PENALTY SYSTEM IS STILL A PIECE OF ****!!!

[Sven Jurgens]

I'm out of the loop; GTS apparently received a big penalty revision not too long ago? My wheel's been shelved for two or maybe even three months now; could anyone kindly point me in the direction of the thread that describes the changes or just summarizes them on a post here? Reviewing the last two pages as of this post, it appears that the system is still pretty negatively-received when it comes to incidents involving contact.

It seems to change on a weekly basis now. The current theme is harsh SR deductions, -10 SR per contact SR Down, while still small or no time penalties. Blame assignment is worse than ever, seems still based on observed advantage which is as dumb as when you punt a car they receive a speed advantage, thus get a penalty. (Or negates the penalty the punter would receive when the puntee goes off)

The big penalty revision is still coming, that patch hasn't landed yet. It's just tweaks to SR loss and what registers as contact that's changing week to week. Plus this week has no penalty zone in race B.

 

[elston87]

It seems to change on a weekly basis now. The current theme is harsh SR deductions, -10 SR per contact SR Down, while still small or no time penalties. Blame assignment is worse than ever, seems still based on observed advantage which is as dumb as when you punt a car they receive a speed advantage, thus get a penalty. (Or negates the penalty the punter would receive when the puntee goes off)

The big penalty revision is still coming, that patch hasn't landed yet. It's just tweaks to SR loss and what registers as contact that's changing week to week. Plus this week has no penalty zone in race B.

I see. While I'm curious about how my racing experiences would go, and how different they would be on a weekly basis with constant penalty revisions, sounds like I'll be waiting for when that update actually arrives before I setup my wheel again. Thanks for the summary.

 

[GTP_TO Blue]

Lost 30 SR in one Race C today due to being tapped from behind once, rubbed on the inside once, and for being taken out at T1, slamming into the wall and a 2 second penalty and SR down arrow.

A Brazilian who gave me the inside rub SR down, then tried to push me off the track, then break check me into Lesmo 2 got their comeuppance when they tried to further brake check me going into Ascari. I braked just before they did but with not as much force taking me into the back of them with enough forward action to send them off to make sand castles. No penalty, no SR down.

Last lap, battling with a WRX going into T1. Not seen them all race. I got the run on them down the straight, went to the middle right of the track, had my nose ahead and we got around the first chicane nicely with no contact. That was a relief for a change. Nice, a clean driver! But sadly not. Into the 2nd chicance, from .750 back they try to ram me through the corner....WTF......coming into Lesmo 1 they again tap me from behind and put 2 of my wheels onto the gravel. They are ahead then going into Lesmo 2, and try a brake check just after the 100m board. Lesson time.......I do the same move that dispatched the Brazilian earlier. No penalty to me.

So, 2 moves that should have garnered penalties and SR down gave me zilch. 3 moves out of my control and I get penalised and dumped to SR B.

 

[Silver_Wolf]

Plus this week has no penalty zone in race B.

Race B is "self manage" penalty zone (before they were introduced) so if you get a penalty it decreases the time if you slow on track or
are longer on brakes through the corner.

I guess it may be a "test" as possibly they are thinking to go back to a mix of forced penalty/self serve based system.

Not that I have had a penalty in Race B yet (only one race) but that's what I saw the other players doing!

 

[Sven Jurgens]

Race B is "self manage" penalty zone (before they were introduced) so if you get a penalty it decreases the time if you slow on track or
are longer on brakes through the corner.

I guess it may be a "test" as possibly they are thinking to go back to a mix of forced penalty/self serve based system.

Not that I have had a penalty in Race B yet (only one race) but that's what I saw the other players doing!

It was rightly abandoned since it led players to braking early to bleed penalties while blocking cars behind them from overtaking, or slow down on straights and block traffic behind them to get a boost back up to speed. Finishes turned into comedies since most people would slam on the brakes before the line to bleed off the penalty. And they are doing it again on the Nord. At least you have to slow down quite a bit to get rid of it and ghosting usually kicks in to avoid accidents. I had a car with a penalty slamming on the brakes right in front of me before the line, luckily he ghosted. Another time I had 0.5 sec from a avoiding car short cut, I just floored it to the finish while the car in front of me tried to bleed off a 1 sec penalty, failed to get rid of all of it, and crossed the line behind me also with +1 0.01 sec still turns into 1 sec.

Penalties should simply be carried over the line without rounding up, that would solve all that crap.

