One year after release opinion

  • Thread starter fernandito
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Sorry, I have to mention 4 things. Because online player:

1. Inconsistent, unclear and generally completely insane track limits penalty system
2. Kerb behavior, sucking cars like black holes
3. Replays, can't jump in time, incredibly difficult to use in leagues
4. The bugs in multiplayer

OK, I mentioned many more than 4 :). Also still enjoying the game though, despite the problems.
 
For me, I was really surprised to love this game this much! I now play it more than Assetto and this says a lot.

However I still find many small issues with it, some of which are pretty normal due to the weakness of our consoles and the heavy resourceful LT3.0 system:
1- Long loading times.
2- Blurry/poor AA/pixelated graphics.
3- Not so great FFB feeling (it could be more realistic though, dunno) (compared to AC at least).
4- Low volume overall on my USB headset (on regular 3.5mm to DS4 it's fine) (compared to AC at least).
5- Slow AI on rain (not a big deal).
6- Lagging in online lobbies when someone joins or leaves.
7- Very VERY limited filter options in multiplayer. What if I want to filter available races to join? (not the ongoing ones)or filter by car or by track? (filter not sort)... etc...
8- Inability to name an online lobby or to even use a description for it.
9- Frequent disconnects when joining a lobby or sometimes even during sessions.
10- The ONLY game that doesn't play well with my 4g wifi-hotspot. Sometimes my wifi is down or slow so I use my 4g as wifi-hotpost on my phone to connect my ps4 to and enjoy gaming online. All of the games work fine except for PC2 (maybe coz it's P2P connection and not server based?!).
11- Online replay saving is limited to ~40min (if I remember well).
12- Very confusing penalty system (especially slowdowns; we don't know for how much we need to slow down; and sometimes it goes away). The penalty system in GTS and AC is much better when it comes to conveying info and showing exact time to slow down.
13- No online matchmaking whatsoever. (Yes I know rating a lobby can narrow a bit the gap but it's not always a good indicator).

Yes AC probably has better physics and FFB feel, and GTS has better graphics and/or online experience but overall PC2 is by far the best and most complete racing game on consoles, period.

Very respectful opinion of yours..

FFB is very good on PC2, but not quite easy to set up as assetto for sure that got a very good FFB out of box.

About your point 6...i don't notice any lag anymore since quite some updates ago when people enter or leave the lobby.

I play with mostly wired connection, fixed IP, Google DNS and all ports opened
The only problems I've got sometimes are a bit of lag or a a disconnection .. But it's not often, and I host an online championship every Monday..

About replay online saves.... My races are 45 min and the game saves them full... Longer I don't know...

About slow downs penalties, yup, would be great to have a countdown in the hud...it was asked quite some times in the support forums.. But no success to finally see it implemented

The PC version if I'm correct has the ability to name the lobby, text chat.. But on PC it runs in dedicated servers while console version runs on P2P servers.... It really shouldn't be an excuse, cause the personalized lobbies on GTS has text chat and ability to name the lobby...but that game suffer other big netcode problems..

Hopefully in the next generation at least all racing games the online is hosted on more capable and stable dedicated servers as assetto or GT Sport mode servers.

And yes, PC2 as assetto and most games don't have matchmaking as iracing or GTS, a feature that will be become for sure more popular in next games as we already see with assetto corsa competizione (hope to see it on consoles)

And like you stated, every game has his pros and cons, for me also PC2 is the most complete racing sim available on console till now ..
 
I still think that a PC2.5 kinda thing should be released with a load of features, dlc & patches added that fans have asked for as a choice for say £10-£20. If you don't want it, you don't have to have it, but the die hard fans will want it & will probably pay. I would.

I'm having a pretty good guess that PC3 will be next gen, mainly because they cannot push this generation anymore without the game suffering.

So that's a 2 year wait to survive on PC2 & then what?
50% will buy a new system.
50% will enjoy racing games.
50% will prefer sim over arcade.
50% will remember PC2.
50% will buy PC3.

