Nissan hints to a new RWD sportscar?

That was just one article, there are several that say the same thing. Guess they all just copied from one another or something.
Almost certainly, for copying others is the way of the internet. I can vouch for the Auto Express article since the writer was on the same trip I was and spoke to the same people, but we just happened to get subtly different answers!

The overall probability for Nissan building a rival for the MX-5 is low, of course, but as far as I understand it hasn't been ruled out completely. Carmakers aren't daft - if there was suddenly a big swell of buyers towards cars like that, they'd rustle one up in no time.
 
Trust me, if they do build one don't expect it in the next 3-5 years. :lol:
That's fairly obvious. It takes at least that timeframe to develop a car from scratch, and if they can't see a business case for it at the moment, then it's unlikely they've started development on one.
 
That's fairly obvious. It takes at least that timeframe to develop a car from scratch, and if they can't see a business case for it at the moment, then it's unlikely they've started development on one.
The easiest way to go about it is what I said on the last page. Entry level Z and run with it.
 
If only BMW had collaborated with Nissan and not Toyota. The IDx could've been the basis of a 510 and 2002 revival. Lightweight and with the turbo triple, that would've been a BMW to really interest the enthusiast driver.
 
VXR
If only BMW had collaborated with Nissan and not Toyota. The IDx could've been the basis of a 510 and 2002 revival. Lightweight and with the turbo triple, that would've been a BMW to really interest the enthusiast driver.
And it need not be a specialty model either. it could be that the Nissan version be entry level and the BMW version, the sport model.

As it is now, the iDX "beige" could still work with that three-box design. Low cost, 16" wheels, 6-speed manual and auto, "tweed"-style seats like the 240SX, stretch the wheelbase a bit to ad a bit more rear leg room. Make the NISMO bits, part options for track duty. Bill a One-make NISMO race for marketing. I think that could work.
I know over here, if the price can hover around $21k-$26k, it's a winner.
 
VXR
If only BMW had collaborated with Nissan and not Toyota. The IDx could've been the basis of a 510 and 2002 revival. Lightweight and with the turbo triple, that would've been a BMW to really interest the enthusiast driver.
But people would have called sacrilege when BMW went and made the 2002 revival FWD anyway.
 
I think Nissan has watched the ZN-twins and seen that there just isn't a market big enough to justify what would be a sizable investment. The id-x is not going to happen.
 
But people would have called sacrilege when BMW went and made the 2002 revival FWD anyway.

It'll be interesting to see if the 2 coupe switches to FWD as well as the rest of the entry BMWs. No doubt they'll drive well, but it won't feel the same.
 
I think Nissan has watched the ZN-twins and seen that there just isn't a market big enough to justify what would be a sizable investment. The id-x is not going to happen.
The IDx was never going to happen in its original form anyway. I think Nissan confirmed that fairly early on, and their creative chief has told me personally that while people liked the design, it just doesn't fit in with the current Nissan range.

But I think you're right - the ZN twins in particular are probably the car Nissan is looking at as a cue to build a similar sports car. The trouble is, this is the current market:

Internet: "We want a lightweight sports car! One where outright speed doesn't matter as much as driving feel."
Toyota and Subaru: "Great! Here's one!"
Internet: "We don't want that one. It isn't fast enough. Give us another!"

I've said it before, but I suspect the only reason even Mazda has been able to continue with the MX-5 is thanks to the economies of scale of the Fiat tie-in. I do quite like the Mazda has been bloody-minded enough for a quarter-century and resisted giving the MX-5 extra power and corrupting the car's ethos, but I'm not sure other manufacturers have that resolve. Possibly Toyota, if it has the guts to make the S-FR and do it properly.
 
Mazda has been bloody-minded enough for a quarter-century and resisted giving the MX-5 extra power and corrupting the car's ethos
Mazda's sheer "No, cock off, we're doing it our way" on everything is part of the reason why it's my favourite brand. The fact that Mazda's way is making everything so damned nice to drive is the other part.
 
The MX-5 also appeals to a vastly larger audience than the ZN does. The 86 is a not-very-attractive, not-very-practical, not-very-fast, not-very-quality, not-very-tech, not-very-roadster, and not-very-cheap car thing. It's decent at almost everything, but really good at almost nothing. As Clarkson once said about the F50, it is a car with few superlatives. The few things that it does nail aren't exactly universally desired. A perfectly balanced chassis, low center of gravity, and a boxer engine are about as niche-wants as you can get. I do not actually think I've ever seen anyone driving a BR-Z or FR-S that was not a male with short hair between 22-30 years old. Maybe the equivalent female, maybe.

I've seen MX-5's being driven by every kind of person you can think of.
 
