Sim racers trash GT4

[Darin]

Even their suspension is set up so it is constantly turning left.
Just imagine...
200 mph , trying to keep the car straight, approaches the bend and OMG, he releases the steering wheel and executes the bend perfectley!! how hard was that..Not very.

THAT WAS SO MUCH EFFORT FROM A AMERICAN!

Damn, i'm a american bashing spree today.

 

[phantasm]

I think Nascars have raced on some proper non-oval circuits like Sears point in the past. I also beleive their lap times were vaery slow for cars of that power.

i'd like to see a NASCAR go head to head on a real track with a nice supercar or semi supercar (ie Enzo or McLaren F1 or GT3 or GTR) and see how well it actually performed in comparision... would be awesome if a street car put a spanking on a "Racecar" on a real track... anyone know if someone has done this? I think i remember a car&driver or R&T article where they put something like this together with a viper, a viper race car, plus an indy car and staggered the starts and the indy car still beat everything despite starting something like a minute behind the street car.

 

[Dave A]

Nascars would get ripped appart by DTM cars on a circuit.

 

[Darin]

Yea, they would.

NASCAR's would get ripped up by just about anything.

 

[phantasm]

for sure... but i'd love to see it... give Dale Jr a 30 second head start at Monaco, then let Schumacher loose and watch him pass the CRAPCAR before hitting the tunnel. Something to really show how garbage the cars are compared to serious racecars.

 

[Darin]

Phantasm. even if that country boy got a head start, Micheal would pass him on turn 3...

 

[phantasm]

LOL nice one...

you better be careful though... being in Northern Florida and bashing NASCAR... isn't that sacrilege?

 

[heero 12]

Did anyone here see that special on speed chanel where Jeff Gordon got to drive the BMW Williams F1? From what I saw he was going kinda slow.........

 

[MadduckUK]

i remember the first apayrus nascar racing on the PC.. turn around at the start and get up as much speed as possible then ram the leading car head on... best crashes EVER, wheels flying everwhere and ****. actually racing was boring as hell....

 

[phantasm]

Did anyone here see that special on speed chanel where Jeff Gordon got to drive the BMW Williams F1? From what I saw he was going kinda slow.........

i did... he was going on and on about how amazing the car was and how incredibly it handled.... yadayadayada.

I don't think he was pushing that hard as he didn't want to wreck the car, and it would take more than a few laps i'm sure to really get a feel for it... i mean the car can go left AND right

 

[pimp racer]

i did... he was going on and on about how amazing the car was and how incredibly it handled.... yadayadayada.

I don't think he was pushing that hard as he didn't want to wreck the car, and it would take more than a few laps i'm sure to really get a feel for it... i mean the car can go left AND right

other then nascar which can barly turn right and when they do they crash.

 

[animateria]

My god, I don't understand a left turning sim being more fun than the GT series.. Although I do understand that there are people who can't stand GT3 because it is boring.. (Usually kids or people who don't give a damn about racing games) Hell, kids want a storyline and 20 laps would be a chore to those who don't care..... But NASCAR? My god they are morons!! "Yeah!! I'm winning more than a dozen cars on a oval, hooray!! I can do great left turns!!! "

 

[vladimir]

well, im not a nascar fan and i have to admit that the tracks lack some variety, but three or even more cars going side by side round the track and overtaking each other all the time can be quite exciting. and the sound of these cars is unbelievable. i once got the chance to see six of them going round the eurospeedway tri-oval and you could feel the concrete vibrating. must be great with 40 cars running simultaneoslyy.

and if you want to compare nascar to formula one, then look how exciting formula one is nowadays. one single driver has won the last three or four championships and every race this season. how boring is that?
and the f1 tracks may have left and right corners, but they are still flat like something that comes out of a cow and then these asphalt run-off areas. man in a few years you could have an f1 race in a parking lot. just draw some lines and you are ready to go.

in nascar people at least still overtake each other and not only to lap the slow ones and you don't know the whole season in advance who is going to win every race...

f1 just sucks, nascar is a thousand times as exciting.

and i want so see YOU sitting in a nascar going round the bowl at 200mph in a pack of 40 cars only inches away. you will wet your pants just sitting in one of them let alone driving one of them...

 

[godzilla_GTR]

Drags and drifts are a billoin times better than nascar!

 

[Iceman]

NASCAR does not even compare to road racing in excitement and just pure enjoyment.

 

[The Vanishing Boy]

Dang those rednecks, if they consider NASCAR is way better than Gran Turismo they are the shallowest racers/people I've ever known, plain stupid and dumb.

At least Drag Racing has more impact than that.