This is possibly a little generous but hey ho you get what I mean (hopefully)

Just carry on supporting what we love & enjoy a little longer.
 
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My thoughts after one year PC2 on the PS4:

Even if PC2 it's kinda good now, I hated to be an alpha tester for month and month paying the full price. And I still don't trust the setups, the weather, the games overall stability, the AA, the DS4 settings, the "design decisions" (cracking chat since ever, no Nordschleife pits)... and that no one of my PS4 "friends" plays it any more because of all that bugs.

But the worse thing was the arrogance and stupidity of some supporters and fanboys in the PCars forums. All this together made the (imho) best racing game loose against a really poor GTSport. So there is no way for a shivering fanboys "Thank You!" for SMS, from a business view SMS is as terrible a gaming company can be. (...and I really liked the idea that a tiny british company is making the better game)
 
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My thoughts after one year PC2 on the PS4:

Even if PC2 it's kinda good now, I hated to be an alpha tester for month and month paying the full price.
This is what burnt me the most too, and for the second time after pc1. I hope they reconsider checking the game status before launch this time, otherwise it may be the last given the very bad reputation pc2 obviously got very early with being a badly bugged game. PC2 is best sim out there since release, but the setups and the other issues around hurt its reputation too much, again. It's just that sad that you don't reconsider the damage this can to such a good game, and please don't begin with the meeting dealines story. It's just that sad. "You don't know nothing about development blahblah".., ********!

It is easy sms. You release a properly functional game in all of its areas, word spreads, and we all win. Release pc3 in the same status as pc2, and you know what happens next.

Jeez they weren't able to even fix the country flags when online lol. It's just that laughable. And they won't fix the problems this engine has been having with managing windows files/folders since the days of Need for Speed Unleashed. Unfixable stuff lying underneath main code is unfixable stuff, is it not SMS?, and are we going for a third attempt with pc3 on this department too?, jesus what happened with the setup screen in pc2 was not normal and you know it. The setups messing all over and again and again in a sim...; normal that you frustrated so many, and also normal they criticized the game that hard.
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I was expecting some trailer or something of that need for speed game they are supposed to be developing according to rumour control, now for Christmas. ok wrong, but if that game is going to be some sorta driveclub game with pc2 street tyre physics on classic need for speed environments (Rivals), then oh boy can't wait to see it in action.
 
They will not reconsider anything.
They don't care. They want your money fast. They don't care the product is good if there's still people buying.

And this is no devs fault. It's who gives the orders fault.
The pc 2 was abandoned in the day of the release little more than one year ago. It's the SMS mentality. It will not change until leadership changes.
Pc3 will be the same.

You spoke about the flags.
You have tons of simple bugs that were not fixed. Tons of nonsense design choices that were not changed.

And the not showing lobbies? The game has poor online, almost no one online and still there are lobbies disappearing from the list. I just got out of one lobby that was not full, to change my car and when I tried to get back to it, it was not showing.

Ian says it's the best sim and pc3 will be the God of sims.... still, the sim community plays other older titles. LOL
 
The pc 2 was abandoned in the day of the release little more than one year ago. It's the SMS mentality. It will not change until leadership changes.
Erm. A year of patches pretty much disproves that.

Tons of nonsense design choices that were not changed.
Design choices are usually discussed in committee and changing this in a patch would require a lot of unnecessary work that could be put to bugfixing etc. A programmer has an allotment of time and if you put that to them simply changing the design of the game as opposed to issues, that's pretty much a waste of time. The only thing they can and should do is take the feedback into account for the next game.
 
One year after release I like Mr Bell have given up on the game unless anything changes I just don't feel the need to play it anymore and yet I still cant bring myself to start GTS. So the near future is looking pretty bleak for driving games and the ps4 ATM i'm just having fun playing the crew 2
 
I stopped playing PC2 for the Christmas Break, but last night I fired it up for my Nephew and was reminded of what a great game it can be!

