GTP Cool Wall: 2014+ BMW M3 (F80)

[Kent]

I don't care about other people's opinions.
SZ.

Nearly a perfect car in a world where I don't worry about price of ownership or purchase price. The only think I might want in place of an M3 is an ATS-V.

Though seeing the esteemed motor journalists of the GTP saying this car doesn't drive as well as it should makes me wonder.

 

[R5]

I'm having difficulties with this one. Not for how it drives, but for how it looks.

It's a bit too Q car for my liking. It does look good, but just a tad... underwhelming for what it is, even with the M-additions.

My lowest rating in a while, cool. Borderline Meh, but I just couldn't rate it that low.

 

[SVT Cobra GT]

I'd be really surprised if the attitude of, or towards, the 1980's yuppies that swaggered into BMW showrooms and slapped down their cash for an E30 M3 is any different to their modern counterparts. If you're going to run with the BMW driving tosser stereotype, then you've got the same tossers to thank for the success of the M3 in the first place, because they're the ones actually buying them - in that respect, I don't see that the F80 M3 can be considered any less cool than previous gen. The people who pick up M3's - whichever generation - 2nd, 3rd, 4th hand certainly aren't much cooler, at least none of the ones I met.

Whilst you have a point on the '80s yuppies buying them in the first place, the motorsport and motoring press would have brought their attention to it by it's abilities on the road and track.
To me the only cool M3s are the E30 (although that's now debatable due to the stance crowd) and the E46 GTR models as they are super rare. Once the silly stance nonsense wears off and people move onto something more stupid, the E36 models will become cool as the generation after the F80 will be released.

 

[MatskiMonk]

Whilst you have a point on the '80s yuppies buying them in the first place, the motorsport and motoring press would have brought their attention to it by it's abilities on the road and track.
To me the only cool M3s are the E30 (although that's now debatable due to the stance crowd) and the E46 GTR models as they are super rare. Once the silly stance nonsense wears off and people move onto something more stupid, the E36 models will become cool as the generation after the F80 will be released.

Fair enough.

Whilst the F8x models are being run pretty close, if not bettered, by some of their competition in the motoring press, Chris Harris did a pretty good comparison of the M3 to it's predecessors -> https://grrc.goodwood.com/road/driv...eryone-beating-new-bmw-m3#BwgBizEoM0jvVTV3.97

 

[C-ZETA]

The M3 has never really interested me at all (with the notable exception of the M3 GTR). This has done absolutely nothing to change that. In fact, I think it's made it even more boring in my eyes.

Uncool.

 

[homeforsummer]

Gotta leave room for the competition package

Or even the M2.

But then BMW didn't make the E46 M3 disappointing just because there was a CSL in the works. The M3/M4 is certainly fast, and they look good, but that's about the extent of them feeling like products from M Division.

I think what disappointed me the most were the things that an M car should get absolutely spot on - steering feel and throttle response. Instead there's this weird, gloopy feeling to the steering and the sort of wait-wait-wham surge to the throttle that makes driving something with that much torque more intimidating than fun.

Not that lack of steering feel makes it uncool. People driving around thinking they're god's gift because there's an M badge and four farty tailpipes on the back makes it uncool.

 

[Kent]

Or even the M2.



Not that lack of steering feel makes it uncool. People driving around thinking they're god's gift because there's an M badge and four farty tailpipes on the back makes it uncool.

Replace "farty tailpipes" with hybrid tech/ hybrid badge and your statement becomes an example of why so many people would argue the insight and prius are uncool.

That's part of why I always judge these cool walls without regard to what I think other people think.

 

[TexRex]

I always judge these cool walls without regard to what I think other people think.

👍

 

[huskeR32]

Uncool. Not because of the drivers, as I find the drivers of regular 3- and 5-series BMWs to be far more irritating than those of the M cars.

No, this is uncool because of

I think what disappointed me the most were the things that an M car should get absolutely spot on - steering feel and throttle response. Instead there's this weird, gloopy feeling to the steering and the sort of wait-wait-wham surge to the throttle that makes driving something with that much torque more intimidating than fun.

