Track Limit Abuse by most Top 10 Drivers

[Mr P]

Yes.
Did ZZZZZZZZZ get a penalty?

Looks like you fell asleep typing his name out

 

[baldgye]

Once again, I'm not talking about Maggiore.
How difficult is that to understand?

I'm talking sector 1 Nurb GP.
And yes, regardless of how you wish to call it, the track limits are being abused.

Ok, so I formatted that post like that, because several people (regardless of who you quote) have been talking about this topic, you can use whatever example you like.... It isn't difficult to understand.

So, if you want to talk about Nurb GP or any other track, you simply remove the first line and the rest of my post follows through and makes sense. Let's do that now, because, I do struggle sometimes;


Have PD consistently allowed this kind of driving? Yes.
What are PD doing about track limits? Nothing.

You can't be abusing rules you are following.

 

[mirial]

Wow! Just heard a whisper that PD has put an order in for some of this Killer grass! Expect to see it in game soon!! 👍

Hope they line the inside and outside of Maggiore first with that stuff

 

[Tassie_tiger]

Ok, so I formatted that post like that, because several people (regardless of who you quote) have been talking about this topic, you can use whatever example you like.... It isn't difficult to understand.

So, if you want to talk about Nurb GP or any other track, you simply remove the first line and the rest of my post follows through and makes sense. Let's do that now, because, I do struggle sometimes;


Have PD consistently allowed this kind of driving? Yes.
What are PD doing about track limits? Nothing.

You can't be abusing rules you are following.

If you feel the abuse of track limits on sector 1 Nurb GP, (turns 2, 3, and 4) is fine, then that's your perogative.
I disagree.

That's it.
That's all I've said.

And you can try to qualify it any way you want.
It won't change my mind.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

Still going around in circles, well it's a racing game, makes sense.

So the arguments are basically
Other people do it, so you should do it to.
As long as you don't get caught, it's legal.
If you find an advantage, stupid not to use it.

Yet then some people admit to not wanting to use that advantage in a race, so basically they know it's wrong on some level. Yet if you use it during qualifying you still use it to pass other people as starting position is more important than the short race itself.

However when PD fixes the track limits and adds penalties, will this suddenly stop? I can often pride myself on being one of the very few without a red dot in the result screen. Yet that just means I didn't push hard enough. Scrubbing penalties is an allowed tactic, other people do it, so I guess I didn't try hard enough.

Anyway I didn't feel like racing on Nurb GP yesterday. The ridiculous lines some people take doesn't make that track fun any more. Especially the final chicane. Penalties aren't enough of a deterrent, people push it until the point where it resets your car. Luckily Brand's hatch was up as well, with some nice slippery grass on the edges. Much better circuit.

 

[VFOURMAX1]

I think people understand that currently PD allows at certain places that driving lines as the above picture or even worse examples on other tracks is currently a legal tactic and line to legally be used and taken advantage of in GTS.

The difference is that many people when looking at the above example or worse cases question why the game even bothers to have a track with Tarmac and white lines on its outer edges?

At some places as it is clearly shown that being within even a full car width of such Tarmac is not even a requirement within the game so the actual track design or layout is not always a factor of a laps racing line?

The difference again does not bring a persons skill or lack of such into question, regardless of if the limits are actually tightened up to requiring to actually having a portion of the car remain on the tarmac of the original actual race course are the top ten fast guys will surely because of skills remain the top ten guys.

But anyone that says and believes that the lap times do not decrease because of corner cutting like in the above picture and the above lap is racing a line that the original circuit designers intended for a racer to adhere to when the course was designed and built probably believes in unicorns as well.

In my opinion only people that really have reasons to opposing the rules throughout a GAME to be uniform and the games limits be the same throughout all corners in the case of corner cutting or the same as far as wall riding not being an advantage in some areas are people that are using those variances to take advantage and competitive edge against other racers.

Why else would someone oppose such uniformity that would be so simple for everyone to without question or confusion exactly and easily understand and know where the limits were for every circuit, corner and yes even wall within the game?

