what on earth has happened here then?

  • Thread starter Thread starter tam38gti
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Hey I don't mean to diss GT6 or anything, nor am I looking to spark a debate.... but if you're looking for engine sound accuracy and proper crash physics, FM4 is worth a look.
 
PD can only do yes or no..
No, we don't get to flip in GT5
Yes, now we get everything flipping over!
 
NixxxoN
The problem is, in GT6 the gravity is clearly lower than it should, and only PD know why.... They should fix that.

Wrong section, this is GT6 board, not FM4.
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Same thing happened in GT5 with a few cars not just in GT6, the difference is that it's worse across the board in GT6.
 
What I like about threads like this is the fact that ALWAYS and I mean 100% of the time there will at least one person trying in some way to steer away the people from criticizing the game - it's fascinating to watch in what "clever" ways the apologist will "explain" why the OP is "wrong" or simply is not (LOL!) using the game like he *should* be using - it's basically your fault that you see some short-comings.

I say we have few potential lawyers in here :lol:
 
Streeto
Oh it doesn't effect me at all, I don't join rooms with no restrictions. But, what kind of car can't handle 400hp on sports soft? Do you floor it through the corners all the time or something?

Sports soft are very grippy, no offense but I question your car control.
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i can control cars just fine. i've managed a lap time 56.916 seconds in the ford gt lm race car spec II, a fairly tail happy car, around eiger nordwand. yes, i was running race softs but this car gets those smoking quite easily. the well planted, easily controlled LCC rocket, as well on race softs, did 57.370. if i were to use sport softs i would have struggled to get under a minute in the rocket and 1:05 in the gt race car.
 
moron88
i can control cars just fine. i've managed a lap time 56.916 seconds in the ford gt lm race car spec II, a fairly tail happy car, around eiger nordwand. yes, i was running race softs but this car gets those smoking quite easily. the well planted, easily controlled LCC rocket, as well on race softs, did 57.370. if i were to use sport softs i would have struggled to get under a minute in the rocket and 1:05 in the gt race car.
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Those are race cars, they're designed for slicks so I have no problem with that.

Although, the only way I can see you lighting those tires up is full lock with your foot down, which you shouldn't be doing. Perhaps you need to work on your throttle control?
 
Morphisor
After seeing and experiencing quite a few of these 'flying saucer' physics occasions, I think I know what the problem is.

You see, the fact that one or several wheels come off from the ground is not at all that strange - perfectly understandable in this instance as well, taking into account the massive braking power from RS tires and soft suspension.

The problem is, that once wheels come off the ground in the game, some sort of ultra-low gravity seems to take over. This is very apparent if you try to flip a bunch of cars on purpose - once they start flying and rolling it all goes way too quick, too easy.
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Maybe the "moon level" gravity kicks in once you brake too hard. :sly:
 
TurismoBad
What I like about threads like this is the fact that ALWAYS and I mean 100% of the time there will at least one person trying in some way to steer away the people from criticizing the game - it's fascinating to watch in what "clever" ways the apologist will "explain" why the OP is "wrong" or simply is not (LOL!) using the game like he *should* be using - it's basically your fault that you see some short-comings.

I say we have few potential lawyers in here :lol:
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I agree. It's funny that a car brakes and does a front flip and that is followed with criticism that the wrong tires are being used as if that matters. People can use whatever tires they want to use not to mention the OP may have set it up this way to prove a point so criticizing it is pointless. The only question is: should that have happened..answer is no so something is wrong.
 
I'm pretty sure in the right conditions, a car can be made to "stoppie", just as they can be made to "wheelie". Should it have happened in this case? Hard to know, since the tyres are an unknown quantity in real terms.


The physics are still the same GT story, though. It only makes sense when you have all wheels on the ground. The only way the "chassis" and "body" (in terms of their physical representation in the game) receive forces, appears to be through the wheels. Obviously, body-contact collisions "work", but it's actually those that highlight the shortcomings best: it's basically only a very primitive simulation of a collection of masses all connected together and flying through 3D space.

Clearly the suspension model has been improved, but the overall physics engine still hinges around the shortcut (historical, for performance no doubt - actually quite ingenious, in a way, just a little unnecessary now) of collating all the forces through the wheels only - so e.g. aero forces are "translated" to act on the wheels (or rather, the suspension mounts).

A next step for PD would be perhaps to collate the forces on the chassis, separate out the aero, body (where distinct), drivetrain etc. forces and have them applied on the chassis in their actual locations. The problem is that that requires a sophisticated physics solver, using 'orrible numerical techniques that are a pain to balance - these things take years of tweaking, typically.

In that regard, PC sims are ahead of the game, particularly the Papyrus legacy (i.e. Dave Kaemmer and his team, now iRacing), but if PD see it as a priority (as the recent improvements might suggest), we should see similar progress for GT in the future - probably not as an update for any existing game, though. ;)


Speedster911
Hey I don't mean to diss GT6 or anything, nor am I looking to spark a debate.... but if you're looking for engine sound accuracy and proper crash physics, FM4 is worth a look.
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I prefer FM2, in terms of its sounds. And PGR4 (pure aesthetics), and iRacing (for technical reasons). :dopey:
But this isn't the thread for it...
 
Outeke
For sure there is something wrong with gravity in GT6.

Never saw a car go UP again after touching 4 wheels on the ground.

