How Realistic is the Gran Turismo Series ?

[Earth]

We want realism, not just difficulty.
Noobs to racing video game cars can't jump into any racing game and start clicking off competitive lap times. GT is not the only game where it's not easy to drive them fast. What we want is REALISM.

And you should stfu about fun and all, cause that's your opinion. I find it more rewarding to drive a car on the edge and get good lap times. You really have to be easy on the trottle and all. For us simracers GT arcade physics are boring because you don't have to be careful.

You dont have to be careful in GT? Have you every tried the S8 license test with no aids in the GT1? Is that easy? You dont have to be careful in GT? Well, if your the type who dont mind grass cutting and wall banging then I guess you dont have to be carefull. Theres more but i havent played the game in ages so I dont remember much.

So if GT had physics that forced you to be easy on the throttle it would be a sim? Is that all that is required?

 

[Pak]

You dont have to be careful in GT? Have you every tried the S8 license test with no aids in the GT1? Is that easy? You dont have to be careful in GT? Well, if your the type who dont mind grass cutting and wall banging then I guess you dont have to be carefull. Theres more but i havent played the game in ages so I dont remember much.

So if GT had physics that forced you to be easy on the throttle it would be a sim? Is that all that is required?

Thanks for shutting the **** up about the fun factor.
READ READ READ, realism is NOT difficulty. If GT had physics that were realistic(not just difficult) it would be a sim. That's what I want. Going easy on the throttle in a 600BHP powered beast is one element you need for a sim. When I said 'GT arcade physics are boring because you don't have to be careful' I was talking about throttle control in slow corners. You need to be careful in ridge racer, nfsu and burnout too if you want to avoid crashing into something. Are those games realistic? NO!

 

[Dave A]

C. Sure, it is easier to drive GT cars. Is it easy to drive them fast? No

Yes, well 99% of the cars in GT3 I found far too easy to drive fast, I only have to fight the odd car like the Speed 12 with no ASM or TCS.

 

[GTXLR]

Yes, well 99% of the cars in GT3 I found far too easy to drive fast, I only have to fight the odd car like the Speed 12 with no ASM or TCS.

GT4P already shows that the handling is a lot different this time round Live, especially if you use The DFP, obviously the physics arent real life (which would invlove most everyone spinning off after the slightest little error, in anything more powerfull than a streeet car), but they are a good interpritation of how it should be, which makes for a more entertaining game.
just imagine how long it would take to complete the 200 championships in first place, with total real world physics.
Example A Super license race in a LM car 5 laps of the ring, against 5 equal PS2 cars that hardly make an error.
We are not Race car drivers, we just think we are! and PD help us pander to that notion. 👍

And Just what do you consider fast?
Are you able to come close to GT.DE times for example.
I consider myself to be fast, yet can only compare against those times in the 30 to 40th region.

 

[Kaniyodrift]

Realism in racing games is consists of many aspects besides handling. Gran Turismo series has the best overall points in all aspects - that's why it's THE BEST AND MOST REALISTIC DRIVING SIMULATOR.

Sure there are games that do one or two aspects better than GT, like graphics (technically), fun factor and ricing in NFSU; handling and sound in GTR, rally in CMR etc. But those examples fall short on other aspects. I'm not gonna dig into those for NFSU for obvious reasons. GTR might have ultra realistic (or so claimed) handling and good sound - but good graphics and joy of driving are not found. Wth am i talking about when i mention gfx, yu0 say? Oh yeah, it has pretty good gfx when compared to those fugly games mentioned in the first post, but when compared to PGR2, RSC2, Forza, or ultimately - GT4, it's got nothing. Infact, i take the pleasure of going as far as saying GTR is like GT2 on steroids. Sure it haz teh high-poly detailed carz, but look at it - can yu0 honestly say it's realistic-looking? photorealistic maybe? nope - looks like "just a game". Racing games have come a long way btw and simply "looking like a game" doesn't cut anymore. Why would i dig into gfx when it has little importance to me personally? Because the name of this thread. Oh and the fun factor - without WSR, there is none of it - only maybe for those who do this for living - no matter what some fb's might claim. There are still lotsa aspects of driving games to discussed (like replay value, customization, feeling of ownership etc), but i don't wanna stretch this post too much. IMO GTR is a niche game - just like NASCARs, only with maybe a little more appeal - it has nothing on GT, except for it's narrow FIA championship - which it specializes in.
Gran Turismo is not a racing game benchmark without a reason - think about it.

