No Restrictions = No Challenge = No fun?

[veryferry]

Yeah, I think that's not going to happen either, but that's exactly what infuriates me... I'm not asking for anything strange or special, I'm asking for something that is implemented in most games...

Anyway, I still don't understand how so many people supports PD decision simply saying that this way the game is accesible for everyone... it is with difficulty levels too, which is a standard, and not everybody is that happy to make their own challenges, otherwise we wouldn't see threads like this one everywhere...

Well, I don't have any complaints about PD.
I make my own challenges, and it doesn't cost me much time really.
Actually, it's very simple.

True...different difficulties would be best, but the solution offered by PD is a perfect second IMO

 

[Resident Troll]

I try not to read this thread, and certainly try not to respond...but I'm sucked in.

I think it's funny to read people complaining about "wasting their time" when playing a video game! Isn't that what they're for? Do we really want to maximize our productivity when playing our games?

Its not about wasting time, that is just the excuse. It boils down to the elitist that now feel threaten that Joe Blow can level up just as fast with far less effort. They do not care about the longevity of this game or that PD maintains as many players as it can, it is about being elite and the fact that that status is quickly going away because the Seasonal events allow people to enjoy the game without having to grind.

 

[Motor City Hami]

Yeah, I think that's not going to happen either, but that's exactly what infuriates me... I'm not asking for anything strange or special, I'm asking for something that is implemented in most games...

Anyway, I still don't understand how so many people supports PD decision simply saying that this way the game is accesible for everyone... it is with difficulty levels too, which is a standard, and not everybody is that happy to make their own challenges, otherwise we wouldn't see threads like this one everywhere...

Did you play GT1, 2, 3, 4 or Prologe? PD has made GT5 very true to the series. I think the only gripe you can have about 5 is the length of time they spend getting it out and focusing much of their energy on 200 cars and a few new tracks. But to challenge the game play to say that there aren't low medium and high difficulty levels is just silly. I applaud them for staying true to the series.

The only reason shooter games have levels is to keep people playing. Once you conquer it on light, medium and difficult, the game goes on the shelf to collect dust. We will be playing GT5 for years.

 

[veryferry]

We will be playing GT5 for years.

If it takes them ages again to make GT6, we will indeed

 

[PataNegra]

I try not to read this thread, and certainly try not to respond...but I'm sucked in.

I think it's funny to read people complaining about "wasting their time" when playing a video game! Isn't that what they're for? Do we really want to maximize our productivity when playing our games?

What I mean with "wasting my time" is playing and not having fun because I'm just trying to create the challenge for the "real race"... videogames are for having fun (while you waste your time, true) and driving a coffee machine like the Schimmwagen adding upgrades until you feel that ending on the first place is actually possible, is everything but fun...

 

[PataNegra]

Its not about wasting time, that is just the excuse. It boils down to the elitist that now feel threaten that Joe Blow can level up just as fast with far less effort. They do not care about the longevity of this game or that PD maintains as many players as it can, it is about being elite and the fact that that status is quickly going away because the Seasonal events allow people to enjoy the game without having to grind.

not really, I don't give a s**t about being elite and even less about everyone golding everything (I'm a bit old for that), I simply don't want to be testing races until I can really enjoy them... I don't have the feeling of testing every single game I play, any other game can be more or less difficult, but the challenge is there, already tested by the developers which is something that doesn't happen here

 

[PataNegra]

Did you play GT1, 2, 3, 4 or Prologe? PD has made GT5 very true to the series. I think the only gripe you can have about 5 is the length of time they spend getting it out and focusing much of their energy on 200 cars and a few new tracks. But to challenge the game play to say that there aren't low medium and high difficulty levels is just silly. I applaud them for staying true to the series.

The only reason shooter games have levels is to keep people playing. Once you conquer it on light, medium and difficult, the game goes on the shelf to collect dust. We will be playing GT5 for years.