Heh, I rather Drift left than turn left for 200+ laps. =yawn=

 

[8400RPM]

How depressing. I didn't realize how ignorant and hypocritical some of the members of this forum were until I read this thread. You guys are just as bad as the subjects of this thread that are bashing GT series. 👎

 

[kidcodea]

imho gt4p is very limited (drivingwise, physics) compared to pc stuff like n2003 or lfs.

i like gt4p but as a relaxation thingie. almost a toy.
if anyone thinks cars drives like in gt4 they are in for a crash in reallife...
but still, have fun, and dont think you are a good rl driver coz you fast in gt4.
you'll save lives that way.

the only thing i dont like in gt4 is the propaganda the genius coder makes on the dvd, attaching gt4 to real life driving...as a school.
thats dangerous behaviour even. kiddies dont need to be told those things just coz he likes to sell mroe copies. he doeesnt need that. and if he trully believes what he says (of coz not) then its coz he never loaded a proper sim on a phat pc with wheels and pedals and dived into it.

still i think the dudes behind gt4 are genius for making you all believe in it
yes gt3 is art in bytes and so will gt4 prolly, but leave aside this sim leet vs console funtoy pad kiddies argument coz it wont go anywhere

 

[Eagle]

How depressing. I didn't realize how ignorant and hypocritical some of the members of this forum were until I read this thread. You guys are just as bad as the subjects of this thread that are bashing GT series. 👎

Alcapowned. Spotted that myself.

f1 tracks may have left and right corners, but they are still flat like something that comes out of a cow and then these asphalt run-off areas. man in a few years you could have an f1 race in a parking lot. just draw some lines and you are ready to go.

As an avid F1 fan I'm going to say - bzzt. You think there's more undulation in your average speedway or in Spa Francorchamps? How about the Hungaroring? Sepang? Monaco? We even race at Indianapolis these days, and most people found the race pretty exciting. Granted, if you visit Paul Ricard, then you are essentially driving in a car park with some lines drawn on it, so you're not that far off, and Michael has indeed won the last 4 world championships and is on route for a 5th straight, and that's something that needs to be addressed - namely by him retiring.

Everyone's got their opinion, whatever it may be. The anti-NASCAR prejudice has done nothing to elevate most of you above the people Earth had the misfortune of encountering.

Not surprisingly, I have a link for you all:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=43496

 

[Uncle Harry]

If Nascar is so easy why are you complaining about Nascar and not out there winning Nascar races?
I am putting on my flameproof suit as I finish typing!

 

[Shen Yin]

They're probably just 12yr old kids who've never played a single GT game. Here's the statements and my responses:


They said GT was crap, wasnt a real sim, had only six cars, no damage, no challenge, and that it was a waste of money.
That's all the evendence you need to prove that the've never been within 8000 miles of a copy of GT. The only true statement was 'no damage', but then again, GT is about simulating circuit racing/grand touring, not banger racing in clapped out Ford Sierras.


They also said those who drive GT cant handle real sim. They said we all use controllers and couldnt drive with a wheel if our life depended on it.
That statement is full of irony. 99.9 of these idiots on this NASCAR game have probably never held a steering wheel in their lives, not even those designed as gaming accesories! They're obviously ignorant of the fact that GT3 and GT4 Prologue actually support steering wheels, and have had wheels specially designed for these games! By the way, I play GT, yet I have no problem driving a real car (i.e: Toyota Yaris/Echo).


They said GT was a waste of money.
How would they know if they haven't played it. They're just a load of ignorant clots.


I talked to him more and turned out he ran a Escudo at superspeedway 150 enduro, won an indy car and used it to win the other races and then claimed they were too easy. yeah if you race a bmw z3 with a F1 I'm sure you will win...
This person is obviously a pathetic little sod. I think it's rather obvious that an F1 car will have no trouble beating a bloody kei car!

These kids are nothing but jealous NASCAR fanboys who would shiver at the sight of an S-bend.

LOL, you're right.

I respect NASCAR n' all, but if I wanted to just turn left for a whole race, I'd merely have an i-link match with my boys, tell 'em all to use the same car and choose the Test Course for about a billion laps.

Their obviously completely ignorant to GT and fall squarely into the mainstream more than most people would normally. Typical...............hicks.

 

[Zer0]

i like gt4p but as a relaxation thingie. almost a toy.
if anyone thinks cars drives like in gt4 they are in for a crash in reallife...
but still, have fun, and dont think you are a good rl driver coz you fast in gt4.
you'll save lives that way.

