It’s OK to back out of a pass.

[demeaning pie]

But at the same time if the DR and SR ranking systems are properly utilized then the players will be separated by a system that should as a result sim group like minded racers together in one rating while the arcade crash and burn folks will be together within their ranking.

The game can support all styles of racers whether arcade or sim seekers the rankings should group them together if done correctly.

The DR and SR ranking system can't change unless you have an official overseeing every race to make the determination if contact was just racing or someone acting like a D-bag. Hand a 16 year old that has never driven a car the keys to a 600 HP race car and you get a majority of the people playing this game. The only way I seeing the racing getting cleaner is having a paid subscription league as that will prevent the "all I wanna do is crash people" from joining. While I hate the idea of having to pay more, depending on the perks offered with that subscription it may be worth it.

 

[VFOURMAX1]

The DR and SR ranking system can't change unless you have an official overseeing every race to make the determination if contact was just racing or someone acting like a D-bag. Hand a 16 year old that has never driven a car the keys to a 600 HP race car and you get a majority of the people playing this game. The only way I seeing the racing getting cleaner is having a paid subscription league as that will prevent the "all I wanna do is crash people" from joining. While I hate the idea of having to pay more, depending on the perks offered with that subscription it may be worth it.

If the SR rankings are applied correctly the "all I wanna do is crash people" will have more incidents and therefore be relegated to the the lower SR ranks while the cleaner racer will be able to have fewer incidents and remain in the higher SR rated lobbies.

It will take a while to sort itself out and yes cleaner racers will receive some undeserved penalties as we go through the sorting process. But if advancing to the higher SR ratings is made more difficult then those which race with constant multiple incidents whether by choice or just lack of skill or race craft will not be among the more experienced or cleaner races.

Everybody will have a place to race that suites the style of their racing, no one will be left out.

 

[Shirrako]

*Sigh*

 

[Kinna39]

*Sigh*

That's pretty much the case in every console racing game (not sure what the PC sims are like)... One thing I'd do in that situation though is back out earlier - the pass was most likely never going to happen and if you slow early into that first corner then IF you do get hit you'll have more time to recover

 

[VFOURMAX1]

*Sigh*

Why did you pick going to the outside rather than the inside when the approaching corner was a left hander and you had more room to the inside as well?

 

[Shirrako]

Why did you pick going to the outside rather than the inside when the approaching corner was a left hander and you had more room to the inside as well?

I would get knocked out either way, doesn't really matter, the one behind me was obviously planning it, I hit the brakes very late and still got pushed pretty hard, at this point I doubt he was trying to take the turn legit either way, this happens about 1/3 of the time on this map, can't be bothered trying anymore on this track, the first turn is murder ground.

That's pretty much the case in every console racing game (not sure what the PC sims are like)... One thing I'd do in that situation though is back out earlier - the pass was most likely never going to happen and if you slow early into that first corner then IF you do get hit you'll have more time to recover

I should have backed out earlier, but the result would still be the same, perhaps even harsher, the one behind me was not even trying to brake judging from the powerful impact feels bad.

 

[MikeTheHockeyFan]

*Sigh*

• You don't have radar or a mirror activated; you have no situational awareness here
• You put your car in a space barely wide enough between an opponent and a wall, and prayed the opponent has the radar on and has great awareness
• When there was contact, you didn't back out of the dangerous situation and persisted, continuing the contact
• You put your car in the most dangerous part of Turn 1, a zone where late braking will result in you getting rear-ended
• The only safe place in T1 of a race is the very inside directly on top of the rumble strip, even riding with 2 wheels on the grass and 2 on the rumble strip to avoid all possible contact from behind

Sorry this Twitter viddy is emblematic of folks who think everyone else in the game is dirty and they are the perfect racer while running in traffic. 0/10 on the defensive driving scale, dude.

 

[Shirrako]

• You don't have radar or a mirror activated; you have no situational awareness here
• You put your car in a space barely wide enough between an opponent and a wall, and prayed the opponent has the radar on and has great awareness
• When there was contact, you didn't back out of the dangerous situation and persisted, continuing the contact
• You put your car in the most dangerous part of Turn 1, a zone where late braking will result in you getting rear-ended
• The only safe place in T1 of a race is the very inside directly on top of the rumble strip, even riding with 2 wheels on the grass and 2 on the rumble strip to avoid all possible contact from behind

Sorry this Twitter viddy is emblematic of folks who think everyone else in the game is dirty and they are the perfect racer while running in traffic. 0/10 on the defensive driving scale, dude.

