What is wrong with the Lamborghini Murcielago in this game?

[Sam48]

Kid, you don't have enough real life experience to even think about arguing with me.

Assuming you know what life experiences I've been through and then claiming I can't argue with you is not what I posted for.

In any case, the base murcielago and lp 640 share the same chassis, and aside from minor suspension tweaks, are extremely similar in terms of driving dynamics. The lp-640's only real difference is in straightline power, but that would not account for the problem that I was describing.

You still did not answer my questions.

The bottom line is that while some cars in this game feel surprisingly accurate (all things considered), none are true representations of their real-life counterparts because it's a ****ing video game, kid, get over it. The point of this thread was to see how many other people have noticed these inconsistencies so that hopefully, the developers will take notice and issue patches at some point down the road.

My point was; did you factor in every variable? I would say not. Whether both cars are exactly identical, both in game and in reality, is not likely at all unless they are under the same circumstances (As seen with Jay, and Jezza, I suppose) You based your claim off of only somewhat related experiences.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I'm amused at the number of people here who seem to think that the Lamborghinis - high-powered, light-weight mid-engined Italian supercars - should behave the same way as a Japanese import.

 

[mani_23]

How is that correcting anything that I said? I said that the (essentially Audi-built) Lamborghini Gallardo has a higher build quality than the murcielago, which is undisputably true. Nowhere did I say that the R8 was nicer than the Gallardo. Please learn to read, thanks.

He was meaning that the R8, and audi, didn't really biuld the gallardo, but instead the R8 was the one that used the gallardos platform.

The Audi is on the Gallardos base, not the other way around.

From what you wrote it seemed like you were saying that the gallardo is based on the R8.

 

[Oversteerin']

I'm amused at the number of people here who seem to think that the Lamborghinis - high-powered, light-weight mid-engined Italian supercars - should behave the same way as a Japanese import.

Ok, expert. For starters, I've driven one and know what it should feel like. Have you? I didn't think so. Secondly, anyone calling a lamborghini a "light" supercar knows about as much about cars as I know about nuclear physics. I swear to god, every time someone points out a fault in this game, you fanboys come out of the woodwork to defend it like someone just insulted your first born child. I would've expected more from a moderator...

 

[StogyBear]

I don't know about the LP640 but the superveloce i drove in the license test was fun as hell. I cant wait to get it I'm too broke right now lol

OP try to turn traction control to 2 or 3. There's nothing wrong with that some cars are just too twitchy to control on your own. Also don't slam on the brakes. Take about half a second for the brake pedal to travel from not pressed to fully pressed. This way the car is a lot more stable under heavy braking. It's what I did in that one license test with the superveloce.

 

[CoolColJ]

My biggest irk with the Super Veloce is how twitchy it gets under heavy braking, especially from 6th to 2nd. I've tried stiffening up the fronts, redirecting the braking force to the rear, better tires, braking in a straight line, pumping the brakes, etc. It helps some of the times but there are times where it just goes buck wild and spins out.

Why would you have rear brake bias???!

That makes it worse, like pulling a handbrake
Try 5:2 or 5:3 to start

GT5's default 5:5 for all cars is plain wrong. Why PD couldn't use their real values is beyond me

Anyway left foot braking for mid engined cars is a must most of the time, or declutch it if you have a wheel that has the feature.
Braking weight transfer + engine braking + engine towards the back = twitchy rear

 

[Oversteerin']

He was meaning that the R8, and audi, didn't really biuld the gallardo, but instead the R8 was the one that used the gallardos platform.

The Audi is on the Gallardos base, not the other way around.

From what you wrote it seemed like you were saying that the gallardo is based on the R8.

Never said or implied that either. What I said was that they both share the same chassis, and that many regard the "baby lambo" as a more exotic version of the R8. The chassis used in the two cars was a co-developed design after audi purchased lamborghini, and because the gallardo was produced under audi's new manufacturing guidelines, the build quality is noticeable better than with the murcielago, which is still very much a typical lamborghini, a.k.a. steering wheels that aren't centered with the driver's seat, finicky electronics that work sometimes and not others, etc. But, like I said earlier, I still prefer the murci because it feels more like a true italian exotic - rattles, imperfections, and soul!

 

[MrGrado]

RL cars have dampers and camber. GT5 cars dont with standard suspension.

 

[VanderbroTT]

I tuned the murcielago with everything it would allow and it's currently at 817hp with soft and hard racing tires....as long as your not taking mediocre turns at 360km/h you should be ok with it. all you guys are upset it won't go 200km/h around a turn...it's not supposed to. what it does do is go 0 to 100km/h in like 2.5 seconds.

 

[CarreraGT]

You should drive the Lotus Elise at the Top Gear-special events.

You will have the laugh of your life....a car, well know for its unbelievable grip and drivability, let you have the drift challenge of your life.