You has played final GT4? replace the "GT4" word in your phrase for any PC sim, both are games without real gravity feedback, g-forces, danger feeling and only a small part of the full real world probabilities replicated.

You think that can learn to drive as a prodriver only seating on a desk with a plastic wheel and playing any "real sim" in a small 2D screen?

All this games are good for training if you have real track experience not for learning how to drive to the limit and try to replicate in the real world without any previous experience(this is mad), the real drive experience don't give it any console or PC game.

 

[JohnBM01]

I seen about 70% of the Pepsi Southern 400 this past weekend. I'm glad to see Jeff Gordon win again. But as far as this topic goes, I'm not going to attack it. I'm going to attack the racing demographic I normally dislike. Here was the intro to this one: (https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=1145483&postcount=1)

First of all Earth, nice cutie in your signature. Second off, thank you for respecting the Gran Turismo series. How can ANYONE say that Gran Turismo is chump change compared to NASCAR? What, because it's easier to make passes? Pit stops are longer? Terminology like "wicker bill" "wedge" are better words than "oversteer" and "damper?" In a future thread, I'll make a 2 or 3 part forum as to why I dislike NASCAR, and I'll be fair. I won't ruthlessly attack it. I'll be honest. But that's for later. I've played Sierra/Papyrus's NASCAR Racing, NR2, and NR1999, and the level of customization was... kind of limited. The stock cars don't act like LM prototypes, so it was a sim as far as stock cars go. But I know one thing. I'd rather race "Like the Wind" than any NASCAR oval. The IRL is better at "just turn left" because the cars are real race cars, there's exciting finishes, yet it's totally neglected by people who think that Formula One and ALMS is crap. I can't believe that on AutoWeek one time, Dutch Mandel reported that when someone asked an undisclosed NASCAR driver "would you want to enter Formula One?" And then he responded, "why would I want to step down to Formula One?" Gran Turismo is as pure of a racing sim. More so than almost any other. It's pick-up-and-play, fast-paced, no crap racing. I bet the same people would turn down NFS: Underground, but even that game is better than anything conjured by NASCAR.

Point being (and I wanted to be as brief as possible but oops... too bad), is that GT will be a racing sim, and if you don't like GT, don't play it. Just go to PGR2 and rub it in the faces of us loyal GT fans. But while you play that, us GT fans will be playing a multiple award-winning game that the world can be proud of from Anchorage, AK, USA all the way down to the southernmost tip of New Zealand. You think NASCAR is better than GT? Damn it to hell... more "preaching" in later posts.

 

[Mr P510]

The final build of GT4 will have an even more realistic physics engine than Prologue so these sim racers......I just dont care what they think, I know myself and about 10,000,000 other GT fans will be lovin life around Nov-Dec. 👍

 

[JohnBM01]

Sure thing, P510. I mean, it will probably be the best of all time. Now I need to stop saying that and await November. Unless, of course, you believe in freezing yourself into a capsule and thaw out when GT4 is done for. But by then, it would be NFL and American college football season (I can't wait), Thanksgiving is forthcoming, girls fashion goes from shorts and sandals to long bottoms and boots, and... brr. Getting cold in here.

I'm not telling PD to hurry up, though. Take your time and make the game and generate as much of total ownage over other games as possible.

 

[SSJChar]

i think the key points to the nascar games is that it actually does come down to skill. the cars are all decently alike, and so the onl major factor left is skill. though skill does make a big part, the skill it demonstrates doesnt vary too much. most of the courses are dominated by left hand turns, and usually 2 or 3 of them, and so the actual range of turning skill doesnt quite vary too much. and i wouldnt be surprised if it might turn out to be more exciting than GT4 online racing just because of the fact that the field is so big and so close that there is always wheel to wheel racing. so in terms of it being fun because it gets your adrenaline pumping, its probably up there, maybe even moreso than gt. BUT like many of you, id rather go the gran turismo route. i enjoy seeing people show a large array of talent, which means a slough of VARYING turns. what i like to see is a persons talent pushed to the max throughout the entire racing spectrum. thats why im a WRC guy. the repetition in turns isnt nearly as high as in nascar, so its not as much trial and error for a single turn. in WRC, you have to actually learn as you go and assest the turn on the fly. nascar people are good at being an expert at taking 3 different turns(given its an oval race), but WRC guys are experts at taking 1000s of different turns.
As for jeff gordon taking an F1 car out, he actually did pretty good, so atleast he, primarily an oval racer, is pretty good at right hand turns, so you cant really judge skill based on their type of racing.
on the note of roadcourses in nascar, they are actually pretty..well... not good. a stock(actual stock, not nascar stock) RSXtypeS gets around the same time as the nascar cars, even faster i think.
on a not too related note, but still in the topic of nascar, why the hell do they still call them stockcars? they arent too stock anymore, and they arent really fooling anyone in believing that their ford taurus is gonna be able to hit those kinds of speeds.

