Is anyone else disappointed with GT5?

[redhed17]

Something I was just thinking:
What about if we ask the same question as the OP, but with a slight alteration?

What if the question was: ignoring the previous titles in the GT series, so taking it as a standalone game with no history, are you disapointed with GT5?

I can't help thinking that a lot of the gripes wouldn't be being brought up, were this the first in the series, not the 5th (6th? 10th? 13th?).

I think even people who had not played a GT game before would be unhappy with the longevity of GT5. As I've mentioned earlier, I've had 6+ months enjoyment from previous GT games, whereas GT5 has given me just over 2 months 'enjoyment', and that is with over 50% using B-Spec, which I had never touched in previous games.

I think it is a moot point though, as most of the people who have bought GT5 have bought previous GT games, and a sizeable number are disappointed in GT5 to small or large extent. And it is not a few minor disappointments either for a lot of people.

 

[PAWEL17]

No i am not. I was expecting Graphics beyond belief, brand new physics engine, and spectacular enviroments, i got all that, plus bonus online freen runs with mates is absolutely best thing to happen to the GT series. Not to mention, constant updates to ever improving game. I think you expected way too much.

 

[gambleboyen]

At release it only took a few day before I realised that it was a poorly quality assured product. However, the patches that have been applied has improved it quite a lot, and gives me hope that further improvement is possible so that GT5 can last longer than an "average racing game".

 

[Luminis]

Something I was just thinking:
What about if we ask the same question as the OP, but with a slight alteration?

What if the question was: ignoring the previous titles in the GT series, so taking it as a standalone game with no history, are you disapointed with GT5?

I can't help thinking that a lot of the gripes wouldn't be being brought up, were this the first in the series, not the 5th (6th? 10th? 13th?).

I wouldn't have been disappointed with GT5 it was the first of the series. Mostly because I wouldn't have bought it.

Don't get me wrong, it's not that bad of a game, but I'm very stingy when it comes to shelling out money for games (I've even been pondering whether to get Super Street Fighter 4 or not for days now, and that's only 20 bucks!). If it wasn't for the GT badge, I doubt it could've made me look past the issues I had (and still have) with it.

I think I would have returned the game instead of grinding my teeth and enduring GT Life to the point where the game kicks into gear and starts to become fun.

 

[FLIGHT50]

1. Old fans that played most GT series tend to be disappointed by GT5. <-- I'm here.

2. New comers that have never played any GT games before tend to be satisfied with GT5.

In most cases this is 98% true in my opinion. I have seen a select few returning fans on this site that appreciate what GT5 brought to the table. Me, I am part of the 98%. Until PD proves to me that they can make a better GT than GT4, I will give the crown to GT4 hands down.

One thing that people fail to realize, is that for their time, GT4, GT2 (two of the better ones) were ahead of the game. They could not be patched or updated. You have GT5 in the age of the internet and they have the ability to fix the game. Compared to the older games, this is sort of cheating. Being updatable is a huge advantage and if GT is to survive in the future they need to massively overhaul GT5 or GT6 sales won't start off too great.

Via internet, if they still can't make GT5 what it should have been, all hope is lost and we have to wait for GT6, heck maybe even GT7. Downside is that all the other racing titles have either caught up or catching up. Besides graphics and physics GT lacks a lot.

At release it only took a few day before I realised that it was a poorly quality assured product. However, the patches that have been applied has improved it quite a lot, and gives me hope that further improvement is possible so that GT5 can last longer than an "average racing game".

Same here. I got my copy at midnight on Nov 24th. Played for 2 solid weeks until I realized that this game did not meet my expectations by far. I seldomly play it now. I didn't intend to eject GT5 until sometime this summer. It was replaced by F1 2010 in two weeks. Now I split time between the two with F1 getting more play time.

I am embarrassed for Sony to have to be the ones to stand beside GT5. Whether its Sony or PD's fault for what we got someone is to blame. Between the two they better fix it before Forza 4 releases later this year.

