(Spin) Problem Handling Cars list

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo 6' started by Gturbo5, Dec 13, 2013.

  1. Astro_BS-AS

    Astro_BS-AS

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    Voodoovaj, if you have to alter the original setup of a car to compensate for a balance problem, it´s clear that there´s a problem.

    The fact that you have FR cars (LOT of weight on the front) doing stoppies says a lot about the MR problem. When you have so much weight on the back, and that weight transfer from back to front somewhat "faster" than it should, you have the problem that many are reporting.

    I can drive without spinning a MR car, with a DFGT, but when you notice the amount of "work" that you have to do, even at cruising speed, something´s not quite right. And THEN you have the wheel WIDTH bug....

    I insist, something´s not quite right.
     
  2. Hamisxa

    Hamisxa

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    The Reventón handles like S**t
     
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  3. Voodoovaj

    Voodoovaj

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    Ok, if you insist, then it must be true :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2013
  4. daveyhero

    daveyhero

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    Hi Voodoo, I agree with Astro that if the stock original setup makes for a difficult car then there's an issue. The Toyota MR2 is not a famous widowmaker like a 911 is, for example. The cars in GT6 would make you believe differently.

    For extra feedback on the topic, I drove the Stratos Goodwood challenge and found the car perfectly manageable, though maybe forced skid assist had something to do with it? Either way, in that challenge, had no issues. Even made me want to buy one :)
     
  5. Voodoovaj

    Voodoovaj

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    I admit, I'm trolling a little ;)

    The more I dig into tuning, the more it seems that reversing weight distribution always works. It is like the car weight are backwards. Whether that is a bug or intentional, I can't say. That said, I have tuned everything to be well balanced, even the "widowmaker" 911.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2013
  6. eran0004

    eran0004

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    It doesn't have racing soft tyres at Goodwood. I think a lot of the problem with spinning cars - at least it has been for me - is because of the tyres. For example: The RUF Yellowbird is great on sports hard tyres, you can feel when it wants to break traction and you can correct it before it goes wild. On racing softs it does have a lot more grip, but it's also a lot more unpredictable, going for your throat when you least expect it.

    It might be that with sports or comfort tyres, when the back starts to slide it brings the front of the car into it as well, giving a sideways slide. On racing tyres it feels like the front stays glued to the road, so instead of sliding sideways, the back is rotating around the front. And because the racing tyres has great traction all the way until it suddenly snaps, it feels something like this:

    Racing tyres: :cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::scared:[​IMG]

    While sports tyres feels more like this:

    Sports tyres: :):dopey::boggled::nervous::O:sly::D:cheers:

    That's my experience, anyway.
     
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  7. OutspokenFlunky

    OutspokenFlunky

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    Regardless if it is a glitch or just me getting use to the new physics I have found that when I run into a "problem car" I just tune everything I can to make it a massive oversteer machine and then work it out to a comfort level I'm happy with than also gives me some good times. A bit of work but it does work for me. Some times just adjusting the ride height helps the cars handling.
     
  8. Voodoovaj

    Voodoovaj

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    I found that the 4wd MR cars need to have the torque sent to the front. I know it's counter intuitive, but it works. It's backwards like the rest of it.
     
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  9. Stotty

    Stotty Premium

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    Brilliant :tup: :lol:
     
  10. Sander 001

    Sander 001

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    Haven't been keeping up with the thread but what are the thoughts on the Auto Union Type C 1937? Granted the wheel arches make it unable to turn at low speed but at higher speeds it just wants to swap ends at every moment. I know it's just a game and so real world physics don't apply, but this car seems to go beyond even the confines of the game's parameters.
     
  11. GregOr1971

    GregOr1971

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    Last few days I've tested that car on different tracks (nurburgring,bathurst , indy ...)and as said , turning circle at low speed is just enormous ,so It is no go on tight tracks > damn I got even stuck at that U turn on Monaco History Cup :D

    Watched some history shoots on YT and car was basicaly made for oval racing in germany so It runs perfect on ovals or tracks with longer straights > default no tune speed = 350 km/h for a car from '37 > those drivers were just crazy . It is kinda twitchy as you mention , but if you put lower tier tires > default are RH if I'm right > which I believe have a way too much grip for a sports tires from 1937 car will become easier to catch when slipp or try puting 1 tier lower tires just on front. Suprisingly it will make car easier to handle/catch when correcting speed in turns.

    I'm looking for some online testing/ duel driving just for fun with that machine and some other more twitchy (MR) cars ,so if you're for some online testing add me on fr.l.
     
  12. TheLuigi755

    TheLuigi755

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    You're just driving with "very fast" tyre depletion.
     
  13. z06fun

    z06fun

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    So I have a question back on the discussion of hard to drive MR cars, how many of you have actually driven an MR car in real life on a track at the limit?

    I've driven several at the limit in real life, I will just say, they feel sooo much more realistic in GT6 compared to GT5. They are not easy to drive in real life if they start out somewhat balanced. In fact, if they are balanced under partial throttle, they will gain huge oversteer under full throttle lift because of the huge weight increase on the front.

    Now with that said, the tire model still has a problem as mentioned with tires heating up way too fast if you slide the car a little (especially unrealistic for Sport/comfort tires). That's not quite realistic and makes them harder to drive in GT6. In real life, if the rear comes out on an MR car under lift, you add some throttle to regain it. In fact, the steering goes fairly numb on most MR cars under hard throttle and the car just wants to go straight, because you have very little weight on the front in this condition.

