The "Online Boost" demystified

  • Thread starter unimental
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its definitely there with euro version and pro races (700pp, suzuka), not quite sure about the number of players yet.

however, its probably the worst "feature" i´ve ever seen in a "simulation" game racing online and hope they get rid of it as soon as possible.

i am a LFS fanatic and love driving clean races with consistent lap times. it just feels wrong to have about +5 sec lap times just because you are leading the race. tire grip is getting ridiculous, car handling decreases and you have to break much earlier than used to (which is sometimes unpredictable, depends mostly what your time advantage is.. very funny).
 
huHuAT
its definitely there with euro version and pro races (700pp, suzuka), not quite sure about the number of players yet.
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Yup... just got one of those bugs where someone rammed me into 1st still in formation, over 300Kmph...

Lead the whole race... alone. Couldn't get it below 1.11. Compared to 1.08 yesterday in 2nd with 4 players, and the first was also a 111 Tuned, doing the same times.

I now believe it to be something like a handicap to the last guy. So in 12 players, 11th is 1% slower, 10th is 2% and so on... so second would be 10% slower. But with four players only, 2nd would be only 2% slower than last and we do not notice much of a difference between the 4.

Obviously 10% is exaggerated, but you get the point...
 
jibber
It depends on your opinion...

For me it's definately not a "mixed bag". If i'm faster, i want to see the reward. If i'm slower, i want to lose.

It's racing, so let it be a fair competition:
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Yea but I mean its unfair for the people who lose p1 because somebody rammed them. I see good drivers ram people also, so if you get pushed off the track intentionally by a guy who's just as good as you, you'll never catch up. Which to me is the unfair side of no boost.

Although with that said I am against the current boosting, makes staying in p1 too hard.
 
BonzoHarry
Yea but I mean its unfair for the people who lose p1 because somebody rammed them. I see good drivers ram people also, so if you get pushed off the track intentionally by a guy who's just as good as you, you'll never catch up. Which to me is the unfair side of no boost.

Although with that said I am against the current boosting, makes staying in p1 too hard.
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If pushed off the track intentionally, i had bad luck with the race i was put in then. Even if that person wins, he didn't earn it. I have no problems in losing a race like that.

I agree about making it hard to stay in first place. Happend to me a few times that i got in the lead... got away... to be magically catched up again then. It ruins the fun of it... completely. Why should i even try to be faster, if the reward is a "penalty" regarding my grip/handling/lap times?

The more i think about it, the more stupid it gets. :sly:
 
So many times I've come across the bridge at HSR when in first, braked in the normal spot only to understeer off into the grass. Worst "feature" ever.
 
I believe some testing tonight shows that, in fact, the "online boost" is GONE from the JPN version, but still present on at least the NA version.

I managed to win 700PP races with both copies tonight using the Tuned Vette and identical Quick Tune settings. Best times while leading a clean, full lap without traffic or drafting:

JPN = 2:07.141
US = 2:11.209

Four seconds is, of course, enormous. And I'm very consistent with that car.

My initial post after the latest update regarding the feeling that the "online boost" was gone was in fact made based on observations in the JPN version. I hadn't cleared A-class in the US version yet, so 700PP races were unavailable. Imagine my utter confusion when, upon entering the Pro races on the US version, the "online boost" was very much in effect.

This bodes well for non-JPN players, as we can all expect to possibly see this handicap removed from other versions in the future. :)
 
unimental
I believe some testing tonight shows that, in fact, the "online boost" is GONE from the JPN version, but still present on at least the NA version.

I managed to win 700PP races with both copies tonight using the Tuned Vette and identical Quick Tune settings. Best times while leading a clean, full lap without traffic or drafting:

JPN = 2:07.141
US = 2:11.209

Four seconds is, of course, enormous. And I'm very consistent with that car.