 

[MeToo]

Has anyone actually put the various complaints about this game to Yamauchi-san? I haven't seen any interviews where they ask anything like "what happened to x3 B spec speed?" or "why the XP system and why so much grinding" Instead the interviewers seem more interested in asking silly questions like "whats your favorite car" Yesterday I did the Suzuka endurance race in bspec nearly 6 hours it took! the same race in GT4 could be done in 2,that is a clear and very frustrating step backwards

I'd like to see Yamauchi-san confronted directly with the games issues and see how he tries to justify them. We need a Bill O'Reilly type to interview him because he asks direct questions and expects direct answers. Someone needs to get right in Yamauchi-san's grill and point out to him what a step back the game is and find out what (if any) explanation he has, instead of the usual media who are justthere to kiss a**

 

[Killinator]

Has anyone actually put the various complaints about this game to Yamauchi-san? I haven't seen any interviews where they ask anything like "what happened to x3 B spec speed?" or "why the XP system and why so much grinding" Instead the interviewers seem more interested in asking silly questions like "whats your favorite car" Yesterday I did the Suzuka endurance race in bspec nearly 6 hours it took! the same race in GT4 could be done in 2,that is a clear and very frustrating step backwards

I'd like to see Yamauchi-san confronted directly with the games issues and see how he tries to justify them. We need a Bill O'Reilly type to interview him because he asks direct questions and expects direct answers. Someone needs to get right in Yamauchi-san's grill and point out to him what a step back the game is and find out what (if any) explanation he has, instead of the usual media who are justthere to kiss a**

Kaz is the king of vague open ended answers, he'd make a fantastic politician,
Not great for the old customer care though.

 

[SuperCobraJet]

Personally I don't believe there is anyway Kaz doesn't know about all the failings of this game.

If he was actually involved in, and knew the level of what constituted the previous games there is no-way he couldn't know.

His replies to direct questioning on it I would love to see, but I doubt we ever will.

To compare GT5 to previous offerings and not be completely baffled and mystified is almost impossible.

While this game could be entirely at'tributable to his vision alone, it would require practically a complete 180 degree reversal from prior art.
This improbability is what still leads me to believe this game is more the product of Sony's direction and influence.

The only other possibility I can fathom, would be a huge talent exodus from PD since GT4 wherein this is the best he could do with what he had to work with.

Kaz is the king of vague open ended answers, he'd make a fantastic politician,
Not great for the old customer care though.

Some bob and weave is expected prior to release, but thats over now.
Now its time to explain to your constituents why you voted for the bill.
Or should I say "bill of goods".

 

[Tornado]

What if the question was: ignoring the previous titles in the GT series, so taking it as a standalone game with no history, are you disapointed with GT5?

GT5 still needs to be compared to its peers, though.

I was expecting Graphics beyond belief, brand new physics engine, and spectacular enviroments, i got all that

You know, I've never understood how people could say this with a straight face.
Yes, when GT5 looks good, it looks fantastic. Perhaps the best looking racer available. The problem being that it very rarely looks that good.
You get more than 10 feet from a car, and the shadows on the ground go insane. You race off road or in the wet, and you are treated with alpha-blending of a quality roughly analogous to what Sega Rally had way back in 1995. There is notable slowdown in spots. Dynamic shadows on most cars look terrible. The Standard Cars exist, some of which looking even worse than they did originally because of how the game renders them.
I could go on.

I think you expected way too much.

I came into the game with reasonable expectations. I expected decent quality control as was the norm (for the most part) in the series. I expected a feature set comparable to that of its peers (and its predecessors). I expected game depth comparable to its predecessors in the series. I expected an evolution of the game design of the previous titles in the series. Suffice to say, none of these expectations seem too outlandish to expect for a big-name sequel with an astronomical budget in a decade-plus long franchise.

And even worse, many of the problems with the game have nothing to do with missing expectations. They have to do with PD obviously being able to perfectly meet some of the expectations set upon them, and then not doing so on purpose.

 

[Zoom!Zoom!]

