The Damage Thread - Best Buy Demo, Now Thats More Like It!

[Devedander]

Like this?

Atleast the damage in GT is corresponds to the spot of contact, the F3 video shows the Bugatti hit head on and for some reason the ENTIRE car gets scratched up, even the back which had zero collision.

Ultimately they are both highly questionable for different reasons...

On one side, the Veyron somehow magically gets damaged all over, but at least it looks kind of like a damaged car.

However the Ferrari takes damage in only the spot it should, but looks like it's made out of paper machet or something....

Ultimately all I can say is that all the claims of "Don't worry, it's GT and KY, it will be awesome!" aren't sounding so solid right now... FM3 had some very questionable issues, but it doesn't look like the certainty that GT5 wouldn't have issues was so well founded... we'll see though!

 

[Pierced Lead]

Hey Devedander, now that you're here again, what's your take on the damage shown so far?

I also want you to know I am NOT asking that in a serious or sarcastic tone, I just though I might know your input

 

[Patrocles]

haha Yeah, the Forza3 scratches are very odd!

 

[Spagetti69]

That's called pre-canned damage.
The 800 standards i think will have pre canned too.

 

[Devedander]

Hey Devedander, now that you're here again, what's your take on the damage shown so far?

I also want you to know I am NOT asking that in a serious or sarcastic tone, I just though I might know your input

Glad damage is in, I am more concerened with mechanical damage and how it effects your driving than visual. As far as I am concerened, visual damge is good as a cue to what the other car has been doing (for instance I like to know that a certain car I am going to try and pass looks like he isn't a solid driver or has a lot of left side damage so is likely to not corner so well to the left) but I give it a good deal of leway. I was perfectly happy with Rallisport Challenge and TOCA in terms of visual damge representation.

That said, I have to say there is a point where it goes too far and if crazy zig zag body panels is where we are going to end up, that seems like it hurts more than it helps.

I have to see for myself how mechanical damage pans out but from reports of how the banged up NASCAR works I think it sounds promissing. Again, I was pretty satisfied with TOCA and Rallisport (respectively to their genres) in terms of mechanical damage modelling, really liked RBR (obviously) and I think the Dirts and Grids have even done a pretty good job lately, so I expect GT to hit a pretty high bar, and it sounds like in terms of mechanical damage, they are on track for that.

I have been a vocal and long standing supporter of damage in GT and I am glad KY came around and went for hit, however back when we saw earlier damage and they said they had gotten where they were in 2 weeks or something, I was blown away (and a little bit sceptical) but that seemed to hint at some really great stuff given how much time they have worked on it since... visually, I am not so sure I am seeing what I thought we would see.

 

[Zer0]

lol

People will hate. That's how it is... It's amazing that for what all GT5 has to offer, instead what people look at are instead its flaws. It really doesn't surprise why it's taken so long to develop this game when expectations are so astronomically high.

I'm amazed at how Kazunori and his team can handle all this hate.

The funny thing is that most of them are Forza players and never complained about its damage model:

...

 

[Asane]

Ultimately they are both highly questionable for different reasons...

On one side, the Veyron somehow magically gets damaged all over, but at least it looks kind of like a damaged car.

However the Ferrari takes damage in only the spot it should, but looks like it's made out of paper machet or something....

Ultimately all I can say is that all the claims of "Don't worry, it's GT and KY, it will be awesome!" aren't sounding so solid right now... FM3 had some very questionable issues, but it doesn't look like the certainty that GT5 wouldn't have issues was so well founded... we'll see though!

Yeah I only see one major problem with that video and that is how the **** did the front not even have the bumber go off or the front cave in on itself. Ask yourself that question for a FINISHED AND ON THE MARKET GAME.


This demo of GT5 that I have played is certainly a demo and a work in progress, not to mention it's more than 2 months old already and I was encountering bugs like my car flying up for no reason in Rome. This is still a demo. Let's wait till TGS or even Nov 2.

 

[PirateThom]

I'll probably get hate for saying this... anyone else think PD need to tone this damage DOWN?

It's too much, they should keep the impact locations and proceedural stuff but if you can smash a car to that degree and bits AREN'T falling off, it's a bit ridiculous.