It seems like the things that made the E46 M such a desirable car are slowly being lost in the

focus on POWER.

M needs to remember why their cars used to stand out so much above the sea of heavy, over-powered AMG and Audi RS models.

 

[MatskiMonk]

Or even the M2.

But then BMW didn't make the E46 M3 disappointing just because there was a CSL in the works.

M2 and the E46 CSL are limited production cars, BMW didn't/won't have to worry about the E46 CSL cannibalizing the standard M3's sales, or the M2 cannibalizing M3/M4 sales to much since they're controlling the numbers... so they had no need to under engineer the base M-cars in question. But, from what I've seen if you want your M6 or M5 to be the way they should, you need to pony up for the comp pack.. no doubt when the CP hits for the F8x models it'll be the same story. If they've under engineered the M3/M4 it's because of this (in my opinion).

Edit: @huskeR32 @Stotty they've not lost anything in the pursuit of power, they focused more than ever before on making the car lighter with minimal power gains... If they've lost anything it's in the pursuit of efficiency and emissions. You only need to check the M3s numbers against its competition to see they've opted out of horse power wars, and they did it before Audi or Mercedes.

 

[Clark]

Would be cooler if the carbon roof was painted body colour.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

A disappointment.

Uncool.

 

[Tornado]

That's part of why I always judge these cool walls without regard to what I think other people think.

Which would perhaps hold some more meaning if you didn't so frequently draw attention to it.

 

[Kent]

Which would perhaps hold some more meaning if you didn't so frequently draw attention to it.

The beauty of it all is that it doesn't need to have meaning for you, only for me.

Then again, the same logic could be said of those who constantly make it clear they love a car but think it's uncool only because of what other people think.

 

[CTznOfTime]

Solid cool !

There are cars out there that are much cooler than this.

 

[Tornado]

The beauty of it all is that it doesn't need to have meaning for you, only for me.

Which makes it all the more odd that you keep congratulating yourself for not caring what others think. Out loud. One would ordinarily think if you were actually being some sort of Cool Wall voting maverick, all of the self-aggrandizement:

I don't care about other people's opinions.
SZ.

That's part of why I always judge these cool walls without regard to what I think other people think.

Flame on!
SZ.

I don't care what people think of me as I drive it, nor do I care what people driving it think of me or themselves.

Solid cool.

More over, as time goes by I've learned that the cool wall is a joke and more often than not a way to make great cars uncool and lame cars the bee's knees.

Not grading based on my opinion of other people's opinions of another person's opinion of my opinion of this car's coolness.

If I were to judge based on TG cool wall standards relative to the USA (my home, you know, where things are in context to my culture, etc etc ), it would end up in the meh to almost uncool.
Thank god I vote based on my opinion and not my opinion of what other people's opinions would be. (what a bunch of pretentious crap that is )

I don't know, I answer these threads based on what I think of a car, not what I think other people think of the car.

Would be unnecessary. Since, you know, you don't care.


Instead, all repeatedly reminding people that you don't care about stereotypes or other's opinions or popular perceptions of things (except when you do, of course) does is just make you look like someone who occasionally wants to be oh so edgy by going against whatever you perceive the grain to be. Particularly when you also post things like this:

I say seriously Uncool because racecar and my views are based on seriously uncool things because racecar. Oh wait, sorry confusing myself for a sheep...

SZ.

Which is incidentally the exact opposite of not caring.

 

[MatskiMonk]

I went Cool, because I don't care if people think I care or not whether they care, 'cus that's how I roll...

Actually, I think in principle it's great car. Glad it's got an I6, I think it looks good, I like the focus on the weight rather than the power, and despite peoples disappointment, I'm sure it's still rather a good car - my opinion is similar to Harris's, people measure M3's against their idea of an M3, and the more of an icon the M3 name becomes, the more disappointed people will become - no matter if the car gets quantifiably better with each generation.

With that in mind, I only went cool because while my passion is for the product and the company, rather than the image and the brand, I'm not immune to noticing the two people I know who have one, are kinda... well tosserish. That and the fact it divided the enthusiast community (more than normal), which has lead to hours for me reading some really bone-headed posts on the internet.