This to me is not about being faster or slower, is not about being legal or not within game but rather to have uniform rules and race a circuit as the original design of the actual tarmac course would dictate the course be raced. Pretty simple actually.

Again regardless of personal feelings what the game allows it allows and unless it is changed we have no choice but to accept it or not race that course or play the game. But just because opinions differ on the subject does not make one person right or wrong or better or worse than another just different in what we prefer to see with what the game allows.

 

[mirial]

Yet then some people admit to not wanting to use that advantage in a race, so basically they know it's wrong on some level. Yet if you use it during qualifying you still use it to pass other people as starting position is more important than the short race itself.

There is a degree of risk when corner cutting of losing the back end which you can afford to take in TTs because of the relative numerous goes you can have to get that one good lap, which is why I much prefer live qualifying because that is a more accurate reflection of true pace. But, the risk is nothing like the risk you might take in attempting to use the full width of the exit kerbs on the real circuits like Suzuka and Interlagos where the car gets very loose, which is why I think the circuits with more arbitrary track limits like these generally have closer fields, because everyone knows where they stand, which is what I like, and you become better as a result

 

[Stotty]

If you feel the abuse of track limits on sector 1 Nurb GP, (turns 2, 3, and 4) is fine, then that's your perogative.
I disagree.

That's it.
That's all I've said.

And you can try to qualify it any way you want.
It won't change my mind.

Don’t see the issue with Nurb GP.

Go watch some DTM or Blanpain footage from there and you’ll see running wide on the exits of 2 and 4 is pretty much the line.

GTS might let you run wider between 2 and 3, but there’s little, if any, time to be gained in doing it - just makes getting on the throttle out of 2 without the rear coming round a bit easier.

And it clear from the track markings that PD expect people to use all the width and more exiting 4.

 

[GBO Possum]

Am I interpreting things right if I say the following?

1. At Maggiore (as an example) the "legal" limits of the track don't closely align with the "visual" track limits.
2. It would be nice if the tracks were adjusted to create such an alignment.
3. All the other stuff about "cheating" and "ethics" would go away if this was achieved.

 

[kilesa4568]

I ran a few laps at Maggiore last night to try and adjust to that cut and the 1st time I got it right, well, it didn't sit well with me at all. Probably because it's the 1st time I'd ever done it but it felt so wrong that I couldn't do it on my next laps.

I haven't changed my mind about it being legal. I was still within track limits but as a personal choice, it's really not for me.

I'm going to change my mind about my fantasy of running in the top 10 and doing the same lines as them to keep up. I think I prefer not being in the top 10 and sticking to the tarmac. For my own enjoyment. Not for an imagined moral high ground.

 

[Spurgy 777]

Other people do it, so you should do it to.
As long as you don't get caught, it's legal.

Neither of these are arguments that have been made. Driving outside of the white lines is legal because PD and the game says it is, regardless of whether other people do it or not or whether other people see you doing it or not.

If you find an advantage, stupid not to use it.

Well yes? As long as it's an intended part of the game and available to everyone then why not? Do you think people who use the fastest car are cheating too? I wouldn't necessarily call it stupid not to use advantages that you have available in the game, such as picking the fastest car or driving to the games track limits, but it's definitely stupid not to use it and then complain that other people are.

Yet then some people admit to not wanting to use that advantage in a race, so basically they know it's wrong on some level. Yet if you use it during qualifying you still use it to pass other people as starting position is more important than the short race itself.

We don't push the track limits to such an extent in races because the closer you are to the limit the higher the risk of crashing or penalties, the same applies to any track regardless of whether there are places you can go beyond the white lines, you simply to get as close to the limit in races.

However when PD fixes the track limits and adds penalties, will this suddenly stop? I can often pride myself on being one of the very few without a red dot in the result screen. Yet that just means I didn't push hard enough. Scrubbing penalties is an allowed tactic, other people do it, so I guess I didn't try hard enough.

Will what stop? People will still be going faster in qualifying than they do in the race for the exact same reason I just said above.

