What about the AI grinds your gears?

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Airetam

Airetam

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Aire_tam
While we all agree that the AI is pretty bad, I'd like to know what you really hate about it!

My top 3 points are, in order:
  • They slow down if you are nearby, hardly fighting for their position. (Defend for fudge's sake!)
  • They swear by their dumb lines, couple that with their magnetic grip to make it even more annoying.
  • They have super brakes, which WILL result in you bumping into them even if you try not to.
 
That they are behaving like GT4's A.I. Seriously, I thank PD for making the A.I a bit more competitive in higher class events, but I rather have GT5's A.I back (minus the braking out the corner). At least they respected your position and didn't ram you like you weren't even there.

A solution for this would be an option to turn damage off in career mode. That's mainly why the A.I pisses me off. I want my car immaculate after the race so I can take pictures or just enjoy the replay.

Another problem, (as I mentioned above) and this comes from GT5's A.I, would be slowing down randomly at the middle of the turn or when exiting the corner is a big problem.
 
After a few AI 'tests', I think there is a coding glitch that makes the AI underestimate where you are on-track. All the AI are coded to come back onto the racing line once you've overtaken them, but from what i've seen they come back onto the line far too soon and therefore rear end you, making it seem as if they are aggressive. A lot of cars also have boundary issues, so maybe this makes the AI believe you have already completely passed them?
Cosbuster
Pretty much everything. I can't think of one good thing about it.
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They're easy to beat even if you're really bad? :p
 
I'm more positive about the AI than one week ago. They may not defend but they can attack if you're slow. They don't slow if you're behind, they slow when you pass them because before curves, they try to drive "clean".

I agree 100% about the magnetic grip. I think they got SRF on by default. I'm not sure the pilot part of the AI can drive the car part of the AI with boosted PP. Think of it : most default setup are pretty bad, with default setup, if you put on top AI driving it's a fail I guess, I'm 100% sure this have been tested in 15 years GT games exists. So a quick and dirty cure was "SRF on" on each car.

What Polyphony should really do I think : remove SRF from Saisonal Events in GT6 and study the setups the best players use and their racing lines, look about the times posted by players online too (or best times at home, or in events, why not ?), then give AI those setups/racing lines with no SRF.

About the ram part, they tend to do this if you ram them I think. The only moments I get ramed is at the end of a corner or in the acceleration phase if I'm in the middle of their line. They have one line, not two. So why not getting the lines from players using the same cars aswell (or the same "kind" of car since in each new GT there's some new cars aswell) ?

I think the reason to get ram after a corner is the AI forgot the physic engine give them aspiration and the AI can't make a decision accordingly. This + magnetic grip = bad playing experience.
You can see this phenomenon playing Like the wind #1 with my ZZII setup (change gearbox and remove aero) for exemple : 3 times out of 10 the just passed car will get aspiration and ram you (the ZZII can't win this race even with NOS so it make struggling for the #2 place, esp if you pass #1).

In endurance races I noticed that the AI slow after you pass them and #1/2/3 slow too if you make the "extra" lap you are suposed to do.

The agressivity toward the player is not the same with other AI cars, this is a problem too. Another big problem is in championships : #1 car get 100 points (or 75 if you beat him) and so on.

Maybe another problem is the lack of different "feelings" of AI. One could be dumb, one agressive, one very fast, one could do accidents and so on. Not at each time, but sometimes. Making an AI reasticly dumb is a tough tech chalenge. They could monitor players for this ^^
 
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hsv010
After a few AI 'tests', I think there is a coding glitch that makes the AI underestimate where you are on-track.
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Aspiration after a curve. I'm 100% sure that's it. Each time I got ramed was under these conditions.
Or I braked too early but that's kind of my problem, maybe.
 
Most of the corners they dont bother me when overtaking, as they tend to avoid me (unless I lunge for a corner).

My main gripe is when in my slipstream (even worse when they have a double slipstream). They move slightly to the left, then slightly in the opposite direction but before they make their mind up, they go right up my backside.
 
hsv010
After a few AI 'tests', I think there is a coding glitch that makes the AI underestimate where you are on-track. All the AI are coded to come back onto the racing line once you've overtaken them, but from what i've seen they come back onto the line far too soon and therefore rear end you, making it seem as if they are aggressive. A lot of cars also have boundary issues, so maybe this makes the AI believe you have already completely passed them?

They're easy to beat even if you're really bad? :p
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I hope this is the case, I've been bumped when overtaking countless times since I bought the game yesterday.

Keeping my fingers crossed for an upcoming patch that is entirely focused on cleaning up and improving the A.I.
If there's hardware limitations there's always hope for improvement in GT7.
 
BlueShift
Aspiration after a curve. I'm 100% sure that's it. Each time I got ramed was under these conditions.
Or I braked too early but that's kind of my problem, maybe.
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It's what everyone's been complaining about in the NASCAR series, you go around them on the high side an they follow you up, only to tag you at just the wrong time and spin you out. I was doing the classic series today in a Daytona Coupe, and the first corner at Apricot Hill proved this theory. I went up the inside of another Shelby, very cleanly, he lifted off and let me drift right up the inside, but he immediately cut across into the back of me.

When I watched the replay, I saw the car had boundary issues. This means that even though the cars did not visibly make contact, the cars still touched. If the boundaries were fine, the car would have just pulled behind mine without making contact.

I'm going to make a thread on this and see what others think on the subject, because this would explain most of the AI aggression and contact issues that people have experienced.
 
