NFS Shift 2 Unleashed - Details

[machschnel]

You know, I've starting to brush the 'simulation elitist' (not to be taken seriously) mentality of a bit during the last few weeks.
Don't get me wrong, I still want ultra realistic physics, but there's something I realised while playing GT5:
Realism is no substitute for fun. Maybe that's just me, but above all else, a game has to be fun. Even if it's not as good a simulation as GT, I don't doubt that I'll have more fun with Shift 2.

And, at the end of the day, that's what's most important to me.

Recently, when firing GT5 up, I pick a car and want to do somethign with it... But, there's little to do. Even with the best physics on a console, it doesn't make the 'driving' anymore exciting. It's still just a game/simulation of the real thing and can't provide me with the joy of driving I'd experience in real life anyways, so driving for driving's sake went out of the window more and more. It actually got old quicker than I thought.

Just give me a fun racing experience with believable physics and I guess I'll be happy.

Agree completely. As long as the the physics model is reasonably good (and they get rid of that horrible sliding) I think Shift 2 could be the game for GT5 dissenters.

 

[breakpoint]

This is just trolling my friend, we were talking about what does "sim racing" or "simulation" really mean and after everyone posted his own idea, I found an interesting definition in wikipedia, so I don't see the point to hate it. I think it well represent the "sim racing" meaning. This will help us trying to decode what kind of game Shift 2 will be, because people need to know it before buy.

We all know what kind of game Shift 2 will be, it will be a mix between sim and arcade. Its just rather annoying to see people posting nothing but negative things about the game, that is trolling. If you don't like the idea of the game then that is fine, but why post nothing but this game is going to be horrible or this game isn't what they say etc. etc.? Obviously "sim racing" will mean different things to different people because not everyone views the world the same, so why debate it because obviously everyone will see it differently. So instead of posting wiki links etc. how about posting videos or information on the game if you find it, or if you really don't care for the game how about just not even post because its not helpful to the thread if its nothing but comments that down the game.

 

[AnPrionsaBeag]

I think Shift 2 could be the game for GT5 dissenters.

Despite the blatant lack of tracks, races and meaningful premiums (Group B rally cars among many others), GT5 is more than ok, although it's arguably not the best in the series. Still, I'll buy Shift Unleashed and Dirt 3 as I'm no monomaniac and these specialized games offer a lot more than GT5 in their fields.

 

[HKS racer]

Don't forget that wikipedia is written by regular people. Everyone can write there. I could write in this simulation thing now my own perspectiv and change it to my view. So it's not really legit.

You can't write completely BS in wikipedia, they use a kind of common sense and if people point that out this mean that "sim racing" around the world got its own sense and meaning. If that's is not enough go ask these guys what sim-racing mean

how about just not even post because its not helpful to the thread if its nothing but comments that down the game.

Not helpful to what? To you and your ideas? Is there a dictature that avoid people requesting developers to show the features they are claiming? Are you that dictator? LOL, I'm waiting their elite mode, and because some people got some doubts about the meaning of "sim-racing" we discussed a bit, it was a nice discussion to be honest but sim-racing actually have its own meaning all around the world. Sim-cade is another thing.

 

[Nuck81]

Agree completely. As long as the the physics model is reasonably good (and they get rid of that horrible sliding) I think Shift 2 could be the game for GT5 dissenters.

Why can't they both be great games that people enjoy for different reasons?

Oh I forgot, a mirror doesn't come off a Zonda. GAME SUCKS 👎👎

 

[boxox]

You can't write completely BS in wikipedia, they use a kind of common sense and if people point that out this mean that "sim racing" around the world got its own sense and meaning. If that's is not enough go ask these guys what sim-racing mean

SRT on iRacing? Are we going to go and ask Speedhunters if Shift is any good next?

Yes there are. With the current pc and console technology we can call Netkar Pro, iRacing, live for speed etc... true sims.