Anyway I didn't feel like racing on Nurb GP yesterday. The ridiculous lines some people take doesn't make that track fun any more. Especially the final chicane. Penalties aren't enough of a deterrent, people push it until the point where it resets your car.

First of all penalties are enough of a deterrent, the amount you gain by cutting the corner at the chicane to the point you're getting a penalty does not gain you enough time to outweigh the time you lose losing that penalty. I can see it being an issue the slower the drivers are though as the slower you are the easier it is to remove penalties, for the top guys you'll be lucky to scrub any penalty at most corners.

Secondly people exceeding track limits and getting penalties is completely irrelevant to this discussion as were talking about whether it's ok to stay within track limits and not get penalties.

Luckily Brand's hatch was up as well, with some nice slippery grass on the edges. Much better circuit.

Brands Hatch, while better than Nurb, still has places you can go way beyond the white lines and cut corners within the track limits, practically every track does to some extent, which just goes to show that those are the track limits PD intends people to drive to for some reason.

 

[JacksHerer]

I'm not taking either side, but the pit bug is legal too, whether its sporting or not.

Before I became aware of some real life races where they go way off track, I thought people were making mistakes and getting penalties. It wasn't till I raced within view of some DR:S guys that I saw them doing it too.
At the moment, hardly anyone goes outside the lines intentionally unless they are the sort that watch the top ten replays to improve themselves.

I'm yet to lose a race position to someone who goes off track, but I'm in no doubt that I'm losing grid positions to people who go off track to qualify.

It is what it is though, it's available to everyone.

 

[Spurgy 777]

I'm not taking either side, but the pit bug is legal too, whether its sporting or not.

The pit bug isn't legal, it's glitching the game mechanics to make something happen that shouldn't. Saying it's legal because you don't get a penalty for it is a huge stretch as it makes no sense to expect the game to penalise something that should never be possible.

 

[VFOURMAX1]

There are instructions in-game that teach use the entire track by using the curbs at the apex and on your way out of a corner.

PD setup the limits and they are supposed to be explored.

If people don’t know the limits they can push to on a track the only people have the to blame are themselves

Another important topic here, relative to Lake Maggiore, is that it's a fictional track to which we can not compare real life track limits.

You know how the track was intended to be driven more than the people who created the track and its limits?

As you read through this entire thread you see quite a few post that seem to present the attitude or deduction that these track limits and corner cutting are how PD intended the game to be played or the track limits would not be set as they are.

As far as anyone knowing what PD's intentions were or are would it not be best to examine the information released from PD regarding the best proper racing lines for or on a circuit to get a more realistic idea of PD's actual intentions as they do actually do so within the game?

The in game circuit experience section is a series of videos designed to teach a racer the tracks layout and the fastest bet way to negotiate each sector and corner of the circuit.

These video's in my opinion are also teaching players new to the game or franchise as to what is deemed acceptable in the terms of racing on each circuit and corner.

I went back and watched all of the in game associated video's for both Lago Maggiore and for the Nubergring GP circuit with the associated narration approved by PD prior to the games release.

In not one of those videos in ANY corner did the video ever show a car not having a minimum of two wheels on the actual track racing tarmac surface on any inside radius corner showing cutting the tracks length or original circuits design by leaving the designated tarmac surface.

As far as what PD has intended is better stated by what they themselves have released in game showing the proper line and way for racing each circuit and corner at maximum pace.

Using that information released and shown in game by PD themselves would go further to suggest that the current corner cutting is not an intended game design but more so an exploit of the games lack of proper application and coding of the penalty system for not assessing a penalty or invalidating a lap for taking such a line on the tracks in game.

I am in belief if this was an intended action or allowance of such laps being an expected faster way around a circuit they would have demonstrated these lines in their videos showing the fast and proper way to drive a track.

Harder to say that PD intended otherwise when a proper lap is plainly shown with complete narration as to how to drive the circuit straight out of the horses mouth.

 

[JacksHerer]

Yeh I was being sarcastic, PD should impose stricter track limits for qualifying, but that would take more coding.