My initial post after the latest update regarding the feeling that the "online boost" was gone was in fact made based on observations in the JPN version. I hadn't cleared A-class in the US version yet, so 700PP races were unavailable. Imagine my utter confusion when, upon entering the Pro races on the US version, the "online boost" was very much in effect.

This bodes well for non-JPN players, as we can all expect to possibly see this handicap removed from other versions in the future. :)
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Very interesting and informative 👍 Hopefully the boost is removed in th NTSC game soon. I think they included it for the launch to please all the casuals who have no hope online, but they may remove it around the time GTA IV is released as the only ones left online will most likely be the enthusiasts

However, the removal of boost opens up a can of worms.

What happens if I start 6th and by the time I clear all the traffic and move into 2nd the leader has already built up a large lead? 3 lap races are simply not enough time to overcome.

Removal of boost MUST be accompanied by qualifying and longer races
 
Thanx unimental for confirming my experience.
Looking forward to when they remove it for the other versions, too! :)
I don't get though why PD don't say a word about that 'feature'?
Got big time confused when i saw how my laptimes were screwed up until i found out it depends on my current position in the race, feels so unrealistic! lets hope they remove it forever and stop experiment with it...
 
I initially thought it had disappeared after the latest update on my JPN Bluray copy when I had some consistent races and laps last week in the GTR at Fuji 700PP, and I thought great. I tried a few more and started to notice the boost and lap times dropping. I then tried with the Clio tuned (3 days ago) and did 10 laps on the free run at Fuji and couldn't match my times with the GTR on free run or TT but went to race anyway, and in some races I noticed I was matching my GTR times with no slipstreaming and only 2 other players where online so IMO the boost is still there. I can't get these times with the current set up for my tuned Clio in TT, even trying again afterwards.

That said, I still come away from some races thinking it's gone or the boost didn't kick and everyone was consistent in that race. I have done about 50 races over the last 5 days at Fuji in the early hours UK time, 7-12 races a night, some with 14 players, some with 2/3 and noticed the boost a lot and just take it for granted its there, but unimental has done more in-depth tests for months and I don't want to argue about what exactly is happening online with this boost handicap, maybe its reduced to some situations or amount of cars, or off calculations due to being Beta?
 
Earth
Removal of boost MUST be accompanied by qualifying and longer races
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Agreed. Also, the rolling start grids should be more tightly packed(ideally in 2 abreast fashion), like in real-life GT racing and have the option for standing starts.
 
My latest experience on this crappy feature was this:

The fastest time in Time-Trial 700PP Fuji is a 1.38.5xx by beatator...
My fastest is 1.39.8xx (Rank 20)

In the Fuji 700PP race-event (same car, same settings) I dropped back for almost one complete lap behind 11 opponents and guess what?

I did a 1.36.2xx -> The turbo boost, haha...


And when Im in the lead in the same event (as im most often...) the fastest I can do is only 1.41.0xx

So this tells me its not only a boost (to tailenders) and also not only a penalty for the leader(s) its both !
 
Gregz0r
Agreed. Also, the rolling start grids should be more tightly packed(ideally in 2 abreast fashion), like in real-life GT racing and have the option for standing starts.
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This is a great idea. It would be cool if qualifying could be quick 'one lap' qualifying like F1 was a few years back, if I recall correctly.
 
profi
My latest experience on this crappy feature was this:

The fastest time in Time-Trial 700PP Fuji is a 1.38.5xx by beatator...
My fastest is 1.39.8xx (Rank 20)

In the Fuji 700PP race-event (same car, same settings) I dropped back for almost one complete lap behind 11 opponents and guess what?

I did a 1.36.2xx -> The turbo boost, haha...


And when Im in the lead in the same event (as im most often...) the fastest I can do is only 1.41.0xx

So this tells me its not only a boost (to tailenders) and also not only a penalty for the leader(s) its both !
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Yes, I've had that too in the JPN copy. My GTR time is 1'40.500 ranked 60.

