Rubber banding

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Bigbazz
Rubber banding happens in real life.

"We need to you catch up to xxx"

"You have a lead, slow down and save fuel and your tyres"


To a certain extent :P.
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No that is just basic race strategy. Never would you get a whole pack of cars slowing down for one guy in the back.
 
Amused2Death66
No that is just basic race strategy. Never would you get a whole pack of cars slowing down for one guy in the back.
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I've not seen this, i've seen a race with me out in front, the 2nd car 10 seconds behind, and with the last guy about 20 seconds behind the main pack, which are a fair bit behind the 2nd car.

Even if rubber banding is in, its doing a good job. Either way the AI is far too slow, they brake for the corner about 40 years too early.
 
Lol, yeah, maybe Rob Smedley is the AI's race engineer...

Seriously I hadn't noticed terrible rubber banding so far... normally my lead increases over the competition consistently through the race... unless I crash, and if I do, I'm normally out of contention pretty quickly.
 
MatskiMonk
Lol, yeah, maybe Rob Smedley is the AI's race engineer...

Seriously I hadn't noticed terrible rubber banding so far... normally my lead increases over the competition consistently through the race... unless I crash, and if I do, I'm normally out of contention pretty quickly.
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I think something needs to be clarified here. The Good racers are not noticing the rubber banding simply because this rubber banding does not allow the AI to drive artificially beyond the capabilities of the AI's car. That is a good thing.

Crap drivers like me do notice the rubber banding more because the game slows the AI drivers down so we can catch up. This in my opinion is a bad thing because if on a given race I finish say 3rd, I want to finish 3rd because I raced well enough, not because I overtook 5th and 4th place simply because after crashing they slowed down to let me.
 
trini_gangsta
I haven't seen rubber banding...I get anti-rubber banding. The first place car puts up a good fight but when you pass him he just falls way behind and goes away.
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This has been my observation as well.

While the AI is bad (STILL!?! after how many years?!? UGH...) they are way better then in previous GT games, especially the mess that was GT3.

I run very consistent lap times and noticed you have fight hard to get thru the back markers and into the top 3. However once you overtake the leader its smooth sailing, I easily pull away and win by 2 or 3 seconds which doesn't make sense since it sometimes takes me 3 or 4 laps to catch up to the leader. I think once you pass the leader he gets mad and that throws him off his game.

Next time I run some races I'll track the AI lap times compared to mine to see if they really speed up. However with a 12 car field its possible half of them are getting held up on laps 1 & 2 and can only run clean laps towards the end once the field spreads out. Shame they removed qualifying as this would solve that problem.
 
I've noticed significant rubber banding as well. There have been a number of times when I've passed the entire 16-car field in the first lap (making up a starting difference of probably 7-10 seconds), then over the next 3-4 laps I can only build up a 2-3 second lead. Note that this is with my lap times decreasing or staying consistent every lap, yet the AI's lap times decrease at the same rate. It's frustrating, but maybe I just need to overpower them even worse so they'll give up.
 
I have yet to see any rubber-banding, not like in GT2, anyways. Last night I got ahead of a bunch of cars on Lap one in my 77 horsepower Fiat 500. Those guys didn't (couldn't) catch me, despite having about 110 horsepower (on average) more than me! By the end of the race I was 6 seconds ahead. I then started the same race over with LESS power. This time I made some goofs, yet still managed to win by a healthy margin.

True rubber-band would have them all clamoring around me no matter what, of course. That's how GT2 was.

Amused2Death66
I think something needs to be clarified here. The Good racers are not noticing the rubber banding simply because this rubber banding does not allow the AI to drive artificially beyond the capabilities of the AI's car. That is a good thing.

Crap drivers like me do notice the rubber banding more because the game slows the AI drivers down so we can catch up. This in my opinion is a bad thing because if on a given race I finish say 3rd, I want to finish 3rd because I raced well enough, not because I overtook 5th and 4th place simply because after crashing they slowed down to let me.
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...and there you go. :) Proof, because I consider myself a decent driver.
 
its real bad in the final karting lvls i just say in 3rd place till the last lap then make my move
 
jbenwa
its real bad in the final karting lvls i just say in 3rd place till the last lap then make my move
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Maybe because they are the top-level drivers and they're skilled with the courses? Just a thought. 💡
 
All i know is that, yes, there are some "rubber-banding" / A.I. issues with this game but they are nowhere near as severe as some other racing games. The most ridiculous example was Midnight Club L.A., the A.I. crap was so ridiculous it made the game completely unplayable at later levels.

GT5 has some issues but is definetly manageable.
 