I played previous GTs (except 4) and I didn't have the feeling that I was testing races that much, I remember them much more challenging even with upgrades, although I don't remember how restrictions worked...

I also didn't have a steering wheel by then, which could be the reason of finding it more challenging

 

[leper-messiah]

What I mean with "wasting my time" is playing and not having fun because I'm just trying to create the challenge for the "real race"... videogames are for having fun (while you waste your time, true) and driving a coffee machine like the Schimmwagen adding upgrades until you feel that ending on the first place is actually possible, is everything but fun...

no one forces you to do that race.............. its optional, I fail to see the issue.

 

[birksy82]

I will put good money on that PD are pleasing more people with the seasonal events being unrestricted than when they weren't, more people will be able to win them so more will actually bother to actually play them as they are now.

The majority will always get what they want, that's just how it is.

I still can't believe that this thread is still going.

 

[GasolineJunkie]

I'm all for making the game accessible for as many people as possible but I liked it better when the restrictions were in place. It makes it easier to know what is acheivable but still a good challenge.

Now, we have to try it stock, see what the outcome is, maybe make some upgrades, try it again, etc. And I know that is fun for some people but I would rather know what is the hardest setup that is still possible to win gold.

Maybe instead of enforcing restrictions, each race could have a list of restrictions that you could follow for more of a challenge. If there were no restrictions on the NASCAR challenge at the ring, I might have thought it was impossible with the setup that was enforced, and then upgraded my car. I'm glad I didn't because it was more than worth it to win it when it was such a challenge for me.

All in all, I'm glad they allow more people to have fun and win the races, but I wish they would at least provide us with a guide to follow at our own will if we wanted to.

 

[elric718]

I just want to add that only have about 10 hours a week to play this game, so I don't really have time to do each race 20 times to get it right.

I generally do the race once with a very minor upgrade and keep at it until I finish first or 2nd with as little upgrading as possible, yet after maybe 5 attempts. If I was still a kid, I would have the patience to try 10 times or more, but I just don't anymore.

P.S. I must buy 15 full priced games every year, but I only really get into 1 or 2 of them. Having the option to blast through the other ones in a few hours is fine by me.

 

[jackargent]

I think we have now established beyond all doubt that some people love the seasonal events & some people don't...oh & some people sort of like them a bit but they could be better.
Excellent work guys.

 

[PataNegra]

no one forces you to do that race.............. its optional, I fail to see the issue.

If you read my previous posts, you'll see that this specific race is just an example... I've had the same feeling with all A-spec races and most seasonal events...

No one forces me to do that race, or any other race, but I bought the game to play and enjoy the different challenges, not for testing them until I balance each race to make it fun...

English is not my native language, so maybe I'm not explaining myself correctly, but is not that difficult to understand...

 

[marshy10156]

If you read my previous posts, you'll see that this specific race is just an example... I've had the same feeling with all A-spec races and most seasonal events...

No one forces me to do that race, or any other race, but I bought the game to play and enjoy the different challenges, not for testing them until I balance each race to make it fun...

English is not my native language, so maybe I'm not explaining myself correctly, but is not that difficult to understand...

It isn't that you aren't explaining yourself, it's people like Troll and Leper (even admits he fails to see the issue) is that they don't get that having no restrictions is fine but for people who do want a challenge thats this is very boring/time wasting (yes this is an issue i don't have a lot of time on my hands to be going back and forth to make these races FUN)
but with one simple implementation (difficulty levels or pre-set restrictions on each of the 5 SE's) it stops one group or another from feeling left out in the cold.
EVERYONE would have an option (go high HP and demolish the competition and earn credits/exp or go low and have a more fun race)

There's not even any need to gift the elitests extra credits for doing it on a harder setting as it's their choice (it will still fuel their ego, e.g. "i completed it on MAX difficulty! what? you only did it 95% mwuhahaha **hurls abuse**)

 

[xXDoc187Xx]

You guys still going on about this "no restrictions no fun" bs, I bet if the 1st seasonal event didn't have any restrictions you guys wouldn't be here whining about how its need ect......