 

[Kent]

Which makes it all the more odd that you keep congratulating yourself for not caring what others think. Out loud. One would ordinarily think if you were actually being some sort of Cool Wall voting maverick, all of the self-aggrandizement:


Would be unnecessary. Since, you know, you don't care.


Instead, all repeatedly reminding people that you don't care about stereotypes or other's opinions or popular perceptions of things (except when you do, of course) does is just make you look like someone who occasionally wants to be oh so edgy by going against whatever you perceive the grain to be. Particularly when you also post things like this:


Which is incidentally the exact opposite of not caring.

I'm guessing you wouldn't be surprised if I told you I don't care much about your judgement of my posting history.

That said, I can tell you definitely care about my post history. I appreciate your attention to my opinions.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

If each generation of M3 has been primarily owned by tossers, where did the M3's good name come from? And don't say motorsport, because it's been a long-time since the M3 was dominant on the race track.

3 years ago wasn't that long ago.

SU cause of performance, I'd say they're not focused enough and rather make their way in a similar way they have since the 90s, a name that people who want to look important to others will go and put money down on. If you want to look like the supreme life of the party and obnoxious yet still not perform, you buy the M version instead of the lower models.

 

[MatskiMonk]

3 years ago wasn't that long ago.

Depends on your definition of dominance, and to certain degree which side of the Atlantic you are on, but for me the 320 very much outshone the M3 for displaying BMWs Motorsport credentials. Either way, the E92 did nowhere near as much to defend the M3 name as the E30 did to create it.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Depends on your definition of dominance, and to certain degree which side of the Atlantic you are on, but for me the 320 very much outshone the M3 for displaying BMWs Motorsport credentials. Either way, the E92 did nowhere near as much to defend the M3 name as the E30 did to create it.

How so, it won the 24 hours at the Ring in 2010, nearly won Spa until a break down right before the finish, won important ILMC races. Then you have DTM where the E92 was the silhouette car and basically the driving point to say this is where the M comes from, as they won their first time back in 20 years. Then 2011 in the ALMS they won overall and several races, and nearly won 2012 overall season only to lose to the team in my avatar. Seems like it won on both sides of the Atlantic where it counted.

Car was a thorn in the side of many and did it not that long ago, and it helped bring forth an even more waivered monstrosity in its wake...the Z4 GTE/GTLM.

But yeah I guess you have a point it does depend on your definition of dominance, sure it isn't the same domination as certain teams get in F1. However, it is the type of domination that gets it noticed just enough to make people think M cars are derivations of their "successful" racing counterparts, which really is the point.

 

[TheCracker]

But yeah I guess you have a point it does depend on your definition of dominance, sure it isn't the same domination as certain teams get in F1. However, it is the type of domination that gets it noticed just enough to make people think M cars are derivations of their "successful" racing counterparts, which really is the point.

So, as has been said before i'm sure, 'M' now stands for Marketing, not Motorsport.

 

[Roo]

I'm guessing you wouldn't be surprised if I told you I don't care much about your judgement of my posting history.

If you genuinely didn't care, you wouldn't post about it at all. You'd just vote and move on. I suspect the reason @Tornado made the post he did was not because of what you actually type, it's to demonstrate that by posting 'I don't care about other people's opinions' you're lying.

Similarly, if you genuinely don't care about what I have to say, you won't reply to this.

 

[MatskiMonk]

How so, it won the 24 hours at the Ring in 2010, nearly won Spa until a break down right before the finish, won important ILMC races. Then you have DTM where the E92 was the silhouette car and basically the driving point to say this is where the M comes from, as they won their first time back in 20 years. Then 2011 in the ALMS they won overall and several races, and nearly won 2012 overall season only to lose to the team in my avatar. Seems like it won on both sides of the Atlantic where it counted.

