Stega's Mega Cockpit of Doom!!!

[kikie]

Playstation Mag said that 3 Screens was going to be supported but thats the same magazine that got confused over the Nascar/Indy. So im not putting too much faith into them.

Surround, peripheral, 3 monitor setup was already a part of GT4, and I believe amar once said that GT5 will feature this.

DG from SRT confrimed to me that "Headtracking" @ E3 was only working on a left/right axis and not in a freedom of movemount allowing head hilting and forward back movment.

I've tested 2 DOF and 6 DOF headtracking with freetrack and although 6DOF is a nice feature, 2 DOF is enough.

3D would be a nice experience in 3.
Not so sure headtracking would be needed with 3 screens though as you pretty much see everything anyways.

3 monitor setup with headtracking could be an advantage as you can see even further ==> over your left/right hand shoulder to see if any car is overtaking.

NOTE: Possibly offensive language contained.

LOL, pimp my pc/cockpit

 

[Mr Latte]

Surround, peripheral, 3 monitor setup was already a part of GT4, and I believe amar once said that GT5 will feature this.

I've tested 2 DOF and 6 DOF headtracking with freetrack and although 6DOF is a nice feature, 2 DOF is enough.

3 monitor setup with headtracking could be an advantage as you can see even further ==> over your left/right hand shoulder to see if any car is overtaking.

LOL, pimp my pc/cockpit

Sorry for taking this further but it might appeal to Stega anyways...

GT4 had support for multisceens but was it not limited to Arcade mode doing TT and with just one car on track?
Thats not good enough. Concept is the only one Ive seen videos of using multiscreens and allowing in game racing with other cars.
Amar has been wrong before so as yet it still stands we just cant be certain full racing will be supported over multiscreens. We can assume yes but until a proper question is put to PD or its confirmed then we wont know.

I mentioned one thing to Darin Ganji recently and that people are forgetting GT5 has "Spectator Mode" already announced.

• This feature would allow a player with multiple screens/consoles to log into different PS3 accounts.
• On each machine goto a single created lobby and be able to view as a spectator.
• This would then allow a number of things to be possible that the "Spectator Mode" features but each console needs controlled independently.

Multiscreen & Spectator Mode
For instance a player could race on a single monitor with 2D or 3D and headtracking, have a realtime replay on another screen/PS3 or a different viewpoint following the race and perhaps data/race information screen on the 3rd screen/PS3. So as a worst case scanario this could still be a nice feature if proper full racing using multiscreesn isnt supported.

Ive not read anyone anywhere even taking this into account but its been on my mind for a while making usage of the screens and consoles if triple screen mode isnt supported fully. I already have the 3xPS3 and Monitors purchased but I wouldnt want to encourage someone to do the same just yet or not at least to we get more confirmation regards the whole matter.

 

[kikie]

GT4 had support for multisceens but was it not limited to Arcade mode doing TT and with just one car on track?

Yes, it was/is.

I already have the 3xPS3 and Monitors purchased but I wouldnt want to encourage someone to do the same just yet or not at least to we get more confirmation regards the whole matter.

+1


A FOV calculator

http://www.widescreengamingforum.com/fovcalc.php

 

[stega]

Just built myself a base for my new seat. Made from 4x4's connected w/ dowels and glue. I've got 5 rubber isolators on the bottom of it now too. I think I will spray it black, or may carpet it.

Here is the base sprayed up:

Looks like I am going to buy a large peice of plywood like 4 x 5 ft h. And bolt down all the pieces of the cockpit individually and carpet the whole thing. I am also trying to make the MOMO sliders work, but they are a terrible design that requires them to be bolted to something at least 2.5'' in height. Here is a pic to get an idea what I am dealing w/:

 

[stega]

So I think the final verdict is I am going to build a riser/stage to mount the whole cockpit on and use the neoprene isolators to stabilize/isolate the vibrations. This will allow for me to hide all wires, and also have a very stable cockpit. I hope.

Does anyone have any experience with this? I will be buying a piece of grade A plywood as thick as I can get it. And cut it down to 4 x 5 ft h so it is a reasonable size, but large enough for my entire cockpit.