I think actually parts becoming detached is how we'll really need to see it to judge though. There's not "stopping point" for this damage, if panels could fall off the damage probably wouldn't get so ridiculous.

Just a thought.

 

[tfujiwara]

Haha funny. Not to far from you, used to live in Carol Stream, now in Aurora.

Thats the BB I'd be going to.

Aurora?..
....damm, never thought I hear the city that I live in from this website. What a small world. that place is like 40 min away from here(in Aurora).

 

[shirakawaa]

Nice comparison, but as we can clearly see, the real NASCAR car has actually deformed inwards (crunching the hood and nose up against the engine block). Where as in the GT5 picture, the damage seems to stay within the parameters of the hood, and nothing deforms/crumples inward.

That's my main thing I don't like of the GT5 damage shown so far. It seems to be limited to side panels, bumpers and hood.
Many here say it's enough, but personally, since PD took the efforts of taking deformation one level higher than the competition, I expected more structural damage, like the ability of visibily knocking off wheel alignment (or even knocking off one or more wheels completely if damage is severe enough), crumple zones etc, in other words, making it in a way that one could guess the car behavior by looking at the visible damage (or, consequently, that what is seen is what the game physics engine uses to calculate the car behavior - WYSIWYG - rather than using apparently random parameters affecting drivability).

Of course, the cabin would have to remain intact because of car makers complaining, etc.
But maybe I was expecting too much?

 

[Devedander]

Yeah I only see one major problem with that video and that is how the **** did the front not even have the bumber go off or the front cave in on itself. Ask yourself that question for a FINISHED AND ON THE MARKET GAME.


This demo of GT5 that I have played is certainly a demo and a work in progress, not to mention it's more than 2 months old already and I was encountering bugs like my car flying up for no reason in Rome. This is still a demo. Let's wait till TGS or even Nov 2.

Oh we're all waiting with baited breath...

The thing is when FM3 came out, there was no shortage of people picking it appart for being rushed, released too fast and full of bugs and how GT5 wouldn't do that since it was done right...

Well 800 standard cars later I am not feeling that sentiment very strongly... and now with damage (I feel a major part of the game) I am also starting to wonder if we won't see very smilar videos of GT5 after launch like we did picking apart FM3....

Oh and don't forget, that FM3 demo... the Forza crowd was quick to point out it was a demo and not final either... not saying this is the same, just putting it out there.

 

[amar212]

So, with arrival of famous constructive critics at this point this Damage thread have officialy became new Standard/Premium thread.

Plague.

 

[Asane]

Oh we're all waiting with baited breath...

The thing is when FM3 came out, there was no shortage of people picking it appart for being rushed, released too fast and full of bugs and how GT5 wouldn't do that since it was done right...

Well 800 standard cars later I am not feeling that sentiment very strongly... and now with damage (I feel a major part of the game) I am also starting to wonder if we won't see very smilar videos of GT5 after launch like we did picking apart FM3....

You can state your opinion, but let's all wait till TGS and the eventual launch then nitpick at the game all you want about how one bolt in a car is out of place or a Ferrari doesn't have enough roar in its engine or the damage looks like putty or whatever you guys wanna complain about.

For us GT fans, we'll be too busy starting up GT Life and start our career to even care.

 

[TiZzla]

Is there any evidence of the AI cars getting damaged?

Or is it just the players car that receives damage, which is lame.

Im happy with the damage BTW, its only the 458 that looks silly. But what do you expect after crashing it 20 times in a row

 

[Asane]

Is there any evidence of the AI cars getting damaged?

Or is it just the players car that receives damage, which is lame.

Im happy with the damage BTW, its only the 458 that looks silly. But what do you expect after crashing it 20 times in a row

I can confirm to you that the AI cars can get damaged as much as the car your driving. I don't have videos but I have seen it playing.

Here's proof that I have.

I was driving the Audi R8.

EDIT: lol I just noticed. It seems like Kotaku got the worst of my photos and never posted the others like the one above.