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The post roll over physics could use a little work but I really want them to keep these kinds of physics in the game. I think that first part of the crash is pretty darn realistic, but the floaty stuff afterwards doesn't look quite right. It's as if the car loses all weight when it leaves the ground. The stoppie stuff in the OP is def a bug in the physics though.
 
Streeto
There's no denying this needs to be fixed, sorry for getting off-topic.

I just wish Kaz would throw us a bone...
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I don't think it's the sort of thing that is "fixed", as such. I think it needs a total redesign from the ground up, plus lots of testing. Depending on when they start(ed), we might not even see it for GT7.

They have to make a large jump, and there's not much in the way of intermediate options, except what they're doing: improving the components (e.g. suspension) without touching the overall framework in the release builds, until they get a proper model working.

I doubt it's the kind of thing we'd get in an update, either. Although, we are still waiting for AI and aero improvements, I think. Both of those would depend on the physics framework, so perhaps there's hope. But I really wouldn't bet on it.
 
Griffith500
I don't think it's the sort of thing that is "fixed", as such. I think it needs a total redesign from the ground up, plus lots of testing. Depending on when they start(ed), we might not even see it for GT7.

They have to make a large jump, and there's not much in the way of intermediate options, except what they're doing: improving the components (e.g. suspension) without touching the overall framework in the release builds, until they get a proper model working.

I doubt it's the kind of thing we'd get in an update, either. Although, we are still waiting for AI and aero improvements, I think. Both of those would depend on the physics framework, so perhaps there's hope. But I really wouldn't bet on it.
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The SS is still a fairly high grip tyre . With soft suspension and relatively tall car with the weight transfer to the front I can see that the rear tyres could unload. It also looks like the braking occurred just after a small crest so that would introduce some rotation as well.


PepeMickey
In GT5 you could even drive the F2007 on Comfort Hards and the car would still drive on rails, that's how ridiculously grippy Sports tires are and Racing tires basically turn the game into NFS.
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That's because it has a large amount of aerodynamic downforce.
 
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I'm seriously thinking about starting a list of people to contact Sony as a group to discuss getting a refund (or partial refund) for all the people who paid full price for this game at launch. The amount of game breaking bugs and issues with GT6 is too much. Seriously too much.
 
NixxxoN
The problem is, in GT6 the gravity is clearly lower than it should, and only PD know why.... They should fix that.
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Yeah the gravity being too low already became evident at the very beginning when the video of the crab walking Nissan Leafs appeared.

But I don't think PD can simply fix the force of gravity without breaking all the other physics in the game. If they correct gravity, they're going to have to rework the rest of it too.
 
Streeto
Try using sports tires instead, I don't get why people think running slicks on a road car, especially 500pp, is a good idea.

Sports soft have plenty of grip, sports hard are fun too but if you're in a RWD car you better know how to control oversteer haha.

Honestly I don't think slicks (racing tires) should be allowed on any road car at all, the only real world situation that you see road cars using slicks is in drag racing to put down all that excessive power.

Leave the racing tires for the race cars I say!
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Oh really?

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I think it's hilarious how judgmental people are around here. Like there is only one way to play the game, your way of course, and any other way of doing things is wrong.

"Don't use racing soft tires, traction control, SRF, ABS...the X1 is so unrealistic." Just let people play the game how they want to. How does it affect you?
 
IIRC you couldn't roll over online in GT5, in A-spec it was possible like you say but it needed quite a shunt. In GT6 I've rolled a car numerous times online.
 
This reminds me of back in GT2 and GT3 when we made hybrids. Adjusting numbers in the .ini file would allow you to make the front or rear of the cars float or wheelie off the ground. Weight distribution could also be coded wrong. If this is only happening to certain cars then they might be able to adjust the down force for the specific vehicles that are having this issue. If it is for all cars, it is a much larger problem. PD fixed a lot of problems with GT5 over the years via updates so I am sure this will get resolved over time.
 
I always see Ai driven Evo 7 or 8s jump up like that on the Matterhorn track right by the underpass. I wonder if its car specific or physics general issue?
 
That was awesome :lol: First time I see someone managed do this other than the A.I. Let me guess: Racing suspension, racing soft tires and racing brakes set up at 10?

Want to avoid this? leave the stock suspension, or at least the racing soft one and use Sport Hards. This won't happen. Racing Soft tires are incredibly unrealistic when it comes to grip. Especially on a street car. Just look at all those videos of people doing wheelies on RS tires. Also, I feel that brakes above 5/5 don't give any advantage.

In my opinion, the Evo and pretty much cars like these handle terribly (at least in every GT I've tried), what you would expect from an econo car fitted with a high performance rally car engine and AWD system. But it can be fixed with some adjustments like weight ballast distribution and tampering with the center differential and YAW control. That makes them feel more loose, and subsequently much more fun to drive.

BDoggPrelude
Oh really?

I think it's hilarious how judgmental people are around here. Like there is only one way to play the game, your way of course, and any other way of doing things is wrong.

"Don't use racing soft tires, traction control, SRF, ABS...the X1 is so unrealistic." Just let people play the game how they want to. How does it affect you?
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I agree with you, although some of us are just giving suggestions on how to avoid that physics glitch.

Oh, and I highly doubt those real life tires have more grip than SH in the game.
 
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To see how much the gravity is messed up, just get a powerful car and go flat out at Matterhorn Riffelsee, after the start/finish line, theres the uphill/downhill part where you can do a huge jump.
 

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