I was going to say exactly the same thing. The Elise (most Lotuses in fact) are renowned for their grip and precision. The Elise in the Top Gear challenge is anything but

 

[CarreraGT]

Never said or implied that either. What I said was that they both share the same chassis, and that many regard the "baby lambo" as a more exotic version of the R8. The chassis used in the two cars was a co-developed design after audi purchased lamborghini, and because the gallardo was produced under audi's new manufacturing guidelines, the build quality is noticeable better than with the murcielago, which is still very much a typical lamborghini, a.k.a. steering wheels that aren't centered with the driver's seat, finicky electronics that work sometimes and not others, etc. But, like I said earlier, I still prefer the murci because it feels more like a true italian exotic - rattles, imperfections, and soul!

Also just for the record, the Murcielago was also designed and manufactured under Audi

 

[FosterG]

The LP 670 is much better, The Lotus on the top gear track goes like lightning with the right tune and tires, I am real new to GT and not the best driver by any means, but I struck gold with the '04 Elise the first time out, it was a fun car even if the course was not.

 

[MowTin]

I was going to say exactly the same thing. The Elise (most Lotuses in fact) are renowned for their grip and precision. The Elise in the Top Gear challenge is anything but

I thought it was just me. I struggled with that 111R challeng for over an hour. It's impossible to drive that car.

Same problem in Prologue. The mid engine cars have exaggerated liftoff oversteer.

You don't need to be a car expert to know that no car would drive like that in real life. It would be a death machine.

But I think the car is like that on purpose. It needs some serious tuning.

 

[Falango]

You should drive the Lotus Elise at the Top Gear-special events.

You will have the laugh of your life....a car, well know for its unbelievable grip and drivability, let you have the drift challenge of your life.

Because they put economy tires on it in the test. The Elise doesn't even come with tires that crappy.

 

[mimizone]

For instance, the Ford GT, which I have quite a bit of real-life seat time in, feels remarkably good in this game.

Would it have anything to do with the fact that Yamauchi san owns a Ford GT and drives it to work ?
(as far as I remember from a documentary on PD/GT5 some time again).

 

[acsguitar]

My biggest irk with the Super Veloce is how twitchy it gets under heavy braking, especially from 6th to 2nd. I've tried stiffening up the fronts, redirecting the braking force to the rear, better tires, braking in a straight line, pumping the brakes, etc. It helps some of the times but there are times where it just goes buck wild and spins out.

THIS.

Luckily by the time I spin out randomly I'm usually up by 10 seconds due to its insane speed. Seriously my head is like this when hitting top speed

 

[cicohipe]

All I can say is throttle control. Mid engine cars have a tendency to throttle off over steer. What is probably causing the LP640 and Elise to appear like they handle so badly, is both speed and sudden throttle lift-off.

Games don't portray speed properly, so you are most likely going mush faster than you think, and much faster than you should be for the corner.

Secondly, when you suddenly lift-off the accelerator it shifts weight forward. Generally, when you lift-off the accelerator it is to brake, so you are then massively shifting weight away from the rear and onto the front tyres. And that is why you are getting massive over steer.

Practice easing off the brake and applying accelerator at the same time, to try and minimise weight transfer. And if you tell me it doesn't work, your lying, because it works fine for me.

Yes a LP640 is a handful when your fanging it around a track, and I would expect no less.

 

[DarthTurismo]

Ok, expert. For starters, I've driven one and know what it should feel like. Have you? I didn't think so. Secondly, anyone calling a lamborghini a "light" supercar knows about as much about cars as I know about nuclear physics. I swear to god, every time someone points out a fault in this game, you fanboys come out of the woodwork to defend it like someone just insulted your first born child. I would've expected more from a moderator...

I'm a huge GT fan as u would expect but i'm not blinded by fanboyism.... hahaha.... you are correct that many of the cars are just a tad off... (or in some cases more) take the lambo murc.. or the lotus elise... doesn't matter what speed you're going... i tested the theory... approach a sharp corner/bend even at low speed (80kph) lift off and whammo... snap oversteer... 150kph plus hard into a corner loud pedal buried then lifted.. ok i can understand that... but seriously no elise or lambo is going to lose it's composure driving sedately into a corner then gently lifted the throttle... in GT5 they do... even the vitz (yaris) doesnt do that... the algorithm is out on some of the cars... take the evo x out on the track... as soon as you are on a straight even at 80kph it is wondering left to right to left to right... i suppose a real evo x does that as well? let's call a spade a spade....

 

[Grayfox]

Because a Lambo is not a race car. It is a wedge with a large motor lodged in the back. lol

the Diablo SV was more like a wedge with a motor on the back

i remember that thing from NFS4 it was gnarly to drive on celtic ruins when it was raining

 

[SavageEvil]

Someone in here has any track experience in pushing Murcielagos around a track? I'm just curious as the Murcielago is not easy to drive in the Special Events section of GT5. Maybe we should add this to the things that need to be patched, sooner or later we were going to run into cars that have bugs in them.

 

[MasterDriver]

I just read all this horse crap and I took out the chrome line murci with the stock tires (sports hard) with TCS 0 and ABS 1.

It handles fine. I either use left-foot braking in MR cars or gently depress and apply the brakes and it keeps stable. I had ZERO trouble handling this car. I just used it in the italia festival around London and Rome, both of which are hard courses for Heavy MR cars.