I've seen MX-5's being driven by every kind of person you can think of.
Trouble for Nissan is, I think they'd probably end up with something closer to the ZN's niche appeal than the Mazda's one-size-fits-all approach. And thus they'd struggle to find a market for it.

Much as I prefer the ZN to drive over the current MX-5, it's very easy indeed to see the ND's appeal - the latest one looks great, it's as affordable as ever, the roof goes down for those who want nothing more than that, it feels faster than the numbers suggest, and it gets great gas mileage. It's actually quite a big ask for any company to top that combination of factors. Even Fiat, and they'll be selling basically the same thing...
 
As much as I like the Fiat 124 (prefer it to the MX-5), It will never sell as many as the the ND, there's far too many loyal customers/fan base for that to ever happen. It really is a tough ask for any manufacturer.

Still would love to see a mini Z car though.
 
Still would love to see a mini Z car though.
You're in luck!
Mini-z s30-フェアレディzでドリフト.jpg

;)
 
I plead the 5th! Nah, I can't recall.

What is telling, the Z does work and they do sell. Funny how a Z could work(especially all these years) and not a 3-box economy/sport coupe. The 510/1600, had Nissan kept the car rwd and not followed other makers, I bet it would have survived just as long. As was mentioned, when an automaker sticks to doing it "their way", people respect that.
 
I plead the 5th! Nah, I can't recall.

What is telling, the Z does work and they do sell. Funny how a Z could work(especially all these years) and not a 3-box economy/sport coupe. The 510/1600, had Nissan kept the car rwd and not followed other makers, I bet it would have survived just as long. As was mentioned, when an automaker sticks to doing it "their way", people respect that.


Except the Z isn't really working. It arguably hasn't worked with the 370 at all. The 350z sold very strong. The 370z has performed very poorly in comparison. (US Sales figures)

350z
2002 13,253
2003 36,728
2004 30,690
2005 27,278
2006 24,635
2007 18,957
2008 10,337

370z
2009 13,117
2010 10,215
2011 7328
2012 7338
2013 6561
2014 7199
2015 7391

Ford sold 122,000 Mustangs in the US in 2015.

The only time the 370z beat the 350z's sale's worst year was it's first year of production. The 350z's best year was nearly three-times bigger than the 370z's best year. I think this is for a myriad of reasons, most notably it's unattractive and uninspiring to drive. They even managed to make it sound terrible.

The FR-S/BR-Z has actually beaten the 370z pretty handily in sales every year they've both been on sale.

2012
11,417 + 4144
2013 18,327 + 8587
2014 14,062 + 7504
2015 10,507 + 5296
 
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But....it still sells enough for them to consider another one, and there will be another one. The entry level model I spoke of twice before is a good way to bring those sales up.

And the 370 can sound fantastic with an aftermarket exhaust. Amuse comes to mind...
 
^^ this is why I find it works. They haven't shelved it. Remember Mustang II? Ford has its bad times too. Nissan just erased the 510/1600 out of existence. Even if the Bluebird exists in Japan, it doesn't in its biggest market.

Done right, that iDX would be a feasible product for Nissan.
 
^^ this is why I find it works. They haven't shelved it. Remember Mustang II? Ford has its bad times too. Nissan just erased the 510/1600 out of existence. Even if the Bluebird exists in Japan, it doesn't in its biggest market.
The Altima serves the market once occupied by the Bluebird. The name may no longer exist, but in a sedan range that includes the Versa, Sentra, Altima and Maxima, Nissan hasn't exactly abandoned the market itself. It's little different to the BMW 2002 eventually becoming the 3-series we have today - along with the 2-series, 4-series, GT models and umpteen other variations.
Done right, that iDX would be a feasible product for Nissan.
I'm not so sure it would, unless the market already showed there was potential. In Nissan's own words, that means companies like Toyota bringing a product like the S-FR to market and it being successful, which is very much a "wait and see" moment.

However, I have a strong feeling when you say a product like the IDx would be feasible, you mean specifically that Nissan could feasibly sell suitable numbers of a compact, lightweight, rear-wheel drive coupe or sedan. Possibly with retro styling.

That is why I'm not so sure it's feasible. Back in the 1960s and 1970s, a compact, rear-wheel drive coupe or sedan was effectively the norm. The majority of cars were compact, lightweight, rear-wheel drive coupes or sedans. And the "retro" styling was contemporary.

Now, that exact format is a niche, rather than the mainstream. People didn't buy Bluebirds back in the 70s because they were pining for the days of light, rear-drive sedans like today; they bought them because they wanted a cheap grocery-getter and that just happens to be what was available to them at the time.

