SRF on seasonals

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CyKosis1973
]I think the whole point of the thread was that the individual had no choice.[/B]

So just to recap, because I've been away from the game a little while, which particular seasonal forces us to use SRF..??

{Cy}
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Correct. Don't force me to use something I don't want to. That is my issue, no other.
 
GTP_CargoRat
...And one last thing here. When I refer to SRF as "training wheels", its not a knock against anyone who uses SRF and it is not meant to offend anyone. I just use that term in like a lighthearted, kidding type of way. Like I said before, I understand there are new people just starting to play the game and may need help in the beginning, but I just think at some point in your learning curve, the training wheels need to come off if you are serious about playing the game as a real driving simulator, as the games' subtitle suggests that it is...
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I totally agree with this, especially "...at some point in your learning curve, the training wheels need to come off...".

But it is sad how anytime there is any discussion about driving aids people say how good they are for new players and for learning how to play the game and then you look at the time trials and generally the top 250 will be using some driving aid of some sort /sadface. And then people defend the top 250 people for using driving aids because it makes them faster so they should use it or are justified in using it because they need to be on a level playing field /sadface.

So perhaps PD are forcing SRF on because people don't really use the difficult to drive cars like the caterham fireblade because its 'too hard' to do seasonals without the aid of the fastest car from the category, case example 111r elise, etc. And then people knock GT5 seasonals because they are 'too easy' /sadface.

I can see PD thinking that forcing SRF on is a good way to recruit new players who may not know how to turn driving aids on or off. I think a better way to implement this driving aid (if they are doing it for the sake of new players) is to have it on by default, as suggested by someone else here, but can be switched off as an option.

I can see droves of people leaving the GT series if SRF (or any other aid) is forced on in GT6.
 
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citycar
I see SRF being forced on as a good way to recruit new players who may not know how to turn driving aids on or off.
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Get real. Even this sweet old lady could work that one out:

 
citycar
Ok, ok, i rephrased it :)
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:grumpy: Yeah, sorry, I'm overreacting. It's just that after investing a couple of years getting reasonably competent at the game I'm getting blown away by the changes they're making at this point in the game's evolution. We're stuck with it for at least 18 months more before GT6 will arrive and I'm not a happy bunny.
 
Its all good, how i rephrased it better represents how i feel about it (cursed dyslexia). I'm not happy with how far away GT6 and PS4 are either :( The only good thing about the 18month wait is that my ps3 and g27 will be worn out by then so i can make a new choice on console and driving sim if need be.
 
I've avoided pitching into this discussion because one more GTP user pitching in with a similar view is not exactly moving the discussion forward however......

The point I would like to make is that SRF is such a completely incompatible assist that there is no way that it could even be called a training aid. The manner in which you drive when using this feature is completely against any form of driver training and if a person that uses it decides to switch it off they will not have progressed one iota in terms of driving skill.

I don't agree with the argument that SRF is there to help gain driving ability, it is there simply to let people win races by whatever means available. If a newcomer wants to start with an easy setting that will enable them to develop driving skills then the aids they should be using are; Traction control, Driving Line and ABS they should not be using SRF!

That said I have absolutely no issue with anyone that wants to use SRF. It's in the game so if you feel the need use it, knock you're socks off. To the folks at PD, please stop insulting the vast majority of the user base by forcing us to drive like we're in some NAMCO arcade racer! Let us decide if we want SRF on or off.
 
roflcoptor
Odd thing to say. If that were really the case, then surely it should be disabled if you used a wheel. :sly:
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Not really. It's far easier to control the car with the wheel and pedals vs. full throttle/full brake you get with a stick.

My question is why do people feel like they must cry about everything? Realism? Nonsense. GT5 isn't realistic, it's lacking ALL the sensory information that one uses IRL to keep the car pointed in the right direction.
 
GTP_CargoRat
Ah yes, SRF. That is Dalone's training wheels, he doesn't leave home without them.:lol: Without SRF, Dalone falls down and goes boom. :lol: I kid because I care. :sly:

Seriously tho, I hate SRF with a passion. Its like driving on a velcro track with velcro tires. It turns "The Real Driving Simulator" into "The Real Arcade Racer". Having said all that tho, I realize that there are lesser skilled people that play the game that may need the extra help to get started in playing and getting used to the game. As much as I despise SRF, I have nothing against anyone who uses it. The thing that I don't like tho is having it forced on. I do not want to use it and I don't want to be forced to use it. I think all aids should be made optional. Do not force them on, or off. Leave it up to the player to decide what they want to use.

The reason why I despise SRF so much is because its not even like a real aid. Not like TC, ABS, or any other of the available aids. To me, SRF is like instant arcade mode. And it is for that reason that I hate it when people in the Seasonal threads (when it is an option and can be turned off) come in and brag about their accomplishments with SRF turned on. My response is, and always will be, "ok hotshot, take off the training wheels and lets see how you do then." The reason for that rather harsh statement is because SRF gives you a huge advantage over everyone else not using it. Its like sim mode vs. arcade mode. I mean, if you want to use it in the Seasonals, thats fine and I have no problem whatsoever with anyone using it, just don't come in and brag about your times or how low of a PP setting you ran while using it. Those accomplishments in no way should be compared with the accomplishments done by people not using SRF. They are entirely two different types of physics, way more than any of the other aids.

