GTHD vs FOrza2 Video on Gametrailers

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo HD' started by RedOak, May 18, 2007.

  1. Gt5dk

    Gt5dk

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    i agree with joey D 300 cars and alot damage, that takes time, but from experience it takes about 8 hours just to create a good car with no damage.

    but if they come out with 700 cars, then don't get ur hopes up to high it can be s*** as hell
     
  2. waxer

    waxer

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    Would they actually have to model each car fully for damage with the restrictions in place from manufacturers. Every car has to damage the same way or they would never allow it. Wouldnt they simply allow a few items to fall of then the rest is all texture/shading work. Did anyone else see that leak ages ago with starwars psp etc. I think it was mercenaries tech demos that showed a car bonet all crumpled up.

    I cant wait to check out the damage in dirt.
     
  3. -Cheezman-

    -Cheezman-

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    Just to note for you guys.

    Active Damage means no pre-damaged model needs to be made. The game calculates damage and then models it in real time..... It's now at the point where everything is represented in numbers, and it can calculate how much damages occurs with a certain weight, at a certain speed, in a certain area, with many other parameters.

    Real car manufacturers use this technology to get an idea of how a car will hold up in a crash before they do real world crash testing. This same concept can be dumbed down, and applied to video games. Now, it's not 100% accurate, or foolproof, but, in a video game, it would do just fine.

    But chances of GT5 having visual damage are slim to none, none of the others had damage.
     
  4. Joey D

    Joey D Premium

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    I would like to see you make the PS3 compute damage without having any clue what the car looks like with damage on it.

    At some point you need to model the wrecked cars.
     
  5. MasterGT

    MasterGT

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    Some of you are not listening.

    Computers can model "what if..." damage and render the results. They do this for structures like bridges and for airplanes, etc. without having to physically test the actual hardware itself. So long as PD uses this type of damage system in GT5 (and no-one is saying they are or they aren't at this point), then they don't have to physically set up each car's damage. Just let the console figure out what kind of a mess you made of their beautiful cars.

    Also, remember that one basic difference between Forza 2 cars and GT cars is that PD is laser-scanning the cars now. Forza's cars are not laser-scanned, this time around. Now, one question is will all GT5 cars be laser-scanned? If they are, don't expect 700 GT5 cars.

    At the average rate of 1 car per day, that would take just about two years (minus weekends and holidays) to physically scan them (not tidy them up and finalize them, inside and out), but some of these rare cars are spread around the world, so could PD possibly scan an average of 1 or two per day? Maybe... maybe not.

    Cheers,

    MasterGT
     
  6. DuckRacer

    DuckRacer Premium

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    Honestly, these Forza 2 vs GT5 comparisons are moot. GT5 is still about 2 years away, so Forza 3 is the one that should be compared to.

    For the FM2 vs GTHD comparisons, those are moot as well since there's no damage, cars on track, etc etc in GT.

    McLaren hit the nail on the head.
     
  7. Gonz013

    Gonz013

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    This half-arsed comparison between a demo and a full game makes no sense.
     
  8. Jay

    Jay Premium

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    Active damage type system (forgot what they actual call this) is starting to be used in upcoming PC games but for objects rather than cars, for example wood and other material no longer being pre-modeled/rendered when it gets shot at or hit but splits and damages uniquely every time.

    Personally I can't imagine the PS3 (or any current mainstream hardware) being about to handle 10 or even 5 other ai cars aswell as your own car creating active damage on the fly, especially with the level of detail the cars have at the moment.
     
  9. panjandrum

    panjandrum

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    Unfortunately, there does not appear to be anything on the market that directly competes in terms of overall features with Gran Turismo 4, let alone GT5. I've looked around a *lot*, so if you know of a true sim that has the following features, please let me know, as I would be very interested in trying it out...

    1) Real cars, lots of them, especially supercars and classic road cars.

    2) Real life tracks (must include "the ring"!)

    3) A decent attempt at real physics. Doesn't have to be perfect, I would settle for reasonably good, like GT4.