So, i sum up this by answering the original question:
How realistic is Gran Turismo series?
Realistic enough to be called a sim.

 

[Soarer]

Thanks for shutting the **** up about the fun factor.
READ READ READ, realism is NOT difficulty. If GT had physics that were realistic(not just difficult) it would be a sim. That's what I want. Going easy on the throttle in a 600BHP powered beast is one element you need for a sim. When I said 'GT arcade physics are boring because you don't have to be careful' I was talking about throttle control in slow corners. You need to be careful in ridge racer, nfsu and burnout too if you want to avoid crashing into something. Are those games realistic? NO!

in GTp in the mclaren F1 GTR in 2nd gear doing a tight corner and you mash the GAS it will light up the tyres and go around! GT4 is ment to be even more realistic so i think the end product will be a good ballence of Realisim and arcade fun

 

[Pak]

GT4P already shows that the handling is a lot different this time round Live, especially if you use The DFP, obviously the physics arent real life (which would invlove most everyone spinning off after the slightest little error, in anything more powerfull than a streeet car), but they are a good interpritation of how it should be, which makes for a more entertaining game.
just imagine how long it would take to complete the 200 championships in first place, with total real world physics.
Example A Super license race in a LM car 5 laps of the ring, against 5 equal PS2 cars that hardly make an error.
We are not Race car drivers, we just think we are! and PD help us pander to that notion. 👍

And Just what do you consider fast?
Are you able to come close to GT.DE times for example.
I consider myself to be fast, yet can only compare against those times in the 30 to 40th region.

just imagine how long it would take to complete the 200 championships in first place, with total real world physics.
Are you forced to use that mode? NO!

GTR will be great for all pc simracers. There's a qualifying system: drive some laps, if you're slow and get of the track you will be forced to drive with other newbies. If you drive very fast and clean you will drive with others on that level. (so you won't get banged of the road by some newbies) Probably a free mode for everyone is included too.
GTR will even feature a 24hrs spa.

Realism in racing games is consists of many aspects besides handling. Gran Turismo series has the best overall points in all aspects - that's why it's THE BEST AND MOST REALISTIC DRIVING SIMULATOR.

Sure there are games that do one or two aspects better than GT, like graphics (technically), fun factor and ricing in NFSU; handling and sound in GTR, rally in CMR etc. But those examples fall short on other aspects. I'm not gonna dig into those for NFSU for obvious reasons. GTR might have ultra realistic (or so claimed) handling and good sound - but good graphics and joy of driving are not found. Wth am i talking about when i mention gfx, yu0 say? Oh yeah, it has pretty good gfx when compared to those fugly games mentioned in the first post, but when compared to PGR2, RSC2, Forza, or ultimately - GT4, it's got nothing. Infact, i take the pleasure of going as far as saying GTR is like GT2 on steroids. Sure it haz teh high-poly detailed carz, but look at it - can yu0 honestly say it's realistic-looking? photorealistic maybe? nope - looks like "just a game". Racing games have come a long way btw and simply "looking like a game" doesn't cut anymore. Why would i dig into gfx when it has little importance to me personally? Because the name of this thread. Oh and the fun factor - without WSR, there is none of it - only maybe for those who do this for living - no matter what some fb's might claim. There are still lotsa aspects of driving games to discussed (like replay value, customization, feeling of ownership etc), but i don't wanna stretch this post too much. IMO GTR is a niche game - just like NASCARs, only with maybe a little more appeal - it has nothing on GT, except for it's narrow FIA championship - which it specializes in.
Gran Turismo is not a racing game benchmark without a reason - think about it.

So, i sum up this by answering the original question:
How realistic is Gran Turismo series?
Realistic enough to be called a sim.

Gran Turismo series has the best overall points in all aspects.
Tell me which aspects of GT4p are more realistic than GTR except for graphics.

