increasing downforce = no change to PP

[velly]

I change the downforce of the VW Scirocco last night and maxed it out on the front end and this didnt change the PP. Does this happen on all cars?

(sorry if this is already in another thread but I did look and couldnt find it hence the post)

 

[ND4SPD]

Yes it does. Downforce no longer affects PP since having more or less can have adverse effects on a car far more noticeable than in GT5.

 

[XPOWER180]

Yes it does. Downforce no longer affects PP since having more or less can have adverse effects on a car far more noticeable than in GT5.

That's correct, it will noticably reduce your maximum speed for example so to add PP would be a double penalty. I prefer this system to GT5's, it seems one of the few areas that's been given logical consideration.

 

[velly]

thanks people, I am not sure if I like this or not. Yes I did notice the speed did change abit and it took me a while to improve my lap time. Not sure now if it was better lines or down to extra coner grip. I will set my wheel up tonight to be more consistance than usin gthe controller.

 

[Boone]

For some context, I was having issues with grip/stability in the corners in the recent 15th AE Time Trial Round 3 with the Audi R18. I raised the downforce for a small penalty of lower top speed but higher cornering speed. There was no change in the PP and I was quite happy.

 

[Furinkazen]

That's correct, it will noticeably reduce your maximum speed for example so to add PP would be a double penalty. I prefer this system to GT5's, it seems one of the few areas that's been given logical consideration.

Unfortunately DF doesn't actually appear to influence speed much from what I've read. If that's true that is a step back from the last version of GT5.

 

[Vagabond]

Unfortunately DF doesn't actually appear to influence speed much from what I've read. If that's true that is a step back from the last version of GT5.

Try an LMP with max then min downforce down Mulsanne. Difference is quite noticeable.

 

[smokeydan]

I think there were several threads about downforce in GT5, and the consensus was that higher downforce did not effect top speed, it appears it does now, so I think this (no change in pp) is a better solution.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Try an LMP with max then min downforce down Mulsanne. Difference is quite noticeable.

Max downforce does kill top end speed but personally I think the added grip and stability makes up for it.

 

[Roadrunr72]

Max downforce does kill top end speed but personally I think the added grip and stability makes up for it.

I think that depends on the track.

 

[Vagabond]

Max downforce does kill top end speed but personally I think the added grip and stability makes up for it.

At La Sarthe it really doesn't. To get anywhere near decent lap times you need quite low d/f.

 

[sumbrownkid]

I think that depends on the track.

It also depends on the car too. The LMPs in general on La Sarthe I feel I get better times with or close to max downforce. However with GT3 cars they get a bit understeery for my tastes.

 

[deviln3]

At La Sarthe it really doesn't. To get anywhere near decent lap times you need quite low d/f.

So its a track by track choice the user has to make... more corners = higher D/F, less corners means lower D/F, I think this is better way of doing things.

 

[Vagabond]

It also depends on the car too. The LMPs in general on La Sarthe I feel I get better times with or close to max downforce. However with GT3 cars they get a bit understeery for my tastes.

Sounds like you're not pushing enough. I'll do a couple of laps tomorrow with max and min d/f and put videos up for comparison... maybe a side by side vid, like this one:

​

 

[sumbrownkid]

Would appreciate it.👍

 

[Welsh-Fury]

Sounds like you're not pushing enough. I'll do a couple of laps tomorrow with max and min d/f and put videos up for comparison... maybe a side by side vid, like this one:

Why not race a lap with just the Zonda R with maximum downforce and another lap with minimum downforce? That way the only performance difference between runs are only defined by the downforce.

 

[Vagabond]

Why not race a lap with just the Zonda R with maximum downforce and another lap with minimum downforce? That way the only performance difference between runs are only defined by the downforce.

Actually I mean to use an LMP car... I put that vid up as an example, not to show which cars I'll use, I think you misunderstood its purpose. That was Zonda R v Veyron in GT5.

 

[Welsh-Fury]

I took my Zonda R to the Willow Springs track. After the first left turn you'll have the long high speed right hand constant sweeper. Perfect for seeing the difference with the downforce.

On racing hards, my Zonda with maximum downforce was about 5-6mph faster around the corner with an exit speed considerably more then my Zonda with minimum downforce. The only section that had little to no difference was the following left and right turns, mostly due to being the only slow part of the track. After exiting the corner, both runs breezed through the fast left and right, however, the Zonda with minimum downforce, I was forced to babysit the throttle over the hill, something I didn't have to do with maximum downforce. Again, the same story on the last corners as it was with the right sweeper, the Zonda with maximum downforce was much faster in, through and out of the turn then the other.

