New official GT5:P & GT5 Wheel by Logitech and PD + GT5:P release dates confirmation

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo 5: Prologue' started by amar212, Feb 20, 2008.

  1. DaveTheStalker

    DaveTheStalker Premium

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    I bought my G25 from Amazon for $246 with Next Day Shipping (set up a temporary Amazon Prime account). That is the best all around deal I found while researching for my purchase.

    The DFP's MSRP is $129.

    The MSRP of the new DFGT is $149.
     
  2. clanks

    clanks

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  3. Goo

    Goo

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    Hi.

    My name's Chris, and I work for Logitech. I'm the product manager for both the Driving Force GT and the G25, as well as the G-series keyboards and some other stuff. I'm the guy in the YouTube video explaining how the DFGT's new realtime adjustment dial feature works. Now that GDC is over and the wheel is actually announced, I'll try and answer some of the questions I've seen about it.

    The Driving Force GT (DFGT) is a direct replacement for the Driving Force Pro. It is not intended to address the same customer as the G25.

    The pedals base has the same external design, but the internals were modified slightly to improve reliability and precision. Much like the G25 pedals, the DFGT's are set up with two parts - the pedal arm turns a gear that is affixed over the potentiometer shaft rather than turning the pot directly. This means that excessive force (and the subsequent deformation of the plastic) on the pedals can no longer cause the potentiometer to move out of tolerance and produce erratic values. The performance of the DFGT's pedals should be significantly improved over the Driving Force Pro's.

    The force feedback transmission is a double-reduction, single-motor system. The gear ratio has been modified such that it is much smoother and quieter than the DFP's. It also features a backlash-reduction main gear similar to the system used in the G25. It does not generate the same amount of torque that the G25 does, as it only has one motor, but it does deliver the same amount of torque as the DFP.

    I'll pop in and answer further questions as I can during the week. It's been quite hectic leading up to the announcement, and I think it will only calm down a little now. Hopefully I can get some pics up of the internals as well.
     
  4. Greycap

    Greycap Premium

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    Great to get some real knowledge about the hardware! :tup:

    I think the biggest question for most people is the feel of the wheel, personally I got the G25 because it's so much smoother with its belt drive than the DFP and its gearing. In other words, will this new wheel feel more like a slightly upgraded DFP or a slightly downgraded G25? Thanks in advance!
     
  5. Jay

    Jay Premium

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    Thank you very much for coming here and clearing some things up.

    Personally I would love to know if there is something in the G25 type line coming up, specially G25 type wheel focused towards Gran Turismo/PS3? (I know you couldn't answer this anyway)

    I really hope GT5 will not ditch clutch and H gate support to officially support the DFGT as it's main GT5 official wheel.

    Very nice to have you here anyway. :tup:
     
  6. Goo

    Goo

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    The wheel feels more like the G25 than the DFP. It's a bit "heavier" to steer than the G25, but is much easier than the DFP. The G25 is able to be turned faster than the DFGT, though.

    There is currently 6-speed support in the GT5:prologue US version we demoed at GDC. Obviously, as we do not write the game, I cannot say definitively what the future holds for shifter/clutch support. I do not expect things to change, however.
     
  7. essell

    essell

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    Your input here is much appreciated, Goo :)
     
  8. Leonidae

    Leonidae (Banned)

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    Goo: What about the users with G25? is it possible to re-map the functions of the scroll and other features of the new wheel so that they can be used with G25's buttons and d-pad?
     
  9. legroom

    legroom

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    I'd agree with essell!

    It's very good to hear someone from Logitech coming on here and adressing questions.

    I'm in limbo at the moment. After my DFP went completely tits up last year and started failing to notice the pedals were attached, then the right flappy paddle stopped too! It did me good service, working well from the purchase of GT3 many moons ago, but i've been waiting to see what the replacement was before taking a hit for a new wheel.

    Goo, is the DFGT now wireless or is it a USB connection similar to the DFP? Also, is there any chance of getting Paddle shifters refered to as "Flappy Paddles" in the instructions?! :p
     
  10. kikie

    kikie Premium

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    That's what I want to know as well.

    +1 :tup:




    :)
     
  11. TheMoose

    TheMoose

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    Good to have someone from Logitech here!:)

    I'll be picking up a DFGT when they come out to replace my wore out DFP!
    I'm hoping for a GT25 also, I would really like a higher end wheel, the only reason I haven't picked up the G25 yet is I knew an updated wheel would most likely be released when the full GT5 was released.

    That said I would like to throw a couple of suggestions out there.
    I like the on the fly adjustments & would like them on the GT25 as well as,
    Better bushings/bearings on the steering shaft!
    Besides the pedal troubles I had (resolved under warranty, thanks!) the "wobbly wheel" has been my biggest problem with the DFP.
    The plastic bushings wore out quick & the wheel wobbles & isn't as smooth as it was new.
    Better bushings/ shaft material with lubrication points would help but at the $300 price point bearings would be better!

    I'd also like to see a wireless wheel if it could be done with no lag, preferably Blutooth so where the console was mounted wouldn't be any problem (no wires would help a bunch in the GF acceptance factor!).
    A PS button would be nice so I wouldn't have to activate my regular controller or dig out the BD/DVD remote to exit the game.

    While some like the separate shifter I'd like to also see attachment points on the wheel as an optional mounting spot for those without a dedicated rig like a playseat.
    Some like the H pattern but I'd like it switchable between a H pattern & forward & back shifting of the DFP

    As for the future I'd like to see some kind of FFB in the brake pedal so it would give more feel & would pulse to let you know the anti lock was engaged.

    In looking at my requests I guess I'm looking for a $1000 wheel for $300!! LOL!