Another situation I've had is when only me and another GTR were on at Fuji 700PP. I did 1'44 from standing start and then two 1'40.5XX and the other GTR ahead of me was doing around 3 seconds a lap quicker. So he/she must have been doing 1'37-1'38 laps in the lead. I don't think boost or holding (rubberbanding) was taking place this time.
 
Earth
Removal of boost MUST be accompanied by qualifying and longer races
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I think everyone agrees that the rubberbanding has to go. Races should be won and lost on the merits of the individual drivers.

I like the idea of qualifying, but I still want the much slower cars in the front. Perhaps the field could be set by inverse order of power points (like now), with ties broken by qualifying times? In other words, if 6 cars have 699 power points, those six cars are sorted by qualifying time, while still behind any 698PP cars and in front of any 700PP cars.

I don't mind the field being spread out at the beginning, as long as the race allows everyone enough time to get through the field without resorting to punting. Shorter races should have tighter packs on the rolling start. Longer races can keep the spread out pack for the rolling start.
 
MustangRyan
I think everyone agrees that the rubberbanding has to go. Races should be won and lost on the merits of the individual drivers.

I like the idea of qualifying, but I still want the much slower cars in the front. Perhaps the field could be set by inverse order of power points (like now), with ties broken by qualifying times? In other words, if 6 cars have 699 power points, those six cars are sorted by qualifying time, while still behind any 698PP cars and in front of any 700PP cars.

I don't mind the field being spread out at the beginning, as long as the race allows everyone enough time to get through the field without resorting to punting. Shorter races should have tighter packs on the rolling start. Longer races can keep the spread out pack for the rolling start.
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The longer the race the less reason to drive recklessly. Most people online aren't going to jump into a 20-100 lap race though, so a happy medium needs to be found.

After many years online with Forza 1 & 2, 90% of the rooms typically were either 3 or 5 laps with standing starts, two abreast. You could order the grid by ranking/1st to worst or vice versa, Performance points, cummulative room points etc.

Most of the better drivers preferred 5 lap races, because they knew in 5 laps they still had time to win even if they were in 7-8th place on the grid. It made the starts less hectic and you could sit back a wait a bit before starting to make a move. Worst case you had to pass about 1-2 cars a lap to go from 8th to 1st.

With 8-16 cars in single file and spread out by such long distances, you need at least 5 laps and maybe a bit more to make up for the rolling starts, because the 9-16th positions are so far back. Luckily most of the races, I've been in just don't have that many drivers, but still rolling starts are awful for short races. I pray PD will add standing starts 2 or more abreast (depending on the track). 3 abreast would be fun at Daytona! :)
 
JackB
3 abreast would be fun at Daytona! :)
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Until you get to the first corner with all of the idiots :dunce:. The ONLY safe place would be the inside of the very first or last row. Everyone else would be punted, rammed or slammed into the outside wall by everyone else. Though I suppose the inside of the last row could also be collected into a large pileup.
 
I spotted this thread the day after I got GT5P and my PS3. The thing though was that from after the first couple races I could tell something was up. Even after increasing my pace (I was learning the first several races so I got quicker each lap pretty much) I would suddenly see my lap drop to a car that when they caught up to me I could see wasn't actually outdriving me.

It began to get annoying as I started to curse myself the next two days as I kept making mistakes. I swore I was misjudging my breaking points or getting on the throttle too early.

Now I come back here and I read more about it and I see it was all part of the handicap.



The idea of a handicap isnt new to racing, it happens in many series along the route of the season by adding weight and air restrictors. Whena car design itself is too quick you will even see tyre compound and aero restrictions added too. Closer racing is betting for the fans is the idea behind it. Good for TV too.....notice I said idea....

Online though....all it does in this sprint format is allow a banzai guy to come jump in the middle of your parade after leading the race and bomb you as best he can.




