Stop Quitting the race if you're the host

[PSTC555]

I think the real losers are those who drive innocently, don't involve themselves in collisions or drive aggressively out of this. It's sad that something beyond our control where you worked hard to get to the position you were in fairly and its taken away because the host quits. I had numerous occasions where I battled in the podium positions without touching anyone and its taken away normally on the final lap because someone makes a mistake of their own and thought its not worth it to continue. It comes to the point where I wish there is some sort of checkbox saying something like "if you want to be host and accept responsibility for the continuation of the race then tick this box" and I be happy to do so. For some reason my Virgin Media UK 20MB broadband service is still not considered fast enough to host most of the matches which baffles what speed I should get to be host. And on the rare occasions I do, I make a damn good job to keep it running for everyones sake regardless of result. Thankfully all the matches I hosted so far were full of clean drivers so it was never an issue. But surely this can't carry on and something has to be done to give justice to those clean drivers.

 

[Sphinx]

I think the real losers are those who drive innocently, don't involve themselves in collisions or drive aggressively out of this. It's sad that something beyond our control where you worked hard to get to the position you were in fairly and its taken away because the host quits. I had numerous occasions where I battled in the podium positions without touching anyone and its taken away normally on the final lap because someone makes a mistake of their own and thought its not worth it to continue. It comes to the point where I wish there is some sort of checkbox saying something like "if you want to be host and accept responsibility for the continuation of the race then tick this box" and I be happy to do so. For some reason my Virgin Media UK 20MB broadband service is still not considered fast enough to host most of the matches which baffles what speed I should get to be host. And on the rare occasions I do, I make a damn good job to keep it running for everyones sake regardless of result. Thankfully all the matches I hosted so far were full of clean drivers so it was never an issue. But surely this can't carry on and something has to be done to give justice to those clean drivers.

Hi PSTC555,
Thank you for your input in this discussion. 👍

I would like to put a question to you:

If you were the host of a race with 6 drivers for example, and during this race, 4 of the drivers quit, leaving yourself and one other to battle it out. You then find yourself in the lead coming to the last turn of the race, and suddenly, and without warning, the other driver deliberately takes you out, no ifs or buts, he did it on purpose, he cheated, so that he could win the race.

Therefore, do you:

Do nothing, and allow the cheater to win the race, and thus prove to him and others, that cheating really does pay and is tolerated?

Or do you:

Do something, and use your hosting responsibilities to the full, and stop the race before the cheat reaches the finish line?

 

[Zetec-ss]

here is a question for you guys, your coming up to the last straight on high speed ring reverse, your drafting off this guy and your just about to overtake, he blocks you before the finish line...is this cheating or not?

any of you that have played HSR-Reverse know that if you stay behind on the last corner you will draft your way to victory because of the long straight. so is this cheating or not? if it was you, would you stay to the left and let the drafter win even though you are technically better because you have been infront for the other 4 laps.

 

[Frippe]

here is a question for you guys, your coming up to the last straight on high speed ring reverse, your drafting off this guy and your just about to overtake, he blocks you before the finish line...is this cheating or not?

any of you that have played HSR-Reverse know that if you stay behind on the last corner you will draft your way to victory because of the long straight. so is this cheating or not? if it was you, would you stay to the left and let the drafter win even though you are technically better because you have been infront for the other 4 laps.

In most types of racing it is allowed to change lane 1 time to block. So he would be allowed to go out and block you and then go back to the racing line. But he would not be allowed to block you twice. This is how it works in F1, but I am sure there are some kind of racing that have other rules.

 

[PSTC555]

Hi PSTC555,
Thank you for your input in this discussion. 👍

I would like to put a question to you:

If you were the host of a race with 6 drivers for example, and during this race, 4 of the drivers quit, leaving yourself and one other to battle it out. You then find yourself in the lead coming to the last turn of the race, and suddenly, and without warning, the other driver deliberately takes you out, no ifs or buts, he did it on purpose, he cheated, so that he could win the race.

Therefore, do you:

Do nothing, and allow the cheater to win the race, and thus prove to him and others, that cheating really does pay and is tolerated?

Or do you:

Do something, and use your hosting responsibilities to the full, and stop the race before the cheat reaches the finish line?

Good question Sphinx. Though it may sound silly I know but for the current situation of the game I would have carried on despite the dissapointment of losing to such circumstances. I'm not a child, I'm 21 and know how to take such dissapointment. I do deplore such actions however so don't get me wrong, I don't condone unsporting behaviour and so I do understand where you're coming from. Maybe some people are not mature enough to understand the consequences of such actions such as that of a child for example. If it's an adult who's hellbent on causing chaos then its a different matter as I definitely have a very dim opinion of them.

