driving style.

I won't touch the question about preorder figuresbut I just can't see how you couldn't feel very much different in physics. ^^
 
Phouchg
Wait what? Did you really play the same demo as I did? The new physics was massively different to the point that I had to completely rethink my driving style.

I won't touch the question about preorder figuresbut I just can't see how you couldn't feel very much different in physics. ^^
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Like I said. Not a night and day difference. It is more similar step that happened between forza 3 and forza 4 for example. But less than happened between rfactor and rfactor2. Yes the academy demo was better than gt5 but it was still very similar. The skyline felt just downright weird and really bad just like it does in gt5 (huge understeer, random snap oversteer, unstable, no sense of grip). The rwd nissan was still understeery which is typical for gt5. But less understeery than in gt5 perhaps. I did quite a few laps around motegi in that car and I got within 3s of the world's best times. Not near the top but definitely enough to have an opinion about it.

I hope I'm wrong! Of course I want gt6 to be amazing and the improved physics is definitely one of my favourite parts about gt6. I'm just not convinced there is a huge difference. And I'm honestly concerned whether the average gt player will even notice the difference. One bad thing that can happen to gt6 is to have lots of people posting in the internet that it is just gt5 with few more cars and tracks. That will definitely hurt the sales if it happens.
 
HarVee
So you're telling me an entirely different physics engine, lighting engine, and rendering engine could be added to GT5 through downloadable content? Wow, great logic you've got there buddy.
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Sigh, we always say those things before launch... My argument was more about content. But if you want to be literal then actually yes, a lighting model, physics, and suspension modeling could in fact be updated. 2.0 of GT 5 did that with shadows and physics both online and off.

But not a renderer, and the first evidence is the drift video with the non blocky smoke. Tesilation isn't a new technology and arguably would have been a stronger announcement along side dynamic damage... GT has always had some degree of tesilation as its how they remove the angulare polys most obvious in the wheel wells of standard cars.

The academy demo was adjusted physics but all that body role is suspension modeling more or if even anything to do with the physics system beyond a simple weight transfer multiplier, on top of the core physics system as its unique to each car (ie not core to the system)

Forza is a game with physics but no real suspension modeling for example. And the leading reason they have no open wheel cars... Prior to 5.

Lets not loose our common sence and go all fan boy on me, nor mistake me as being anything other than starving for more information, just like you.

Btw this stuff is being discussed in greater detail elsewhere on the forum. Feel free to reference my history and get more perspective.
 
Lawndart
But if you want to be literal then actually yes, a lighting model, physics, and suspension modeling could in fact be updated. 2.0 of GT 5 did that with shadows and physics both online and off.
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You've missed the "entirely different" part of my post. They weren't utilizing an entirely new engine with the updates done to GT5, they only made tweaks to the existing one(s).
 
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HarVee
You've missed the "entirely different" part of my post. They weren't utilizing an entirely new engine with the updates done to GT5, they only made tweaks to the existing one(s).
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Ok... Would you care to define "entirely different"? As its the only supporting words your leaning on and also happens to be shrouded in ambiguity. i.e. nothing more than provoking argument, losing context for the point of the statement, and just trying to make a point that isn't at all relevant to the topic.

Think content for context, not literally as your likely not an expert on said "entirely different" criteria.

Or lets simply chalk this up to semantics, removing the catalyst to argue wording and move on to more constructive dialog. I'm here to learn about GT 6, share what i know as a game developer that some might find interesting, not debate with Internet guy.
 
Low or high, how does one's pre-order affect the other? I pre-ordered, never once did I take into account others' decisions, order numbers, etc. I just know I will get my game.

Do you feel if they are low, Sony/PD will not support the game as much? Generally curious, because I see this sort of topic even with PS4/Xbox One. Since when did people take these metrics into account in purchasing anything? (unless you are a shareholder)
 

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