 

[With a EG6]

This Damage model in GT5 seems to look a bit stupid , it just dosent crumple right and i dont want my lambo looking like a piece of cheese when i make a mistake ! on the upside the scratches and dents look sweet , and thats all it should have

 

[TiZzla]

I can confirm to you that the AI cars can get damaged as much as the car your driving. I don't have videos but I have seen it playing.

Here's proof that I have.

I was driving the Audi R8.

Ok i can't see that picture but if theres more than one car damaged then im happy 👍

I just watched the latest 458 (grey) video from the new demo and he crashes head on with the GTR which receives no damage

 

[Asane]

Ok i can't see that picture but if theres more than one car damaged then im happy 👍

I just watched the latest 458 (grey) video from the new demo and he crashes head on with the GTR which receives no damage

Here's the direct link to the GTPlanet front page where all this hoopla started.

https://www.gtplanet.net/new-gran-turismo-5-damage-model-in-best-buy-demo/gt5-bestbuy-damage-9/

That's the proof your looking for. Again I was driving the R8.

 

[Devedander]

You can state your opinion, but let's all wait till TGS and the eventual launch then nitpick at the game all you want about how one bolt in a car is out of place or a Ferrari doesn't have enough roar in its engine or the damage looks like putty or whatever you guys wanna complain about.

For us GT fans, we'll be too busy starting up GT Life and start our career to even care.

Look we can all wait until lauch to talk about anything (ultimately whatever game show we wait for, we will also be told to wait till launch/next gameshow if what shows up at said gameshow isn't pleasing) but then what's the point of this forum?

How about the GTP forum just be shut down until Nov2?

 

[Asane]

Look we can all wait until lauch to talk about anything (ultimately whatever game show we wait for, we will also be told to wait till launch/next gameshow if what shows up at said gameshow isn't pleasing) but then what's the point of this forum?

How about the GTP forum just be shut down until Nov2?

lol So, if it's gonna be like that then what about talking about the different things that GT5 actually does well and comment on those things instead of dreading about all the stuff we can complain about..

Having played GT5 damage is on the bottom of my list now as even the demo does a lot of things well.

How about actually giving props to PD for implementing procedural damage instead of the pre-canned damage that other games have such as Forza 3 where I get hit in the front and my whole car is suddenly scratched up.

 

[Spagetti69]

I'm sure 800 cars are pre canned too.

 

[Organ-Donor]

I'm sure 800 cars are pre canned too.

We heard you the first time. We were expecting standard cars to get only scratches and dents like they stated a while ago. I still wouldn't expect the standard cars to get dented in the rear of the car if they have a head on collision though.

 

[Spagetti69]

I wouldn't expect that either.

 

[Devedander]

lol So, if it's gonna be like that then what about talking about the different things that GT5 actually does well and comment on those things instead of dreading about all the stuff we can complain about..

Having played GT5 damage is on the bottom of my list now as even the demo does a lot of things well.

How about actually giving props to PD for implementing procedural damage instead of the pre-canned damage that other games have such as Forza 3 where I get hit in the front and my whole car is suddenly scratched up.

How about not ignoring the posts where I do?

I said go karts looke fun, and while unexpected I was surprisingly interested in them... but no one pays attention to that.

I have said Premium cars look incredible on many occasions, but you don't pay attention to that.

Just last page in direct response to how I feel about damage I say I am happy it's in, mechanical damage (which I consider to be more important) sounds promising and I am happy about it. Visual damage is important to me and I am glad we get some even if it's looking pretty rough so far.

If only the PD Defense force wasn't so worried about jumping on every negative out there and trying to shut it down... maybe would see the forest despite the trees

 

[Zer0]

If only the PD Defense force wasn't so worried about jumping on every negative out there and trying to shut it down... maybe would see the forest despite the trees

A defense force would not exist if one of attack did not exist.

It's not a secret that a lot of people are in denial about GT, them just post to complain and to tone down the fan's expectations even when they know very little about the game and are proved wrong a lot of times.

 

[SSJNeBiRoS]

I expect something like this for Standards:





With maybe some deformation, but very little. And as you can see this system is not pre-canned either, when you hit the front you don't get the whole nose with scratches , or when you hit one side you don't scratch the whole side, the scratches appears according to the crash, and as in the videos if the car is scratching the wall the scratches increased according to it.