Thanks for all the info fro mthe people like unimental with the JPN copies. I didnt expect so many people to have that!



btw speaking of boosting. I just tested some viper setups on Fuji and some turd with a name something like "mcunnish" in his tuned Evo X kept trying to bomb me after he caught me up...he bombed my 4 times in two races and I still beat him while experimenting with the new car....
thats boost for you....
 
jmcn R
The idea of a handicap isnt new to racing, it happens in many series along the route of the season by adding weight and air restrictors. Whena car design itself is too quick you will even see tyre compound and aero restrictions added too. Closer racing is betting for the fans is the idea behind it. Good for TV too.....notice I said idea....
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Actually it is. There is no real life racing, that gives a handicap in the "MIDDLE" of the race. Not horse racing, car racing, dog racing, midget pig racing, potatoe sack racing.... You name it.

Sure some jockeys add weight and Danica Patrick has to add weight this year prior to the race to her car to "make weight", but no racing I know of on Planet Earth adds or removes weight/power/braking etc. "DURING" the race.

It might be fun though. During the pit stops they could add an extra hundred pounds or so per car depending on their position. Or maybe they could use a helicopter to add weight, so the drivers wouldn't even have to pit. :crazy: On second thought. Nah...

I can't see PD keeping this in Prologue or GT 5 in North America. Maybe it makes sense in Japan, but I sure hope it isn't in the North American release.
 
Come from behind boost is a major dissapointment. I thought maybe in pro sessions it would be eliminated. Unfortunately it's not. If' you're going to have it, make it in the beginners classes and keep it out of the pro. Why have Professional physics and handicap? That's an OXYMORON.
 
Did a few races today: three at PP700 at Fuji and three at PP700 on Daytona Road Course. Didn't experience any online boost at all. I don't know if PD is doing something behind the scenes but it pretty much wasn't there. Didn't make any headway on leaders, nor did they make much on me. Lap times pretty much stayed fairly consistent. Anyone else experiencing this?
 
Same here, I had a SL 55... once the Tuned vettes overtook me, I did not catch up to them.. It was really hard to since they have more down force. But yeah, my lap times seemed constant. And took the Vetts about 2 laps to over take me (DAYTONA OVAL). If BOOST was here.. they would of do it within the first lap.
 
LOL, it's still very much in effect for the NA version. GTP_TheMoose and I just ran away from the field at Suzuka and essentially drove the final lap on S3 tires. Our cars were very evenly matched, and even with drafting I couldn't manage better than a 2:12.

Remember, the boost is based on position AND how much of a spread there is in the field. If you're in first and the field is tightly packed behind you it won't have the same effect as 10+ cars spread out along the track (which is very much the case at Suzuka.
 
There's definitely a element of boost there. I usually get insanely quick starts on Fuji where I go from 11th to 1st before the first turn, get tapped from behind and end up dead last. I can usually pickup the pace and catch up a good 5-6 positions quite easily, yet it's difficult to really pull away from the pack when you have the lead.
 
unimental
LOL, it's still very much in effect for the NA version. GTP_TheMoose and I just ran away from the field at Suzuka and essentially drove the final lap on S3 tires. Our cars were very evenly matched, and even with drafting I couldn't manage better than a 2:12.

Remember, the boost is based on position AND how much of a spread there is in the field. If you're in first and the field is tightly packed behind you it won't have the same effect as 10+ cars spread out along the track (which is very much the case at Suzuka.
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I have the NA version and my honest position is that it looks like it's been dialed out. Even when the field got spread out at Daytona Road Course, there wasn't much rubber-banding. I don't know what's going on, but recently boost seems less ridiculous recently. On the other hand, I haven't played GT5P since last week. I've pretty much gotten bored with it already, unfortunately. :indiff:
 
Follow up note on previous post, boost is different depending on nr of players.

Yesterday I was going 1.10/ 1.11 steady on HSR leading from lap 1 with 5 sec advantage and 10 players. On a second race, with Brendholdt only (who has cleaned up his act!), I could do a 1.08 and two 1.09. And the difference is not bigger because I changed the settings on the Elise to make it faster on the straight.