From the European perspective, the 320Si won multiple national and international championships, some for consecutive years, and competed in, and won far more races than the M3. Googling wins in the FIA WTCC alone, the E90 320Si/TC racked up 51 race wins and two world championship titles, add to that race wins and championship titles in the BTCC and STCC, as well as many race wins and championship titles in ADAC Procar, Asian, Danish, Russian and Portuguese Touring car championships. Not trying to decry what the E92 M3 achieved, it was successful, but I wouldn't have classed it as dominant, and for me the lineage of the E30 M3 is far better held up by the E90 320 than the E92 M3.

and it helped bring forth an even more waivered monstrosity in its wake...the Z4 GTE/GTLM.

Don't hate the player ...

So, as has been said before i'm sure, 'M' now stands for Marketing, not Motorsport.

Yep you're right,...

...it has been said before, just pasted that into google and got 1,170,000 hits.

Seriously though, I'm not sure we'll see an F8x based racing car (and no, the M4 DTM doesn't count), and so far we've seen no real effort at an F30 touring car. This generation will have the least convincing motorsport link that the 3 series has had since, well, ever... probably -- but that never stopped the 1M, M5 or M6.

 

[TheCracker]

Seriously though, I'm not sure we'll see an F8x based racing car (and no, the M4 DTM doesn't count), and so far we've seen no real effort at an F30 touring car. This generation will have the least convincing motorsport link that the 3 series has had since, well, ever... probably -- but that never stopped the 1M, M5 or M6.

I'm surprised WSR haven't adopted the F36 shell for the BTCC, given the advantages in aerodynamics the lower Passat CC has provided for BMR.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

So, as has been said before i'm sure, 'M' now stands for Marketing, not Motorsport.

Yeah basically the only thing I agree on about the entire thing.

From the European perspective, the 320Si won multiple national and international championships, some for consecutive years, and competed in, and won far more races than the M3. Googling wins in the FIA WTCC alone, the E90 320Si/TC racked up 51 race wins and two world championship titles, add to that race wins and championship titles in the BTCC and STCC, as well as many race wins and championship titles in ADAC Procar, Asian, Danish, Russian and Portuguese Touring car championships. Not trying to decry what the E92 M3 achieved, it was successful, but I wouldn't have classed it as dominant, and for me the lineage of the E30 M3 is far better held up by the E90 320 than the E92 M3.

Well M cars aren't sold in Europe only. Also for the class it raced in it was quite somewhat dominant in what it did for as soon as it was introduced. The importance isn't what car BMW motorsports is known for but how the M cars do in motorsports, people care more about the upper class like DTM and ILMC or even 24 of Nurb more so then regional BTCC and STCC. And even if they did care that's not the point, the point is to show that a car claiming to be an "M3" won high profile races and thus should be bought by the general public who want a car that replicates that performance for the street. But as others said M is more of a marketing exercise anyways than it is an outright motorsports effort.

Don't hate the player ...

I don't, since the player was denied the entire game when they brought them.

 

[Kent]

If you genuinely didn't care, you wouldn't post about it at all. You'd just vote and move on. I suspect the reason @Tornado made the post he did was not because of what you actually type, it's to demonstrate that by posting 'I don't care about other people's opinions' you're lying.

Similarly, if you genuinely don't care about what I have to say, you won't reply to this.

The "I don't care" sentiment has been applied far too generally, it only applies to opinions of "cool cars."

I do, very much care about what people think of my posting here on the GTP. For that very same reason it is important that I respond to you and that I make it clear- I do not allow other people to change my 'vote.'
It's nothing personal, and I mean that regarding @Tornado as well...

With this coolwall I see many people each week (sorry to be so vague about it), giving a reason why a car is SU based on other people... This crowd, that crowd, various stereotypes and prejudices. When I have said 'I.D.C.' in these coolwall threads, it has always been to make the point that my idea of cool doesn't go with peer pressure, it's simply what I like, not what someone else likes.

Regarding this F80 M3.
I haven't driven it.
Does that mean I shouldn't vote about this car being cool?
Otherwise I'd have to say again it's supercool. Amazing power and sound from a car that looks good (imho).

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Amazing ...sound

Are we looking listening to the same car?

 

[Kent]

Are we looking listening to the same car?

I actually like that arcade car sound.

 

[edawg456]

Overrated car by an overrated car company. Seriously uncool.