Some of the design choices I find frustrating and bizarre. I also don't understand why Bandai Namco didn't flood the Christmas shelves with a Complete / Ultimate Edition of the game.

Stopping updates / fixes to the game seems short-sighted. Surely the next game is two (or more likely three years) away and continuing to polish PC2 (together with a Complete Edition release) could do a lot to build the player base.
 
I'm still playing the game religiously, every bit of spare time I'm thinking of weird & wonderful combinations, I simply can't get enough.

But this (here's you game, we'll support it for a year & that's it regardless) mentality pisses me off, especially in this day & age when most games are still supported even when the new version is out.

I mean christ, the kids PS3 version of minecraft got an update a few weeks ago & here we are nearing the end of the PS4.

I don't know who's making the business decisions Namco or SMS but as @Sick Cylinder says it's a very short sighted approach that's not doing them any favours.

They have got a fantastic product here but like all things, to stay fantastic it needs love & support, not led out to barn with a shotgun after a year like an old incompetent sheep dog.
 
Simple question then, regarding extended support (and this is not meant aggressively, or in excess defence of SMS etc) - who pays? SMS are a mid-sized independent developer. They don't have Sony/MS money behind them - which is a good thing!

However the problem then is they don't have unlimited funds - you want them to support pCARS2 for another year? Maybe 2? How do they pay their developers/artists/whatever given this will generate minimal additional game sales at this point in the lifecycle, and additional DLC will also probably not get many buyers? You can talk about generating goodwill for future projects, and that's all well and good, but that doesn't pay mortgages etc.

They supported and updated the game for a year and fulfilled their DLC commitments. I'm happy with the game I paid (well, put £100 into WMD) for, and I'll be right there for the next iteration if and when it comes around.
 
Well, I would think that they would not need to put many people on supporting the game, no need to keep any artists or designers working on it, possibly just a couple programmers with another person supervising would had been more than enough to keep working on bug fixes, for some of the most annoying bugs.

I find it hard to believe that doing that for a few more months would have had a noticeable impact on the budget, while on the other hand it would had been making the game even more enjoying to play, with less frustrations, and would make us more excited for this game and for the next one in the series...
 
@gregc, I do sort of agree with you & understand that they are a small team with big ambitions.

I, like you, would be happy to buy PC3 (no questions asked) & if I had the programming skills I would be asking @IanBell for a job so I could be a part of it (but I don't), my love for cars has always been there but my love for sim racing has grown extremely rapidly over the past year with PC2.

However I can see the player base being even smaller on PC3 because it'll only be the die hard fans buying it, as the casual sim racers (if there is such a thing) or the people they're trying to win over will feel they've been burnt twice, which in turn isn't going to help pay the mortgage either.

Just to make you aware my only main gripe with PC2 is the imbalances regarding wet weather (AI & puddles) & the removal of the chicane at Classic Monza (or the option to at least).

This video is me in a thunderstorm & both the AI & me didn't even need to pit for wet tyres (which worked in my favour for once) we all stayed on dry.

But there are 50% of tracks that are just impossible to race on due to puddle intensity (with wet tyres & using a steering wheel) while the AI sails through at speed (pun intended) which does make the feature 50% useless.

I'm not asking for more DLC, but just few little tidying up patches to iron out the quirks, just knowing that they'll look into it & do what they can in due time would be enough for me (other people might feel different) but just 1 or 2 people combing through the code & 1 final patch would pay dividend in the long run.

You can't not support the already small number of people that you have & try to encourage more players with this way of thinking, it don't make sense (business or otherwise) in the long run, you need to invest & put a concrete base down now for this product to grow even bigger otherwise it'll crumble & fall, which I & quite a few fans don't want to happen, the more sims we have competing & pushing each other the better sim community will be.

Bandai Namco should be aware of this aswell & support your decision if they want to see a return & if I were them I'd be throwing money at you, because you have succeeded in bringing something good & different to an already niche market which has made a few people stand up & say "hey these guy's are serious"
 
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As much I would like to play the game more regular, which for me would be almost daily, I still can't get myself to prefer it constant over other games. Whether it's starting up F1 for some racing or playing shooters or other storybased singleplayer games I often wonder why I didn't choose to start PC2.