This isn't a big deal as it only serves to keep some races enjoyable, but I have yet to notice the AI to do this in Arcade. I drive the McLaren Stealth on la Sarthe and i find it quite realistic how the AI reacts and I'm only playing on the intermediate setting. Without slipstreaming you would only catch up to the slower cars, unless those slower cars were huddled between a couple of faster ones. It's hard to beat the faster cars like the BMW McLaren and Chapparal 2J as if you let them get out in front, they are gone.

AI is very reasonable and don't drive blind, in fact I watch to see what they do when I come along side them, they are pretty good at holding a line and adjusting to my presence, only time they tend to plow into me was if I made a move that well IRL you wouldn't attempt because it's suicidal and race ending. Too many people are driving like invincible maniacs and expect the Ai to account for that, the AI is driving as if they can damage out their vehicles. PD should include a patch that allows the AI to drive the car to it's limits with no fear...then there would be another thread AI is just impossible to beat. Seriously finding the balance for AI is pretty tough to do as the AI would have to be able to adapt to variable amount of driving styles. When that happens and the Ai has personalities, then we'll have even more issues as the Ai could effectively drive like schumacher and slow down only to humiliate you by taking advantage of your mistakes while not making any of his own.

Nice name Rubber Banding, lol. It happens when you are definitely struggling in the rear not all races though. That Vitz race there was some strange things happening there, until I noticed that a few of the cars were the premium ones and they had better tranny and power. I'm driving my lowly Euro edition(63hp), couldn't do anything but strain in 4th gear.

Funny thing anyone else notice the names of some of the competition? I've seen H. Schumacher, S. Boyle and a few other famous names popping up, I wonder who put those in there?
 
Maybe it's just bipolar drivers.
"Oh, your behind me? I'll slow up for you, man."
"Wait, get back here you ******! BOOST!"

But...I also do this with my brother, too. I'll slow down and let him catch up, then he spanks me and I have to cheat to catch up.
 
I have not noticed any rubber-banding. There were people claiming the same thing about Prologue and it was not present there. I will take notice of AI track section times next time I play to see if their performance increases when I'm in the lead.
 
jbenwa
its real bad in the final karting lvls i just say in 3rd place till the last lap then make my move
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The trick in those is to stay off the racing line so they don't get a draft. Did the same thing in the Circuit de la Sarthe S class license. When you get ahead, stay out of the racing line, check where they are behind you and make sure they don't get a draft. Eventually you will creep ahead by a margin that makes drafting ineffective and then you completely destroy the competition.

Drafting is still kind of ridiculous in this game.
 
I finally started to notice this too. At first I thought someone was exaggerating but it truly is there.
 
beNNyco
All i know is that, yes, there are some "rubber-banding" / A.I. issues with this game but they are nowhere near as severe as some other racing games. The most ridiculous example was Midnight Club L.A., the A.I. crap was so ridiculous it made the game completely unplayable at later levels.

GT5 has some issues but is definetly manageable.
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Yeah I think it's pretty much a standard feature of racing game AI these days, but GT5 certainly does a better job of it than many other games. I mentioned F1 2010 earlier, which shows it far more obviously simply because you can spot odd results, like a Lotus finishing on the podium having used your car to "tow" himself and take advantage of this effect, or at least an effect very similar.

So I can't really hold it against them, it's just the way racing games have headed in recent years to keep the racing close and more 'exciting' I guess.
 
Parnelli Bone
I have yet to see any rubber-banding, not like in GT2, anyways. Last night I got ahead of a bunch of cars on Lap one in my 77 horsepower Fiat 500. Those guys didn't (couldn't) catch me, despite having about 110 horsepower (on average) more than me! By the end of the race I was 6 seconds ahead. I then started the same race over with LESS power. This time I made some goofs, yet still managed to win by a healthy margin.

True rubber-band would have them all clamoring around me no matter what, of course. That's how GT2 was.



...and there you go. :) Proof, because I consider myself a decent driver.
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That is just as worrying to me about the AI as rubberbanding.
Given that a pack of 190Hp motors couldnt keep up with your little Fiat Shows that there most be some shockingly bad AI drivers in GT5!
 
I've noticed it, certainly. It's beyond the last lap "go for broke" which has always been in GT for as long as I remember.

To give PD their credit, it's not actually that noticeable when you're driving an evenly matched car. It's not even too bad when your car is a little ahead of the competition, although at that point some of the enemy drivers seem to be getting some suspiciously fast performances out of their cars.

Where it does become noticeable is if you enter a race in a stupidly overpowered car. I've been messing around with a 700bhp Skyline testing the (lack of) race restrictions on some of the early events.