 

[PataNegra]

You guys still going on about this "no restrictions no fun" bs, I bet if the 1st seasonal event didn't have any restrictions you guys wouldn't be here whining about how its need ect......

I don't think so, I've been missing restrictions (or difficulty levels) even in the A-spec mode, from the first race to the last one, with only 2 exceptions if I remember well...

 

[Resident Troll]

It isn't that you aren't explaining yourself, it's people like Troll and Leper (even admits he fails to see the issue) is that they don't get that having no restrictions is fine but for people who do want a challenge thats this is very boring/time wasting (yes this is an issue i don't have a lot of time on my hands to be going back and forth to make these races FUN)
but with one simple implementation (difficulty levels or pre-set restrictions on each of the 5 SE's) it stops one group or another from feeling left out in the cold.
EVERYONE would have an option (go high HP and demolish the competition and earn credits/exp or go low and have a more fun race)

There's not even any need to gift the elitests extra credits for doing it on a harder setting as it's their choice (it will still fuel their ego, e.g. "i completed it on MAX difficulty! what? you only did it 95% mwuhahaha **hurls abuse**)

This time excuse just doesn't make sense. Right now you are complaining because you have to tune cars to make it fun. Why? Just run them straight stock, no tuning. If you can not quickly beat the event with a straight stock car then how can you expect to do it if restriction were in place? Plus with restrictions in place you will spend extraordinary amounts of time just trying to win, far more then you would spend now tuning a car to make it challenge. Only a minority of people enjoy grinding an event over and over and over in the hopes of winning. The majority just want to have fun.

 

[Jeromezor]

I say for the upcoming seasonal events, let's have 2 extra bonus races which are restricted (car/tyres) and are EXTREMELY challenging. Reward no credits but a monstrous ammount of XP relative to your level. Say 35% XP of the current levelup. That'd be cool, and anyone could level up much easier. It would take just 15 weeks to reach level 33> 40 instead of 150 weeks as it is now >.<

 

[Resident Troll]

I say for the upcoming seasonal events, let's have 2 extra bonus races which are restricted (car/tyres) and are EXTREMELY challenging. Reward no credits but a monstrous ammount of XP relative to your level. Say 35% XP of the current levelup. That'd be cool, and anyone could level up much easier. It would take just 15 weeks to reach level 33> 40 instead of 150 weeks as it is now >.<

I like it. Anything that caters to everyone is always a plus.

 

[marshy10156]

This time excuse just doesn't make sense. Right now you are complaining because you have to tune cars to make it fun. Why? Just run them straight stock, no tuning. If you can not quickly beat the event with a straight stock car then how can you expect to do it if restriction were in place? Plus with restrictions in place you will spend extraordinary amounts of time just trying to win, far more then you would spend now tuning a car to make it challenge. Only a minority of people enjoy grinding an event over and over and over in the hopes of winning. The majority just want to have fun.

I usually do no tuning, sometimes knock up the tyre grade +1 if i'm struggling but some events (kubelwagen) took approx 45mins (without counting the times of actual racing) of tickering till i got it right, it was not fun. Even the I-miev race i did a lot of tuning to get that one.

If you re-read what i wrote i said have them restricted but over the 5 races have them increasing in difficulty (1st race easy, 5th race super-pros only) or even recomended tune set-ups (easy 350bhp-racing hard, medium 330-sports softs, hard 310-sports hard) just so you know if you are consistantly a high/mid/low level racer you know what you need to do to win the race. Just want to do the race quickly and reap the rewards you could still take an over powered car and demolish it.

Pretty much just any sort of consistency across the board of races because at the moment you can go into the race with a stock car thinking you can do it when it turns out you can't get anywhere near because it seems PD didn't test them and just leave it up to us to figure out what to do with the game. I understand a lot of people like this but just SOMETHING, to help out the section of loyal racers they seem to be pushing away, would be a big improvement in my eyes.