Although it has almost everything to get me hooked it doesn't. The custom races seem a bit empty sometimes, simulating a championship is difficult wity varying cars / liveries and getting caught out by strange weather is often quite a bummer.

We all would like to see further improvements but we have to accept SMS's decision to stop the support. Perhaps we should hope for the game to become a PS plus game
 
Let's be clear. No one of us have ever enjoyed a sim like this, ever. Tyre model is the best; content ammount undisputed, as well as the weather stuff which is just too good to be true.

However, in the eyes of the public, the issues ended up gathering more strength on the internet and once again damaging the reputation of project cars which reflected on eventual yearly sales. This hasn't been of justice at all because pc2 has been the best sim for a full year, and continues too (perhaps until pc3?)

Happy new year everyone! Cheers!
 
Although it has almost everything to get me hooked it doesn't. The custom races seem a bit empty sometimes, simulating a championship is difficult wity varying cars / liveries and getting caught out by strange weather is often quite a bummer.
"Almost everything to get me hooked" is an apt description for how I feel, too. The physics and general features are great, but custom single races get repetitive without a more compelling career mode or custom championships, and the car list still lacks too many of my favorites and the sort of cars I would prefer to drive. Subarus, more old BMW roadcars, more old Porsche roadcars, roadcars in the Class F or Class G range of performance...

Let's be clear. No one of us have ever enjoyed a sim like this, ever. Tyre model is the best; content ammount undisputed, as well as the weather stuff which is just too good to be true.
Tire model is good, the amount of tracks is good, weather effects are good, but that doesn't make it the most enjoyable sim I've played. That would be Enthusia Professional Racing, still to this day, because it has a much more appealing selection of cars and much more enjoyable gameplay modes.
 
That would be Enthusia Professional Racing, still to this day,
The one for ps2 you say?, and yes sorry for speaking for everyone my mistake of course, but that's just because of how much fun I have had withpc2, and that the hype continues
 
The one for ps2 you say?, and yes sorry for speaking for everyone my mistake of course, but that's just because of how much fun I have had withpc2, and that the hype continues
PCARS2 is without a doubt the best sim I've played since EPR. :cheers:
 
Although it has almost everything to get me hooked it doesn't.

I think this comment accurately describes how many people feel about the game.

For me some of the Season Pass DLC has been excellent, but to make proper use of that I really need a Custom Championships feature - and a few extra DLC cars.

Perhaps we should hope for the game to become a PS plus game

I think this is a very good comment and it could significantly swell the number of people playing the game - probably best to do this in the last 6-12 months before release of PC3. Before that Bandai Namco should release a Complete / Ultimate edition - I was surprised that they didn't in time for Christmas 2018, but maybe the plan is to do so before next Christmas?
 
Hi all!

I bought PC2 about 2 months ago after taking a break from sim racing and selling off all my racing gear in early 2013. One of my ex-colleagues opened up a sim racing centre here in Reykjavik, Iceland called "GT Akademian", and the licensed game he was running was PC2, so my first experience of it - and sim racing again - was around November and in a proper 3-screen full motion rig with crazy expensive setup. Like this:

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After years of playing Gran Turismo 5P and 5 with my Logitech wheels at home, competing in GT Academy and regularly in the WRS here on GTPlanet, I felt immediately at home in the game (which I assume must have been running the latest patched version) and felt all of my gathered experience of physics and track knowledge to be immediately transferable to PC2 on these rigs.

As the owner of the centre is my ex-colleague, a bunch of us from the office who are enthusiastic about this sort of thing all went regularly for a few nights and then downloaded the game for playing in the office, on X-box controllers on PC. Lunchtime races became a thing, and although some of the less-experienced players in the office struggled on pad and much preferred the sim rig experience, I managed to make pad use work for me better than I ever had done on GT5P with Sixaxis.

