Microsoft Reveals Next-Gen Console: "Xbox Series X"

[tunaphis]

The kicker, of course, is that the console will likely still be cheaper to buy than either of those discrete cards...

RtX 2080 ti's are between $1800-$2300 in Oz.

 

[TokoTurismo]

Nah, hold your horses. It would be great if they would show off the actual game, but it is more likely they will show a small tech demo with lots of talk. We might even wont see that if it happens behind closed doors.

Guess we'll just have to wait and see. It would be odd if T10 didn't show the public how the game will look like on the XSX though.

 

[tunaphis]

The Laptop people must be sending out resumes to console companies.
Who going to drop $2500 on a pc that can't compete with a sub $1000 console?

 

[RaceFuchs]

The Laptop people must be sending out resumes to console companies.
Who going to drop $2500 on a pc that can't compete with a sub $1000 console?

To be fair, we will see new Nvidia GPUs by the end of the year, possibly new AMD cards too. So if you would like to spend 2500 bucks on a PC this year, you should do so at the end of the year. And you will be able to build a PC thats stronger then the new consoles. However, the Xbox Series X will propably not only be sub 1000 bucks, but most likely be sub 600 bucks. Heck, maybe it will be only 499. Price-Performance ratio is insane, but thats hardly news. You can buy an Xbox One X pretty much everywhere for 270 bucks now, and that is a nice machine with 6 TF that will propably run stuff like Halo Infinite and Forza 8 in 4K as well, although they will look even better on the Series X...

 

[Corsa]

Dear Gamers,
Refresh rates matter, Resolution does not.

Why the obsession with 4K gaming?

You’ll experience a far greater gaming experience at a smooth 144hz, than you ever will watching a 4K cutscene at 30fps.

1440 vs 1080 does not apply to my opinion here, we know the goal should be 1440.

 

[FT-1]

Dear Gamers,
Refresh rates matter, Resolution does not.

Why the obsession with 4K gaming?

You’ll experience a far greater gaming experience at a smooth 144hz, than you ever will watching a 4K cutscene at 30fps.

1440 vs 1080 does not apply to my opinion here, we know the goal should be 1440.

Prioritising 4K over 144hz is mostly a corporate-led decision rather than something hardcore gamers have a say in. Hi-Res screenshots with crisp textures are a far easier sell than smoother frame rates for mass market audiences. Some people can barely tell the difference between a stable 30hz refresh rate and 60hz, let alone 60hz to 144hz.

Plus most consoles are hooked up to TVs which are capped at 60hz, so 144hz will only be utilised by a niche market.

 

[Jtheripper]

I wonder how heavy ray tracing will be on the GPU. I don't really expect more than 1080p @ 60fps for games with all bells and whistles.

That's why im hoping for a ps5 pro later on so it can more fully use rt and 3d sound and physics and all in smooth crisp flow as much as possible.
I'll wait and see at least for a while.

 

[RaceFuchs]

That's why im hoping for a ps5 pro later on so it can more fully use rt and 3d sound and physics and all in smooth crisp flow as much as possible.
I'll wait and see at least for a while.

Unless you're looking for 8K, i don't think there is any need to hold back for an eventually upgraded version of a console that hasn't even been shown to the public.

 

[Arado_Blitz]

Not every game will use raytracing. We also dont know to which extend... Control on PC for example, lets you activate or deactivate various raytracing options. So there might be a "small" raytracing solution for many games. Native 4K is already a possibility on the best PC GPUs and it should be the same with the Series X. But its also true we might see some other solutions like dynamic resolution.

I bet the so called raytracing will only be limited to raytracing shadows and reflections, at least for the PS5 which is rumored to be weaker than the XBox. If the rumors about 9.2-10 TFLOPS are spot on, then we should forget about global illumination, at least on third party games. Exclusives might be another story though.

 

[Jtheripper]

Just thought, the problem with backward compatibility is you're pushed to get the same brand for next gen, else you lose that.

Unless you're looking for 8K, i don't think there is any need to hold back for an eventually upgraded version of a console that hasn't even been shown to the public.

Maybe as you imply they will only up-res games on a pro, just hoping they would more fully use the added power for all aspects of the games.