In the end, there was just not enough straitaway to catch the Zonda with maximum downforce. Then you also have to remember that this isn't a speedway course. Still, the times weren't far off. My Zonda R with only the Low RPM Turbo as its only upgrade ran a 1:05.972 lap with maximum downforce and a 1:06.565 with minimal.

 

[JoshDevil]

Unfortunately DF doesn't actually appear to influence speed much from what I've read. If that's true that is a step back from the last version of GT5.

Yeah, the Red bull cant go over 260 without help at max downforce.

 

[VrapPlus]

Have you tried lowering your ride height and adding downforce? These two things work together, and if you can find the right balance you should be able to have a relatively high top speed with high downforce as well, the higher the downforce the lower the car, creating less drag ontop of the car at speed.

Edit: play around with low/high downforce on both front and rear separately while adjusting ride height independent of each other. I find that a lower front with higher downforce, while maintaining a good ratio of higher rear with lower downforce gives you both speed and handling benefits.

 

[NixxxoN]

I think there were several threads about downforce in GT5, and the consensus was that higher downforce did not effect top speed, it appears it does now, so I think this (no change in pp) is a better solution.

Thats incorrect then. The more downforce, the less straightline speed, in both games. Fact

I think this new GT6 system is better because in GT5 having low downforce you had a PP advantage because you could have more HP.

 

[Exorcet]

Thats incorrect then. The more downforce, the less straightline speed, in both games. Fact

I think this new GT6 system is better because in GT5 having low downforce you had a PP advantage because you could have more HP.

The effect in GT5 was never zero additional drag from downforce, but initially it was very close to zero. After downforce was patched, the effect was more noticeable but for the most part still too subtle.

Have you tried lowering your ride height and adding downforce? These two things work together, and if you can find the right balance you should be able to have a relatively high top speed with high downforce as well, the higher the downforce the lower the car, creating less drag ontop of the car at speed.

This isn't right. It also depends on how advanced GT's aero model is. Lowering the car reduces the drag on the tires and also tends to lower pressure under the car, which increases downforce. This also increases the car's pitch sensitivity which is bad.

Lowering the car should also tend to lower the front stagnation point and send more air over the top of the car which can slightly increase downforce and drag. Along with ground clearance, you need to consider the car's rake. Increasing rake tends to increase downforce, especially front downforce, and so it's useful for changing grip as well as balance.

How much of this matters in GT6 though I don't know.

Edit: play around with low/high downforce on both front and rear separately while adjusting ride height independent of each other. I find that a lower front with higher downforce, while maintaining a good ratio of higher rear with lower downforce gives you both speed and handling benefits.

Typically you set the downforce as high as you can without compromising top speed (this means focus on the rear wing) and then you adjust the front downforce to get the desired balance since it usually has less effect on drag. Suspension wants to be low even if you don't take aero into account. Once you get a good right height, play with rake and see what it does to your car's handling.

 

[OdeFinn]

Bit odd at adding flat floor to car and Pp's jumps 20+ higher.
Hard to understand this ideology.

 

[Jump_Ace]

That's correct, it will noticably reduce your maximum speed for example so to add PP would be a double penalty. I prefer this system to GT5's, it seems one of the few areas that's been given logical consideration.

I would argue that while you lose top speed, you gain a lot in handling, it's a trade-off. So I'm glad the PP doesn't change anymore.


Jerome

 

[Exorcet]

Bit odd at adding flat floor to car and Pp's jumps 20+ higher.
Hard to understand this ideology.

Underbody panels are very different from wings and have no drawbacks, so it makes sense that PP goes up.

There is also a difference between adding parts and just setting them. I like that changing the settings on the wings does not change PP, but putting a wing on a car should probably increase PP since it makes the car more versatile (if adjustable) and often, faster.

 

[Awong124]

Underbody panels are very different from wings and have no drawbacks, so it makes sense that PP goes up.

In GT6 the Flat Floor creates a lot of drag and decreases straight line speed by a lot. There's a thread that discusses that. A lot of people find that not adding the Flat Floor results in significantly faster lap times in most cases. It makes the car a lot more stable through corners though.

 

[XPOWER180]

I would argue that while you lose top speed, you gain a lot in handling, it's a trade-off. So I'm glad the PP doesn't change anymore.

Yeah that was the point i was making haha!!

 

[Exorcet]

In GT6 the Flat Floor creates a lot of drag and decreases straight line speed by a lot. There's a thread that discusses that. A lot of people find that not adding the Flat Floor results in significantly faster lap times in most cases. It makes the car a lot more stable through corners though.

Given that GT6 is supposed to have a heavily revised aero model, I'm hoping that this is a bug or oversight of some kind. This is a really silly thing to get so wrong.