No rubber banding? How does an Audi A2 1.4, gaining on you, while you're doing 140mph grab you? That's beyond what could be explained even by the most eager "AI cars drafting each other" implementation, that to me indicates a piece of rubber banding code that's been given an unexpected corner case and resulted in pushing a car obviously beyond its peak performance.

I suppose the other possibility is that the AI cars put on tuning according to how powerful the car you bring is, but that wouldn't tally with the things people are noticing with going slow or fast in the same car.

It's a shame as if PD had put a reasonable limit on it, the banding would barely be noticeable - it isn't so much when you're having close races in relatively well matched cars - it just gets a bit obvious when cars put on spurts of "magic speed" resulting in them travelling far faster than the top speed of that model.
 
Kinda makes tuning a bit redundant really. Well for offline anyway.
 
I noticed this while doing the VW bus race on the top gear race track event. On the straight away I would be on the tail of the bus in front of me slipstreaming and I was hitting around 65 mph and yet the other racers I left far behind were catching up, unless the AI had modified versions of the same vehicle I don't understand how they would catch up. They were too far to slipstream me, and even if they were I was flooring it and slipstreaming as well how are they going faster than me?
 
The way I look at this? You're rubber band is a side effect of the hot/cold idea in B-Spec. Those people you're racing are nothing more then B-Spec Bob's, when they're leading they're in the blue, when you're right behind them they start getting worried and I'd imagine go to about the middle of the blue/red bar, and when you pass them their director tells them to overtake and they go deep into the red!

Just a theory.
 
drastick
The way I look at this? You're rubber band is a side effect of the hot/cold idea in B-Spec. Those people you're racing are nothing more then B-Spec Bob's, when they're leading they're in the blue, when you're right behind them they start getting worried and I'd imagine go to about the middle of the blue/red bar, and when you pass them their director tells them to overtake and they go deep into the red!

Just a theory.
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this is exactly how i see it. I was gonna say this earlier but couldnt put in words
 
The AI will slow down a little if you drop behind in A spec. Still the AI behaves mostly the same as B spec. In a few Lagura Seca runs I did, the leader cross the line in the first lap 3 seconds slower than when I'm in the pack. In arcade mode the AI doesn't seem to slow down no matter where I'm at.
 
You'll notice it when you get to longer races (but maybe not endurance races cause they are so long that you'll lose track). You can BURN the computer on the first couple of laps, continue posting lap times that improve, and suddenly, out of nowhere, 2nd place will be on your ass.

I started the FGT championship just now, took the lead in 4 laps and maintained it for 15 straight laps. While jockeying for first, I noticed the 2nd place CPU was hitting top speed midway down the straight, but after I passed him and built up a lead, he would gain on me in the straight despite being too far back and out of line with my draft (I moved out of the racing line on the straight to see if it was just mega unreal draft...not the case). Then all of a sudden, on laps 17, 18, and 19, out of NOWHERE he's on my ass, despite my lap times continuously improving. Pepper that in with the STUPID GT5 AI that drives the same exact line even when an object is slowing in front of them, and you get rear-ended into a spin knocking you from 1st to 12th place with half a lap to go on a race that took a ****ing half hour, and is just the beginning of the championship. Thank you, horrible horrible GT5 AI combined with your stupid arcade rubberbanding.

Lesson learned: there's no point racing well to build up a lead when magical CPU rubberbanding will eat it at the end. Stay comfortably in 2nd, and only worry about racing well on the last 2 laps
 
drastick
The way I look at this? You're rubber band is a side effect of the hot/cold idea in B-Spec. Those people you're racing are nothing more then B-Spec Bob's, when they're leading they're in the blue, when you're right behind them they start getting worried and I'd imagine go to about the middle of the blue/red bar, and when you pass them their director tells them to overtake and they go deep into the red!

Just a theory.
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That still wouldn't explain how they could overtake a car that is already going as fast as the car can possilby go...

That would be like saying "I floor my car and go X fast, but if get nervous my car goes FASTER when I floor it!"
 
In the few close endurance races I've race the AI does seem to speed up a little near the end of the race if they are not far from the player (same lap). AI seems a little slow with flesh cold tires but pick up speed after a few laps.
 
omerc10696
I noticed this while doing the VW bus race on the top gear race track event. On the straight away I would be on the tail of the bus in front of me slipstreaming and I was hitting around 65 mph and yet the other racers I left far behind were catching up, unless the AI had modified versions of the same vehicle I don't understand how they would catch up. They were too far to slipstream me, and even if they were I was flooring it and slipstreaming as well how are they going faster than me?
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not possible, the AI and lap times are fixed in those events
 

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