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Discussion in 'Sim Racing Hardware' started by Pennzoil23, Jan 20, 2020.
Good to know there's two Australias then. I suggested because I can buy it.
A full motion rig (6DOF) doesn't create G-forces. It simulates G-forces and even that you have to take with a grain of salt. It creates movement.
Honestly I would have preferred that Thrustmaster had made the chassis completely from metal and added $100 to the price.
Plastic is a great material when used in the correct application, but it isn't a good material for strong varying forces - I can see those bushing attachments breaking off after a period of time.
Maybe there'll be a pro set later on which uses metal as its base.
That would have put them very close to CSW V3 in terms of price though.
The price difference between T3PA PRO which are completely metal and T3PA which are plastic is 50€. That's why I think Thrustmaster can make T-LCM PRO fully metal version for no more than 250€/250$
They might be a bit reluctant to have two different products at such similar price points though......
Now if they could do a full metal construction with hydraulics between pedal and load cell for less than 300....
Racing drivers are strapped in tight enough by their harness that this is irrelevant. They don't move around like you would in a passenger car. You're understanding is incorrect.
His understanding can only be applied to the driver's leg.
Yeah. I thought I was impressed with this Thrustmaster T-LCM pedals myself but the plastic housing bothered me too. I'm currently watching a Fanatec Clubsport Pedals V3 review by Barry of Sim racing Garage and I have to admit the Fanatec V3 looks far superior and more professional all round....Looks/finish, durability, and accessibility of parts. True the Fanatec is approx $US150-160 more but seems to be worth it in the end.
Pssst, everybody. FeelVR pedals!
Just thought of something. You might say that the V3 pedals are actually in reality €390, so almost €400. Because IMO the brake performance kit is a must. In fact, I'm not really sure why those pedals are sold without it (well apart from making more money of course). The V3 without the BPK is not worth the money. That may sound a bit harsh but it's my opinion. The brake pedal transforms into something completely different with the BPK installed.
So the T-CLMs could easily survive a price increase of €50, again IMO.
Load cell rating ≠ force required on the brake pedal. The 100kg is the maximum force that can be measured as applied directly to the load cell; the pedal on its pivot is a lever which acts as a force multiplier. You won't need to put anywhere near 100kg of pressure on the brake pedal to max out the load cell. There may be pedal sets with a 50kg load cell that require greater force at the pedal than these.
The use of a 100kg load cell in this case is likely to keep the unit fairly compact while retaining a reasonable amount of pedal travel.
There is another alternative in the CSL Elite pedals. But my experience with logitech, Fanatec and Thrustmaster you wont notice that much difference as long as the brake is a loadcell. Plastic or metal, under your feet the pedals are all metal and any small flex is for the most part not noticeable. In the end you get what you paid for, but honestly I think the LCM seem like a great deal for the price.
Do you think these can be mounted on a wheel stand pro?
Dont know why it would not? But to be sure, I would contact Wheel stand pro or:
Both the Thrustmaster T-LCM and The Fanatec Clubsport V3 are far superior to the Fanatec CSL Elite though. It's like chalk and cheese. All of the CSL Elite's standard pedals (Throttle and brake) have potentiometers which are prone to muck and shorter life span.
Even if you replace the Fanatec CSL Elite's basic brake pedal with a load cell, that still leaves the throttle pedal with potentiometer.....in contrast to the T-LCM and Clubsport V3 both of which come standard with load cell brake and hall sensors for throttle and clutch....far better performance-wise and longer lasting/durability.
It would have been great if the Fanatec CSL Elite or a version of came with load cell brake and hall sensor throttle (those two pedals alone fine with me since I don't use clutch pedal but instead the wheel paddles for gear change). I would buy that if available but unfortunately isn't.
I have to disagree there. CSL elite are full metal pedals. HALL are better but not much better like "chalk and Cheese". My argument was, that if you like full metal pedals in a budget, the CSL LC are a great alternative. The potentiometers are not as prone to failure as you try to make it out to be though. Both have 12/16 bit in resolution. Performance of HALL vs pots is not much different. I have a feeling you are massively overrating HALL sensors for pedals.
Well according to research and reviews hall sensors are much better than potentiometers.
I didnt deny that fact. But you claim it is better like chalk and cheese. I disputed that. Performance wise there is virtually no difference. And as long as you keep the pots clean, they will keep on going.
Are you speaking from experience by the way? Or are you trying to validate the decision of purchasing the CSW pedals?
edit: @kikie made an excellent point. LC>HALL>Pots
A bit off topic but the Heusinkveld Ultimate pedals use load cells instead of potentiometers (throttle and clutch pedal). I wonder why.
You can ga even further with hydraulics vs LC's .
Different ways to skin a cat. Remember there are lots of different types of load cell; they're not all the same thing. AFAIK the load cell on the throttle and clutch on the Ultimates measure the deflection/tension of a lever below the pedal arm, in which case they are measuring the position of the pedal rather than the amount of force being exerted upon it.
Speaking from experience in owning a Fanatec CSL Elite (PS4)
They do come with a mounting template so you could drill holes or get the cockpit adapter which make the mounting points like T3PA pedals. From what I’ve read anyway
I couldn’t disagree with this more.
Sure Hall sensors are better, but honestly you wouldn’t really be able to tell the difference. And if I have to choose between a metal base with zero flex under braking vs the T-LCM with plastic/flex. I’ll easily choose the metal frame with potentiometers.
Plus springs for the brake pedal, no thanks. I’ll take the CSL elastomer over springs. Brakes are FAR FAR FAR more critical.
The flex in the T-LCM is a complete deal breaker IMO.
Contrary to others I don't see flex as being anywhere near the issue that others do. On the videos where the pedals are mounted in a half way decent manner there's virtually no flex, and on the rigs that these are mounted solidly there's no flex in the base.
If you are going to mount the base on the four corners only with no cross brace from one leg of the rig to the other at all you're going to have issues. On the one video I can find with really bad flex in the base this is how they are mounted. I personally would not mount any pedals like this. The section with the most pressure being applied to it has zero support
Of course all metal would be better, but at the price point they're at they're looking to be a good option for TM owners that need console compatibility. Cheaper than CSL Elites with load cell for us here down under and no drive hub needed.
Disclaimer: If I was a PC only racer I'd get the V3's with the brake performance kit at the very minimum
Those bushings like the ones in the Fanatec V3 Brake Performance Kit, where do I get something similar?
I'm still confused where to get these, how these bushings are called correctly etc .. .
Watching how Barry struggle to reach 100% brake force I would say that he applies 70kg of pressure:
For comparison here is the ClubSport V3 pedals with 90kg load cell where it seems to me that he applies less pressure to reach 100% braking force:
Do you mean which terms are used? Fanatec calls them elastomers or elastomer springs (green and red), and polyurethane springs or PU springs (beige).
Seem a bit hard to come by though: This guy got them from a Fibro reseller: https://chippedwood.wordpress.com/2015/09/03/diy-hydraulic-load-cell-sim-racing-pedals/
Here's a list of manufacturers. Click on each to get to a "Where to buy" button. You'll have to give some personal info though.
Sim Racing Garage you could see the flex in the actual pedal not the base. This is because the pivot point is the weak link. It doesn’t matter how you mount the base, the weak link will still be the pivot point of the pedal which is plastic. Watch his video and you can easily see the flex from multiple points as he does heal/toe.