Thinking about it a set-up similar the Specials (AMG flight academy, Seb Loeb Rally, etc.) would be great to see where you get given a car and told to beat you're competitors, you win, you keep the car + small prize money or opt for full prize money.

 

[Shadyfruit]

You don't have to fully tune your car if you want a challenge!

 

[marshy10156]

You don't have to fully tune your car if you want a challenge!

How about reading the 12 PAGES!! of comments before posting something utterly useless to the forum

 

[FerrariMarv]

Its funny how people make threads; where as the title seems to insinuate that we all feel the same way. I like it the way it is.

is it really too easy on PRO physics, no assists, no upgrades?

As the saying goes; be carefull what you wish for

the seasonal event where too complicated at the begining imo. I tried to get into it but the hp resrictions made it a real chore.

tried again a few weeks ago and noticed it was more laxed:tup:
made about 4million, had FUN

as a whole a challange is fun; as long as that challange isnt to taxing.
It reminds me of call of duty.
Its fun but the kaos of war is taxing if you realy get into it while you play. it makes me unable to play for long periods; because it drains me mentaly. so it not that much fun. Its really a game I MAKE my self play.(to stay sharp)

it like saying golding licenses is fun?

 

[lator-illa]

I myself miss the restrictions. Seasonal Events #2 was probably one of the hardest events i've raced in the GT series. I would say the Ford Focus and the RX7 in Tsukuba are up there in terms of difficulty level. But so satisfying when you do end up winning.

 

[Zero7159]

If you re-read what i wrote i said have them restricted but over the 5 races have them increasing in difficulty (1st race easy, 5th race super-pros only) or even recomended tune set-ups (easy 350bhp-racing hard, medium 330-sports softs, hard 310-sports hard) just so you know if you are consistantly a high/mid/low level racer you know what you need to do to win the race. Just want to do the race quickly and reap the rewards you could still take an over powered car and demolish it.

The problem with your approach is that you are excluding a guy like me, who has little time to play videogames, and when I play I am generally bad at them, from playing the "5th race super-pros only" and winning at it. Isn't the better approach to allow the user (me or you) to choose how hard the race should be? Why does PD have to take that choice away from me or you? To a large extent, PD did that with earlier GT games and GT5 Prologue and thus I never came close to finishing any of those games. They were just too damn hard and time consuming during the later stages. GT5 (and every Forza game for that matter) strikes a balance by giving the user (me or you) full control over the difficulty via the assists and tuning.

 

[Resident Troll]

The problem with your approach is that you are excluding a guy like me, who has little time to play videogames, and when I play I am generally bad at them, from playing the "5th race super-pros only" and winning at it. Isn't the better approach to allow the user (me or you) to choose how hard the race should be? Why does PD have to take that choice away from me or you? To a large extent, PD did that with earlier GT games and GT5 Prologue and thus I never came close to finishing any of those games. They were just too damn hard and time consuming during the later stages. GT5 (and every Forza game for that matter) strikes a balance by giving the user (me or you) full control over the difficulty via the assists and tuning.

Thats the rib. The guys that play 6 - 8 hours a day want to be able to complete them and not have Joe Blow able to as well with a little tweaking and far less commitment. I know everyone is crying the "time" issue but I do not buy it and believe it is the "elite" issue that has the minorities panties in a bunch. I am like you, I want to sit down, spend a little time and have fun. Sure once in awhile I will take a few hours and grind something out but that should not be the requirement for a game, your user base will quickly diminish and I fully believe PD wants to maximize users in-order to sell us a crap load of DLC over the next few years. I know personally, as long as they keep dropping cool, easy and fun to drive events on us, I will continue to play and when DLC comes out I will be sure to buy. If they start ratcheting up the difficulty to a point only a hand full of people have a chance of completing, I am done and will move on.