Pic of the isolators:

Ok so not a complete 360, but I will be ordering a 8020 frame and will be making that my main cockpit frame as it is the best way to do this imo w/o welding and all that good stuff. Also it is super modifiable and customizable.

I will still be making the plywood platform/riser for better performance from my transducers. And I will now have a complete second cockpit sitting around for friends and stuff.

 

[stega]

The Audiosource mono-block 5.3 amp came in today. This will be used for the Clark Synthesis transducer:

Also here is a quick shot of the side mounts reversed on my seat...Wanted to show Nick the 2 different ways to side mount it.
Sorry it got dark, and no flash.

Here is it with the rails on:
Sorry about the bad lighting I will take some daytime pics tomorrow
The wood is not bolted to the sliders in that pic, I have not done this yet.

So any ideas how to best mount my seat with or w/o the sliders to the 8020 frame and still keep 5'' clearance??
The side mounts can be reversed, or one can be reversed and the other straight or both straight.

 

[stega]

well, the pedal rails are 35" and the seat rails are 38", but they must overlap by 3". So, the total possible is 70". But, i think we should have you get one long rail for each side. I'll continue this on your thread...

Right so what size rail should I order? two 70'' rails? I found a 15 light series 71.75" rail. Or should I go bigger??

 

[nicka117]

So, I think you may want to either take an 8020 seat rail and add two L-brackets and then you could use your momo sliders. Or, you can ditch the sliders and use an 8020 linear bearing. One 1515 seat rail, then the bearing, then another 1515 piece the same length as the side mount, and then the side mount on top of that. see pics below:

Envision the bottom 1515 piece extending the entire length of the cockpit. The width between the seat side mounts will determine the width of your cockpit, and everything else will be built around that. Actually, all you have to do is decide whether you want the side mounts standard or reverse--standard looks better--then measure the width between the centers of the slots at the bottom. Subtract 1.5" from that number and that will be your main crossmember length.

Then decide how long the cockpit should be so that you can order the right length for the main rails. I doubt it needs top be longer than 60". These rails will be the seat rails and the pedal rails.

 

[stega]

I would like to mount it as you have it in that pic I really don't like these momo sliders. Is there any way I can use taller 15 tslot for the top rail? to get a bit more height??

Other than that I would really like that design over my sliders.
Can you help me out finding the parts I need. Like the bearing, L bracket all that good stuff.

I just measured out my platform/riser and it is about 72'' so for the main rails I think I will go with about 64''

 

[nicka117]

So, to be clear Stega, it should be similar to below, where there is only one main rail on each side--it works as the pedal rails and the seat rails.

 

[stega]

Right... looks good to me!
Answered my question in your PM thx! and I sent 1 back...

 

[nicka117]

I would like to mount it as you have it in that pic I really don't like these momo sliders. Is there any way I can use taller 15 tslot for the top rail? to get a bit more height??

Other than that I would really like that design over my sliders.
Can you help me out finding the parts I need. Like the bearing, L bracket all that good stuff.

I just measured out my platform/riser and it is about 72'' so for the main rails I think I will go with about 64''

Yes, you can use the wider 15 series to bolt to your side mounts so that you can get more height. thats called 1530 lite, because it is 1.5" on one side and 3" on the other side. That will look very good.

I think you only need to purchase the two 64" pieces, and the two 1530 pieces (they should be the length of your side mounts) and 4 end caps for the 1530 pieces. I think i probably have the rest of the stuff you need in my spare parts.

 

[stega]

I am thinking of doing a 3 screen mount similar to this one you did here but ---> :

but I suppose I will figure that out once I know my seating height and all that...

I want to move my 7'' touchscreen monitors to where you have your button box on one of those cockpit pics. But one on each side of the wheel... Anything you can suggest that you think works for something like that?

I may drill a hole at the bottom of the wheel mount mdf/wood and use my gooseneck mounts to angle them like that.

They also came with these mounts I could bolt on somehow I guess...??

 

[Mr Latte]

YES YES YES

Go with multiscreens, although I reckon one touch screen would be enough for "Touchbuddy"
Why would you need two now? Would you consider selling one?