Again I think it comes down to simulators having a reputation for realism that exists totally independently of anything they actually do or how accurate that might be. Do any of these basic nKP errors prevent it from being a true sim? Does iRacing's car or tyre model sound like a true sim to you? Is LFS really a true sim? They all sound kind of a lot like plain old ordinary WIP software to me. And it seems their developers are perfectly well aware of this too

 

[breakpoint]

You can't write completely BS in wikipedia, they use a kind of common sense and if people point that out this mean that "sim racing" around the world got its own sense and meaning. If that's is not enough go ask these guys what sim-racing mean

Not helpful to what? To you and your ideas? Is there a dictature that avoid people requesting developers to show the features they are claiming? Are you that dictator? LOL, I'm waiting their elite mode, and because some people got some doubts about the meaning of "sim-racing" we discussed a bit, it was a nice discussion to be honest but sim-racing actually have its own meaning all around the world. Sim-cade is another thing.

Oh course since your so talented in trolling you missed or ignored the point of my post and what it was trying to say. It wasn't helpful to anyone here, what helpful information about the game did you provide? None. Everything you post is either arguing with someone about what they like about the game or how you think this game is just going to be horrible, so either contribute to the thread or just leave the thread alone for us who actual want to play this game, please.

 

[haehre]

In this recent interview, Marcus Nilsson says:

– With Shift 1 we had a little identity crisis. It was the up and coming "Need for Speed"-title, and we had to make certain compromises--we haven't had to make any compromises this time. We have worked towards a realistic racing-experience, and that means several things we couldn't do with the first game.

 

[TB]

Welcome to GTP, haehre.

I've edited your link to be more user friendly for those of us that can't read Norwegian.

 

[machschnel]

Why can't they both be great games that people enjoy for different reasons?

Oh I forgot, a mirror doesn't come off a Zonda. GAME SUCKS 👎👎

Well.... by definition, a "GT5 dissenter" doesn't enjoy GT5, so I guess that would be the primary reason.

 

[Destinkeys]

I simply feel that altogether too much attention is given to a label... 'Sim' or 'not Sim'. It's all semantics. What are you 'simulating'? The look? The sound? The physics? The rules of the sport?

Sadly, I see altogether too much attention payed to the look. So a mirror won't fall of... Big wup! Does this affect how you RACE? Hardly. I also see a lot of attention paid to the physics. Yes, I know it's important, but bear with me...

What's the POINT of true to life physics, if married to a game that completely ignores true to life racing RULES?

Imagine this... Say EA come out with a game that LOOKS just like soccer. Amazing attention to detail, each blade of grass modeled to perfection. Each player from the soccer league of your choice is photorealistic, to the point where you can't tell that it's not a broadcast of a real match. The sound of the crowd singing, the lights, the weather, the pitch getting wet, you name it. Modeled to perfection.

Now imagine that each player's moves are all motion captured, and that, once again, you can't tell real from the game. Shadows, shoelaces, it's all perfect...

BUT.... When you PLAY the game, there's nothing in the game to stop you from picking the ball up with your hands (when you aren't the goalie) and running down the field with it like a rugby player, and diving into the net holding it, AND THE GOAL COUNTS..!! So, now, every other player on the field is trying to tackle you with leg chops, fists, kung fu moves, and maybe an Uzi...

Now, there might be a few of you out there that might think that game sort of sounds like FUN! But is it 'soccer'?

Of course it isn't!

But that's where we are with racing games. They LOOK like racing, they DRIVE like race cars. But the game is set up so that, to win, you have to play demolition derby... or at least avoid those that want to play it. No serious soccer game would EVER allow you to pick up the ball. But racing game not only allow you to bash and cheat your way around, but they REWARD you for doing it! That's how Shift 1 was, and so far, I haven't seen anything in print about changing anything to make up PLAY at racing rather than '🤬 your buddy' or 🤬 everybody else...

So, I ask you... without stringent rules and penalties for non-racing behavior, what on earth gives any game the right to call itself a 'sim'..? Physics and graphics certainly don't, IMO...

 

[sauac]

Destinkeys, I totaly agree.

GTR and GTR2 by simbin made an excellent attempt at simulating most of the positive things that possibly constitute a "sim" and as it stands are probably the most complete "off the shelf" racing sims ever made.

If EA had their way, you would be able to fire an UZI but then the game would be called shift 2 Behind Enemy Lines.
Now there's a thought...... 💡

 

[Imari]

Destinkeys, I totaly agree.