And one last thing here. When I refer to SRF as "training wheels", its not a knock against anyone who uses SRF and it is not meant to offend anyone. I just use that term in like a lighthearted, kidding type of way. Like I said before, I understand there are new people just starting to play the game and may need help in the beginning, but I just think at some point in your learning curve, the training wheels need to come off if you are serious about playing the game as a real driving simulator, as the games' subtitle suggests that it is.

Anyways, I hope I have clearly explained my views on SRF and hope I have not offended anyone in the process because that certainly is not my intention. Peace, I'm out.
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SRF is a real aid available in real life. You didn't know that?
 
Ills1999
SRF is a real aid available in real life. You didn't know that?
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Sorry, but I assume you're being sarcastic?

It seems you may be missing the point. The fact that some aids or even GT5 in general is realistic isn't the argument. It's having an aid no matter what it is being forced on.
 
ncrthree
Sorry, but I assume you're being sarcastic?

It seems you may be missing the point. The fact that some aids or even GT5 in general is realistic isn't the argument. It's having an aid no matter what it is being forced on.
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Let's really get real and point out that you're not going to spin a lightweight FF car at those power levels and speeds on soft street tires without grabbing a handful of parking brake.

That people think cars "realistically" or "normally" behave as though one is driving on marbles is mindboggling.

It's ALL a very poor substitute.

Driving a FF car with soft street tires IN REAL LIFE *IS* like having velcro tires and road surface.

Spinning the car is what's not "realistic", not having the damn thing stick like glue.
 
Ills1999
Let's really get real and point out that you're not going to spin a lightweight FF car at those power levels and speeds on soft street tires without grabbing a handful of parking brake.

That people think cars "realistically" or "normally" behave as though one is driving on marbles is mindboggling.

It's ALL a very poor substitute.

Driving a FF car with soft street tires IN REAL LIFE *IS* like having velcro tires and road surface.

Spinning the car is what's not "realistic", not having the damn thing stick like glue.
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But having them stick like glue because of SRF cutting in and out is fake. A FWD on soft tires will oversteer,not understreer agreed. But not stick like glue?:boggled:

SRF is not real! Yes there're some some things similar in real life, but SRF as represented in GT5 is phony.

If you need it o.k.👍 But most here want it optional.👍👍
 
playnthru
But having them stick like glue because of SRF cutting in and out is fake. A FWD on soft tires will oversteer,not understreer agreed. But not stick like glue?:boggled:

SRF is not real! Yes there're some some things similar in real life, but SRF as represented in GT5 is phony.

If you need it o.k.👍 But most here want it optional.👍👍
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Very well said and you have further driven my point home about SRF. Nothing more to say as you have reached into my mind and put into words exactly what I would have said and how I feel about the subject.👍
 
playnthru
SRF is not real! Yes there're some some things similar in real life, but SRF as represented in GT5 is phony.
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SRF is something that you will only see in games; you will probably never see it on a real car because it involves giving the car more physical grip when you are oversteering which is physically impossible.
 
GTP_CargoRat
Very well said and you have further driven my point home about SRF. Nothing more to say as you have reached into my mind and put into words exactly what I would have said and how I feel about the subject.👍
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Hope he washed his hands after reaching into your mind!

Ills1999
SRF is a real aid available in real life. You didn't know that?
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Eh?

Show me a link or retract that inflammatory remark! :irked:

 
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MSTER232
SRF is something that you will only see in games; you will probably never see it on a real car because it involves giving the car more physical grip when you are oversteering which is physically impossible.
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BMW was working on it years ago.:sly They called it Active Yaw Control, it's in-game,but for AWD. Other companies have been working on it too.

Other nanny devices are available too(in real life). And, I never said SRF was real, or that you will see it anywhere!:confused:

But (since you said it), No it's not physically impossible? It's not about providing more grip? It's about maximizing grip through artificial devices (computer, motion sensors,blah,blah). Which I am against.👍

But the fact is driving aids exist(not SRF per say). And in the future we will see more and more of them(unfortunately:()
 
playnthru
BMW was working on it years ago.:sly They called it Active Yaw Control, it's in-game,but for AWD. Other companies have been working on it too.