From what I've read from this thread disappointments are coming from every direction. There's no way PD could fill everyone expectations for the game. Some want all the car to be premium while others believe PD wasted too much time on premium interiors which they don't use anyways. Many fans in the past wanted car interiors for GT series and PD tried to do them right. Now people are crying because no doubt focusing on these interiors took some time and energy away from other areas of the game. I think PD was in a lose/lose situation when it came to pleasing fans with GT5.

 

[t.o.]

From what I've read from this thread disappointments are coming from every direction. There no way PD could fill everyone expectations for the game. Some want all the car to be premium while others believe PD wasted too much time on premium interiors which they don't use anyways. Some many in the past wanted car interiors for GT series and PD tried to do them right. Now people are crying because no doubt focusing on these interiors took some focus away from other areas of the game. I think PD was is a lose/lose situation when it came to fans with GT5.

See the problem with what you're saying comes from the fact that it isn't so much wasting time on this or that it's wasting time on something that can't even be used. Kaz himself has said that the level of detail on the prems go beyond what the PS3 can really work with. WHY? Why not go to the level of what the PS3 can best work with and save that time putting other cars up to those levels? Every car should have came with a cockpit. That's a given. Would be nice if all cars got the premium treatment but they could have all gotten some treatment without giving the premium cars a level of detail that we have to wait for a PS4 to see. And of course you know what will happen when the PS4 drops? They'll take the cars to another level beyond these so it'll all be moot in any case.

 

[Destinkeys]

From what I've read from this thread disappointments are coming from every direction. There's no way PD could fill everyone expectations for the game. Some want all the car to be premium while others believe PD wasted too much time on premium interiors which they don't use anyways. Many fans in the past wanted car interiors for GT series and PD tried to do them right. Now people are crying because no doubt focusing on these interiors took some time and energy away from other areas of the game. I think PD was in a lose/lose situation when it came to pleasing fans with GT5.

It's called prioritization...

You address the #1 complaint first, then the #2, then the #3, so on, and so forth.

PD seem interested in the #39 and the #213, but the #1 goes unaddressed, and sadly, it's the EASIEST to fix.

Fix the grind. 400 new A-Spec races, with reward cars (who NEEDS to grind when you can race and WIN the cars?) and standard cr. and XP (sure, it's a LONG way from Level 37 to 40, but 400 new events take the sting out of it).

If PD said to us what ONE feature would you have us fix if we were only going to fix ONE...?

It's either this or the slow, dumb AI.

Make those #1 and #2, you've got a GREAT game. Ignore them, and no amount of returning a fully functioning gearbox, or another 800 Premium's is going to change it one iota.

 

[ScouserInExile]

At release it only took a few day before I realised that it was a poorly quality assured product. However, the patches that have been applied has improved it quite a lot, and gives me hope that further improvement is possible so that GT5 can last longer than an "average racing game".

We really do need to make a distinction between "poorly quality assured" and "poorly designed and implemented".

I'm fairly convinced that all of the issues were highlighted during development (they had long enough, after all) and were either willfully ignored or it was decided that they were too difficult / time consuming to resolve.

 

[dominic280378]

The word disappointment is the real key. As strange as it is, I would be fine if the game was crap. If PD tried something new, fresh and outrageous and failed at it, I think I'd be ok with it. At least they tried to do something new and failed.
But they didn't try anything new. The game is not crap, its just disappointing.

Its like being a kid and doing something wrong, you expect your parents to go ballistic but they just tell you they are disappointed in you, wasn't that always the worst feeling?
I get that feeling playing GT5.

We've got excellent posts on this thread with constructive criticism of GT5 (shout out to stagga and ScouserInExile and many others for your well thought out arguments/posts), that highlight the fact that:
-> PD voluntarily decided to ignore bugs that the QA process would have high lighted

-> They imported tracks from GT4 "as is" with out doing any work to them what so ever

-> That they put in place a badly designed leveling system in the game with the soul purpose of artificially extending the game due to lack events

-> That they removed features from GT4, rather than adding to a game that people loved.


I've been trying to understand why all of the above happened, but I simply can't. It hints at a design philosophy thats broken or has contempt for its audience.