    I just can't find a PC sim that does those things, even finding 2 of the three is proving difficult. Unfortunately most of the PC sims seem to feature an limited number of mostly fictional cars on a limited number of mostly fictional tracks.
     
  10. Sonzilla

    Sonzilla

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    Same here. lol



    It's funny how in Forza 2 every time a car hits another car no matter what part of the car it hits some how the windows shatters. :tdown:

    Another thing I noticed was that even the race cars seem to have the shattering glass symptom. Last time I checked real race cars use polycarbonate windows and are shatter proof.

    Forza 2 I will buy and play because simply GT5 isn't out yet. I'm sure I'll still manage to have fun especially online.:tup:
     
  11. godzilla_GTR

    godzilla_GTR

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    gtr2 has the ring, good physic's and reall car's(not road car's though:() do a google for it...
     
  12. RedOak

    RedOak

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    Dude, that's complaining about the most insignificant of details. Just like the "no rear lights" in GT...

    Come on
     
  13. Sonzilla

    Sonzilla

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    I just stated a fact, like it or not that's your problem.

    IMO that is indeed a major flaw and definitely out weighs no reverse lights in GT4 on a good old PS2. Complete disregard by Forza on real car crash dynamics. I mean come on the windows are shattering on a Supposedly Real RACE CAR. How could you not find that hilarious.:lol:
     
  14. Joey D

    Joey D Premium

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    I don't think Forza ever really claimed to have real damage...they claimed to just have damage in general.
     
  15. McLaren

    McLaren Premium

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    That's not true at all. I've been bumped and hit, and my windows have never shattered unless it's a big wreck.
    The road cars problem is not a fact. That's just you complaining over nothing that's not even true unless you're ramming cars at 100Mph while they do 50Mph.
     
  16. zReHmz

    zReHmz

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    I don't think you've seen the forza 2 commercials floating around tv yet.
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=Pa-Yf5jPW-Y
    "They're no different than any real car"
     
  17. Sonzilla

    Sonzilla

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    So you agree the windows shatter.

    So explain to me in this video at the beginning the Lambo is traveling aprox 70 mph and hits another car not significantly hard yet the windows driver side shatters and the rest cracks.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8SvtiTndDQ


    This one at around 35sec in the video the Rx8 simply shatters another car from a mild hit on the side.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ye92FaqsEp4


    Another video perfect example of the C6R cracking not one but all windows :dunce:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWcJH9leXdY&mode=related&search=

    No complaints just stating the fact.
    Remember it's just a game facts are facts just accept it and move on.
     
  18. RedBaron

    RedBaron

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    Even GT4 looks much more "live" than FM2, which still looks like "just another game". It's about car modelling, geometry, position on road, how suspension travel look, textures, sizes of things etc. Kazunori is simply number one in this aspect.
     
  19. speedfreak69

    speedfreak69

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    I played the DIRT demo today and I must say I was amazed at it's damage system, and I'm still crashing the poor scuby just to see how it crumples and falls apart!:eek: :dopey:
    On the other hand, I get about 25fps(options maxed@1280x960), and considering my rig has core2duo@3250,very fast cl4mem@900 and 8800gts, I'm not very happy...:nervous: Also, the new TOCA will use the same engine so this are not good news...:guilty: Although it looks rather next-genishly good, the looks do take their toll.
    As for GT5, cars already look good enough and so do the backgrounds, but I'm not that happy with immediate sorroundings like the near the track objects,grass,greenery, that kind of thing...sound is tragic, physics almost there,hopefully damage gets in and so on,but I really hope they gonna get it all done properly by the time it comes out.
     
  20. Gabkicks

    Gabkicks

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    maybe on consoles... but not number1 over all games trying to simulate cars.
     
