The impact penalty: good or bad?

  • Thread starter Thread starter SuntoucherUK
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The Toyota Demo had the 10 second penalty. It took a lot of force in the impact to set it off, though. I think it would be a welcome feature if it was the same in GT4.

Odd thing, there were "shortcuts" in the Fuji track that when you used them, you received no penalty. Using the shortcuts was the only way to make a full run around the course before the two minute limit was up while using the Prius. I wonder if it will be the same in GT4?
 
me not like them penalty system as it is - it should be changed
when you slam hard into the wall it will surely not make you go any faster so there´s no need to penalize big mistakes in a lap even more.
there should be a penalty though for cutting the chicanes (leaving them out) like there was in gt2...
we´ll see.
 
That penalty isn't as bad as I first thought. I tried GT4:P and well I hardly ever got one. Although it would be annoying to get one whilst racing a really important race...... But hey....... It's racing
 
yeti
I like and I dislike the penalty system...

If you get rammed into a wall then You get penalised however if you ram someone else into a wall (AI) they don't get penalised and neither do you. (You don't get a penalty for hitting other cars...

Also some places in the track seem more sensitive... Like I slammed my car into a wall after a turn on NY (Still can't get the braking points yet!) and I didn't get one... then I gently clipped a wall later with the middle of my car and did get one...

The other thing is that it is much more apparent in courses like the New York one instead of Fuji... as this is a Proper speedway with run off areas and grass so instead you just end up going slower (Unless you really get something wrong!) and not being penalised...

C.
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It depends on what part of the car hits the barrier. I've found you can slam the rear and sides into as much as you want as hard as you want. It seems to take affect from mainly the front of the car. I've had incidents at Citta when i'm sure i've just slightly scraped the car on the side and it's given me a penalty. I like it, but I see no point in having penalties for going off on massive bits of runoff and hitting the wall, that's a punishment in itself.
 
Last night I noticed that the penalty system is more stringent on Fuji for hitting cars than in New york for hitting cars!!

In New York I can quite happily plough through the field and send them into various places on the course...

However in Fuji the slightest tap and I get penalised (Not that this matters cos I can make up the difference by cutting through the two chicanes!!!

C.

PS How do you think they are going to handle the chicanes in the real game?
 
I'm pretty sure there wasn't a penalty for hitting other cars on the Chineese version, just for the walls.
 
From my prolouge experience ive learned to hate it, simply put because it only works when it shouldnt. Im a able driver (all golds should prove that) and i basically only get done for it when i 'graze' a wall or other racer. It just pisses me off when youre passing a car and he swerves accross and the penalty goes off taking you from 280km\h to 50 on a straight and you have done nothing wrong.
My other problem with it is the fact that you can hit a wall at max speed with the side of youre car and not get done, but hit the wall with the front at 5km/h and you have 10 seconds of hell. IMO it should be determined by impact force (if thats possible) not just "the front of the car has hit something - trigger"

Just my thoughts :)
 
Unfortunately us Canadians don't have the prologue but from what others are saying i hope there's some progression in terms of sensitivity and implementation of the penalty. I think you should be penalized if you smash into a wall or ram drivers... hopefully there will be more real race logic implemented in the system. Rubbing someone when passing is completely different then nailing the rear corner of an opponent ahead of you in a corner. Also, it's stupid if you get hit into an object that you get a penalty... the person that hit you should... as for implementation, i do like the idea of the black flag type penalty better (stop and go in the pits).
 
I think it stinks.

I would like a 2 second penalty instead and penalty given much easier than now. (more penalties, but shorter ones)
 
I think it all boils down to the fact, as pointed out on here, that GT is meant to be a driving simulator. It was nice of PD to try something new with the impact penalty but I don't think it should survive to the final build of GT4.

All they need to do is make the AI good enough that the time you lose through the impact itself is enough to put you off doing it again! That said you can drive a 5 lap race on New York and get loads of penalties and then still win by a mile. I'll give PD the benefit of the doubt and trust their wisdom to make the right choice with the final game.
 
i think the time penalty system in gt4p is a good idea it just needs a little work before they use it in the finished article i mean getting a fail or time peneltys for bearly touching the car in fronts back bumper is a bit harsh ,i mean try racing when all you can see is the back of the car in front and have to take bends blind with only experience or good luck keeping you off the walls a little tap is gonna happen.also when your only a couple of tenths quicker than the car in front it nedds to allow for a bit of side by side pannel rubbig into corners with out penelys for either car I think the peneltys should be given when you smack in to other cars not little bumps, rubs and nudges. also they should issue peneltys for people who use wall to help them round corners and doing heavy cuts and putting all four wheels off the track at chicanes.
 
With my legitimately purchased cd of prologue purchased when it was released in the UK, to be honest, i think it's bad if it stays as it is. It needs to be dropped for little nudges and kept the same for big impacts, and forced fishtails.
 
in skunkwerx e3 videos you see cars hitting the wall, you see the new impact effect but i can´t remember seeing a time penalty for those hits
 
I think the 10 second penalty should stay in! I used to cheat like crazy on the Tokyo circuit in GT3...On the long straight, dont' brake just smack into the wall at full speed, then set off again. Also in the complex before the final hairpin, full speed, hit the barrier and it "pings" you round! Although I won many races this way, it was a little dissapointing.