You have enough stuff at home by now to start a shop, lol.
Keep me posted on the Clarke TST mate...

(btw ive figured out a way to use the Buttkickers with the CSP rumble rather than just audio activated, muwhaahaa)

 

[stega]

YES YES YES

Go with multiscreens, although I reckon one touch screen would be enough for "Touchbuddy"
Why would you need two now? Would you consider selling one?

You have enough stuff at home by now to start a shop, lol.
Keep me posted on the Clarke TST mate...

(btw ive figured out a way to use the Buttkickers with the CSP rumble rather than just audio activated, muwhaahaa)

I will be ordering the screens next payment period so that is probably next Thursday.
I may use 1 for "Touchbuddy" and the other as a music player... but I may sell one if It seems like a waste, but I would have to wait for the three screens before I decide that. Now that I am using 8020 I feel like a triple mount solution can be quite cheap. And I can go for larger sizes 26''-30''
Latte what size screens you think work best?? 24'' samsung's seem very reasonable. Is there anything a bit larger in the same range??

The Clarke should be in on Wednesday. I am also building a stage/riser for the cockpit so we will see how that translates as far as transferring the vibration.

And the CSP rumble thing Ohh lala!!! sounds amazing.

 

[nicka117]

stega, in regards to your pm, this is why I mount the 3 screens with no angle. This is for rfactor and softth, the road/guard rails line up better. In the first pic, the angled screens don't line up because of the software. Now, this may be different for GT5 and ps3.

Mine, with the screens flat--outside views match (also have bezel management here):

 

[Mr Latte]

For screens best advice Id give is to look at a range that has a good response rate, wide as possible viewing angle and as thin of a bezel as possible. 24" is the most common used now in 1080p Native.

You could consider 27" but in all honesty its quite a premium if buying a decent brand/model and if you go bigger part of that is lost as you will have to sit further back to get the full peripheral view of all monitors.

I dont think it would be that great for a cockpit to have 3x 24" monitors all straight.
Well not new widescreen models and pictures I see of setups are all angled in one form or another. Take a close look at the Renn Sport Cockpit to see how close you are to the screens. The edges of the outer monitors should be just about level with the wheel with the centre monitor approx above the pedals, so they are very close.

What is important particulary for FM3 is monitor alignment and with FM3 limited in options it is vital you get the correct seating position. The seating position is what makes the difference. Its hard to explain but ONLY when you are in the correct position both in distance and height with the screens will you get perfect alignment in FM3. Its all to do with angle of your eyes from your seating position match with the angle of the screens. GT5 if supported may have the same issues.

Notice how the left hand side seems to be aligned okay but the right isnt.
Its all to do with the position of the person or in this case camera.
You tube videos will tell you the same thing as its hard to get a camera fully aligned as well.


3x 24" is approx 63" wide (depending on angle amount)
I had been playing sitting about 30" back from centre screen.

 

[kikie]

Stega. It seems that you like to spend money, so my advice is to get LED 16:9 monitors. They have a very thin bezel and don't take up too much space.

GT4 with 3 24" Samsungs 245B.

 

[stega]

Dbl post.

 

[stega]

Well I am really looking to spend no more than about $300 each for the monitors. So I will have to look into this a bit more. It seems once the monitors get larger than 24'' the price jumps dramatically.

I ordered the rest of the 8020 stuff I will need. The frame is coming Thursday/Friday and the other parts for the seat mount should be here early next week, Monday or Tuesday.

Are LED LCD's any better I do not know much in this area???
Also what response time am I looking for 5ms or 2ms???

Once I get an answer to these questions I will be able to choose a bit better. But I found a few nice monitors in my price/spec range. Seems to be a lot of monitors with no mounting capability other than the original mount.

 

[Racer XO]

Well I am really looking to spend no more than about $300 each for the monitors. So I will have to look into this a bit more. It seems once the monitors get larger than 24'' the price jumps dramatically.

I ordered the rest of the 8020 stuff I will need. The frame is coming Thursday/Friday and the other parts for the seat mount should be here early next week, Monday or Tuesday.

Are LED LCD's any better I do not know much in this area???
Also what response time am I looking for 5ms or 2ms???