I bet the so called raytracing will only be limited to raytracing shadows and reflections, at least for the PS5 which is rumored to be weaker than the XBox. If the rumors about 9.2-10 TFLOPS are spot on, then we should forget about global illumination, at least on third party games. Exclusives might be another story though.

That's what worries me, even at 12Tf.
I prefer moody dynamic lighting and physics and 3d sound to silly 8k res. Just give me smooth 60fps at least.

Edit: grr double post sorry.
Ty for fix mod.

 

[Mr Grumpy]

@rhalgr

The Xbox One already had BC, which didn't require patches to get enhanced games

Yes but I meant to the level of actual x enhanced.

Although the 1X supposedly boosted all games to a degree, only certain games received the actual x enhanced patch.

 

[ImaRobot]

@rhalgr



Yes but I meant to the level of actual x enhanced.

Although the 1X supposedly boosted all games to a degree, only certain games received the actual x enhanced patch.

You're really just answering you're own question with the very same sentence you're asking it in.

 

[die996]

INB4 the specs that keep getting leaked are from an extra-expensive model and the actual console 75% of people will buy is much like the PS5, you've read it here first!

 

[ImaRobot]

INB4 the specs that keep getting leaked are from an extra-expensive model and the actual console 75% of people will buy is much like the PS5, you've read it here first!

Leaked?

 

[rofajole]

INB4 the specs that keep getting leaked are from an extra-expensive model and the actual console 75% of people will buy is much like the PS5, you've read it here first!

I agree with you. I have a feeling the Xbox Series X will be a $800+ console, possibly being sold in a monthly plan like a phone plan with Xbox Game Pass Ultimate for ~$50 a month.

 

[Griffith500]

Dear Gamers,
Refresh rates matter, Resolution does not.

Why the obsession with 4K gaming?

You’ll experience a far greater gaming experience at a smooth 144hz, than you ever will watching a 4K cutscene at 30fps.

1440 vs 1080 does not apply to my opinion here, we know the goal should be 1440.

I'm personally amazed that 120 Hz gaming on consoles is even a thing at this point. Incredible.

I suppose the old "disruptive" approach still works with tech, even "basic", "consumerist" stuff like games consoles...

We can probably thank VR for a lot of the momentum behind UX improvements in the last few years.

 

[Terronium-12]

INB4 the specs that keep getting leaked are from an extra-expensive model and the actual console 75% of people will buy is much like the PS5, you've read it here first!

I mean, Phil Spencer has already hinted that there's going to be a cheaper Xbox next gen several times, and them being very specific about the naming convention doesn't do much in the way of suggesting otherwise.

I agree with you. I have a feeling the Xbox Series X will be a $800+ console, possibly being sold in a monthly plan like a phone plan with Xbox Game Pass Ultimate for ~$50 a month.

$800? Are you familiar with the term "financial suicide"? Because that's what that would be. Neither company is going to price a console at $800.

 

[rofajole]

I mean, Phil Spencer has already hinted that there's going to be a cheaper Xbox next gen several times, and them being very specific about the naming convention doesn't do much in the way of suggesting otherwise.



$800? Are you familiar with the term "financial suicide"? Because that's what that would be. Neither company is going to price a console at $800.

Not entirely. $600 in 2006 is equivalent to $780 today and Sony didn't go under with the PS3. If Microsoft can market the Series X as a "Pro" device for the ultimate gamer and that they can get it for "Only $50 (or less, just spitballing a price) a month with unlimited games with Games Pass included" and still have a $400 Series S which is equivalent in performance to the PS5, they probably would. The pro-sumer is already used to paying exuberant prices for devices, like the phones nearly everyone upgrades for ~ $800 or more every two years.

 

[Terronium-12]

Not entirely. $600 in 2006 is equivalent to $780 today and Sony didn't go under with the PS3. If Microsoft can market the Series X as a "Pro" device for the ultimate gamer and that they can get it for "Only $50 (or less, just spitballing a price) a month with unlimited games with Games Pass included" and still have a $400 Series S which is equivalent in performance to the PS5, they probably would. The pro-sumer is already used to paying exuberant prices for devices, like the phones nearly everyone upgrades for ~ $800 or more every two years.

I never said anyone would go under, I said it would be financial suicide. Remind me, what happened when Sony sold the PS3 for upwards of $499? The prime difference there is at least a key contributor to that pricing scheme was the fact Blu-ray was still in its relative infancy and expensive to manufacture as a result.