I once kept a journal thread here on GTPlanet about my transition from Sixaxis to G25 use and all the experiences, difficulties and successes that involved. So to be able to match the wheel laptimes I was doing over the next month or so in the office on pad - even setting one world record time on the time trial leaderboards - was extremely refreshing. It also meant I could enjoy sim racing again without the whole wheel/stand (and now a strong PC) at home, making it affordable and easier to fit in around family life.

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Having helped out with GT Academy UK and Mercedes benz GT events in the past, I was really interested to see how the GT Akademian centre here in Iceland would do hosting its opening celebration tournament using Project Cars 2, especially with the rigs they have, the smaller audience here but with a full streaming team in house. We did have some issues with setting up the lobby, and the VR machine which was one of the 8 rigs here gave us some issues but overall it was a huge success. The track boundary penalties almost decided the outcome of one race, which is a shame as they seem completely draconian at some locations!

Playing the game more and more at the centre on the rigs, I started to improve a lot and some of the old technique filtered back, to the point where I could regularly carry out direct comparisons with the pad use. Some odd things started to emerge, like how on my controller set up at full lock, a number of corners were not full throttle as the car would understeer, but on the rigs using the wheel with precisely the same settings, the car would almost have a higher turning angle and be able to do corners full throttle - e.g. the last corner at Algarve in a default setup McLaren 650S GT3 with Stable setting. I did the same laptime after 2 laps in the rig in time trial as I had in the office on pad after an hour.

Maybe this is a setting I'm just missing on the pad in the controller setup menu? It seems a wild disadvantage to not be able to get the same steering/turning angle with the exact same car setup and environmental settings as a wheel.

Before that realisation, I had been extremely happy with the pad use and I was very competitive. It was possible to race clean, save some slides (but not as much as with the wheel), with the obvious caveat that the odd countersteer resulted in snap oversteer in the opposite direction. Definitely an issue with more loose setups needed for some of the time trial leaderboards.

EDIT: Right, Steering Sensitivity. Found it haha!

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One of my absolute favourite features of PC2 is the ability to create custom liveries in photoshop and then use them in-game. Working with a bunch of graphic designers has really allowed us to explore this feature and create some mega liveries that we export and use in the rigs at GT Akademian too. I know it's a niche feature, but I dream of Project Cars 3 allowing the option to have multiple custom liveries for the same car. I basically had to abandon my amazing 80s Lambo livery above because one of my colleagues was desperate to race the Lambo in our events, so I migrated to the McLaren, since we wouldn't be able to have 2 different custom liveries in-race. It's been really awesome to have the Big Mac McLaren, a Sony VHS-liveried 488, a ZX Spectrum liveried AMG and a Wipeout-liveried Audi - all designed by graphic designers (and me) race together. Watching the replays has been incredible fun, although i wish the trackside camera angles were more varied lap after lap the way GT's are.

I really like the sounds in the game and I find much more success using the cockpit view than I ever did in GT - where I used bumper cam for lap time purposes.

I really find it surprising that there's no reverse grid option, so in the tournament when the lobby went kaput after qualifying, we really had to fudge it to get the correct grid for the final race - as there was no way to set the custom grid after re-making a lobby.

Overall, I really love the game. It got me back into sim racing after nearly 6 years away, and the itch had really started to come back, yet something about GT Sport made me hesitate to dive in. I wonder if people are still using the handbrake in GT racing cars to get more rotation in corners as they were at the end of GT5 and that year's GT Academy time trial at Silverstone :P

PC2 does have issues with lobbies and lag, the bugs where the pit crew won't put the right requested tyres on etc... so basically when we race we turn off the tyre and fuel wear and just race for speed and close fun racing, and we tend to race together locally instead of venturing into online lobbies where we had some awful experiences with punters. In that respect I guess it's similar to GT where it's worth investing time in joining a community and getting into league/WRS race groups where you know the racing is clean.