I get the lax limits for racing as they want people to race without fear of penalties, but without an AI steward I can't see how it can be improved.

Maybe the circuit guide should use the off track lines for the videos, at least then the new players will not be in the dark.

 

[Spurgy 777]

As you read through this entire thread you see quite a few post that seem to present the attitude or deduction that these track limits and corner cutting are how PD intended the game to be played or the track limits would not be set as they are.

As far as anyone knowing what PD's intentions were or are would it not be best to examine the information released from PD regarding the best proper racing lines for or on a circuit to get a more realistic idea of PD's actual intentions as they do actually do so within the game?

The in game circuit experience section is a series of videos designed to teach a racer the tracks layout and the fastest bet way to negotiate each sector and corner of the circuit.

These video's in my opinion are also teaching players new to the game or franchise as to what is deemed acceptable in the terms of racing on each circuit and corner.

I went back and watched all of the in game associated video's for both Lago Maggiore and for the Nubergring GP circuit with the associated narration approved by PD prior to the games release.

In not one of those videos in ANY corner did the video ever show a car not having a minimum of two wheels on the actual track racing tarmac surface on any inside radius corner showing cutting the tracks length or original circuits design by leaving the designated tarmac surface.

As far as what PD has intended is better stated by what they themselves have released in game showing the proper line and way for racing each circuit and corner at maximum pace.

Using that information released and shown in game by PD themselves would go further to suggest that the current corner cutting is not an intended game design but more so an exploit of the games lack of proper application and coding of the penalty system for not assessing a penalty for taking such a line on the tracks in game.

I am in belief if this was an intended action or allowance of such laps being an expected faster way around a circuit they would have demonstrated these lines in their videos showing the fast and proper way to drive a track.

Harder to say that PD intended otherwise when a proper lap is plainly shown with complete narration as to how to drive the circuit straight out of the horses mouth.

So the track limits in game where you actually get a penalty are wrong for literally every corner in the game? Because every corner I've encountered lets you run 2 wheels on the kerb and 2 wheels off track with no wheels on the tarmac? It's all very well using the circuit experience videos as evidence of what PD intends the track limits to be, but it is completely contradicted by what actually gives you a penalty.

 

[JacksHerer]

So the track limits in game where you actually get a penalty are wrong for literally every corner in the game? Because every corner I've encountered lets you run 2 wheels on the kerb and 2 wheels off track with no wheels on the tarmac? It's all very well using the circuit experience videos as evidence of what PD intends the track limits to be, but it is completely contradicted by what actually gives you a penalty.

Not on interlagos, I caught a spin and got a penalty with 2 wheels on curb
fast forward to 1:25

 

[Javi Piqueras]

excuse this I find it absurd for lovers of racing, we can find the excuse we want, this is what differentiates us from the simulator players in pc, how are they going to take us seriously? in any pc sim this conversation would be impossible to exist. that's why this is a game and not a simulator. What a pity

 

[war_ops_84]

This is an FIA game right? Doesn't the FIA define track limits as the white lines on the edge of the track? As long as you have some part of the car on or over the track surface you are considered on the track? This is not hard to do from a programming perspective. I wish people would stop defending the driver in the video because the OP clearly stated it was about the the track and the game. It would have been any name in the video because who was driving is irrelevant. No one is cheating by using the track limits the game gave them. It's about the game, not the driver.

You realize you just contradicted yourself, right?

First you say: I wish people would stop defending the driver in the video.

Then you say: It's about the game, not the driver.

Your second statement is the reason why people are defending the driver.

But let's assume for the sake of argument the driver did "abuse" the track. Even if the programmers fixed this "problem", the driver in that video would still be faster than than the complainers in this thread.

The truth is that some people will always find an excuse to complain, especially when they are under-performing relative to their own unrealistic expectations.

Put more simply, the complainers just don't want to admit to themselves that they will NEVER be that good at GTS, so they come up with lame excuses instead.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

Neither of these are arguments that have been made. Driving outside of the white lines is legal because PD and the game says it is, regardless of whether other people do it or not or whether other people see you doing it or not.