In GT4P you don't get the penalty for leaving the track or wall rubs, even touching other cars gently is ok...but the big smashes get you a 10s penalty, instead of "killed"

I have to smile at some of the posts claiming that they get double punishment, for spinning off, and the time penalty...guys...STOP SPINNING OFF !!
 
In the Toyota demo they had this i found out when going 83 MPH and trying to turn the damn pirus. :lol: I think it will be challenging so yeah i want it.
 
Having just lost another race because another tool decided it'd be more fun to play bumper cars to win than actually know how to drive in NFSU, the impact penalty can't come quick enough.

And no one bother telling me that's what I get for playing NFSU.
 
Eagle
Having just lost another race because another tool decided it'd be more fun to play bumper cars to win than actually know how to drive in NFSU, the impact penalty can't come quick enough.

And no one bother telling me that's what I get for playing NFSU.
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Thats what you get for playing NFSU.....

Nah just kidding ya :dopey:
 
GT4 is supposed to be a driving simulator. And while painstakingly reproducing every cars, their physics, handling, tracktimes, tracks, drivers in cars shifting and steering etc, the lack of damage has always been a problem in the serie's.

A lot of people complain about the "double punishment" when you crash into a wall or something. Well, that double punishment counts for damaging the car in such a way that you normally would have to quit the race since you wrecked your vehicle. So if you want a car-simulator, it is acceptable that you are punished for reckless driving that would seriously **** up your car. You better brake early enough and be carefull with that precious thing, so it stimulates decent realistic driving. They probably have arcade modes or optionable "no-penal-modes" if you single-race for the people who like to go wild.

For me, one of the biggest anoying things in GT3 was still the usage of fellow cars to take that corner and effectively bump off them with some speedloss when you hardly braked for a certain corner. The other car could be used as a brake, and they were slammed into the wall. That was lame driving, which took a great hit on realism. In fact, I could do better laptimes if I overpowered my car with huge tuningkits, drive like a maniac into a corner, slam the car against the wall to brake, and accelerate out of it. If I would correctly brake at the best time without crashing, driving the ideal line, I would be slower sometimes.

What they need to do, besides improving the AI much more (but I heard the Prologue AI isn't near the final-AI build anyway), is calculate the impact factor/force and cling a resulting penal to that (more seconds for bigger impact) for both involving cars, maybe lower topspeed for the rest of the race from certain impacts if that was possible. Burnout2 has a great collison-detection too with crashes, the CPU intensive stuff lies more into the graphical result of that formula.

But wouldn't it be more logical if they made a 2D topview of the car in the corner of the game-screen, and highlight every damaged area in red, yellow or green or so, and make a simple calculation-formula on that in connection to your car's performance. That could be acceptable for manufacturars, cuz the damage wasn't actually shown in-game in 3D. Little damage would take less penal-time, or less time to fix in the pits (tires, wings, bumpers), and bigger damage would be more critical to performance and un-reparable in the race. Maybe even undrivable that you would have to quit the race. You would have to fix that in investing money after the race for repairing. Technicly I think that collision-detection/calculation wouldn't be that hard to implement.

It would be ideal if gamepay-wise they also could recognise that the car that is the 'cause' of a touche, either by leaving the race-line bumping into a fair and steady racing car doing his race, or 'slamming the door shut' into a corner when a car is inside more than half, then that 'bad driver' would be penalised more than the one that is the victim of his behaviour. A so called referee of racing, just as the FIA does in F1 when a race-incident happens. I think that last thing is too advanced for the PS2 though, since all the other implemented things use so much resources that I can hardly imagine it can be added. AI is a challenge on itself, and even the FIA sometimes needs to look at incident for a minute or so after they decide who's fault it is and penalize him.

Maybe PD can calculate the distance between cars in-game. AI-cars could be randomly aggresive in blocking as individual drivers, but when another car has the beneficial position of the corner, they should back off, make room, and leave their ideal raceline instead of shutting it with a 'touche'. The fine theoretical line between blocking smartly by defending the ideal programmed/scripted raceline as a humanlike car on one side, and making room by letting go on the other side is something that should be technicly possible if they could calculate that distance in every overtaking corner (normally the most used location of overtaking) between the cars. If half of the overtaking car is alongside/passed his frontrunner, they should make room and let go, as a rule.

And now I need a beer. I typed myself thirsty.

/editted some typo's and added stuff.
 
why not make it so if someone runs into a wall hard or flys off the track for too long all the other cars should slow down. The AI should take complete control until everyone is back on track.
 
Having bought prologue this weekend, i think the penalty system is good, if implimented a little heavy-handedly. Perhaps, as others have mentioned, it should be done on a scale like having a 10 second penalty for a very high-speed colision, 8 seconds for a slightly slow colision etc etc. I think, especially since we will be playing GT4 against others online, a penality system is very much needed. I certainly approve of the way the cars handle on 'rumble' strips and on the grass. Its much more life like, although not perfect.
 

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