 

[Silver_Wolf]

It was rightly abandoned since it led players to braking early to bleed penalties while blocking cars behind them from overtaking, or slow down on straights and block traffic behind them to get a boost back up to speed. Finishes turned into comedies since most people would slam on the brakes before the line to bleed off the penalty. And they are doing it again on the Nord. At least you have to slow down quite a bit to get rid of it and ghosting usually kicks in to avoid accidents. I had a car with a penalty slamming on the brakes right in front of me before the line, luckily he ghosted. Another time I had 0.5 sec from a avoiding car short cut, I just floored it to the finish while the car in front of me tried to bleed off a 1 sec penalty, failed to get rid of all of it, and crossed the line behind me also with +1 0.01 sec still turns into 1 sec.

Penalties should simply be carried over the line without rounding up, that would solve all that crap.

I am well aware of the plus and bad points of the old system but I guess it depends on the players with the current situation.

Had several races at Nurburgring with the Porsche yesterday and whilst there were penalties I only saw one player take his penalty at the line, most crossed over and just simply had the penalty time added to the race result but that is probably down to them being DR B drivers so have a bit more sense?

At least after today I have a few days to actually go racing so I will have a better chance at all the races then.

The only negative I would say about the "ghosts" is when you get that 'klunk' noise on your car as you drive through someone whose about to unghost because that can still sometimes randomly throw a penalty but I have to say I think I've seen less penalties recently but that is probably more down
to luck than anything else.

 

[cassiusclay99]

To me, at this point, the game is basically broken. I am DR C and SR S (well...A since yesterday)...and my results in the races have nothing to do with my driving skills (which are bad, mind you...), and everything to do with the penalty system AND the points system.
I went from 9th place at the start, finished 4th... won 600 points DR points.
Next race: I start 9th, finish 13th and last because someone bumped into me and made me crash, going from 4th place to 13th (he got no penalty)... I lost 800 points in DR... and a whole rank in SR (while I did not get even 1 penalty!!)...

Another race: I accidently bump into the death chicane... and -rightly- loose tons of time...but the game gives me a 5 seconds penalty... for what exactly? Crashing into a barrier without touching anyone and/or gaining time?! I would understand losing DR points on this... but a 5 seconds penalty for a driving mistake that bothered noone ?!



And then: people ramming into each other like hooligans don't get penaltys?! Or get 0.5 or 1 second penalty max...when they repeatedly and purposely ruin everyone else's race ! I mean: seriously, sometimes, the game really looks like Destruction Derby! And noone gets penaltys...or so little!

2 years after release, the penalty system is still completely broken! How can you make an online focused game when your penalty system is such a disaster?
How can it be this bad in the first place: should have been the first game mechanic that works. The core of the game. And the game was one year late !

Since how many years has PD been working on this? The results are a terrible terrible mess.

 

[sneaky77]

The SR down arrow will make you lose Sr even without a time penalty assigned,

Now the way this is assigned is also broken for the most part or at least highly inconsistent except to penalize a lot of times the people not dive-bombing every turn.

 

[Racerx_34]

The SR down arrow will make you lose Sr even without a time penalty assigned,

Now the way this is assigned is also broken for the most part or at least highly inconsistent except to penalize a lot of times the people not dive-bombing every turn.

My SR was negged because my car ghosted and then became solid, resulting in the car behind me driving into the back of me.

 

[milehighmadd]

The SR down arrow will make you lose Sr even without a time penalty assigned,

Now the way this is assigned is also broken for the most part or at least highly inconsistent except to penalize a lot of times the people not dive-bombing every turn.

Yep. Each orange down arrow is -10 SR. And oddly, I had a race with a 4s collision penalty, and my SR rose +1 afterward.

 

[O604]

I think things are vastly better since the update.

Right before the update I was about to quit altogether. It was bad. It's not perfect now but works well enough that it still motivates me to play.

Biggest difference I see is a lot less intentionally dirty drivers out to ruin races vs before the update. Weeding those players out, for me has made all the difference in enjoying online racing.

 

[cassiusclay99]

I think things are vastly better since the update.

Right before the update I was about to quit altogether. It was bad. It's not perfect now but works well enough that it still motivates me to play.

Biggest difference I see is a lot less intentionally dirty drivers out to ruin races vs before the update. Weeding those players out, for me has made all the difference in enjoying online racing.

Glad you can still have fun with the game... I don't really know what to do myself. I am willing to play but there is too much frustration compared to satisfaction... I realise that even when I play well, i spend more time avoiding any penalty than really focusing on the driving. I can't help wondering if that guy behind me will play clean or if he ll just bomb me in the next corner.
And often it s the latter.