 

[JrunkenC]

I am a die-hard GT fan and I can't wait to play GT4 when it comes out. I have 791 days on GT3 and finished GT4P in two days (not all golds tho...)

I mean, I'm your typical asian dude who lives in SoCal ten blocks from Gushi Auto (Ken Gushi's shop,) owns an AE85, loves to go mountain driving, yada yada yada. Went to the first inaugural D1GP as well as this year's Rim of the World Rally and will definately be going to the inaugural JGTC showing in December.


BUT, its hard for me to sit here and read people bashing NASCAR. Anyone who likes cars can come to appreciate NASCAR, its just basic ignorance that cause people to bash different types of auto racing. NASCAR is all about strategy and if you sit down and watch a race, you can really appreciate how hard it is to win a race in NASCAR. The crashes are for the masses but the strategy behind the racing is really a thing of beauty. What people don't realize is that EVERYONE is putting the pedal to the metal and yet some racers always seem to win more than others. Things like when to pit, when to pass, waiting for yellows, how much gas and which tires to switch, its the little things that make HUGE differences. NASCAR is not an easy sport no matter what you think. If you're a basher of NASCAR I suggest you watch one race and even if you decide you don't like NASCAR racing, I'm sure you'll have more respect for the NASCAR racers.

 

[Buggy Boy]

I like GT because yes, the handling isnt the greatest simulaiton on Earth, BUT, the cars handle real enough to make it a challenge, yet you dont have to be on edge every lap to push it to the limit. The handling is just real enough to make it fun.

But I excuse GT because it MORE then makes up for those short commings with AWESOME sound and graphics, huge selection of cars and tracks, along with a passiontly customizable Simulation mode.

GT is for car guys, and real race fans who love cars so much they dont need damage etc, they just love to push a car to the limit and hear the squealling tyres and the wind and the motor and the crowds.

I think your description is very honest here. I just don't agree with that crowds thing

the only thing i dont like in gt4 is the propaganda the genius coder makes on the dvd, attaching gt4 to real life driving...as a school.
thats dangerous behaviour even.

That's disturbing me too. GT4P remains an arcade game, very accessible, and with a lot of steering and braking assistance.

---
The creators of the Nascar-series proved what they're worth by developping 👍 Grand Prix Legends 👍 , not equalled by any other simulator since 1997.

 

[TheCracker]

I can't belive how juvenile and small-minded*some of the posts in this thread are!

Nascar - the sport - is just as valid a form as motor sport as F1 or Sports Prototypes, the cars are relativly basic - but it doesn't mean they are not real racing cars - they are nearer to being a pure racing car than the GT & GTS Class cars running in LeMans or ALMS - which are based on road cars. Jeff Gordon, who tested for Williams the other year, seriously impressed Frank Williams and Patrick Head - and caused quite a stir in F1 circles with his pace.

Nascar - the (papyrus) game - is a more advanced 'simulator' than GranTurismo can ever hope to be. Having spent some time hanging around in the Papy Nascar forums, and having played/watched a few online games, i can tell you that these guys are dedicated to this game - just as much as we are to GT. Saying that they should try playing GT with a DFP wheel is just plain stupid - the equipment that most of these guys use is so much more advanced than the DFP - most of it costing hundreds if not thousands of pounds/dollars - this stuff makes the DFP look and feel like a babies/kids toy steering wheel.

I'm not sticking up for a few mis-informed rednecks, but comparing the 'sim-ness' of GranTurismo to Papys' Nascar is fighting a losing battle. GranTurismo is great at what it does, and Nascar is good at what it does - but they are both of a different genre and direct comparison is impossible.

 

[vladimir]

good to see not everyone has lost his mind here...

funny how someone can complain about nascars going left all the time and then praise drag racing in his next sentence...


in the end, you need skill for every kind of racing, no matter how much corners the track has. and nascar may look boring at the first glance due to the ovals, but if you look more closely you will find lots of action on such an oval which makes nascar just a thousand times as exciting as todays forumula one.
but i think every kind of racing can be exciting and everybody has his favorite so its useless to argue about which is the best.


and gran turismo 4, although getting more and more realistic is still not as much sim as papyrus' nascar is, thats just a matter of fact.
but GT4 is on a good way and i am, as a dedicated simracer, looking forward to it, maybe i will even buy a ps2 for it...