Oh, and it doesn't hurt my feelings towards the game that I won the opening GT Akademian championship event :D

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EDIT: I forgot to add, I do wish there was a way of watching ghost replays in the video section; something more than just trying to keep up with the ghost on track to see how the best do it!

All the best
Maz
 
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Good read 👍 Just to pick up on this point:

Playing the game more and more at the centre on the rigs, I started to improve a lot and some of the old technique filtered back, to the point where I could regularly carry out direct comparisons with the pad use. Some odd things started to emerge, like how on my controller set up at full lock, a number of corners were not full throttle as the car would understeer, but on the rigs using the wheel with precisely the same settings, the car would almost have a higher turning angle and be able to do corners full throttle - e.g. the last corner at Algarve in a default setup McLaren 650S GT3 with Stable setting. I did the same laptime after 2 laps in the rig in time trial as I had in the office on pad after an hour.

Maybe this is a setting I'm just missing on the pad in the controller setup menu? It seems a wild disadvantage to not be able to get the same steering/turning angle with the exact same car setup and environmental settings as a wheel.

I'm reasonably sure that the setting you need to be adjusting here is Speed Sensitivity - it basically reduces the amount of lock available the faster you go, and the default setting of 95 is quite conservative, enough that in mid to high speed corners you simply cannot get enough lock to make the turn (which feels like understeer, but without any tyre slip). I understand why they've done it this way, as a lower setting can feel a bit twitchy, but to get that last bit of corner speed you will need to reduce it. I'm currently running with it at 75, which feels good for me.
 
Good read 👍 Just to pick up on this point:



I'm reasonably sure that the setting you need to be adjusting here is Speed Sensitivity - it basically reduces the amount of lock available the faster you go, and the default setting of 95 is quite conservative, enough that in mid to high speed corners you simply cannot get enough lock to make the turn (which feels like understeer, but without any tyre slip). I understand why they've done it this way, as a lower setting can feel a bit twitchy, but to get that last bit of corner speed you will need to reduce it. I'm currently running with it at 75, which feels good for me.

Absolutely spot on, and I realise I had just taken the settings I looked up online a month or so ago as gospel and never bothered to read the actual in-game description for each parameter! I had been running it at 100, and just tried 75...wow that's twitchy but the perceived understeer is gone! I'm just running 85 and have lopped off half a second from my Portimao laptimes...

Thanks for the reply!

All the best
Maz
 
Erm. A year of patches pretty much disproves that.

A year of "patches" with releases almost only with the dlc releases, the change logs with fixes that didn't happen, the omitted change logs after, hiding what they have "fixed" and the ton of bugs and some of them really basic that still exist, pretty much proves that.

Design choices are usually discussed in committee and changing this in a patch would require a lot of unnecessary work that could be put to bugfixing etc. A programmer has an allotment of time and if you put that to them simply changing the design of the game as opposed to issues, that's pretty much a waste of time. The only thing they can and should do is take the feedback into account for the next game.

Let's not be intellectualy dishonest here.
We are not talking about changing the core of the game, or rebuild a feature.


For sure it is not needed a meeting with the Namco president, it is not a unnecessary task, it doesn't take 1 mouth to change, neither is something that can only be done in the next iteration to not send you to the main menu after you leave a lobby when playing online.
 
Very nice post indeed!

EDIT: I forgot to add, I do wish there was a way of watching ghost replays in the video section; something more than just trying to keep up with the ghost on track to see how the best do it!

You can do this when you are in time trial (having selected a ghost when starting it), just click on the ghost name itself (not the gear symbol) in the opening screen and you will get a replay of the ghost.
 
Very nice post indeed!



You can do this when you are in time trial (having selected a ghost when starting it), just click on the ghost name itself (not the gear symbol) in the opening screen and you will get a replay of the ghost.

Thank you! Just gave this a go and I did indeed get the replay, but with no sound and no HUD gear info etc. Is that normal?

omfg nice stuff man

Many kind thanks!

All the best
Maz
 
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