But also its probably because I tend to think overall whatever we come to think of Gran Turismo 5: Prologue, I personally see it as a game. There's always a second chance, a next race, a fresh start to try again unlike real life. I personally don't like doing something thats considered wasteful, therefore cutting off the game would've just completely wasted my efforts rather than carrying on where you salvage at least some money. Or maybe I'm just too nice?

 

[FoolKiller]

here is a question for you guys, your coming up to the last straight on high speed ring reverse, your drafting off this guy and your just about to overtake, he blocks you before the finish line...is this cheating or not?

One block, no. And then if he does it right he will ruin your momentum from the draft so then he should be able to just get off the racing line and not let you draft. I know in races with friends in GT4 I have done my fair share of pulling off the racing line in a straight to prevent them from drafting me.

if it was you, would you stay to the left and let the drafter win even though you are technically better because you have been infront for the other 4 laps.

Wait, who is technically the better racer? The guy in front who used his technical expertise to grab an early lead or the guy slowly moved up through the pack and waited to attempt a clean pass coming out of the last turn with a draft?

It sounds to me as if both cases are a case of good technical driving and whoever can win down the straight should earned it.

 

[Beerz]

In most types of racing it is allowed to change lane 1 time to block. So he would be allowed to go out and block you and then go back to the racing line. But he would not be allowed to block you twice. This is how it works in F1, but I am sure there are some kind of racing that have other rules.

The example you just gave is, at least to me, 2 blocks. not just 1.

You're drafting on someboy, get close, pull to the right. The guy does the same. He blocked you.

If you still have the momentum and the reflexes, you swerve to the left to keep on gaining on him. If he pulls to the left (as you said, to 'his racing line'), he's technically blocking you a 2nd time.

At least that's how I see it.


Also, as you gave F1 example, the same principle applies. You only get to change lane 1 time and that's it. the return to your original racing line, if done while the driver in the back is trying to go there as well, counts as a 2nd block and it's illegal.

 

[Frippe]

The example you just gave is, at least to me, 2 blocks. not just 1.

You're drafting on someboy, get close, pull to the right. The guy does the same. He blocked you.

If you still have the momentum and the reflexes, you swerve to the left to keep on gaining on him. If he pulls to the left (as you said, to 'his racing line'), he's technically blocking you a 2nd time.

At least that's how I see it.


Also, as you gave F1 example, the same principle applies. You only get to change lane 1 time and that's it. the return to your original racing line, if done while the driver in the back is trying to go there as well, counts as a 2nd block and it's illegal.

You are right. The going back to racing line is considered as a second lane change as is not permitted. My mistake.

 

[DustDriver]

Blocking is a right you have, except when the guy who's trying to overtake you is already beside you.
It happened to me once that I deliberately stopped trying to overtake him in the last few corners, because i would have the advantage of slipstreaming on the last straight.
Those who went to the UKGTP7 lan know i'm good at slipstreaming

But when i wanted to overtake him he tried to block me, even though i was already beside him and he just pushed me into the wall.
That is no good sportsmanship and i was pissed about it. We really need ingame chat for such occasions.
Well, i still came in second, so the damage wasn't to bad.

 

[Sphinx]

Or maybe I'm just too nice?

I was expecting the answer you gave because you do come across as a nice guy, but also a guy that perhaps cannot really appreciate the huge effort that has taken place within the GT community over the past nine years or so to exclude cheaters from this game. For me to allow just one cheater to benefit from their actions, is one cheater too many.


When the ‘GT community’ is ever mentioned, it doesn’t just mean this site, it means most every major GT Website on the Internet, and every site worth its salt follows, with the odd variation, the standard OLR rules.

For example;


Standard Clean OLR Rules:

• 2 wheels on (or vertically in line with) the track at all times
• rumble/ripple strips are part of the track
• no contact with walls or objects, visible or invisible
• if you're not 100% sure that your lap is clean, then consider it dirty
• no hybrids
• no cheating of any kind
• nothing that goes against the spirit of the rules
• save your replay ('Save Ghost Replay' icon)

Although these rules are based on our current OLR system of play, the principals are the same regarding the sections about cheating. So when you hear someone mention ‘our rules’, they don’t just mean the GTP, they mean every mayor Gran Turismo Website or message board. It’s very important that everybody remembers this fact, and not believe that anyone here is trying to be high and mighty, as some here have implied.


For me being GTP’s WRS (Weekly Race Series) race steward, I have the role of maintaining and organizing the largest and longest running GT race series on the Internet (5yrs). Every week I have to ensure that the rules above are followed and maintained. I cannot see it as childish when I see someone cheat and then attempt to stop them from benefitting from their actions; I see it as a responsibility.