GTR and GTR2 by simbin made an excellent attempt at simulating most of the positive things that possibly constitute a "sim" and as it stands are probably the most complete "off the shelf" racing sims ever made.

If EA had their way, you would be able to fire an UZI but then the game would be called shift 2 Behind Enemy Lines.
Now there's a thought...... 💡

See, now you're giving me ideas for a James Bond racing game. Bunch of fancy supercars, variable weapons outfitted on your car before the race, free for all racing mayhem.

Why has no one made this game before!?

All right, that was pretty off topic, but still...

 

[sauac]

...it was slightly of topic wasn't it.....but you gotta laugh......sim physics...not sim physics. When shift 2 finally hits the shelves we'll all know whether it meets our own personal criteria and more importantly if we enjoy it or not.

The first shift was marred by a poor driving experience and questionable AI...bordering on well "Slightly Mad"(sorry couldn't help that).

Here's hoping for consistent believeable AI that ramps well from "novice" up to "elite" mode.

I don't think that's too much to ask.

 

[Terronium-12]

Enjoy the new gamplay vids.

Audi R8 LMS




Rear end still looks a bit loose, but it does look more controlled.

Pagani Zonda F


The splatter at the end is a nice touch.

 

[Imari]

That chase cam doesn't do them any favours, it's very loose and moves around a lot. The in-car cams look nice though, smooth and tight, a bit of rear-end kicking out where you might expect it to on powerful RWD cars. I don't see anything to complain about in those vids, and there are certainly some lovely touches like the bug splat.

 

[Speedster502]

Chase cam looked pretty poor in terms of sliding around, but as Imari said the interior view seemed to look very nice. Definitely seems to be less of the bumping around that plagued the original Shift.

 

[Destinkeys]

Bathurst looks great! Mind you, they had better make the walls DESTROY your suspension, or I see a lot of 'wall-riding' going back in the game from Shift 1..

The sound is still exciting. Not a vacuum cleaner to be heard

 

[tribolik]

But the handling of the cars still seems alot like Shift 1 - no so much the jumping around but the sliding around is still there

 

[sauac]

But the handling of the cars still seems alot like Shift 1 - no so much the jumping around but the sliding around is still there

Yes there does still appear to be a bit of sliding going on. It seems that a gamepad is been used...what do you think?

 

[Terronium-12]

Yes there does still appear to be a bit of sliding going on. It seems that a gamepad is been used...what do you think?

It's possible, and there were aids being used so we still don't have a good enough representation of how the physics appear with no aid whatsoever.

 

[sauac]

I Prey the game has fantastic FFB...I mean GTR2, Gran Turismo levell FFB. I don't want some cheap rumble effect as used in the last game or by codemasters in F1 2010.

EA and Slightly Mad realy talk up the authentic and immersive nature of this title. I believe once you've played a game with an excellent FFB steering wheel you won't ever want to use a pad or be satisfied with a simple rumble effect from the wheel.

 

[Imari]

Chase cam looked pretty poor in terms of sliding around, but as Imari said the interior view seemed to look very nice. Definitely seems to be less of the bumping around that plagued the original Shift.

I don't think so. I think it's just the way the camera is set up for when the car turns, it shows a lot of the side of the car. Apart from a couple of instances where the car is clearly actually sliding, there's little to no tyre squeal, and if you focus on just the relationship between the road and the car it's not actually doing anything weird.

It's all smoke and mirrors to make it LOOK like it's extreme and drifty, but it's not actually doing it.

When you look from the cockpit cams, it's totally different because now you're (sort of) locked into looking in the direction of the car, so you KNOW when the back is stepping out. With the chase cam, they can swing the camera wide and it feels like you're going sideways, when really you're not.

I think that's partly why the camera seems so loosey goosey too. The camera is strongly linked to the inputs, and so every time the pad player (it's totally a pad) shoves his stick sideways, the camera jerks off to the side.

 

[HeadsoupBob]

One screen here from CeBit, which Shift 2 was shown at. Did anyone by chance get a hands-on there? (Hannover, Germany). Decent Fanatec setup, that's for sure! Shows the post race screen, but not really much at all given away

http://wasd.ro/editoriale/658-cebit-2011-intel-extreme-masters-hall-23

 

[Destinkeys]

I don't know why anyone gets down on Shift (and by extension, Shift Unleashed) for being drifty...