 

[sk0pe]

See the problem with what you're saying comes from the fact that it isn't so much wasting time on this or that it's wasting time on something that can't even be used. Kaz himself has said that the level of detail on the prems go beyond what the PS3 can really work with. WHY? Why not go to the level of what the PS3 can best work with and save that time putting other cars up to those levels? Every car should have came with a cockpit. That's a given. Would be nice if all cars got the premium treatment but they could have all gotten some treatment without giving the premium cars a level of detail that we have to wait for a PS4 to see. And of course you know what will happen when the PS4 drops? They'll take the cars to another level beyond these so it'll all be moot in any case.

He has said himself that the premiums could/would be transferred and be used in GT6. I wouldn't expect to much more than the current models.

 

[sk0pe]

It's called prioritization...

You address the #1 complaint first, then the #2, then the #3, so on, and so forth.

PD seem interested in the #39 and the #213, but the #1 goes unaddressed, and sadly, it's the EASIEST to fix.

Fix the grind. 400 new A-Spec races, with reward cars (who NEEDS to grind when you can race and WIN the cars?) and standard cr. and XP (sure, it's a LONG way from Level 37 to 40, but 400 new events take the sting out of it).

If PD said to us what ONE feature would you have us fix if we were only going to fix ONE...?

It's either this or the slow, dumb AI.

Make those #1 and #2, you've got a GREAT game. Ignore them, and no amount of returning a fully functioning gearbox, or another 800 Premium's is going to change it one iota.

This whole grind thing, i personally don't think he expected everyone to want to just sit and race against AI lol. In today's day and age he wanted to go down the online route and i believe A-Spec is just a filler till all the online features mentioned in the past get implemented.
I can see people being attached to the old GT series and way of doing things, but do you really want another 400 races against what people refer to " as the worst ai imaginable" ..
If the AI is sooooo bad, why do people want more races against them.. Makes me laugh anyways.

 

[Killinator]

This whole grind thing, i personally don't think he expected everyone to want to just sit and race against AI lol. In today's day and age he wanted to go down the online route and i believe A-Spec is just a filler till all the online features mentioned in the past get implemented.
I can see people being attached to the old GT series and way of doing things, but do you really want another 400 races against what people refer to " as the worst ai imaginable" ..
If the AI is sooooo bad, why do people want more races against them.. Makes me laugh anyways.

Your kind of pointing out why people are so frustrated:

They want more races to end the grind of repeating countless A-Spec races to reach top level,
They don't want to race against dumb AI, they want better AI racers, but would rather have more varied races with said dumb AI than repeating the same races over and over with the same dumb AI,
Online isn't near fleshed out enough to be considered the main focus of the game, it doesn't even have matchmaking,

At the end of the day the leveling system has a lot of blame to bare,
coupled with the reward system its a recipe for a grind, and a long one at that.

 

[ScouserInExile]

This whole grind thing, i personally don't think he expected everyone to want to just sit and race against AI lol. In today's day and age he wanted to go down the online route and i believe A-Spec is just a filler till all the online features mentioned in the past get implemented.
I can see people being attached to the old GT series and way of doing things, but do you really want another 400 races against what people refer to " as the worst ai imaginable" ..
If the AI is sooooo bad, why do people want more races against them.. Makes me laugh anyways.

Well, the problem is that there are parts of A-Spec that are only reachable by grinding. The final Endurance race is at level 40 and you have to grind to get there, so Kaz must have expected people to grind, why else would the content be there?

The other issue with the grind is that it only serves to highlight the lack of difficulty in the game. I'm not one of these autistic types who can do the Nurb 24 hours in 57 seconds in a Fiat 500, but I haven't been challenged in the slightest in getting as far as the Endurance races - I've completed every race / series up to the end of Extreme and can't actually remember losing a race. Not only have I found it easy, I've done it within a very short space of time - I was off sick (with man-flu) for a week, played it a couple of hours a day and progressed from only having completed a few races to where I am now in that space of time.

All of which is just, well, disappointing...