Which brings me to:

Good question Sphinx. Though it may sound silly I know but for the current situation of the game I would have carried on despite the dissapointment of losing to such circumstances. I'm not a child, I'm 21 and know how to take such dissapointment. I do deplore such actions however so don't get me wrong, I don't condone unsporting behaviour and so I do understand where you're coming from. Maybe some people are not mature enough to understand the consequences of such actions such as that of a child for example. If it's an adult who's hellbent on causing chaos then its a different matter as I definitely have a very dim opinion of them.

I know it’s a good question. In fact, as I already stated, I predicted your answer. Therefore the answer you gave wasn’t too important to me. What is important however is that the question shows the other side of the coin and highlights that a host that quits a race due to cheaters isn’t the same as a host quitting a race simply because they can. It also highlights that a host that quits as race due to cheaters are not carrying out a childish act, they are in fact maintaining the rules of OLR that every mayor Website or Message Board has been maintaining and following for over 9 years.

 

[BrainGow=Bairn]

Damn GT-R and Lotus drivers its for you!!!! i play at Fuji 650 i have a great connection and in 99 % i host! IF YOU !DAMN IT TAKE! PUSH MY GREY VIPER I QUIT REMEMBER THIS! Viper extremly hard to drive! And i always on 3-1 place! Be careful if you wonna play at good host! If you play normal i play fair too!

and there we have it.. the core of the quitting problem.

You do realise that not EVERYONE in the race stands for that GT-R and that lotus that rams you off, right? not everyone is out to get you, and it is in NO WAY justified that YOU quit the game because YOU got rammed off... knowing that you are the host makes it even worse.

Sjees.. that's like bombing a entire country just because there are a few people in that country you don't like, screw the rest then?

 

[Beerz]

Sjees.. that's like bombing a entire country just because there are a few people in that country you don't like, screw the rest then?

It's been done before, and it worked.

 

[BrainGow=Bairn]

It's been done before, and it worked.

I was afraid that people would that take that qoute, and that quite only.. let's keep it on topic please.

 

[nasanu]

the huge effort that has taken place within the GT community over the past nine years or so to exclude cheaters from this game


When the ‘GT community’ is ever mentioned, it doesn’t just mean this site, it means most every major GT Website on the Internet, and every site worth its salt follows, with the odd variation, the standard OLR rules.

For example;


Standard Clean OLR Rules:

• 2 wheels on (or vertically in line with) the track at all times
• rumble/ripple strips are part of the track
• no contact with walls or objects, visible or invisible
• if you're not 100% sure that your lap is clean, then consider it dirty
• no hybrids
• no cheating of any kind
• nothing that goes against the spirit of the rules
• save your replay ('Save Ghost Replay' icon)

Although these rules are based on our current OLR system of play, the principals are the same regarding the sections about cheating. So when you hear someone mention ‘our rules’, they don’t just mean the GTP, they mean every mayor Gran Turismo Website or message board. It’s very important that everybody remembers this fact, and not believe that anyone here is trying to be high and mighty, as some here have implied.

What you have to keep in mind now is that online racing is totally distinct from the offline times trials that have been going on in GT since the late 90s. You and what you call the GT community have every right to dictate what goes on in those offline time trials, but you have no right at all to tell people who have no interest in you or your forums how to play in their copy of GT in their own home.

I understand that the rules are generally for the benefit of all and with some modifications to keep up with the times would serve very well if PD were to enforce them. But there is the rub, its solely up to PD to enforce them, not you. Plus its not like the members here all follow the rules online anyway, as my race with spyrarrari half and hour ago (he was losing so he quit) proved.

 

[DustDriver]

spyrrari didn't quit because he was losing, he had a messed up connection.

Sphinx isn't enforcing the rules to the general public, and you're right, you don't have to follow them.
But when you want to race in a league that is organised by (a part of) the GT community, you will have to respect those rules.
And that's what he is trying to explain i think.

 

[spyrrari]

What you have to keep in mind now is that online racing is totally distinct from the offline times trials that have been going on in GT since the late 90s. You and what you call the GT community have every right to dictate what goes on in those offline time trials, but you have no right at all to tell people who have no interest in you or your forums how to play in their copy of GT in their own home.

I understand that the rules are generally for the benefit of all and with some modifications to keep up with the times would serve very well if PD were to enforce them. But there is the rub, its solely up to PD to enforce them, not you. Plus its not like the members here all follow the rules online anyway, as my race with spyrarrari half and hour ago (he was losing so he quit) proved.

see my new thread!!!...it whas not my fault mate....and again my connection failed completely 5 minutes ago.....am having problems here dude...i never ever quit a race in my life before.....
spyrrari.