Well there almost is nothing, but my biggest problem is each one not created equal.

Like if I have a Professional Race Event in Arcade I want each A.I competing even if I pass them not oh let's have a car from 1960 that's not a race car go against Pagani Huayra when the difference is about oh let's say 500 HP between the Pagani and that 60's car.

I guess a shorter way of saying it I get tired of lapping cars sometimes it's funny, but then after awhile it's old then it gets annoying.
 
hsv010
When I watched the replay, I saw the car had boundary issues. This means that even though the cars did not visibly make contact, the cars still touched.
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Nicely spot :)

So the AI patch they could work on is :
- beware of slipstream out of curves
- beware of "bad" collision model

Got an idea. Try to take a photo from the sky. If my idea is rigth you should "see" the car touching (by Z-projection). Now a photo from the side : the cars won't be touching themselves.

It may be a technical problem : hard to have picture-wise collision model when you move 16 cars with 16 physic thread, 16 rendering threads and so on. T go around this, the "warning: overtake or brake" flag should be raised a little before I think.

edit - anyway, who would care ramming if the AI have no magnetic grip. You would get rammed and the car that would have rammed you would spin. Currently the AI ram you because it's always a good move for it.

With no SRF, just before ramming you the AI could predict what happens if they ram you and decide if they still does. Predicting algorythm are really easy to do with a video card, I'm a bit rusty on my math. In 2000 a convolution, which is what is used there amoung other things, took 1 DSP cycle using DSP assembler + the loading part (2 cycle if my memory helps me). So it's not "this" calculation heavy. Now I don't know the driver calls of the PS3 but think of it :)
Ah I should work in gaming industry. If only they paid...
 
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My biggest gripe is simply that they do not yield the line that and they have a tendency to move over in front of you just enough to cause you to tap them and then hit their brakes ruining that chance to pass. I get pretty annoyed at the Red Bull Jr cars for that reason.
 
HBR-Roadhog
My biggest gripe is simply that they do not yield the line that and they have a tendency to move over in front of you just enough to cause you to tap them and then hit their brakes ruining that chance to pass. I get pretty annoyed at the Red Bull Jr cars for that reason.
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Surprisingly enough, that is one of the cars that has boundary issues. I think this is turning my theory into a theorem!
 
Getting constantly punted off the track by the AI and/or they decide to turn into me, spinning me off the track.

So annoyingly aggressive..
 
Extremely slow to react to your position in relation to them/others.
 
In like the wind race they spun me out multiple times in the corners, it's like they're driving freight trains and I'm in a GEO. I can't move them but they have no problem spinning me out.
 
I don't like that they are hard to displace, but when they touch you, you get sent off easily.
 
montez34
In like the wind race they spun me out multiple times in the corners, it's like they're driving freight trains and I'm in a GEO. I can't move them but they have no problem spinning me out.
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Read my posts and the one above about them more likely than not having SRF. It explains everything.
 
Welsh-Fury
My problem happens most anywhere except on the Nascar events. What you explained is most likely my case with boundary issues, but it doesn't explain the AI battering my rear bumper causing me, or both of us to slide off track on a corner.
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It does - they have boundary issues. They aren't actually touching you, they're just close to you. It's bad coding that causes the issue.

EDIT - double post - very sorry.
 
I've noticed P7 seems to be the most aggressive. I wish they were all that way.
 
hsv010
Surprisingly enough, that is one of the cars that has boundary issues. I think this is turning my theory into a theorem!
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Interesting, I will have to pay more attention to this, Which other cars have you noticed this with?
 
This is the most annoying one:
  • They have super brakes, which WILL result in you bumping into them even if you try not to.
Even when I know that they do that and try to avoid it, I still end up hitting them. Sometimes it feels like they do it just to annoy you, even when they don't need to brake.

sumbrownkid
I don't like that they are hard to displace, but when they touch you, you get sent off easily.
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Easy way to spin out AI us to use the PIT maneuver. AI even did it to me on the 24 minutes of Le Mans. I was like: what... what?!... what the ef was that for!

120px-Pit_maneuver.svg.png
 
They're just plain stupid most all of the time.
 
HBR-Roadhog
Interesting, I will have to pay more attention to this, Which other cars have you noticed this with?
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I don't know exactly, but i'd say half the cars i've driven have shown signs of boundary issues. Some like the Red Bull Jr and the Daytona Coupe have really noticeable issues though, i'd say about half a metre.
 
hsv010
Read my posts and the one above about them more likely than not having SRF. It explains everything.
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I had SRF on too, it didn't matter.
 
Well, the AI is so bad that PD uses rubber banding. I hope that the AI get a complete redo by the devs in one of the next updates...
 
BSD200
Well, the AI is so bad that PD uses rubber banding. I hope that the AI get a complete redo by the devs in one of the next updates...
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I don't even think they use that if they do it's probably on the one car that's in first place if anything and then eventually he backs off once you get too far.

In fact just did a race at Matterhorn in the to see what exactly was wrong with A.I noticed that up until 7th place car since you must start at back of the race everytime their speed is limited to no more than 100 mph, and then once you pass them it's like they drive no more than 60-80 mph afterwards.

6-4 place probably has a speed cap of 130 and 3-2 same in a way except they'll start fighting to catch up again depending on your car.

1st place car he's the only one that would truly fight back to gain the lead.

I'm starting to think that the Rolling Starts also is a way for PD to mask the problem of TERRIBLE A.I Cause if we ever had Grid starts for both GT5 and GT6 the sales would probably be much worse then one could imagine.
 
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