GTR might have ultra realistic (or so claimed) handling and good sound - but good graphics and joy of driving are not found.
STFU about joy of driving in GTR. DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND!? For me driving in GTR is way more fun than GT4p. It's just that GT4 has so much cars/tracks/modes.
Having fun with driving in GT or GTR is a matter of taste.

Oh and the fun factor - without WSR, there is none of it - only maybe for those who do this for living - no matter what some fb's might claim.

sigh..

Oh and the replay value of GTR will be very high for me. While it only has the tracks and cars used in the FIA GT. Why? Because the driving is so much fun for me. I already drove 100 laps or so and it never gets boring. And I haven't even driven the morgan competitive! So much fun with 2 cars and 1 track.

 

[Front]

Gran Turismo series has the best overall points in all aspects.
Tell me which aspects of GT4p are more realistic than GTR except for graphics.

GT4

GTR​

Actual racing shot's, NO PHOTOMODE, NO FANCY EFFECTS genuine racing shot and GTR looks more realistic in MY opinion

Graphic's wise GTR uses High Resolution Textures GT4 doe's not, GTR also models the interiors of the car's GT4 doe's not, GTR also allows you too see through the windows of the vehicles GT4 has mega heavy tint, The Alloys are 3D in GTR they are 2D in GT4, There is reverse lights in GTR there is none in GT4

I know I will prob get flamed but PD can't do the interior "because it will take soooooo long" in truth they keep adding more car's and more car's until the point where adding interiors will be impossible i'd rather more detailed car's then a selection of 500, but again IN MY OPINION

 

[Ubiquitous]

Oh god here we go again...

Will people stop comparing a PC game to a PS2 game... it's bad enough with idiots comparing Xbox games to PS2 games... THE HARDWARE ON THE PS2 IS EXTREMELY OLD AND VERY VERY LIMITED. The PS2 does not have many resources at it's disposal at all. When you consider that GT4 is using 32MB Memory for Graphics, Sounds, Physics and everything else and still produces the best feeling I've ever had driving in any game to date I think you can be impressed. If the PS2 had more power you'd have a far more realistic game with far better graphics, the only reason you don't is down to the limits of the PS2 hardware. Put GTR on a 32MB machine with an ultra slow chip and see how it runs, or doesn't... This whole debate is useless and stupid. GT4P has amazingly realistic physics, if you've journeyed through the GT series as I have and were shocked at how brilliantly GT replicated physics all those years ago you'd understand. The evolution has been amazing, when I first played GT3 going from GT2 it was 100x harder and more realistic and I was gobsmacked... then GTC came and made GT3 seem useless... now GT4P has shown that even GTC sucked... and GT4 will blow GT4P away...

So anyway, GTR is a PC game and whilst it is good and I do enjoy playing it with the DFP I enjoy GT 100x more. As for the looks the Press Demo of GTR doesn't look terribly great at all, but then again it is a Demo so I wont criticise it. Yet again the comparison of graphics between these platforms is retarded. Stick GTR on a machine with 32MB Memory which is shared for the graphics on the machine too and see how nice they can make it look then. I'm fed up with people posting screenshots of ultra anti aliasing enhanced uber PC graphics beside PS2 graphics and announcing the PS2 graphics are ****e? That's like me buying a supersonic jet and flying around at 700mph before announcing that F1 cars are slow... different platforms... different abilities.. different limitations.

GTR will be arguably the best PC racing game, GT4 will be the best console racing game... I personally will be playing GT4 much more than GTR. The main reason I got GTR was to drive Spa anyway... that's a track they need in GT4

Just stop your stupid arguing over mute points... if you don't like how realistic GT4P is.. don't play it... if you don't like how GTR handles.. don't play it... stop making stupid debates and bickering over things which are obviously not comparable.

We should be happy that these two games are set to come out this year and we can all be fully enjoying them by Christmas...

 

[BAR-ZoNdA]

i think that gt4p has done extremely well in that case against gtr considering that ou can use much more memory with a pc game but damn, if thats wot gt4p is like against a complete game which can use more memory with the ps2's limits, well then gt4 will simply be awsome and i cant wait to play it.

 

[Front]

i think that gt4p has done extremely well in that case against gtr considering that ou can use much more memory with a pc game but damn, if thats wot gt4p is like against a complete game which can use more memory with the ps2's limits, well then gt4 will simply be awsome and i cant wait to play it.