So I end up not really defending my position... and not attacking either: I just wait for the players to make mistakes that let me get through smoothly.

The number of dirty players is really high, especially considering that I spend 99% of my play time with S SR players.

Game is broken in m book.

 

[Tea_Leaves]

Game is broken in m book.

Yep, it's certainly broken with older versions (1.52 and before) of the system remaining better than the current.

At Monza this week, cars behind have PIT maneuver me a number of times at the first chicane and I'm given a 3s penalty because of gaining a so-called speed 'advantage' in the process. I later sideswiped the person who did it off the track with no SR down or time penalty. So from what I gathered, it's still incorrect at assigning fault or simply doesn't give out penalties at all.

I'm hoping next update at least does something to address it rather than make it worse.

 

[NosOsH]

Why the system looks at the speed advantage of a puntee for maybe one second after a contact, if only it kept observing for 5,10,15,20 seconds after an incident, until both parties were back up to speed on the road, then reset the ACTUAL beneficiary back to before contact WITH a 10-20 second penalty.
That MIGHT start to detract people from doing it.

 

[RacingGrandpa]

Why the system looks at the speed advantage of a puntee for maybe one second after a contact, if only it kept observing for 5,10,15,20 seconds after an incident, until both parties were back up to speed on the road, then reset the ACTUAL beneficiary back to before contact WITH a 10-20 second penalty.
That MIGHT start to detract people from doing it.

Easy to game. Straight punt from behind, then lift off, the guy ahead gets moved back and a penalty and the offender comes out ahead

 

[cassiusclay99]

Project cars has a system where, if you hit someone and overtake it, you have 15 seconds to give its place back.

Why not add something like this in GTS?

 

[Sven Jurgens]

Project cars has a system where, if you hit someone and overtake it, you have 15 seconds to give its place back.

Why not add something like this in GTS?

1.53 had the penalty trigger when you hit and pass. It was easily gamed, simply turn into someone to stop them from over taking. It also triggered for any position loss, thus if the punter lost a position due to losing speed and getting passed by the car behind him, the puntee got the penalty.

It won't be any better by having to give the position back if the game can't even figure out who deserves the position back. You could brake check someone then pull over and completely ruin their race. Or get tapped by a car spinning out and have to wait for them to recover.

 

[Tea_Leaves]

The easiest 'solution' would be to adopt SR E ghosting at all SR tiers, it's already in the game. If I can avoid divebombers and sideswipers with a penalty to add more salt in the wound, I'd welcome it with open arms.

I never played it but I watched some footage of an online GT6 race and it appeared to be exactly like this. Although granted, it's not really considered 'racing', the penalty system still isn't up to an acceptable IMO so I'll take it.

 

[Ares85]

WTF IS GOING ON WHIT THIS SYSTEM !!! i just have been droped from A - 36500 to C - 7000 in one race !!!!!!!! WTF.

 

[RacingGrandpa]

WTF IS GOING ON WHIT THIS SYSTEM !!! i just have been droped from A - 36500 to C - 7000 in one race !!!!!!!! WTF.

It's a DR reset. If your SR drops two levels below your DR your DR gets reset.

 

[Ares85]

It's a DR reset. If your SR drops two levels below your DR your DR gets reset.

This is b....**** i have been bumpt and push off track and i get the drop of the rank.

 

[RacingGrandpa]

This is b....**** i have been bumpt and push off track and i get the drop of the rank.

I can't argue with that. The major problems with the penalties has always been appointing the blame right.

 

[DAMOHTID]

I'm so disappointed more than anything with this penalty system. I've been playing since release to only be something like C / A . At one point I was A / S. I mean it's quite easy to get back to S but C!? Was in B for ages grinding. I'm no amateur either, people have done a lot more but something's like 1200 races and almost 400 wins with equally respectable fastest laps and poles... the penalty system knocks down you rank way to easy. 2 years of playing with no accolades... unless some clicks my profile.

I came here mostly to say that racing yesterday at Tokyo in the Mx5 some guy either just wanted to take me out (for no reason) or he severely oitbraked himself, either for a massively collision from him into me into the wall it gave me the penalty... got to the point now where I just laugh.

Having fun in the Porsche wins and podiums without a Q time coming from 13th approx... those hero drives are by far the most rewarding

WTF IS GOING ON WHIT THIS SYSTEM !!! i just have been droped from A - 36500 to C - 7000 in one race !!!!!!!! WTF.