  21. Diversion

    Diversion

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    You can't compare GTHD to Forza2.. I'd say GTHD looks as good as it does because it's able to use all CPU resources on a single car model.. and whatever is left over is used on the environment (and unfortunately not even on sound). If Forza2 was a single-car environment like GTHD is, I would garauntee it would look as good if not better (since it's a finalized game) than GTHD. Wait for GT5 or more than 1 car on the track to compare the two and then you can argue about which game is more polished off in terms of graphics.
     
  22. Scaff

    Scaff Staff Emeritus

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    While you are quite right we will have to wait to look at this in more detail it is unlikely that PD would release even a demo that utilised higher levels of detail than the finished article will have; I also find it very, very doubtful that it uses all the PS3s CPU resources in the demo.

    The sound issue is another one that will be difficult to judge yet, given that the demo itself is rather small in size (600 meg or so), it may simply be that they are hideously compressed at present (well fingers crossed on that one).

    Regards

    Scaff
     
  23. Digital-Nitrate

    Digital-Nitrate Premium

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    I agree. Not only that, but just visual damage with little to no impact on performance is meaningless. In that case, I'd just as well wish there was no visual damage at all, and have the developers focus more of their attention and dedicate more processing power on driving physics.

    Unless they are trying to make an arcade game, the whole point of damage is to have it effect the way the car performs, thus making the races more realistic and to make the lap and race times finally in line with real world racing.

    Just watching the video clips and the trailer linked in the first post, any of those impacts where nothing more than the windows getting cracked, would have immediately resulted in a DNF for those cars involved.

    I'm not saying real damage should be mandatory, but it really should be an option for those wanting a realistic racing scenario, and to be able to compare clean race times with other players who also chose to race using realistic damage effects... not just visual effects.
     
  24. Joey D

    Joey D Premium

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    In Forza if you crash your vehicle the car's performance is greatly affected. You can't steer, the turbo goes, etc. If your car is to banged up it will not move just like in real life and you will have to quit the race and try again. You can change the damage in the game to different levels so that is why it may be different in different video clips.

    But once again many people have said it, it is pointless to compare GTHD and Forza 2 because one is nothing more then a demo while the other is a full game. Also you'll never be able to compare Forza 2 with GT5 because GT5 probably won't be out till the later part of 08, by that time who knows what new things will have come out for the next gen systems.
     
  25. Stoffinator

    Stoffinator

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    Yes I agree. I think Forza looks pretty damn good but it reminds me more of Toca then GT. And GT HD still looks better in graphics then Forza 2.
     
  26. Kryz11

    Kryz11 Premium

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    i got a 360,... not using it much, after this overated game Gears of war and overpriced parts and short overpriced games i lost hope in xbox... it only collects dust waiting for halo 3... so i am not going to buy forza 2,.. after playing the first one and the forza 2 demo... game is not what i expected... about the video.. hmm GT HD graphics looks much better
     
  27. Joey D

    Joey D Premium

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    You aren't looking hard enough if you can't find good xbox games. Every system out right now has at least 5 good games.
     
  28. matherto

    matherto

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    Theres one glaring bad part to Forza, the lighting on the cars is bloody awful. For example. the first part with the Corvette C6. The back of the car is completely pitch black, and then the top surface around the back window is so shiny its like they've made it out of chrome, it looks terrible. Not to mention the horrible looking wheels in motion, they look like theyve been painted on and then blurred. GT:HD definately looks better
     
  29. Kryz11

    Kryz11 Premium

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    i have few games for my xbox, they were all blast for few days ... but i really dont like the other games that much, nothing interesting is comming out in my opinion.. i think ill have to say for the PS3... hmm only games im looking for is ninja gaiden, GTA4, GT5, metal gear solid, FF, tekken, and maybe other one or 2 titles... same goes with 360.. maybe other then halo 3, i will get one or 2 more games.....

    i mostly play PC games right now, and im rally having the most blast... me and my brother are building a new PC over summer soon :) so i cant wait.
    as for racing... im done with GT4 and GT HD... im playing GTr2 and rfactor a lot on the g25....
     
  30. godzilla_GTR

    godzilla_GTR

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    try out live for speed;) It's great fun with the G25...