Here you're suggesting the price just because? And you can't compare the iPhone market — a segment Apple knows exists because they have years of research confirming as much — to the console market where, again, you're suggesting Sony and Microsoft would follow this trend...just because?

 

[Arado_Blitz]

Just thought, the problem with backward compatibility is you're pushed to get the same brand for next gen, else you lose that.


Maybe as you imply they will only up-res games on a pro, just hoping they would more fully use the added power for all aspects of the games.


That's what worries me, even at 12Tf.
I prefer moody dynamic lighting and physics and 3d sound to silly 8k res. Just give me smooth 60fps at least.

Edit: grr double post sorry.
Ty for fix mod.

Raytracing is still primitive, even games such as control use only a couple of hundred rays in each scene, we need at least another 5 years for very high quality raytracing. I mean take a look at Quake 2 RTX, raytracing won't be much better than that for at least 5 years.

 

[Jtheripper]

Raytracing is still primitive, even games such as control use only a couple of hundred rays in each scene, we need at least another 5 years for very high quality raytracing. I mean take a look at Quake 2 RTX, raytracing won't be much better than that for at least 5 years.

I see yeah, well i don't know, just wishing it can be as good as possible.
And that the specific tech and optimisation possible on something like a ps5 or ps5 pro can give surprising or really cool results.
I'll have a look at it, thanks.

 

[Mr Grumpy]

You're really just answering you're own question with the very same sentence you're asking it in.

Yeh, what I'm trying to say is do you think that this time around they'll be no need for a SX enhanced patch, a bit like running a game on a mid range PC compared to a high end PC.

Just install the game & voila, it adjusts everything to the capability of your device without the need for specific patch.

Example PC2 runs just under 4k @ variable refresh rates with a few jaggys & stutters on the 1X even though it's been X enhanced (god knows what it looks like without it)

So would running PC2 on the SX clean this up automatically (constant 4k @ solid 60fps with a tad more AA & without stuttering) or would it need to be patched by SMS (although we all know that's not going to happen)

 

[rofajole]

I never said anyone would go under, I said it would be financial suicide. Remind me, what happened when Sony sold the PS3 for upwards of $499? The prime difference there is at least a key contributor to that pricing scheme was the fact Blu-ray was still in its relative infancy and expensive to manufacture as a result.

Here you're suggesting the price just because? And you can't compare the iPhone market — a segment Apple knows exists because they have years of research confirming as much — to the console market where, again, you're suggesting Sony and Microsoft would follow this trend...just because?

The PS3 was a large mistake for Sony because there was not a backup plan to combat that high launch price, which a speculated Series S would rectify. The price I am saying is just speculation, yes, but not without reason. AMD's fastest GPU currently on the market sells for $400 and has a computational value of 10 Teraflops, the 7nm 8-core 3700x costs around $300, 1Tb M.2 around ~$140, plus Blu-ray drive, PSU, R&D, etc. Considering the CPU will not be the 3700x and with the deals with manufacturers, I could easily see this console costing Microsoft over $700 to produce.

As for comparing to the iPhone market, Microsoft themselves have already dabbled with this. https://www.pcworld.com/article/344...l-access-subscription-heres-how-it-works.html

At the end of the day, I hope you are correct and that I am extremely wrong. But I would rather be realistic about the fact that this generation could be very expensive.

 

[inCloud]

Neither company is going to price a console at $800

For 800$ its price/performance ratio would be super high and hardcore gamers would buy it like hot cakes. Especially, if M$ would bundle it with Elite 3 gamepads or will offer it by subscription model.

IMO, series X wouldnt be only one, there would be Xbox Series S(?) with zen2 and RDNA2 GPU comparable to One X in 200-350$ price range.

 

[GTV0819]

I agree with you. I have a feeling the Xbox Series X will be a $800+ console, possibly being sold in a monthly plan like a phone plan with Xbox Game Pass Ultimate for ~$50 a month.

Lmao who's going to buy a console with an amount of an overpriced (or overrated) iPhone?