 

[marshy10156]

To Both Zero and RT, you both seem to be missing MY point i'm agreeing with you in a way. I'm only offering suggestions, to an extent i like no restrictions (if i'm driving a car i hate or even when i just cant be bothered, i'll just max it out to get it over and done with and gain credits to blow on another car)
I think even just having the recommended HP and tyre restrictions (recommended being the key word there) it would save people like myself the time and effort issues of trying to find a tuning that keeps it challenging and do-able whilst still leaving it open for the more casual users (just to say I play a lot whilst still having a 9 to 5 job AND a social life outside of PS3 but can't really call myself a casual user). You don't have to take away the choice from the player but just offering us a choice rather then seemingly selling us the game and telling us to just get on with it, which is how i feel about this game sometimes.

Also just to add, RT, i have no issues with people golding all the events. Just because people are limited by skill level/time issues doesn't mean they should be forced to have less than 100% of the game they bought (otherwise i wouldn't have ever gotten into the GT series when i was 8) for the elitists there's always Licenses and Time Trials lol. I bought this game to race & collect cars, without SE's i would have a lot less cars in my garage (which the thought of makes me sad) but i just want to be able to have some decent racing without wasting time doing set-ups etc. or being forced to go online (even though I have plenty of races online, sometimes i just get too sick and tired of the ramming/glitching/general annoying driving)

 

[BigYoSpeck]

Thats the rib. The guys that play 6 - 8 hours a day want to be able to complete them and not have Joe Blow able to as well with a little tweaking and far less commitment. I know everyone is crying the "time" issue but I do not buy it and believe it is the "elite" issue that has the minorities panties in a bunch. I am like you, I want to sit down, spend a little time and have fun. Sure once in awhile I will take a few hours and grind something out but that should not be the requirement for a game, your user base will quickly diminish and I fully believe PD wants to maximize users in-order to sell us a crap load of DLC over the next few years. I know personally, as long as they keep dropping cool, easy and fun to drive events on us, I will continue to play and when DLC comes out I will be sure to buy. If they start ratcheting up the difficulty to a point only a hand full of people have a chance of completing, I am done and will move on.

This whole 'elitist' issue and panties in a bunch/whining that's been mentioned a few times now, where exactly is this? I've seen 12 pages of people complaining that the restriction free system doesn't present them with a challenge unless there is some kind of guideline as to what the real challenge would be who are perfectly happy for there to be an easy mode or just plain simple free access to the games entire content for those who's boat that doesn't float followed by people refusing to concede a middle ground would make every one happy and making grandiose statements that most people don't seek a challenge presuming that they are in fact the majority.

 

[marshy10156]

This whole 'elitist' issue and panties in a bunch/whining that's been mentioned a few times now, where exactly is this? I've seen 12 pages of people complaining that the restriction free system doesn't present them with a challenge unless there is some kind of guideline as to what the real challenge would be who are perfectly happy for there to be an easy mode or just plain simple free access to the games entire content for those who's boat that doesn't float followed by people refusing to concede a middle ground would make every one happy and making grandiose statements that most people don't seek a challenge presuming that they are in fact the majority.

Big +1 on this ^

 

[PataNegra]

If you re-read what i wrote i said have them restricted but over the 5 races have them increasing in difficulty (1st race easy, 5th race super-pros only) or even recomended tune set-ups (easy 350bhp-racing hard, medium 330-sports softs, hard 310-sports hard) just so you know if you are consistantly a high/mid/low level racer you know what you need to do to win the race.

That's also a good idea that would fit perfectly for me. Having recommended tune set-up would be as good as having difficulty levels because it would save me all that unnecessary and boring testing.

And please, for all those that still insist about that elitist crap, make an extra effort to understand that the only thing most people is trying to explain, is that we simply want to be challenged. I'm seeing lots of people like me who don't care at all about how easily the rest of you gold each single race, in fact, I wouldn't even care if you got 100 extra million credits per race, XP or trophies for overtuning all cars...