Other nanny devices are available too(in real life). And, I never said SRF was real, or that you will see it anywhere!:confused:

But (since you said it), No it's not physically impossible? It's not about providing more grip? It's about maximizing grip through artificial devices (computer, motion sensors,blah,blah). Which I am against.👍

But the fact is driving aids exist(not SRF per say). And in the future we will see more and more of them(unfortunately:()
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That's all well and good but that's not how SRF works in the game. What it does is allow faster corner speeds because it eliminates the loss of speed and tire scrub, and loss of control, that would normally accompany excess corner speed both in real life and in the game. It doesn't provide more grip perse, what it does is eliminate the effects of excess corner speeds allowing a greater margin of error on the part of the driver. Your car still slides with SRF, still gets sideways, it just doesn't slow down or lose control as a result. If it truly boosted traction, you would still have the normal game physics at work with higher levels of grip all around, but SRF only kicks in when the car is starting to lose control.

Real life aids work to prevent the car from sliding to begin with, not to continue the slide at higher cornering g-forces than the tires are inherently capable of.
 
As I see it there is only one reason SRF is mandatory in certain events:
Like Amar said, some events would be impossible, even for a D1 gold driver, without it.

It's just a matter of too little testing and last minute quick fixing.
They probably had no time to test the AI difficulty until Wednesday night and went: "This is impossibru! We better make SRF mandatory so our 🤬-up isn't too obvious."

Imagine the amount of complaints if SRF was optional and elite alien drivers failed to get the win!
Remember the Japanese 80's @ Tsukuba with the MX-5 on pole...

It's not really a big shock though.
It's like a fractal version of the whole of GT5.
Poor planning / a lack of time for testing and bug filtering leads to emergency fixes, leaving the gamers with a foul taste in their mouths!

Sound familiar?
 
playnthru
BMW was working on it years ago.:sly They called it Active Yaw Control, it's in-game,but for AWD. Other companies have been working on it too.

Other nanny devices are available too(in real life). And, I never said SRF was real, or that you will see it anywhere!:confused:

But (since you said it), No it's not physically impossible? It's not about providing more grip? It's about maximizing grip through artificial devices (computer, motion sensors,blah,blah). Which I am against.👍

But the fact is driving aids exist(not SRF per say). And in the future we will see more and more of them(unfortunately:()
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Well I can only wish BMW good luck with that. Because SRF is about adding more grip to the tyres on top of their normal grip, and in real life the only thing you can do is maximize the amount of grip available and none of the available grip is wasted.

Also, I'm pretty sure AYC has been installed on Mitsubishi Evo cars, right?
 
MSTER232
Well I can only wish BMW good luck with that. Because SRF is about adding more grip to the tyres on top of their normal grip, and in real life the only thing you can do is maximize the amount of grip available and none of the available grip is wasted.

Also, I'm pretty sure AYC has been installed on Mitsubishi Evo cars, right?
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Instead of trying to argue with whatever I say, you could just do a search.💡:dunce: SRF in NOT about adding more grip than available, it's about what I already stated.👍 Maximizing available grip through technology.

Yes (in-game) AYC is a Mitsubishi option. In real life, it was BWM's baby. Again do a quick search instead of arguing.:dunce
 
Johnnypenso
That's all well and good but that's not how SRF works in the game. What it does is allow faster corner speeds because it eliminates the loss of speed and tire scrub, and loss of control, that would normally accompany excess corner speed both in real life and in the game. It doesn't provide more grip perse, what it does is eliminate the effects of excess corner speeds allowing a greater margin of error on the part of the driver. Your car still slides with SRF, still gets sideways, it just doesn't slow down or lose control as a result. If it truly boosted traction, you would still have the normal game physics at work with higher levels of grip all around, but SRF only kicks in when the car is starting to lose control.

Real life aids work to prevent the car from sliding to begin with, not to continue the slide at higher cornering g-forces than the tires are inherently capable of.
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I never said it boosted traction. Nor did I say it provided more grip. So I'm not really sure what you're trying to argue. As for (real life aids),They are meant to act once traction is lost, not before. They're meant as an aid to re-gain control, Once it is lost. ABS,TC same way, they act when they sense traction loss. Not Before.👍

So your assumptions on how and why driving aids work is in correct. They don't stop a skid from happening, they control it once it has happened.

Honestly, a simple search would tell you this.

Seriously you wrote a paragraph which has nothing do with what I said?:confused:

Kids these days I tell ya.:sly:
 
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What if SRF was always on and there was no option to turn it off, and you didn't even know there was such a switch? Apart from the 25,000 or so top end fanatics I reckon most of he 7 million who bought/used the GAME, it's not a big deal. It's really tough to say whether it iaffects the realism, the GAME is only a $50 semi-virtual experience, I really can't fault PD other than for providing too many switches and not enough explanation behind them. If you want to do virtual sliding then use harder tires.
 
Poor planning / a lack of time for testing and bug filtering leads to emergency fixes, leaving the gamers with a foul taste in their mouths!
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This is how I've felt since I bought this game. PD put GT5 together like a school kid who forgot his science project was due and entered the one he used a couple of years earlier after he polished it up the night before it was due.
 
MSTER232
SRF is something that you will only see in games; you will probably never see it on a real car because it involves giving the car more physical grip when you are oversteering which is physically impossible.
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It's already available on many cars.
 
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