 

[PirateThom]

If only the PD Defense force wasn't so worried about jumping on every negative out there and trying to shut it down... maybe would see the forest despite the trees

It's hard to see 2D trees in real life though.

Anyway, I don't mind discussing negatives and potential positives. If something is a negative now, why can't it be improved post-release or the next iteration? Going to have to be discussed sometime, why not now? Is it improved on release? No loss. Is it the same? We see where it is and present solutions and see if anyone takes notice.

 

[Devedander]

A defense force would not exist if one of attack did not exist.

It's not a secret that a lot of people are in denial about GT, them just post to complain and to tone down the fan's expectations even when they know very little about the game and are proved wrong a lot of times.

The problem is nothing is perfect, everything will have some negatives. But the PD Defense force seems to exist with the intent of reducing negative observations to 0. So enthusiastically so that if you are negative at all, you are painted as nothing but negative and a troll even if you are not.

BTW in my experience it has been the excessively positive who are proven wrong much more often than those who are noting potential negatives... pretty much any example in which a form of "It's GT/PD/KY we are talking about here! No need to worry, it will be incredible, they are masters and won't do anything but the absolute best, you'll see!" is used ends up poorly.

Easy to say then, but thsoe people seem to magically dissapear when stuff like standard cars and weird crumply hoods pop up.

 

[analog]

A defense force would not exist if one of attack did not exist.

It's not a secret that a lot of people are in denial about GT, them just post to complain and to tone down the fan's expectations even when they know very little about the game and are proved wrong a lot of times.

Depends on perception, meaning if you regard critical opinions as attacks needing to be defended or just a critical opinion not shared by you which you could counterargue if you feel like it or simply ignore.

If I didn't have a critical opinion or a single worry about aspects of GT5 ( I only have one major gripe which is lack of cockpit view ) and would only look forward to it being released offering all I ever wanted I certainly wouldn't have my enthusiasm dampened, or feel bothered, by other people expressing a different opinion ( nor would I feel the need to complain about complainers as I would simply acknowledge they can't simply seem to share the excitement I felt those poor miserable souls, no need to rub it in or call them killjoys but just feel silently smug ).

It's only those who are critical of each and every aspect who have to ask themselves whether they're posting in the proper forum themselves perhaps ( not refering to an actual person by the way, just a general remark ), not those who have one or even many more issues regarding the game they also love ( otherwise why express concern? ) as they indeed can be positive about other aspects of GT5.
But I guess I'm preaching to the converted again as some can still be objective to an extend whilst discussing a game they love ( or the largest part of the game ).

Oh and by the way, I really liked the damage shown in the last few days, if I weren't I would like to feel safe here in expressing it as an honest opinion or observation without being called complainer, whiner or troll.

 

[Asane]

Depends on perception, meaning if you regard critical opinions as attacks needing to be defended or just a critical opinion not shared by you which you could counterargue if you feel like it or simply ignore.

If I didn't have a critical opinion or a single worry about aspects of GT5 ( I only have one major gripe which is lack of cockpit view ) and would only look forward to it being released offering all I ever wanted I certainly wouldn't have my enthusiasm dampened, or feel bothered, by other people expressing a different opinion ( nor would I feel the need to complain about complainers as I would simply acknowledge they can't simply seem to share the excitement I felt those poor miserable souls, no need to rub it in or call them killjoys but just feel silently smug ).

It's only those who are critical of each and every aspect who have to ask themselves whether they're posting in the proper forum themselves perhaps ( not refering to an actual person by the way, just a general remark ), not those who have one or even many more issues regarding the game they also love ( otherwise why express concern? ) as they indeed can be positive about other aspects of GT5.
But I guess I'm preaching to the converted again as some can still be objective to an extend whilst discussing a game they love ( or the largest part of the game ).

Oh and by the way, I really liked the damage shown in the last few days, if I weren't I would like to feel safe here in expressing it as an honest opinion or observation without being called complainer, whiner or troll.

I guess it's just the fine line between insult(trolling) and criticism which people have to watch out for.