Well yes? As long as it's an intended part of the game and available to everyone then why not? Do you think people who use the fastest car are cheating too? I wouldn't necessarily call it stupid not to use advantages that you have available in the game, such as picking the fastest car or driving to the games track limits, but it's definitely stupid not to use it and then complain that other people are.

We don't push the track limits to such an extent in races because the closer you are to the limit the higher the risk of crashing or penalties, the same applies to any track regardless of whether there are places you can go beyond the white lines, you simply to get as close to the limit in races.

Will what stop? People will still be going faster in qualifying than they do in the race for the exact same reason I just said above.

First of all penalties are enough of a deterrent, the amount you gain by cutting the corner at the chicane to the point you're getting a penalty does not gain you enough time to outweigh the time you lose losing that penalty. I can see it being an issue the slower the drivers are though as the slower you are the easier it is to remove penalties, for the top guys you'll be lucky to scrub any penalty at most corners.

Secondly people exceeding track limits and getting penalties is completely irrelevant to this discussion as were talking about whether it's ok to stay within track limits and not get penalties.

Brands Hatch, while better than Nurb, still has places you can go way beyond the white lines and cut corners within the track limits, practically every track does to some extent, which just goes to show that those are the track limits PD intends people to drive to for some reason.

How do you know all that was intended to be used that way by PD. The same argument has already been made for wall riding. They have shown incompetence with the penalty system, the loose track limits and wall penalties could simply be closely tied to a penalty system they don't trust themselves. Better keep it loose instead of getting more complaints about unfair penalties.

There's lines on the road, imo those are there for a reason, not as a suggestion. Why not move the curb two car lengths to the inside in that example on Magiorre to fit with the 'intended' track design.

Somehow in DR.A and low DR.S people still find plenty time to get rid of penalties, overtaking on the inside off track still happens, it's not enough of a deterrent. Perhaps the top 1% is well behaved yet why not tighten the penalties and track limits for the bottom 99% to make the races more safe. Most people adhere to the visual track limits, yet there's always a few that force a way through where there shouldn't be one and get awarded for it.

Let penalties stand until the end, and make the rules clear. Move the white lines to where the actual track limits are or fix the track limits. Every other sport has clear rules on what's in and what's out. In GTS it's trial and error to figure out what's in or out. Is it the same with every car, does car width have an effect, does the back end breaking out have an effect, does duration and speed have an effect.

Why does it take so long for the game to hand out the penalty. Is is simply a comparison of what the game thinks the fastest possible time is and what you achieved by corner cutting. Slowly cutting corners usually doesn't get penalized at all. It's guess work. Bring back GT4's Nordschleife trial, more than 2 wheels of the track, restart

 

[JacksHerer]

This thread title isn't the best way to discus track limits, ^^ yes the fast guys will still be the fastest, or the top 10 leaderboard will be full of the the 10-20 fastest guys who are exceeding track limits to beat the top 10 fastest.

 

[VFOURMAX1]

So the track limits in game where you actually get a penalty are wrong for literally every corner in the game? Because every corner I've encountered lets you run 2 wheels on the kerb and 2 wheels off track with no wheels on the tarmac?

First off the some of the limits being exploited in this thread some go way beyond even having two wheels remaining on the curbs at the tracks edge without drawing a penalty or invalidating the lap.

According to the circuit experience videos released as the proper driving line yes. Does the idea of a penalty system being broken or wrong to such a point where a driver is given a penalty 90% of the time when being the outside car going through a corner and being hit by the car on the inside running wide?

Does a penalty system that randomly penalizes an innocent driver under the yellow flag for passing a ghosted car that caused an accident add any credibility to the accuracy of how the penalty system is accurate with its implementation?

Why would you think that a penalty system who's coding perimeters on some track allows "wallriding" without instituting a penalty while other tracks it does not allow the same action without instituting a penalty?