Just watched the full replay, he hit me off the road and left the race right after, so he just did it for the laughs and intentionally.
Sure I didn't take the perfect line, I did not want to take the risk pushing the driver in front of me when taking a turn, so I took the outside line, the driver behind me hit me at pretty much twice the speed I was going in, meaning he would not be able to take the turn even if my car was not there at all, so your whole argument falls apart before it even begins.

Sorry but your post is emblematic of folks who try to defend the online when it has obvious problems. I think a 1 hour ban for people that have SR - in a race and leave would help, this would decrease the amount of trolls hit and running in the game, but obviously there's people like you that pretend everything is fine all the time, you've just defended a guy who intentionally rammed me off the track and left the game 5 seconds later, but sure I'll take the blame

 

[MikeTheHockeyFan]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. You put your car in a dumb place, you made dumb decisions, hence you wound up with a dumb result.

I'm amazed at the shirking of personal responsibility by folks who play this game and wind up in incidents. There is zero personal responsibility taken, when having a good SR means doing just that and not making bad decisions.

You tried to play Senna around the outside on the first turn of the first lap, and you got exactly what was expected duder

Sorry but your post is emblematic of folks who try to defend the online when it has obvious problems. I think a 1 hour ban for people that have SR - in a race and leave would help, this would decrease the amount of trolls hit and running in the game, but obviously there's people like you that pretend everything is fine all the time, you've just defended a guy who intentionally rammed me off the track and left the game 5 seconds later, but sure I'll take the blame

 

[Shirrako]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. You put your car in a dumb place, you made dumb decisions, hence you wound up with a dumb result.

I'm amazed at the shirking of personal responsibility by folks who play this game and wind up in incidents. There is zero personal responsibility taken, when having a good SR means doing just that and not making bad decisions.

You tried to play Senna around the outside on the first turn of the first lap, and you got exactly what was expected duder

I am starting to doubt you can read what others write so I'll just end it with a big "OK".

 

[05XR8]

It really is okay to back out of a pass..., but not for a championship trophy.

 

[MikeTheHockeyFan]

Look, you have the wrong mindset to enjoy online matchmaking racing in an environment such as iRacing or GT Sport, where a no-fault SR system exists.

We can tell because you have dedicated significant time to already making a video about one single occurrence, you're posting another video about this single incident tomorrow, etc. That is not how you move up and away from bad drivers in a no-fault safety rating matchmaking system.

If you want to get into races with less ramming, then you need to make better decisions about where you place your car on the track, and keep making those decisions over a long period of time. If you get caught up in every little incident, you are just going to be tense and aggressive every race as you were with this clip, and you'll continue putting your car in positions where bad drivers will cause an accident for you as well.

I recommend you check out the excellent "Surviving Rookies" videos on YouTube if you are serious about making better decisions while racing online. If you like getting angry about every single little thing, then maybe this isn't the game or genre for you.

I am starting to doubt you can read what others write so I'll just end it with a big "OK".

 

[ScottPuss20]

Here's an idea: Don't make the pass to start with if you know it won't work.

 

[Yamface]

I've never seen my SR fluctuate like people say. Currently at B but jumped to A quickly before that. I purposefully dumped it to C to try for a win (got it, finally) because I'm just not good enough (YET!) to qually with the big boys. Mind you, I dumped my rating by crashing into walls, not drivers, for several races. Now, in FIA, I'm a B and it's tough to get to the front, if at all. Started Brands Hatch in 3rd last night and got bumped a lot but I blame myself for missing that turn in the beginning... Still love this game!

Brands Hatch first turn is brutal. Its my most hated corner in any race track. I either never get it right or even when I do, it feels like I'm slower than than I should be. Graaaar!

Love the track otherwise.

 

[Inzyman]

Not that I get this joy often but there is nothing like stacking on the pressure by stalking for a few laps and then making a great pass when he just leaves the door open...........priceless. I would rather stay behind then bash my way through.

 

[Adam Duffield]

I found that in the lower teirs this happened a lot but now my SR rating is S the players I race against seem to know how to race but it's not perfect, still get some argy bargy but no where near as bad as it was at the start.

Find the first and second corner at Interlagos can be tricky not to bump into people, many times I have almost wiped other players out at those corners unintentionally but I find it better to sacrifice my race so I don't ruin other peoples!

I won't force my way through as long as no one closes the door, would rather attempt the move cleanly at another corner then lose any SR points!

 

[Inzyman]

I want to clarify something, as I'm new to the racing sim genre, but am currently DR:B and SR:A working my way to SR:S.

I know what weaving is, and I genuinely try to avoid it, but I will close the door on people trying to dive the inside of corners on me. Typically it happens when I have somebody following me who's going roughly the same speed, not drastically faster - and instead of taking a driving line they want to dive on the inside of a corner to pass me.
In this situation I usually just turn into my corner sooner than normal, taking a not so ideal line, but closing the inside dive bomb. Usually this means they back out, but I've had some force their way right over a curb just to keep inside of me.