GTR is not complete

GT4|P was up against an ALPHA Press Demo hehe not the full version

 

[BAR-ZoNdA]

in GTp in the mclaren F1 GTR in 2nd gear doing a tight corner and you mash the GAS it will light up the tyres and go around! GT4 is ment to be even more realistic so i think the end product will be a good ballence of Realisim and arcade fun

something much more realisting is when ya just bring the car onto the grass is slides out and you slide around all over the place unlike gt3 when ya just go along until you get off and wot your saying with the F1 GTR, it gives ya good handling when ya go around for like 2 sec. or so, and it really gets goin.

 

[BAR-ZoNdA]

GTR is not complete

GT4|P was up against an ALPHA Press Demo hehe not the full version

oh!

 

[Pak]

Oh god here we go again...

Will people stop comparing a PC game to a PS2 game... it's bad enough with idiots comparing Xbox games to PS2 games... THE HARDWARE ON THE PS2 IS EXTREMELY OLD AND VERY VERY LIMITED. The PS2 does not have many resources at it's disposal at all. When you consider that GT4 is using 32MB Memory for Graphics, Sounds, Physics and everything else and still produces the best feeling I've ever had driving in any game to date I think you can be impressed. If the PS2 had more power you'd have a far more realistic game with far better graphics, the only reason you don't is down to the limits of the PS2 hardware. Put GTR on a 32MB machine with an ultra slow chip and see how it runs, or doesn't... This whole debate is useless and stupid. GT4P has amazingly realistic physics, if you've journeyed through the GT series as I have and were shocked at how brilliantly GT replicated physics all those years ago you'd understand. The evolution has been amazing, when I first played GT3 going from GT2 it was 100x harder and more realistic and I was gobsmacked... then GTC came and made GT3 seem useless... now GT4P has shown that even GTC sucked... and GT4 will blow GT4P away...

So anyway, GTR is a PC game and whilst it is good and I do enjoy playing it with the DFP I enjoy GT 100x more. As for the looks the Press Demo of GTR doesn't look terribly great at all, but then again it is a Demo so I wont criticise it. Yet again the comparison of graphics between these platforms is retarded. Stick GTR on a machine with 32MB Memory which is shared for the graphics on the machine too and see how nice they can make it look then. I'm fed up with people posting screenshots of ultra anti aliasing enhanced uber PC graphics beside PS2 graphics and announcing the PS2 graphics are ****e? That's like me buying a supersonic jet and flying around at 700mph before announcing that F1 cars are slow... different platforms... different abilities.. different limitations.

GTR will be arguably the best PC racing game, GT4 will be the best console racing game... I personally will be playing GT4 much more than GTR. The main reason I got GTR was to drive Spa anyway... that's a track they need in GT4

Just stop your stupid arguing over mute points... if you don't like how realistic GT4P is.. don't play it... if you don't like how GTR handles.. don't play it... stop making stupid debates and bickering over things which are obviously not comparable.

We should be happy that these two games are set to come out this year and we can all be fully enjoying them by Christmas...

It's like this:

Some people want a sim mode in GT4. PD is holding back something that 'takes racing a lot more seriously' because it doesn't attract the mass. (so it's probably possible on the ps2) I would like to see that simulation as an extra option.
So even if the ps2 was 10x more powerful than any pc, PD would hold the sim mode back because it doesn't attract the mass.

There's nothing wrong with saying GTR press demo simulates this better or GT4p simulates that better. Some people have problems with that and think we're talking about the final versions or blaming developers.

What I wouldn't like is when PD is intentionally making GT4 easier for the mass and not include the true sim physics(which they already made supposedly) as an extra option.

 

[Front]

Will people stop comparing a PC game to a PS2 game... it's bad enough with idiots comparing Xbox games to PS2 games... THE HARDWARE ON THE PS2 IS EXTREMELY OLD AND VERY VERY LIMITED. The PS2 does not have many resources at it's disposal at all. When you consider that GT4 is using 32MB Memory for Graphics, Sounds, Physics and everything else and still produces the best feeling I've ever had driving in any game to date I think you can be impressed. If the PS2 had more power you'd have a far more realistic game with far better

There's a game Grand Prix Legends on the PC, and is still conicdered the benchmark for current sims and it was released 10/31/1998

I doubt PC's had the uber powers in 1998 (wonder what the average system would have been) well Grand Prix Legends managed to create a top class physics system, it's either laziness on PD's part or they do not create a SIMULATION mode for GT4, it's nothing to do with system specs or memory or how the PC is dominating the console right now (specs wise)....