I use a G25 Wheel and a Chair. I was using Manual (paddle shifts) since the muric has paddles. The car felt great. A bit of understeer but thats expected in this heavy awd. I even drove it with TCS at 5 for my first outting and it understeered much more. If you jam the gas pedal your going to lose the back end with or w/o TCS, but it felt very very planted.

I don't know what you guys are talking about. The only thing I can think of is taking ABS off, is proably going to cause a problem unless your using left-foot braking, because brake pedals on these wheels aren't as analog as a real pedal. I've got accustomed to it, but whenever i use 0 abs it requires 100x's more concentration (with ANY car) much less a Heavy MR.


My Rating: Chrome Muric....Feels Great. I'd have to assume driver control issues more so then car glitch. It feels as i'd expect.

SideNote:
I just found out my Hot-headed Racer. "G.Valentin" is a Muric MASTER! This dude whips the crap outta the murc. WOOOT!

SideNote 2:
For anyone having trouble using ABS 0 and holding the backend of various cars, I recommend you drop your Brake balance from the default of (5) to (4) or (3). This allows you more range of movement when applying the brake through the pedals. You'll Thank Me.

 

[Xouved]

I had a similar experience with the Murcielago. I used the Chrome-line one and it was very hard to keep the back-end from spinning out. I then bought some Racing Soft's and the problem was solved.

It actually is quite a good car provided it's set up right.

P.S. I had ABS on 1 and Traction Control on 2-3.

 

[vfrmaverick]

There is no problem. Its an AWD car, so when the rear steps out the system will try and straighten you out, but since you countersteered now itll send you where-ever your front wheel shappen to be pointing. Simply lift off the throtle to straighten out.

 

[Pesmerga7551]

It's a crap car with street tires for sure. Doesn't seem correct to me.

 

[INSTG8R]

I had to register as I have been lurking for awhile.

The problem with the Elise at least and I suspect most of the other hairy MR cars is the spring rates are "backwards" I know it is in the Elise and I bought the 512BB as well(another one that was a little tail happy at stock) I suspected it may have been a camber issue but when I bought the Mid range Suspension for it and saw the high rear spring rates I could see what the problem was. I just bought a Gallardo the other day and just haven't done anything to it yet to check whether it is the same issue but I suspect it is.

Basically the rear spring rates are higher than fronts which is wrong. In any car including FF the front spring rates are always higher than the rears to keep the weight transfer towards the rear. This is why they are so crazy at keeping their rear ends in check.

In my Elise at least turning down the rear spring rates and raising the fronts sorted the car right out(sadly with the mid range suspension upgrade there isn't enough adjustment to totally correct it.

 

[Mr. Apex]

I had to register as I have been lurking for awhile.

The problem with the Elise at least and I suspect most of the other hairy MR cars is the spring rates are "backwards" I know it is in the Elise and I bought the 512BB as well(another one that was a little tail happy at stock) I suspected it may have been a camber issue but when I bought the Mid range Suspension for it and saw the high rear spring rates I could see what the problem was. I just bought a Gallardo the other day and just haven't done anything to it yet to check whether it is the same issue but I suspect it is.

Basically the rear spring rates are higher than fronts which is wrong. In any car including FF the front spring rates are always higher than the rears to keep the weight transfer towards the rear. This is why they are so crazy at keeping their rear ends in check.

In my Elise at least turning down the rear spring rates and raising the fronts sorted the car right out(sadly with the mid range suspension upgrade there isn't enough adjustment to totally correct it.

Welcome to GTP. The the spring rates MUST be higher in the rear because an Elise IS heavier in the rear (since it is a mid-engined car). Go check out this Lotus board to see for yourself: http://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f91/spring-rates-survey-63606/

 

[Crowood]

Yeah, realized that to. Some cars are very hard to drive on "stock" tires. You can feal a big differenz with "sport soft" tires and a great improvement with tires from the "racing" section.

Try a RUF yellowbird on stock tires, jay that reminds a bit of the elise challenge.

The murc (chrome line) on stock was: "wtf, why is that car not breaking?! It´s supposed to be a supercar!"

 

[marshy10156]

The Gallardo, on the other hand, is built under the new(ish) audi partnership, so it's basically a more exotic version of the R8, and a much better built car than the murci because of this. Despite this, I still like the murci better because it feels more like a lamborghini to me. Anyway, I'm getting off topic now. I hope that answered your question.

I don't mean to be a d*ck but the Murcielago was built during the audi partnership as well (Lambo was bought out nearly 4 years before the Murci was released)

 

[Fusion]

Yes Murci was a product of Audi ownership as well. You can even see it in the design with the fat ass like an Audi TT

Seriously though Audi played a big role in the cars design, and not just on the interior.

 

[Bigbazz]

I've done a fair bit of sim racing, and think myself pretty decent, i've also driven a fair few of the other MR high powered cars in GT5 and i can say that around a track the Murcielago is one of the hardest to drive, slowest, longest braking distances and one of the most unstable tankslappers under braking.

So many cars run circles around it.