So in conjunction with the videos released within the game by PD showing the proper fastest way around the circuit from PD'S own point of view then yes it is very possible a very sporadic and inconsistent implementation of a penalty system that in many areas constantly showing examples of not working correctly could easily be the root cause that is allowing excess off track lines to be treated as valid lines without being penalized.

 

[war_ops_84]

Ya as i said not your fault but the games fault.

When you accuse him of "abuse", that implies some kind of fault.

Not many would know you can cut corners like this and wonder how they can't match this time.

And whose fault is that? The Top 10 list has replays of the fastest times, so it's not like this is a secret being hidden from the masses.

And what is stopping people from testing the limits of a track on their own? To me, that just seems like common sense.

PD should rectify this

What difference would it make? The driver in the video would still be faster than you and all the other complainers. And lazy and unimaginative drivers would still struggle to push the limits of the course.

 

[nord_clane]

As far as what PD has intended is better stated by what they themselves have released in game showing the proper line and way for racing each circuit and corner at maximum pace.

This is not a valid argument. The Demo-Runs from the circuit experience don't show maximum pace at all...i never played a game in which the demo-runs are actually showing the "maximum pace"

Demo-runs are often just clean, tidy laps. but not one of the fastest...they are just there to show the majority of people a decent lap. So you can't take that as an example for setting track limits.

 

[zzz_pt]

How do you know all that was intended to be used that way by PD. The same argument has already been made for wall riding. They have shown incompetence with the penalty system, the loose track limits and wall penalties could simply be closely tied to a penalty system they don't trust themselves. Better keep it loose instead of getting more complaints about unfair penalties.

There's lines on the road, imo those are there for a reason, not as a suggestion. Why not move the curb two car lengths to the inside in that example on Magiorre to fit with the 'intended' track design.

This penalty system has been part of GT for a decade. No changes.

Wall riding has been addressed as unintended exploitation.

Also, why do you think the white line is the limit in turn 3, 4, 8 and 11 and ignore the well visible white surface on the inside (designed specifically for this track) , completely available to drive over? If that wasn't a place to drive with your car over, PD could have used grass as it did in most of the other corners.

Regarding the videos from the circuit experience, I didn't watch them tbh. As I guess a driver who's been racing for 20 years (the time I've been playing GT), he's not going to watch tutorials for kids when they start their karting careers. They instruct you on the basics. Then you push the limits of what the game allows.

 

[nord_clane]

I'm going to change my mind about my fantasy of running in the top 10 and doing the same lines as them to keep up. I think I prefer not being in the top 10 and sticking to the tarmac. For my own enjoyment. Not for an imagined moral high ground.

That sounds like an excuse.

It is possible to get into the top 10 without corner cutting like T4 at Lago Maggiore. I did that not just once and i'm not the best driver around. I even did that on the same day ZZZ_pt did his lap which started this thread.

 

[Johnnypenso]

You realize you just contradicted yourself, right?

First you say: I wish people would stop defending the driver in the video.

Then you say: It's about the game, not the driver.

Your second statement is the reason why people are defending the driver.

But let's assume for the sake of argument the driver did "abuse" the track. Even if the programmers fixed this "problem", the driver in that video would still be faster than than the complainers in this thread.

The truth is that some people will always find an excuse to complain, especially when they are under-performing relative to their own unrealistic expectations.

Put more simply, the complainers just don't want to admit to themselves that they will NEVER be that good at GTS, so they come up with lame excuses instead.

Nope. At that point in the conversation people were already leaping to the defense of the driver as if he'd been attacked when the OP had already clearly indicated his post wasn't about the driver it was about the game. The reason people are defending the driver is because they don't read the OP and don't know how to have a proper discussion. There's also no need to assume the driver did abuse the track, that's a strawman argument. He didn't. He stayed within the lines that the game allows. End of story. @zzz_pt is a straight up alien and he'd be at the top no matter what, but again, that's another strawman and completely irrelevant.

 

[JacksHerer]

Forget the strawman, bring on the wickerman, PS. ZZZ_PT in a white dress

 

[Spurgy 777]

Not on interlagos, I caught a spin and got a penalty with 2 wheels on curb
fast forward to 1:25

It's hard to tell from the camera angle, but it's entirely possible your front left wheel went off track briefly at the end of the kerbing, resulting in 3 wheels off track not 2, would need the replay to confirm though.