 

[Sphinx]

You and what you call the GT community have every right to dictate what goes on in those offline time trials, but you have no right at all to tell people who have no interest in you or your forums how to play in their copy of GT in their own home.

OK. Just as you mention here, I also own a personal copy of GT5p, I also play it in my own home, So ask me, based on you own opinion that no one can dictate to anyone how to play the game in their own homes, then who the hell do you think you are trying to dictate to me and others how we should play GT5p in our own homes?

So there we have it; Based on your very own argument (and don't even try to retract it), I can do whatever the hell I please when racing, and if that means quitting a race whilst being the host because a bunch of idiots and cheaters are on the track, then that is what I shall do, if I desire to do so.

BANG BANG! You’re dead.

i never ever quit a race in my life before.....
spyrrari.

I bet that's not strictly true.

 

[spyrrari]

I bet that's not strictly true.

hehehe......never quit beceause i couln't win or spun out i ment

 

[Sphinx]

hehehe......never quit beceause i couln't win or spun out i ment

So you've never quit a race?

 

[Beerz]

i never ever quit a race in my life before

=/=

never quit beceause i couln't win or spun out i ment

You should've made that clear the first time, wouldn't hurt you. 👍

 

[nasanu]

who the hell do you think you are trying to dictate to me and others how we should play GT5p in our own homes?

My argument was all along that quitting is bad and more to the point that it is worse than what I did, but I was never talking about trying to get people banned or anything of the sort. I want PD to fix it, I don't expect or want team america to come and do it for them.

Sorry spyrrari if your connection did drop out, it just really looked bad. You were trying to catch me, spun, 10sec behind, 19 sec behind, then your gone.

Hope it gets more stable for you.

 

[spyrrari]

=/=




You should've made that clear the first time, wouldn't hurt you. 👍

agreed

 

[thedeester1]

Bad English aside, it is annoying as **** soon we will only be able to win races were hosting.

 

[CoccoBill]

Person A who likes to ram people goes all out and rams 5 people off during the race, how many honest racers are affected?

Person B who likes to quit when being a host quits the game when he sees person A, how many honest racers are affected?

Justifying the latter by saying it somehow works towards some greater good (how exactly?) doesn't fly in my book, both actions are equally unfair. It could even be argued the latter is worse, since person A only affects those he manages to ram, person B is guaranteed to screw up the race for everyone.

 

[dark_ruffo]

I always quit.

But not because I'm loosing, is because I don't get matched in the same race with my friend. We always pick the same car, tires, no abs, and stuff to have fun races..

I don't feel like racing all alone with S or N tires with a stock car against some ****ing tuned R tires fited cars.

It is always the same thing, about 99% of the online "racers" choose that Elise or that Evo X.

 

[H20HYBRID_GT]

I always quit.

But not because I'm loosing, is because I don't get matched in the same race with my friend. We always pick the same car, tires, no abs, and stuff to have fun races..

I don't feel like racing all alone with S or N tires with a stock car against some ****ing tuned R tires fited cars.

how sad this is

 

[PSTC555]

I always quit.

But not because I'm loosing, is because I don't get matched in the same race with my friend. We always pick the same car, tires, no abs, and stuff to have fun races..

I don't feel like racing all alone with S or N tires with a stock car against some ****ing tuned R tires fited cars.

It is always the same thing, about 99% of the online "racers" choose that Elise or that Evo X.

how sad this is

I agree with H20HYBRID_GT here. Just because you're not in the same race as your friend doesn't mean that it gives you the right to end other people's race as well. I have a couple of online friends I want to race but I couldn't most of the time so I have to live with it. If you're not host, then its probably fine but if you're host then you just end up wasting other peoples time and bandwidth. For a high success rate of getting your friend in try doing an event with low numbers of people entering. Also try to do it roughly at the same time when connecting, some IM would be useful here.

 

[DustDriver]

I just got the warning: connection lost with server
After i got second in a race bye bye money

 

[PSTC555]

I just got the warning: connection lost with server
After i got second in a race bye bye money

It hurts doesn't it when it happens? I had that happen to me a couple of times, its like you did all that hard work and you get nothing in the end as a reward. All that time is wasted as a result. I think its the most cruelest way of disconnecting in my opinion because they're way down the grid. I'm not getting into the argument whether the host may be unfairly punted off or something but the bottom line is if the host quit simply because they was losing then I personally find it as the most disgusting behaviour imaginable in OLR terms.

 

[Beerz]

I always quit.

But not because I'm loosing, is because I don't get matched in the same race with my friend. We always pick the same car, tires, no abs, and stuff to have fun races.

Then you should probably stay away from the online mode until private lobbies are in place, shouldn't you?