To clarify, I'm not blocking somebody who's got a clear run of speed inside of me, it's just preventing an attempted underbrake.

Would you classify that as being an ass?

Nope.

It's an arcade racer mindset that will be hard to remove from a lot of people, on part they just do not care, also even though there is safety rating, they see the position in that race is more important than an overall grade.
From watching a lot of racers, people use bull headed logic in both breaking, cornering and passing, very messy and inacurate, sadly if they dive bomb the inside line and hit a safer driver, usually thanks to the frustrating penalty system, safer driver takes the hit, to SR, position and sometimes even a 10second penalty for their troubles.

People need to relax, race their race, watch the oppositions corners and pounce upon the correct oportunity.

The fact we have 3 lap races does not help, very little time in 3 laps to observe another racer, especially when watching your own back on every turn for a kamikazee dip****.

Unfortunately the drivers we are all talking about, need to be here reading, learning and mixing with the community to understand what we are all on about. We are preaching to the choir and the people that need to hear the message are not getting because they don't really give a ****........I race in a time zone renowned for super aggressive drivers, I do not see any of their location flags on the on the site avatars....

 

[baldgye]

A bigger issue is that people put themselves into 'over taking maneuvers' that they cannot back out off and there is zero penalty for doing so.

I'd like to see damage come into Sport mode on the higher SR ratings and retirements due to damage

 

[JayneS]

I usually back out of about 98% of my overtaking attempts because I see the person I’m trying to pass ‘close the door’ or do something stupid ie weave unpredictably/erratically...

I totally agree that knowing when to back out is a priceless skill, but also, knowing when you’re beat / don’t slam the door like an ‘🤬‘ is as valuable

98% of them?! How on earth do you progress?

I must admit, I've found myself racing properly and sacrificing position for the sake of clean racing. It's nice to get a bunch of clean racers together, but unfortunately there are usually a few who take pleasure in ramming off the road, especially in lobbies where there is no real consequence.

 

[pedrocor]

It really is okay to back out of a pass..., but not for a championship trophy.

Actually McLaughlin had a post race penalty and lost the championship being demoted from 11th to 18th on the race classification.

 

[Sean Renon]

Actually McLaughlin had a post race penalty and lost the championship being demoted from 11th to 18th on the race classification.

Looks like 90% of drivers on GTS, comes into a corner diving and doesn't give enough room for the other car to go 2 wide on exit, basically forces him back, then drives another driver into the barrier to prevent a pass.

 

[BSDShoes]

I was almost side by side to another car and I was moving faster than the other car but the other car had a superior race line so I decided to drop behind the driver since we were heading into a corner. There are decisions like that you end up making in races.

 

[Sean Renon]

I was almost side by side to another car and I was moving faster than the other car but the other car had a superior race line so I decided to drop behind the driver since we were heading into a corner. There are decisions like that you end up making in races.

Good on you, but you are not required to do that. If you are level, you have equal claim to the corner.

Granted sometimes early in races it's not worth fighting over every spot if it ends up slowing you both down in the process.

 

[cleanLX]

Actually McLaughlin had a post race penalty and lost the championship being demoted from 11th to 18th on the race classification.

Well, I hope the penalty was for forcing the car into the wall on the straight... and not for the brilliant move 2 corners previous.
Not only is it ok to back out of a pass, but, when you've clearly been had, it's ok to "not" go ahead and turn down into the guy.

There is so much crying about dive bombing (and yes that absolutely happens, a lot) that i think people have lost sight of the fact that most passes do indeed take place under braking (otherwise you would never have heard of the "over-under")... use your mirror, know when you're beat, and try to get out hard and return the favor... cleanly.

Last night late in the NurbGP race I followed a fellow racer for a couple laps, putting pressure on w/o ever touching... he'd obviously been harder on his tires and I was waiting, finally out of a slow corner he spun/slid and I got a great run on him... fully along side into the braking, and, wouldn't you know it, slam from the outside... he went off track, and, feeling generous and not wanting to get punted in the next corner I slowed and let him back on... only for him to ram me (while I was going very slow and off the racing line, to give the friggin' spot back). It wasn't over, he then then slammed on the brakes in the middle of the back straight, and yep, I hit him, who would figure that to happen... then after the race I got message'd that I suck... LOL.
Use your mirror, know when you're beat... be a man and race it back rather than crying that every inside braking move is a dive bomb...
It's like you cannot pass anymore without retaliation.

 

[CConspicuous]

Hey all!

So after about 3 weeks playing sport mode I am beginning to see a pattern forming with a majority of drivers and what leads to a majority of frustrating incidents in online races.