 

[Soarer]

something much more realisting is when ya just bring the car onto the grass is slides out and you slide around all over the place unlike gt3 when ya just go along until you get off and wot your saying with the F1 GTR, it gives ya good handling when ya go around for like 2 sec. or so, and it really gets goin.

yeh kinda play with no driving aids and youll see where im coming from

 

[GTXLR]

GTR is not complete

GT4|P was up against an ALPHA Press Demo hehe not the full version

Got OPSM2 today.

The monitor section for GT4:

We breath in, flat in sixth, trees and barriers, stream past like childhood tears. The wind noise is near deafening. Theres a corner round here somewhere:
The cars shaking so much we can hardly hold it straight, let alone see properly.
Cresting a sharp crease in the track, we take off and spot the corner at the same time.
Stab the brake, turn the wheel. Smacking back to tarmac the tyres shriek as they lock, grip evaporates, the cars spins like a dial....
Tarmac, Grass, Armco. Ouch. The impact blurs the vision.
its nearly six seconds before we come to a stop, idling in the middle of the track facing the wrong way. At nine seconds we breath out.
What the hell? Gran Turismo has changed.
Its gone hardcore.

We now know that GT4 Prologue was misdirection, sleight of hand.
Gran Turismo 4 has taken a step forward, and its a big one.
The handling has changed significantly, and although its still very recognisably GT, Its much harder to control.
Making a corner is no longer simply a case of stabbing the turn in point and nailing the throttle.
The cars are so precariously balanced, even hitting the rev limiter is enough to caause oversteer, even if your in a fast turn.

GT4 has upped its game.
Success requires far greater levels of finesse and subtlety than any other game on the market.
If you turn in a quick lap here youll genuinely desrve it.
This game has gone to a level previously only seen in PC simulations.

CAN YOU HANDLE IT.
The version we played-and we were the first outside Sony and Polyphony to do so, and does not include the Arcade mode.
Impressively Powered up are the indicators of speed.
Bumpy tracks shake you hard enough to make vision difficult, while shady sections are very hard to see.
Engine sounds are harsh and six cars together sound furious.
Sadly the Replay collisions look and sound familiarly Rubbish!

We Cross referenced the game with Prologue, driving the same car around the same track in each.
There Is NO comparison.
GT4 is a New game.

 

[Soarer]

wow if thatts true and not just hype GT4 will be cool sounds like it will give GTR a run for its money in the sim department

 

[Pak]

Got OPSM2 today.

The monitor section for GT4:

We breath in, flat in sixth, trees and barriers, stream past like childhood tears. The wind noise is near deafening. Theres a corner round here somewhere:
The cars shaking so much we can hardly hold it straight, let alone see properly.
Cresting a sharp crease in the track, we take off and spot the corner at the same time.
Stab the brake, turn the wheel. Smacking back to tarmac the tyres shriek as they lock, grip evaporates, the cars spins like a dial....
Tarmac, Grass, Armco. Ouch. The impact blurs the vision.
its nearly six seconds before we come to a stop, idling in the middle of the track facing the wrong way. At nine seconds we breath out.
What the hell? Gran Turismo has changed.
Its gone hardcore.

We now know that GT4 Prologue was misdirection, sleight of hand.
Gran Turismo 4 has taken a step forward, and its a big one.
The handling has changed significantly, and although its still very recognisably GT, Its much harder to control.
Making a corner is no longer simply a case of stabbing the turn in point and nailing the throttle.
The cars are so precariously balanced, even hitting the rev limiter is enough to caause oversteer, even if your in a fast turn.

GT4 has upped its game.
Success requires far greater levels of finesse and subtlety than any other game on the market.
If you turn in a quick lap here youll genuinely desrve it.
This game has gone to a level previously only seen in PC simulations.