So nr of players is relevant (as I suspected), and I confirm it affects grip and cornering speed.
 
I found the same thing to be true, it seems to me the breaking point is when I reach an 8 second lead, whether in London or Daytona Road (those places I have confirmed the 'handicap' so far) and also depends on what other cars are on the track too. My best example is when I was at London in the GT-R, I normally turn out 51.7's to 52 flats on avg. but sometimes while keeping the same line, I'm lucky to hit 52 seconds...wtf! But in one instance in particular I was getting chased by another GT-R (along with other cars wayy back there) and I hit a 51.1 EASILY (and I shanked the last section too). So I have no way to explain it except that its RETARDED! If I find a fast driver, I want to know exactly how we stack up, mano y mano, not mano y emulated mano... F- that! :grumpy: But I guess that is what the leaderboard is for... :)

Jerome
 
Boost is definitely still in the NA version even when racing in pro events. I spent a while perfectly tuning a car for Daytona oval today. I know exactly how this car will react in the corners and exactly how fast it will go. I can just keep the pedal pegged in 5th and drive it around both corners. No braking, no lift. Happy, I went and joined a race, got almost immediately punted (by a Corvette driver, no big surprise), and fell back to the end of the pack by half a bloody lap! So, no drafting happening, that's for sure. But, guess what? The car keeps going out in the corners! The tail is coming off the pavement and I'm spinning out. The boost is trying to help me, but instead all it has done is given me enough extra power to screw up my car's very carefully constructed handling.

I can't wait until we have to opportunity to turn this option off!
 
Factory Driver
I have the NA version and my honest position is that it looks like it's been dialed out. Even when the field got spread out at Daytona Road Course, there wasn't much rubber-banding. I don't know what's going on, but recently boost seems less ridiculous recently. On the other hand, I haven't played GT5P since last week. I've pretty much gotten bored with it already, unfortunately. :indiff:
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The boost drives me mad,but i have GT5P since early January and cant get enough from it ! LOL

jump_ace
I found the same thing to be true, it seems to me the breaking point is when I reach an 8 second lead, whether in London or Daytona Road (those places I have confirmed the 'handicap' so far) and also depends on what other cars are on the track too. My best example is when I was at London in the GT-R, I normally turn out 51.7's to 52 flats on avg. but sometimes while keeping the same line, I'm lucky to hit 52 seconds...wtf! But in one instance in particular I was getting chased by another GT-R (along with other cars wayy back there) and I hit a 51.1 EASILY (and I shanked the last section too). So I have no way to explain it except that its RETARDED! If I find a fast driver, I want to know exactly how we stack up, mano y mano, not mano y emulated mano... F- that! :grumpy: But I guess that is what the leaderboard is for... :)

Jerome
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Same here! But wouldn`t it be nice if we had our best times recorded for the online races aswell? Without Boost of course :D

panjandrum
Boost is definitely still in the NA version even when racing in pro events. I spent a while perfectly tuning a car for Daytona oval today. I know exactly how this car will react in the corners and exactly how fast it will go. I can just keep the pedal pegged in 5th and drive it around both corners. No braking, no lift. Happy, I went and joined a race, got almost immediately punted (by a Corvette driver, no big surprise), and fell back to the end of the pack by half a bloody lap! So, no drafting happening, that's for sure. But, guess what? The car keeps going out in the corners! The tail is coming off the pavement and I'm spinning out. Then I start paying attention, and I'm now magically able to enter the corners faster. The boost is trying to help me, but instead all it has done is given me enough extra power to screw up my car's very carefully constructed handling.

I can't wait until we have to opportunity to turn this option off!
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The option to turn boost off for certain races would surely be a good solution!!!
I love GT series, but that really makes me sick, i didnt like it in arcade games and i for sure hate it in a game that should be something like a sim...:crazy:

I mean IF there`s oil or whatever spoiled over the track give me a dam yellow/red stripe flag please so i could slow down a bit , watsup?! lol:nervous:
 

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