Wow that's tough. Think this is what she happened to me

 

[Redneckchef]

🤬🤬
I understand what is going on. I know we wanted to make it easier to lose SR and harder to gain it back.

But there needs to be some balance or recognition of the track. I got hit entering the chicane at Monza lap 1 and tapped by a spinning car on my way out. Nothing else a race. . . Neutral SR.
1 corner of a race C shouldn't wipe out 9.8 laps of clean contact free driving. Same with race A and B. Have they thought of weighting the contact penalties relevant to the amount possible to earn in a race?

 

[ZiltoidRacer]

🤬🤬
I understand what is going on. I know we wanted to make it easier to lose SR and harder to gain it back.

But there needs to be some balance or recognition of the track. I got hit entering the chicane at Monza lap 1 and tapped by a spinning car on my way out. Nothing else a race. . . Neutral SR.
1 corner of a race C shouldn't wipe out 9.8 laps of clean contact free driving. Same with race A and B. Have they thought of weighting the contact penalties relevant to the amount possible to earn in a race?

i was doing race C last night and got 2 SR downs in the race (only very slight contact) and that cost me 20 SR points where as a clean race of 10 laps gave me 13 SR points it's just not consistant.

 

[Tea_Leaves]

I agree SR point values need a further readjustment. Race A and B this week give very little SR and 1 SR down not only costs you the total possible points in those races, you finish in negative point equity. It's then a grind to gain it back if you focus on those two races.

Monza is 18 SR points with the CRB (pretty hard to consistently achieve with all the carnage happening unless you drive lapped as an untouchable ghost, lol) so again, a timed penalty or SR down is costly.

 

[Groundfish]

I kinda like it this way.
Fast cars on dangerous tracks carry a significant risk.
Now, they need to work on it! I’m not saying they don’t...An update is on its way...IT better be good too!
They talked it up...Personally I don’t bother with Monza.
Entering a race...To me, it’s a big deal, it’s RACEDAY. Take ANY race too lightly and you’re in trouble.
I like it this way, the element of rating risk,
but blame assignment accuracy is still completely broken.
The best way to ensure safety is put in a q time that represents your racepace, not a one lap wonder that took hours and a hundred retries, but Monza is Monza it’ll always be a complete cluster, that’s why I don’t bother.
This weeks races are all about a 9 on difficulty. FIA races are great for sr recovery if you don’t qual and just participate...They are longer and offer much sr.
I dunno, you just can’t expect to run Monza under this system and not risk reset, it’s not possible.
That said, being more careful and keeping distance from others and only making sure you overtake safely and not driving out of control is the most you can do for maintaining sr. Most people go balls out every race and end up with pens.
In a race imo you need a controlled racepace not balls out 100 percent every corner...
Not many average sr people do that. In fact they often make huge mistakes and drive over their heads. Not to mention using no tcs in race-cars...They want the position NOW...
I agree with Yalum, if your sr drops a letter you can’t race, you gotta get back to 99 first by careful cruising.
Yeah the systems not good, but it’s better than it was before last update.
If you are losing sr and don’t change your behavior...

I hope they can either get blame right or always blame everyone involved, myself.

 

[RacingGrandpa]

I agree with Yalum, if your sr drops a letter you can’t race, you gotta get back to 99 first by careful cruising.

I don't. I took it easy first lap, kept my distance to the cars ahead. It will only guarantee that the cars behind can easier catch you and straight up ram you in every corner.
The way the SR works now it's not a representation of your race craft and safety it's a representation of those around you. And there is no controlling them.

 

[Tea_Leaves]

but blame assignment accuracy is still completely broken.

That therein is the problem, I've lost SR because of another's reckless driving. That doesn't reflect on me and how clean I am as a driver. What you say would make sense if the penalty system was correctly assigning blame and more often than not, it isn't.

 

[Groundfish]

That therein is the problem, I've lost SR because of another's reckless driving. That doesn't reflect on me and how clean I am as a driver. What you say would make sense if the penalty system was correctly assigning blame and more often than not, it isn't.

True, but if you have less incidents even if it’s not very accurate you stay higher on sr. Everyone who plays has lost sr because of others...
But a full blown reset is hard to do, that’s my point. A full blown reset doesn’t happen out of ones control imo.
It’s hard to get a reset.

@RacingGrandpa
True, but if you leave yourself a race you can no qual, it’s not too bad.