 

[deftonesmx17]

This whole grind thing, i personally don't think he expected everyone to want to just sit and race against AI lol. In today's day and age he wanted to go down the online route and i believe A-Spec is just a filler till all the online features mentioned in the past get implemented.
I can see people being attached to the old GT series and way of doing things, but do you really want another 400 races against what people refer to " as the worst ai imaginable" ..
If the AI is sooooo bad, why do people want more races against them.. Makes me laugh anyways.

Is that why online races orginally did not give XP or worthwhile credits?

 

[SuperCobraJet]

Your kind of pointing out why people are so frustrated:

They want more races to end the grind of repeating countless A-Spec races to reach top level,
They don't want to race against dumb AI, they want better AI racers, but would rather have more varied races with said dumb AI than repeating the same races over and over with the same dumb AI,
Online isn't near fleshed out enough to be considered the main focus of the game, it doesn't even have matchmaking,

At the end of the day the leveling system has a lot of blame to bare,
coupled with the reward system its a recipe for a grind, and a long one at that.

There should have never been any grinding to start with.
That's the product of a lousy level progression system.
The game should have had an improved version of the A-spec point system from GT4.

However since we're now stuck with it, a sufficient number of A-spec races
would have helped alleviate the grinding of the same races over and over.

It would have also helped balance the lopsided credit system.

Personally I don't have any big problems with the AI.
It is what it is and it's certainly not insurmountable. A revised and updated A-spec point system helps this situation as well.
I've had worse races online at times than with the AI.
The A-spec challenge is what you make it.
Again this is why the game needs the A-spec point system.

 

[Destinkeys]

This whole grind thing, i personally don't think he expected everyone to want to just sit and race against AI lol. In today's day and age he wanted to go down the online route and i believe A-Spec is just a filler till all the online features mentioned in the past get implemented.
I can see people being attached to the old GT series and way of doing things, but do you really want another 400 races against what people refer to " as the worst ai imaginable" ..
If the AI is sooooo bad, why do people want more races against them.. Makes me laugh anyways.

They may be bad, but at least they don't deliberately decide to ruin a race for you.

Maybe Kaz thinks that everyone in the world has a Friends list as long as your arm, worldwide (so you can get a race at any time of the day or night) and they ALL race exactly the car and track YOU want to race (at the hp/kg you want to race) and are all good clean drivers. That certainly ain't me! I have a hectic and unpredictable schedule, and don't really have time to cultivate a collection of Friends that I trust to race clean, and who want the same tracks and cars I do (or are happy with Shuffle Mode), and have the same unpredictable schedule.

So, two things are important to me. First, that online, better matchmaking and Shuffle racing rules are implemented (Shuffle mode is a great idea, ruined by a decision to ONLY use it on POS daily drivers with Comfort Soft's, and cars that have been upgraded need a way to temporarily DROP the upgrades so that you can join ANY lobby), and then, if I CAN'T find a lobby with a decent connection, clean racers and a good variety of tracks and cars (most good lobbies tend to stick to just ONE car type), I have at least PLENTY of offline races to keep me busy until a good Online lobby opens up (I don't have all day to sit around by myself trying to get a paltry two or three others to join me for a race!).

If I want to race the AI, I can simply seed them 50hp or a 200kg, or slap lousy tires on.

Thing is, what made PD decide that they were WRONG on every other GT title? What made PD go 'Dropping 400 events from A-Spec ought to make this game SO MUCH better'...?

And, boys and girls, why is the abominable state of the AI a feature you are resigned to? Other racing games provide AI that are a challenge, that have personality (bang them around, they bang back, drive clean, they leave you alone, and they actually race each other as hard as they race you), why are we so resigned to such a game-ruining feature?

GT players are a strange breed. They will troll other racing game forums, and make fun of their physics, all the while ignoring the fact that the physics is the ONLY thing they can make fun of. The rest of their game is a very bad joke.