Today, the mainstream Nissans serving that same purpose are cars like the Versa and Sentra. They might have changed in form and ethos, but ultimately they serve the same ends, and they sell because of it. (Incidentally, the same applies to everyone who thinks the VW Beetle should still be rear-engined, rear drive, and everyone who complained that Dodge was somehow abusing the Dart name with the latest model.)

It'd be great to have the 510's original ethos in a modern car, but ultimately the market for such a thing is very slim. Return on investment is low, and that's even more off-putting when you'd have to develop a rear-drive platform from scratch, as Nissan would have to with a production IDx. So no, I'm not so sure an IDx would be feasible, unless the market for small, lightweight, rear-drive sports cars suddenly exploded.

And even then, we'd have to live in a world where people didn't immediately complain that the IDx/S-FR/MX-5/86/BRZ "wasn't fast enough".
 
Thing is, if that same market(Versa, Sentra, Altima, Maxima)were rwd, consumers would have to accept that as the norm from Nissan. When the first Sentra SE-R dropped, auto journalists immediately referenced it to a modern 2002tii. What if it were rwd? The car need not look retro. It just needs to be done right.
 
Thing is, if that same market(Versa, Sentra, Altima, Maxima)were rwd, consumers would have to accept that as the norm from Nissan. When the first Sentra SE-R dropped, auto journalists immediately referenced it to a modern 2002tii. What if it were rwd? The car need not look retro. It just needs to be done right.

Making it RWD compromises the packaging too much. A FWD layout just leaves more scope. Especially if that platform will spawn vehicles of different usage. 99% of owners of these vehicles couldn't care less about rear wheel drive. But they do care about a bit more boot space and rear leg room.
 
Making it RWD compromises the packaging too much. A FWD layout just leaves more scope. Especially if that platform will spawn vehicles of different usage. 99% of owners of these vehicles couldn't care less about rear wheel drive. But they do care about a bit more boot space and rear leg room.
For sure, no argument there. Many owners don't know if there car is fwd or rwd.
The same person that wants a CX-5, won't be looking at a CX-3. Yet, someone looking to get a Mazda 3, is more likely to look at a CX-3 than CX-5. I tell you, in the past, I sold cars that didn't come with bluetooth. I lost sales because other makes came with bluetooth standard. Cabin space goes without saying for today's buyers BUT, doesn't matter how much space it has. If it doesn't have Pandora or someone's mobile phone is not compatible with a certain car, the consumer could careless how much money they save or how much space it has, from one brand to the next.
 
For sure, no argument there. Many owners don't know if there car is fwd or rwd.
The same person that wants a CX-5, won't be looking at a CX-3. Yet, someone looking to get a Mazda 3, is more likely to look at a CX-3 than CX-5. I tell you, in the past, I sold cars that didn't come with bluetooth. I lost sales because other makes came with bluetooth standard. Cabin space goes without saying for today's buyers BUT, doesn't matter how much space it has. If it doesn't have Pandora or someone's mobile phone is not compatible with a certain car, the consumer could careless how much money they save or how much space it has, from one brand to the next.
I get what you're saying, but you're drawing an erroneous comparison by adding another variable into people's purchasing decisions.

This isn't "people care more about Bluetooth than they do about space, therefore people don't care about space". It's more like "people care more about Bluetooth than they do about space, and they care more about space than they do about the driven wheels". Putting the latest infotainment system on a rear-wheel drive sports car won't con people into buying it over a practical front-wheel drive four-door sedan without the latest infotainment system...
 
Make anything FWD with a Z badge on it and enthusiasts will lose their minds.
The GripZ concept was a good example of that, though I was quite a fan. As I said in my interview with Nakamura, I reckon something like GripZ would work great as part of a Z "brand", but I'd not like it to be the only Z. The Z has always been a front-engined, rear-drive coupe at heart. Six cylinders too, though I think a turbo'd four would be accepted fairly quickly.
 
If the next Z is to sell well, it needs to be more assured of it's own ethos. Right now it's stuck somewhere in between light weight sports car and GT-esque muscle coupe.

It's not nearly as fast or refined as a Mustang GT or Camaro nor as fun and full of life as an MX-5 or ZN. It's stuck between those two extremely in almost every category. Conceptually, this should/could be a niche of its own, but I think the market has spoken decidedly otherwise.

Unfortunately, with current trends, I feel like the next Z might indeed be a crossover type thing. But if it's sexy and still based on the FM platform (aka V6, rwd, with a manual trans option) it might be able to carve out a fresh market that has never been seen before. Suddenly you have an "activity-lifestyle-performance" type vehicle that can do things like Uber, carry mountain bikes but also be fun on the back roads.
 
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