Have you guys ever driven on Comfort Hard tires (or even Comfort Soft's!) in GT5? Or are you all hooning around on Racing Soft's? Because, to be quite honest, I think that Shift 1 had more grip than those Comfort Soft's... But nowhere NEAR as much as Racing Soft's. I simply put Shift's handling down to being on street tires (and if you pretended it had JUST rained, it helped, too!), and it felt a LOT better!

One thing I found I liked about Shift's handling was, because the wheel wasn't set in stone to 900º, but you could adjust it, it was easier to 'catch' oversteer with some countersteering, as you didn't have to move the wheel so far if set to 360-450º. With a pad, no problem, go hard left to hard right in a flash, but a wheel set to 900º takes a LOT of motion to pull off a good countersteer.

 

[Imari]

I don't know why anyone gets down on Shift (and by extension, Shift Unleashed) for being drifty...

Have you guys ever driven on Comfort Hard tires (or even Comfort Soft's!) in GT5? Or are you all hooning around on Racing Soft's? Because, to be quite honest, I think that Shift 1 had more grip than those Comfort Soft's... But nowhere NEAR as much as Racing Soft's. I simply put Shift's handling down to being on street tires (and if you pretended it had JUST rained, it helped, too!), and it felt a LOT better!

One thing I found I liked about Shift's handling was, because the wheel wasn't set in stone to 900º, but you could adjust it, it was easier to 'catch' oversteer with some countersteering, as you didn't have to move the wheel so far if set to 360-450º. With a pad, no problem, go hard left to hard right in a flash, but a wheel set to 900º takes a LOT of motion to pull off a good countersteer.

I agree. I find my cornering speeds to usually be about equal to sports softs or sports mediums. Which is nice, because I think those tyres are about the best balance of grip and slip.

Shift did seem to be unnaturally balanced in oversteer situations though. Most cars you had to really push to get them to spin, they just wouldn't do it all by themselves. I'm not going to compare to GT5, because I think GT5 does all sorts of things wrong in this regard too, but Shift was definitely very stable (stupid bouncing and drift mode aside). And because it was so stable, it was as easy as hell to pull off massive drifts, making it "drifty".

I also think it had a lot to do with the sound. In Shift, the tyre squeal kicks in really early. REALLY early. So if you're driving from bumper/cockpit, your ears are telling you that the tyres are sliding and you've got very little visual reference to tell you otherwise. The tyres ARE sliding, but only minor slip as you'd expect when cornering.

I noticed immediately in the new video that they've toned this down. The tyres don't squeak nearly as much, and you have to be cornering a lot harder. It might just be me seeing what I want to see, but that was definitely the impression I got, and I've been playing a fair bit of Shift 1 in the last couple of weeks.

 

[JJ72]

I feel that cars in shift 1 not so much drifts....but just the rear end want to crab walk without going near the limit of grip, feels like some sort of active rear steering in action all the time, It's a feeling I remember very vividly.

So far in all shift 2 videos I have yet seen this behavior coming back, so thank god by that.

 

[MagpieRacer]

That 3rd video shows Monza Junior which I dont recall being listed as a variation on the official site.

 

[NLxAROSA]

Why has no one made this game before!?

Actually, Bizarre Creations did with 'Blur'. Excellent game, but unfortunately, nobody played it.

[/offtopic]

 

[HKS racer]

Lol to my friend breakpoint It's a pleasure know that you don't want people have a different opinion from yours. I'm not saying the game will be "horrible" at all, I was just talking about car physics in a sim-racing perspective. Graphic and sound will be top notch without any doubt. Anyway thanks to Terronium for the new videos, that sliding in the first one is a bit different from Shift 1 but is still.. sliding, I respect Imari's idea but I don't think is only for the camera. Maybe with a wheel cars will handle different, GT5 with pad is a "different game" than GT5 with wheel, the same thing is for Shift 1, and probably this will happen with Shift 2 too. Any info about the FF? Maybe with the good FF settings and some setup tuning this game could be fun even for sim players, I really hope that because it looks good and it sounds good. The sun reflex in the 2nd video make me remember GTR2 times.