    If you want them easier to drive in GT6 you can downgrade the front tires one level or use the skid force recovery, that's what its for :)
     
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  14. Furi

    Furi Premium

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    Right. People have been calling the Cizeta undriveable on racing tyres. Have you ever thought that it's the way tire model acts? I like it. On Racing softs it's horrifically twitchy and horrible, wanting to spin. RH tyres it still does a little. On Sport Soft tyres it's a brilliant car. I drive most of my supercars stock, and don't see much of a problem. It does give me a theory on the tire model however. Seems the car is more spin happy on higher grip tyres, my theory:

    More grippy tyres = more grip for the car to stick to the road. However this means when the car breaks traction or slips, there is more grip that is suddenly lost, thus making the reaction more extreme, as more traction is lost. Essentially with the Cizeta, on sport softs there is a decent amount of grip, but not enough to ensure a turn of direction or break of traction is extreme. On Racing softs, say they have 2x the grip level of Sport Softs - this means that when traction is broken, there is 2x grip to lose, hence the extreme reactions.

    I'm going to try this with the Pagani Huayra and Lamborghini Diablo as well at some point, those two stir up a fuss and some complaints around here...
     
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  15. MrUnknown

    MrUnknown (Banned)

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    A kart. :sly:

    It's a drifty devil. :p
     
  16. Bo

    Bo Premium

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    I got tutored in karts, and whilst they did chuck oil down on the track for us to learn fine control (I was doing one-handed drifts while others were feathering the throttle :D), the karts in GT6 are a step in the right direction grip wise. They don't kill you under brakes any more, and they skitter along the surface instead of sliding.
     
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  17. Morphisor

    Morphisor

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    That's pretty much it, yeah. The lower grade tires actually make it much easier to handle oversteer, even though it tends to be more prevalent due to lower threshold while the power remains the same.

    Good luck explaining this to the RS-on-all-cars crowd though.
     
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  18. Furi

    Furi Premium

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    This existed to an extent in GT5 as well - I ran a Ford Mk IV in a classic car series for two years and we went from racing medium to sport softs, and cars actually where more predictable on the sports tyres, they were less liable to just snap out on you.
     
  19. dtimefeel

    dtimefeel

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  20. MrUnknown

    MrUnknown (Banned)

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    We have a badass here! :cheers:

    On topic; The kart is a great example of the MR traction: it can spin anytime if you don't have enough strenght to control it.

    When I make some Time Attacks with a kart, I always make it drift a bit so I could make better times. :p
     
  21. NixxxoN

    NixxxoN (Banned)

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    Agree. And even a little kart is challenging and tiring to drive at the limit, so imagine one of those 500HP wild beasts like the Lamborghini Diablo.

    Drivers who can't control MR cars can always choose FWD hatchbacks instead :D
     
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  22. 4everdelayed

    4everdelayed

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    I think it's worth saying again that driving a high performance car is not as easy as it looks on edited youtube videos from EVO or whatever. Watch this instead: http://rutube.ru/video/75300df2eef55fa8a6324983d01c9774/

    Watch 5 minutes of the video from 51:15 onwards, just to give you a little taste of the skill level required. If you watch the entire video, you'll realize how much work and attention a guy like Walter Röhrl needs to provide in a simple historic rally event. Imagine how he was driving in a much more competitive environment in the 80's...

    edit: Btw, in that rally, they were driving on the reversed Nürburgring.
     
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  23. KingSakery

    KingSakery

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    I don´t have any problems with the Aventador.
    Either on Sports/Comforts or with Racing Tires.
    After I put the LSD settings to:
    Front: 5/10/5 and Rear: 10/20/10

    And added rear toe to +0.15 and rear Camber to 1.5 front at 2.0 and softer rear than front at same "lowness"
    It was still more in the oversteer category but I could drive a lap on HSR without thinking " is the steer axle the rear ?"
    And I reduced the rear Downforce to minimum and 35/65 Torque split.

    Try it for me the Aventador drives perfectly ! (No aftermarket wheels installed btw)
    (Stock weight almost stock power and all other parts fitted)
     
  24. ITCC_Andrew

    ITCC_Andrew (Banned)

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    If people are still struggling with this "spinning cars" problem, I'd like to offer my personal advice:


    Take a Lancia Stratos home. Take it to Toscana Reverse. Try to set a lap below 2 minutes. I'm pretty sure it's possible, but I'll check right now...


    You have a "poor handling" car on a low grip surface where your reaction time needs to be instantaneous. When you're on gravel/dirt/mud/snow, your inputs need to come sooner. You brake sooner, you countersteer sooner, etc.



    When you return to driving (the Lancia) on tarmac, you'll start to feel like everything is in slow motion.


    Edit: I tested it, best lap 2:02.345 - it's totally plausible. If I had more time, I would be in the 1:59s, but I can't right now. Just take my word on it and try it!
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2014
  25. steve30x

    steve30x

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    I played Project Cars yesterday for the first time in months and I played Asetto Corsa. Some of the cars in Project cars feel uncontrollable and the Ferrari F40 in Asetto Corsa is impossible to drive. I find all the cars in GT6 a lot easier to drive with Traction Control turned off , Stability management turned off and skid recovery force turned off far easier to drive than those other two sims.
     
  26. GordonS

    GordonS

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    Massive 'spin problem' with this car on relatively low speeds ;)
    On more serious note, plenty of examples like this can be found on the interweb.
     
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  27. super_gt

    super_gt

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  28. Stotty

    Stotty Premium

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    That video makes the F40 look almost impossible to drive... where as this one doesn't!

     
  29. steve30x

    steve30x

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    Congratulations you are able to post a video without typing a single letter.

    Anyway The F40 is a lot more Slippery in Asetto Corsa than it looks in that video.

    Thats a Ferrari F50
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2014
  30. masonite

    masonite

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    watch the video instead of looking at the screencap. He drives both.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2014
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