Once I get an answer to these questions I will be able to choose a bit better. But I found a few nice monitors in my price/spec range. Seems to be a lot of monitors with no mounting capability other than the original mount.

Hi Stega......

To answer your question about LED's being better.

LED monitor's are LCD monitor's the difference is that it uses LED lighting instead fluorescent or incandescent bulbs for backlighting, does it make it a better monitor because it uses LED lighting no because it depends on the type of LCD panel that is used.

LED lighting is basically used a a sales pitch of better picture quality but that's not true, however using LED lit monitors use very little energy compared to fluorescent or incandescent bulb monitors.

The advantages that you do get with a an LED monitor are supposed to better energy efficiency, more accurate color reproduction, a conceivably thinner panel design, and a higher potential brightness level but keep in mind these are very hard to find because most manufactures are not taking advantage the technology so if you do find one it will be very expensive.


Another monitor to look at is an IPS "In Plane Switching" based monitor, these are very good monitors and considered to be the best tech there is right now....this is not my opinion btw


Here are the current monitor panel technology that's out if you want to do your own research

IPS - Considered the best overall LCD technology for image quality, color accuracy and viewing angles, IPS monitors are widely used in graphics design because they have consistent color reproduction however they are more expensive because not a lot of manufactures are using IPS panels compared to TN, and VA panels that places IPS monitors at a higher price.


VA (Vertical Alignment) - Middle of the road panel with very good contrast ratios giving very good black levels and very good viewing angles, and offers better resolution than a TN panel at a lower price.


TN (Twisted Nematic) - By far the most widely used panel out due to it's low manufacturing costs with fast response times, how ever TN screens cannot display the full 16.7 million colors that 24bit screens can, because TN panels are only 6bit.



I babbled enough but I do hope this helps you choose the correct monitor for your needs.

 

[stega]

Perfect Racer.. Just want I needed to know. Now if someone could only explain refresh rate and what I should be going for 5ms or 2ms etc...

 

[Racer XO]

Perfect Racer.. Just want I needed to know. Now if someone could only explain refresh rate and what I should be going for 5ms or 2ms etc...

No prob!


Rule of thumb for refresh rate is the lower the better, I definitely would not consider any monitor with refresh rate higher than 5ms. If you do ...you risk ghosting problems especially with games around 60fps, racing games, sports games ect..

So just stick with anything 5ms, or less.

 

[Radracing]

It also seems the lower number "ms" the better it responses to your controller movements. Is this true or am I just imagining this?

 

[Mr Latte]

A small issue with most TN monitors, mine too is that the black level isnt the best level of black possible. Im nit picking but its one thing Id wish more monitors did better.

Stega if you look on some PC related forums for gamers (OcUK is a good one in err UK) although a quick google will get you what you need. Do searches like " 24" Monitor Comparison " many hardware expert sites will have performed tests to determing the best models suitable for your needs and budget.

 

[stega]

It also seems the lower number "ms" the better it responses to your controller movements. Is this true or am I just imagining this?

I doubt this. Highly.

These BX2440X Samsung 24'' LED LCD's are a great buy imo..
Only problem I can see is it being 5ms not 2ms.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001389

I have seen an acer 3d ready monitor that is also reasonably priced. Will 3d ready monitors be able to play gt5 in 3d anyone??!?
GD235HZbid Black 23.6''
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824009222

I am really leaning towards the acer 3d ones if they will work with gt5.

 

[Mr Latte]

1. has no hdmi according to comments

2. Dont get too wound up in maunfacturers response times

3. No it wont work

Have you even bothered to google or check PC hardware sites for commonly highly regarded models?

 

[sonac]

LCD specifications are always completely useless, so please do not buy a monitor because of 3ms shorter response time - it may be far from truth. Rather read a few reviews if you can find them and then decide

 

[stega]

Latte alot of monitors I have found on those sites do not have VESA mount capability or any mounting capability at all.
I found a bunch that meet all my requirements but all of them seem to have no mounting holes.

lol looking further into it...
Example, Samsung sells a bracket so you can mount the tv. Sold Separately... Dick.

 

[Mr Latte]

Asus VW246H