PEOPLE NOT BACKING OUT OF A PASS THAT IS GOING TO FAIL.

How do we teach drivers that it’s ok to back out of a pass when it’s clearly not going to work. 99% of the time that I’ve been involved with an incident resulting in a SR and/or Time penalty is when some muppet tries a move, and instead of realising it’s not quite going to work and applying the anchors, just charges on through regardless. This is how side swipes and poorly timed punting seems to be occurring most often.

Knowing when not to pass is a far greater skill imo than passing at all costs and I wonder if anyone has any ideas how this can be taught in-game?

People try to go side-by-side on the wrong side of the chicane at Kyoto Miyabi, then proceed to fill the inbox with abuse when the obvious happens....

 

[TenderLoins]

I don’t understand the thoght process that would lead someone to think passing through a chicane is a good idea. If you make a move leading up to the chicane and have inside position (given that the other driver also knows how to drive) fine. The other driver would see he’s been beaten and lift off tucking in behind. Unfortunately this usually isn’t the case online.

People try to go side-by-side on the wrong side of the chicane at Kyoto Miyabi, then proceed to fill the inbox with abuse when the obvious happens....

 

[Spongeinside]

98% of them?! How on earth do you progress?

I must admit, I've found myself racing properly and sacrificing position for the sake of clean racing. It's nice to get a bunch of clean racers together, but unfortunately there are usually a few who take pleasure in ramming off the road, especially in lobbies where there is no real consequence.

Well 98% is maybe a bit much hehe.. but I usually somehow get grouped with alot of people that don’t know when they’re beaten and will slam the door close on me or just swerve all over the place to prevent me passing them... so I just back out and try to stay with them waiting for them to make a mistake and fly off the track enough for me to go by...

 

[TeWheke]

Brand Hatch is the perfect example, the 3 high speed corners after the back straight (Hawthorns, Westfield, and Sheen) require the full width of the track so there just isn't room to leave space for another car. Because they are high speed it's very easy to get a great run on the car ahead of you but if you try to overtake at any of these corners you are going to cause a high speed collision that could ruin both of your races so sit tight and try to force enough of a mistake.

 

[DigitalBaka]

I don’t understand the thoght process that would lead someone to think passing through a chicane is a good idea. If you make a move leading up to the chicane and have inside position (given that the other driver also knows how to drive) fine. The other driver would see he’s been beaten and lift off tucking in behind. Unfortunately this usually isn’t the case online.

Had someone think it was a fantastic idea to take advantage of traffic in the chicane at Dragon Trail, if you can believe it.

Early in the race I was P2 a little ways off the leader; not real far but not such that I was on his bumper either with P3 equally close behind me. P1 slid slightly on the hairpin right going into the chicane section and I was gaining a little ground on him . On the mid-straight after the right-left the leader hit the wall pretty hard and slowed quite a lot. I was not in a position to get around him safely before the left-right so I hit the brakes and slowed up fast moving to the center of the track so as not to rear end him. I avoided him fine and was right on him but in the middle of that "thread the needle" bit comes P3 barreling up on both of us.

Of course, he hits the wall on the right and slams my rear quarter sending me spinning and ended up facing the wrong way in the middle of the road. Thankfully I must have been ghosted but I moved quickly to the side out of traffic. Unfortunately everyone was still pretty close at this point so the only opportunity to get back in safe was at the end of the train. 2 to dead last because someone tried to fit their car in a place it didn't in a spot they shouldn't. Made up a few spots by the end but it was still a pretty miserable race. Wish I had saved the replay but I quit out of the lobby quickly so as not to get into an argument on the internet. Maybe he got bumped from behind, maybe he misjudged or maybe he was a complete tool, I can't say. Maybe I was the idiot but I don't believe so. I know that he was definitely not along side to be able to even think about a pass and certainly should not have been thinking such at that place on the track.

It's been said but I do wish they would put in something more than 2 videos to get into these races. A handful of quick pass/defend missions with contact DQs would at least make me feel a little better even if it does nothing to help. I think at least showing people how to setup a proper pass on slow traffic would go a long way. Maybe even highlight good and bad passing areas in circuit experience?

 

[gorlt]

Re: drivers who will not let you pass.

If the driver behind you was once 4 seconds away and now they're trailing you on every corner, it's time to lay off the gas and let them pass, instead of defending every corner.

Brands Hatch, Gr.3 race, stuck behind a driver who, when I attempted to pass, would nudge me ever so slightly, forcing me to drop back or take the wrong line for a turn. Eventually passed him on Paddock Hill and left him behind by at least 5 seconds. It seems people don't understand that they aren't the fastest on the track.