How do you know all that was intended to be used that way by PD. The same argument has already been made for wall riding. They have shown incompetence with the penalty system, the loose track limits and wall penalties could simply be closely tied to a penalty system they don't trust themselves. Better keep it loose instead of getting more complaints about unfair penalties.

There's lines on the road, imo those are there for a reason, not as a suggestion. Why not move the curb two car lengths to the inside in that example on Magiorre to fit with the 'intended' track design.

Somehow in DR.A and low DR.S people still find plenty time to get rid of penalties, overtaking on the inside off track still happens, it's not enough of a deterrent. Perhaps the top 1% is well behaved yet why not tighten the penalties and track limits for the bottom 99% to make the races more safe. Most people adhere to the visual track limits, yet there's always a few that force a way through where there shouldn't be one and get awarded for it.

Let penalties stand until the end, and make the rules clear. Move the white lines to where the actual track limits are or fix the track limits. Every other sport has clear rules on what's in and what's out. In GTS it's trial and error to figure out what's in or out. Is it the same with every car, does car width have an effect, does the back end breaking out have an effect, does duration and speed have an effect.

Why does it take so long for the game to hand out the penalty. Is is simply a comparison of what the game thinks the fastest possible time is and what you achieved by corner cutting. Slowly cutting corners usually doesn't get penalized at all. It's guess work. Bring back GT4's Nordschleife trial, more than 2 wheels of the track, restart

First off the some of the limits being exploited in this thread some go way beyond even having two wheels remaining on the curbs at the tracks edge without drawing a penalty or invalidating the lap.

According to the circuit experience videos released as the proper driving line yes. Does the idea of a penalty system being broken or wrong to such a point where a driver is given a penalty 90% of the time when being the outside car going through a corner and being hit by the car on the inside running wide?

Does a penalty system that randomly penalizes an innocent driver under the yellow flag for passing a ghosted car that caused an accident add any credibility to the accuracy of how the penalty system is accurate with its implementation?

Why would you think that a penalty system who's coding perimeters on some track allows "wallriding" without instituting a penalty while other tracks it does not allow the same action without instituting a penalty?

So in conjunction with the videos released within the game by PD showing the proper fastest way around the circuit from PD'S own point of view then yes it is very possible a very sporadic and inconsistent implementation of a penalty system that in many areas constantly showing examples of not working correctly could easily be the root cause that is allowing excess off track lines to be treated as valid lines without being penalized.

Track limits are completely different to crashing into people and wall riding in so many ways that have already been addressed several times that it is stupid to compare them, so why do you insist on carrying on?

With regards to how the game gives penalties out though, track limits are far easier to define and the general rule in practically 100% of cases is at least 2 wheels on track where kerb is track, with the odd exception where tarmac run off is also allowed it seems. Deciding whether an advantage is gained through wall contact and in particular who is at fault in a collision is far more complicated. So to say that "penalties are incorrectly given for collisions and wall riding then you should expect the same for track limits" isn't a great argument to start off with.

But it's far worse than that as you are both claiming that the track limits PD actually meant to implement are the white lines, and as has already been pointed out that would mean they got it wrong on practically 100% of corners. So not only are you saying that the penalty system between track limits, wall riding and collisions should all be equally broken, you're saying that the track limits are far far more broken than both of the other two. Again that makes zero sense.

 

[zzz_pt]

That sounds like an excuse.

It is possible to get into the top 10 without corner cutting like T4 at Lago Maggiore. I did that not just once and i'm not the best driver around. I even did that on the same day ZZZ_pt did his lap which started this thread.

I agree with you.

My previous lap (top1) was this one:

Completely different approach to T4:



This lap was 4th best time after midnight when I went for the faster one and improved 0.151sec.

I'm sharing this "slower" lap just for those who think I was only on the top10 because of the lap shared in the OP.