 

[Terronium-12]

The PS3 was a large mistake for Sony because there was not a backup plan to combat that high launch price, which a speculated Series S would rectify. The price I am saying is just speculation, yes, but not without reason. AMD's fastest GPU currently on the market sells for $400 and has a computational value of 10 Teraflops, the 7nm 8-core 3700x costs around $300, 1Tb M.2 around ~$140, plus Blu-ray drive, PSU, R&D, etc. Considering the CPU will not be the 3700x and with the deals with manufacturers, I could easily see this console costing Microsoft over $700 to produce.

Product/Manufacturing costs aren't the same as the price to consumers. Using your example, the 5700 XT would not cost Microsoft anywhere near $400 per unit. Nor would an M.2 drive cost them $140; it's more likely to cost them less than $30.

At the end of the day, I hope you are correct and that I am extremely wrong. But I would rather be realistic about the fact that this generation could be very expensive.

I mean no ill will when saying this, but there is nothing realistic about a console costing $800 when Microsoft have already gotten 🤬 for the Xbox One costing a mere $100 more than the PS4 at launch. That's $499 vs $399, and now you think both companies are just going to launch $799 consoles and expect the mass public to be okay with it?

The only way this were to ever happen is if the issues with Coronavirus were so unfavorable that it affected manufacturing to the point both Sony and Microsoft were forced to sell the first batch of consoles at an exorbitant price point because there'd be a shortage of several months that they had zero control over. And even then...

I'm trying to see things from the perspective you're discussing, but that price would never fly under any circumstance. If, in some warped parallel universe they both were to sell the consoles at the price — congrats, the price is going to drop substantially within 6-12 months, if not sooner. Guaranteed.

 

[deththrasher]

The Laptop people must be sending out resumes to console companies.
Who going to drop $2500 on a pc that can't compete with a sub $1000 console?

Lol, this happens every console launch.

I agree with you. I have a feeling the Xbox Series X will be a $800+ console, possibly being sold in a monthly plan like a phone plan with Xbox Game Pass Ultimate for ~$50 a month.

What are you smoking lol

 

[ajmiles]

Raytracing is still primitive, even games such as control use only a couple of hundred rays in each scene

That's not even remotely true. Control shoots millions of rays per frame, not hundreds.

 

[redhed17]

For 800$ its price/performance ratio would be super high and hardcore gamers would buy it like hot cakes. Especially, if M$ would bundle it with Elite 3 gamepads or will offer it by subscription model.

The thing is though, to make it a success they have to go way beyond hardcore gamers. Yes, a lot of those may pay whatever M$ say it is regardless at launch, unless they go way beyond what even the most pessimistic are predicting, but the volume of sales is where success or failure will be.

£300 has been the magic number that they have all tried to get close to over the years though, with PS 1+2 being that price, and also the original XBox, with the XBox 360 slightly below at £280 (= £421 in 2019), and that was for the Premium version with the 20 Gb HD. The Core version was even cheaper at £210 (= £316 in 2019).

Below are the release prices (UK) and the equivalent inflation adjusted values for 2019. Even though some of the adjusted values get close to £600, those are not the values that people will think of when they compare to the value of a previous product, they will think of the cost at the time. To go from £450 for the XBox One to potentially £600 - £800 is a big jump. For Sony those prices would be an even larger increase. If Sony don't have the XBox performance, as is rumoured, but get close at a massively cheaper price, will the average person on the street know or care!

It is going to be very interesting to see how M$ and Sony price these consoles, especially if the games don't seem a huge increase quality visually, which for some they may not be on a 1080p TV.

XBox, 2001 £300 = 2019 £500
XBox 360, 2005 £280 = 2019 £421
XBox One, 2013 £450 = 2019 £520

PS1, 1995 £300 = 2019 £581
PS2, 2000 £300 = 2019 £508
PS3, 2007 £425 = 2019 £594
PS4, 2013 £349 = 2019 £404

 

[rhalgr]

Yes, a lot of those may pay whatever M$ say it is regardless at launch, unless they go way beyond what even the most pessimistic are predicting, but the volume of sales is where success or failure will be.

M$?

Sale numbers is an outmoded metric.

Sony’s Chief Executive Officer Kenichiro Yoshida has said the business should be judged by the number of active users, not the number of hardware units sold.

https://seasonedgaming.com/2020/02/...judged-by-user-count-not-hardware-units-sold/