 

[HuskyGT]

Its so sad... And the worst thing happens when I try to give GT5 another opportunity, after a week or so without playing, I power up GT5 expecting to have more fun, but more dissapointment is what I get. Today I descovered small details, but to this point they were absolutly devastating. To have more "fun" I decided to test all premiums. The horible thing happend, when almost every premium I´ve tested, had a detail that ruined the experience. Just to mention a couple, I purchased the F430, and noticed that the driver animations were wrong! He shifted by moving an invisible stick at the far back of the center console, ignoring the shift paddles... got rid of the car... Got an Enzo, and it sounds like a f430...Got rid of the car. Got a humble old S13 Silvia and the tachometer acts like a speedometer... Got rid of the car. My favorite car, the Viper, has an unaccurate speedometer, didn´t get rid of it, but I suffer everytime I drive it. M5, the same, but with the Tachometer... And the list goes on and on....
Yep, I´m dissapointed, specially because there is not much to do anymore. Im in half level 29, without any hope of reaching 30, since its too boring.

 

[Barso]

To be totally honest, it's the most disappointing release of 2010 for me.
The game has so many problems it should have been shelved.
The standard cars, framerate and vsync, ps2 courses And the whole UI and structure of the single player kill it for me.
I have already traded it in and have my PS3 on eBay as I purchased it for gt5 only.
Back to the xbox and forza for me.
I know it's been raised so many times but what were they really doing for 6 years?

 

[HugoReyes-8]

Six years to wait and the main inprovement is graphics?! GT5 is an EPIC disappointment!!

Bring on the TROLLING attacks

I TAKE MY WORD BACK PD!!

 

[Scotracer]

i think i read gt5 is 600hz.

But i think gt5 is only as good as the guys, or friends, you race with.

trust me, no way is gt5 600hz.

i get the point and i recall this

* rfactor &#8211; 400 hz
* test drive unlimited &#8211; 100 hz (collision detection) / 1000 hz (vehicle dynamics)
* netkar pro &#8211; 333 hz [posted by kunos on rsc]
* forza motorsport 2 &#8211; 360 hz [from wikipedia article]
* ferrari challenge: Trofeo pirelli &#8211; 60 hz
* iracing &#8211; 360 hz [from autosimsport]
* live for speed &#8211; 100 hz (general) / 2000 hz (tyre rotation) [posted by scawen on lfsforum]
* nascar racing 2003 season &#8211; 288 hz (possibly)
* grand prix legends &#8211; 288 hz
* sports car gt &#8211; 50 hz [from blackhole motorsports article]

http://www.virtualr.net/tech-stuff-physic-engine-rates/

Pssst: the sampling rate isn't what's important, it's what the reduced-order models actually look like inside the system. Of course, a smaller delta-T, the smaller your error but that error is irrelevant if you're not taking 1/100th of what is necessary in to consideration.

You can tell the physics engine is crap in terms of realism if the game on 6 year old consumer-based hardware can sample at 600iterations/second. You do realise that an engineering simulation (one that is used to actually design the cars...i.e. as-close to reality as possible) could do 0.00001Hz, maximum, on main-frame supercomputers?

Video-games...realistic? LOL.

 

[R34EVO9]

Today I gave this game another boot up to get some laps in online and EVERY SINGLE TIME I GET BOOT FROM LOBBY. Everything worked fine the last time I played the game and now it just terrible online. And the one room i got it was full with monkeys behind a wheel.

So unless this is fix tonight I dont think I am going to keep copy of the game tonight

 

[redmercurypr]

To be totally honest, it's the most disappointing release of 2010 for me.
The game has so many problems it should have been shelved.
The standard cars, framerate and vsync, ps2 courses And the whole UI and structure of the single player kill it for me.
I have already traded it in and have my PS3 on eBay as I purchased it for gt5 only.
Back to the xbox and forza for me.
I know it's been raised so many times but what were they really doing for 6 years?

I think about doing that almost every day.

 

[Tornado]

I can say with a completely straight face that any disappointment that I had with GT5 has completely evaporated.

 

[Daverytimes]

I can say with a completely straight face that any disappointment that I had with GT5 has completely evaporated.

Am with you on that one my dear sir, polyphony designed this game to be built upon and if every update is going to be like 1.05 and 1.06 then am going to be playing GT5 longer than any other game








DAVE

 

[Luminis]

Meh, stuck at work for another eight hours...

The performance points might revive the game for me. I've always had a sweet spot for min-maxing