    Thanks & welcome!:cheers:
     
  12. Duratec

    Duratec

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    Been trying to find out this but to no avail, guess its a bit early... maybe Goo has the answer? I'm prayin it can be done.
     
  13. Goo

    Goo

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    Again, this is more of a GT5:prologue question than a wheel question. As a result, I can't really answer it definitively. My opinion is that it is unlikely that this will occur.
    It is not wireless, and the shifter buttons are pretty much the same design as the DFP. We will not call them "Flappy Paddles" in the documentation. :)
     
  14. superwally

    superwally

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    LOL, several times. And another thanks for taking the time (and risk) to come here. You will find it well worth it in the long run to get us straightened out. Some folks have outrageous expectations and take every gray area to a negative extreme.

    The upgrades you described (as well as the more publicized ones) pretty much resolve my issues with the old DFP-assuming the soldering under the flappy paddles has been beefed up. I'd like to thank the good folks at logitech-I now can solder circuit board connectors quite effeciently.:)

    In all honesty my DFP's have taken some serious abuse, and are not prone to failure, aside from the things mentioned. I have a PS3 (60 gig and 7 games/2 controllers-$405-ebay-wahoo!) and my tax refund on the way, looking forward to picking this up.
     
  15. gt3killer

    gt3killer

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    Although I'm using the G25 wheel and loving it this new wheel as me interested. I'm curious to how the added features of the wheel will work during the game, also I wonder if you can insert the G25 pedals into the new Logitech wheel?? I love the way the G25 pedals feel much improvment over the DFP wheel, but of course the whole G25 setup is a much improvement :)
     
  16. Rocket Punch

    Rocket Punch

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    sucks.
     
  17. cubits

    cubits

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    The pot ranges should be identical, but you would have to rewire the pedals to get them to work on the DFGT (much as you would for the DFP). 3 into 2 does not go. :p
     
  18. amar212

    amar212 Premium

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    Goo, thank you very much for your answers here, much appriciated.

    As all my friends have covered a verios questions regarding new wheel, I have one which is a small blasphemy - but I certanly would like that soomeone from industry answer it.

    What is happening with Microsoft's decision not to go with true force feedback on their consoles? Sice I know Forza 3 is in the development, can we expect any progress on that field?

    And this one - you should know it better than anyone at this point:

    Will we be able to use G25 pedals on new DFP wheel? If not, can you consider something like that to be done somehow - without ruining the waranty with bricking the wires internaly?

    Thank you in advance and best regards - hope you'll stay tuned here for a longer period.
     
  19. racingfreak01

    racingfreak01

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    Will probably get this for my existing DFP setup...my buddies can use it...I'll stick to my G25 thankyou!
     
  20. Touring Mars

    Touring Mars Moderator

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    I read an interesting article in The Sunday Mail yesterday where one of their guys got to play what he described as GT5 Prologue and he mentioned that each track had weather effects which mimicked the real weather at the location in real time... I suspect that it wasn't GT5: Prologue but an in-house GT5 demo that he got to play, but nevertheless I was really surprised to hear that it's already playable with full weather effects.
     
  21. Goo

    Goo

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    They do not work out of the box, no. There are certainly some things you can do, the most straightforward of which would be installing the DFGT's potentiometers into the G25's pedal housing, but there's nothing that can be done without a screwdriver and subsequent voiding of warranties.

    As far as the other thing goes - I have no more information about force feedback wheels on the Xbox 360 platform than you do. It is up to Microsoft to determine how their platform, titles, licensing, and technologies work.
     
  22. amar212

    amar212 Premium

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    Bad news, but thank you very much! Something like that would be great to have, and I guess it wouldn't be a problem to do - only if someone thought of it earlier.
     
  23. kikie

    kikie Premium

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    Why would you want to do something like that? The DFGT has:
    , so it seems that the new DFGT pedals are as reliable as the G25's.

    The G25 pedals are better looking, build with better materials etc... but while driving, I guess no one is looking at his/her pedals. The G25 pedals are probably having a more realistic feel when pushing them? And I think the clutch doesn't work if you connect the G25 pedals to the DFGT. So in essence there is not much difference.


    :)
     
  24. amar212

    amar212 Premium

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    Of course, I 'll talk after I lay my foot on new pedals, but judging from pictures:

    a) as reliable - not,
    b) more realistic feel at G25 - probably, especialy the brake,
    c) I don't speak about the clutch,
    d) in ESSENCE, difference is ESSENTIAL.

    Oh, BTW - do you have G25?
     
  25. kikie

    kikie Premium

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    Yes, about a year now. It's good but the H-pattern shifter could be more precise.
     
  26. amar212

    amar212 Premium

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    I agreee with the H-Shift, it's not good as it could be. On the other hand, I find it's pedals as prime example of "the pedals". And I have a certain amount of doubt that DFGT pedals will come even close to them. However, I'd like to be wrong though.
     
  27. kikie

    kikie Premium

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    The only pos. feature about the DFGT are the 2 new buttons which control the car setup on screen.


    :)
     
  28. superwally

    superwally

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    Did you read the part in this thread about the improved internals (pedals internals as well) and larger wheel?

    Logitech's mistake with this wheel? They didn't change the wheel's appearance enough from the DFP-maybe to keep costs down, who knows. Most of the focus on here seems to be more about the fact that it looks like a gussied-up DFP than the improvements to the wheel. That's too bad.
     
  29. Nitrof1

    Nitrof1 (Banned)

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    does G25 have a turning lock for 180 degree?
    900 degree is very unnecessary in gt5p :(
     
  30. dark_ruffo

    dark_ruffo

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    It has 1º to 899º wheel lock.

    But is not like the DFP phisycal lock, it is virtual.