CAN YOU HANDLE IT.
The version we played-and we were the first outside Sony and Polyphony to do so, and does not include the Arcade mode.
Impressively Powered up are the indicators of speed.
Bumpy tracks shake you hard enough to make vision difficult, while shady sections are very hard to see.
Engine sounds are harsh and six cars together sound furious.
Sadly the Replay collisions look and sound familiarly Rubbish!

We Cross referenced the game with Prologue, driving the same car around the same track in each.
There Is NO comparison.
GT4 is a New game.

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT!!111

GTXLR you just made my day. 👍

edit:

I'm busy building a cockpit right now and saving money for the DFP. Can't wait.

edit2: Is there any more info in PSM gtlxr?

 

[Ubiquitous]

Heh Pak.. just be patient and hold out for GT4 it will be very good. It might not be super sim but it's gonna be very well balanced for it. I would like a hardcore sim mode, however if it means the game will take a few more months to complete just for that mode which I wont probably use that much then I'd rather just have the game.. I can handle the balanced physics cause with the DFP and road tyres GT4P feels great... and I know that GT4 will feel 10x nicer and have Sim tyres which are even more realistic.

As for Front's comment about 1998 GPL release... computers around then still had at least 64MB main memory and 16-32 on the graphics card. That's still far more than the PS2 has... plus PC's then also could read the files off a HDD... which is far faster than a DVD... plus the PC's had much more raw grunt to handle things anyway.. even back then. Oh and don't forget GPL didn't look as good as GT does... So anyway... comparing PC games to console ones isn't the best thing to do.

 

[cobragt]

GTR doesnt look anywhere as realistic as gt4, it's a pc game for crying out loud.

 

[Pak]

GTR doesnt look anywhere as realistic as gt4, it's a pc game for crying out loud.

Err.. I think GT4 looks more realistic overal than GTR. But a pc game doesn't always look unrealistic.

 

[xcsti]

I think GT gets schooled by almost everyone on Background realism, but I really don't care about that. The cars look good, the driving is supposedly amazing, so I'm going to be happy.

 

[_aj]

From that quote from the article posted on the previous page is it possible PD have seen "hmm Forza ok that's a direct competitor to us" but GTR coming to XBox also with amazing (or should that be unforgiving) handling, and has looked and went for the best of both worlds, give the casuals arcade and let them have their fun but give the serious racers (not gamers) something to really grapple with and stand up to the Real Driving Simulator title. Hopefully yes and it's about time too !!

If that makes sense to you then wahey, if not then I need sleep.

 

[Pak]

From that quote from the article posted on the previous page is it possible PD have seen "hmm Forza ok that's a direct competitor to us" but GTR coming to XBox also with amazing (or should that be unforgiving) handling, and has looked and went for the best of both worlds, give the casuals arcade and let them have their fun but give the serious racers (not gamers) something to really grapple with and stand up to the Real Driving Simulator title. Hopefully yes and it's about time too !!

If that makes sense to you then wahey, if not then I need sleep.

It makes sense yes
I'm very happy about PD making it harder, though I'm still a bit afraid that the oversteer in racecars is too easy to correct.. Have to wait till november.

 

[code_kev]

GTR doesnt look anywhere as realistic as gt4, it's a pc game for crying out loud.

OH DEAR GOD NO

 

[Dave A]

That comment from Cobra made me laugh so hard, he has no idea about anything has he?

 

[TriplePlay]

GTR doesnt look anywhere as realistic as gt4, it's a pc game for crying out loud.

cobra when he's looking at gt4:

no harm meant, just thought it was funny

EDIT: the you are stupid sign is aimed at the guy in the pic, not at cobra. Although he can say some redundant things at times...it's all in good fun

 

[Gen.]

GOD damn that is ugly *shudders*

 

[everybodysfool]

I think GT gets schooled by almost everyone on Background realism, but I really don't care about that.

i agree. even in gt3 i haven't really even noticed the background much. usually when i race, im too busy concentrating on my line and the car infront or behind to be worrying about how the background looks. if you're so caught up about how the background looks than you are either driving a super slow car, losing soo bad you decide to drive the other way, or winning by so much cause you chose an f1 to race a mini.