Where did PD go Wrong?

[Tornado]

I'm curious how Sony keeping their wholesale price the same is reconcilable with the already tenuous claim that Sony reached their break even point so the price went down.

 

[Ignition]

GT6 was what GT5 should have been, but it was released a couple years too late.

 

[starknight97]

GT6 was what GT5 should have been, but it was released a couple years too late.

Problem is GT6 isn't what GT6 should have been.

 

[ITCC_Andrew]

In my opinion, GT6 is an excellent game with the wrong servers. It's great, but we really need better servers. I'm pretty sure 99% of people can connect to each other on Call of Duty games, Battlefield (and the lag probably stems from having an absurd amount of players on an absurdly sized map) and so on...



So why can't we just have the better servers which will make this game fun again? Battling with connections all of the time doesn't make the game fun. It was obviously intended to be 90% online, since the career mode is so easy. I'm 300 km. away from Platinum, so..

 

[pyrates]

In my opinion, GT6 is an excellent game with the wrong servers. It's great, but we really need better servers. I'm pretty sure 99% of people can connect to each other on Call of Duty games, Battlefield (and the lag probably stems from having an absurd amount of players on an absurdly sized map) and so on...

So why can't we just have the better servers which will make this game fun again? Battling with connections all of the time doesn't make the game fun. It was obviously intended to be 90% online, since the career mode is so easy. I'm 300 km. away from Platinum, so..

Which one is it? Great or too easy? It was not intended to be a 90% online game. It was never advertised as such. The very very basic online functions also suggest that it is still more of an afterthought than a well out online mode like you would expect in a game with a 90% online focus.

 

[Ignition]

Problem is GT6 isn't what GT6 should have been.

I don't understand this reply because you're basically reiterating my same point.

 

[ITCC_Andrew]

Which one is it? Great or too easy? It was not intended to be a 90% online game. It was never advertised as such. The very very basic online functions also suggest that it is still more of an afterthought than a well out online mode like you would expect in a game with a 90% online focus.

Given that I run a racing series, I quite like the amount of control the lobby settings gives me. Surely you don't think that the online mode is an "afterthought," while I think that the game's major focus was online. Kaz/PD did mention online a lot in the press releases before the game release.

 

[pyrates]

Given that I run a racing series, I quite like the amount of control the lobby settings gives me. Surely you don't think that the online mode is an "afterthought," while I think that the game's major focus was online. Kaz/PD did mention online a lot in the press releases before the game release.

It works fine when you take the time to organize series on a board like GTP, sure. For instance, if you are not that involved in a community and want to race online it is rather a major PITA to find a lobby that suits you.

 

[ITCC_Andrew]

It works fine when you take the time to organize series on a board like GTP, sure. For instance, if you are not that involved in a community and want to race online it is rather a major PITA to find a lobby that suits you.

People race in random lobbies? That's funny. I didn't realize people were willing to waste their time like that. In saying that, I guess I agree with you in that regard, but... it's great for my chosen usage of it. It's only as much fun as you make it. If you want to dislike it, you will.

 

[pyrates]

People race in random lobbies? That's funny. I didn't realize people were willing to waste their time like that. In saying that, I guess I agree with you in that regard, but... it's great for my chosen usage of it. It's only as much fun as you make it. If you want to dislike it, you will.

Yeah some people do that. And that's the point. Right now it really is a huge waste of time as the game doesn't give you the tools to make it less of a pain. That's what I mean with the online mode being an afterthought. It is in terms of features to go out and race online without the need to self organize.

 

[ITCC_Andrew]

Yeah some people do that. And that's the point. Right now it really is a huge waste of time as the game doesn't give you the tools to make it less of a pain. That's what I mean with the online mode being an afterthought. It is in terms of features to go out and race online without the need to self organize.

Fair enough, but I mean - outside of drag racing, drifting and cops/robbers (or whatever they call it now) - rather decent.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Given that I run a racing series, I quite like the amount of control the lobby settings gives me. Surely you don't think that the online mode is an "afterthought," while I think that the game's major focus was online. Kaz/PD did mention online a lot in the press releases before the game release.

I also agree the online portion of the game is poor at best. It gives the bare minimum to hosts to organize race series or random events and that's it. As a whole package serving the many types of people that use or would use online, it's actually quite awful.

 

[ITCC_Andrew]

Fair enough, but I mean - outside of drag racing, drifting and cops/robbers (or whatever they call it now) - rather decent.

I also agree the online portion of the game is poor at best. It gives the bare minimum to hosts to organize race series or random events and that's it. As a whole package serving the many types of people that use or would use online, it's actually quite awful.

And we're all agreed. 👍

 

[HKS racer]

GT6 was what GT5 should have been, but it was released a couple years too late.

I don't think so. GT6 like GT5 is an unfinished game, with poor, frustrating game design leading to yet another inconsistent/illogical/mediocre use of the quality content they made.

PD should just make premium cars, tracks, shaders, photomode locations and traliers. All the rest they try to do is garbage, more or less. And no, it's not only Sony's fault. I guarantee no one at Sony headquarters forced Kaz to make one of his 3d artist building a moon rover.

Kaz had "Visions". Hmm... either he smoke too many cigarettes or he doesn't smoke only that.

Would need an anti-doping test!

 

[ITCC_Andrew]

I guarantee no one at Sony headquarters forced Kaz to make one of his 3d artist building a moon rover.

In fairness, he did say that it was just a simple matter of inputting some different gravitational variables, modelling the surface of the moon (which is just a few rocks) and one extra car. What we had before hand (the night time sky had all of the stars already, etc.) was good enough to make him say "it's probably just worth it to add the moon."


And, driving around Bathurst in the middle of the night with the stars gleaming down on you as they do is simply an awesome feeling.

 

[HKS racer]

In fairness, he did say that it was just a simple matter of inputting some different gravitational variables, modelling the surface of the moon (which is just a few rocks) and one extra car. What we had before hand (the night time sky had all of the stars already, etc.) was good enough to make him say "it's probably just worth it to add the moon."

In fairness, option to select opponents was hidden in GT5 secret menu. I bet GT6 is no different. This guy tends to hide common sense features, maybe he think to be special doing so.

 

[Ignition]

I don't think so. GT6 like GT5 is an unfinished game, with poor, frustrating game design leading to yet another inconsistent/illogical/mediocre use of the quality content they made.

PD should just make premium cars, tracks, shaders, photomode locations and traliers. All the rest they try to do is garbage, more or less

Your last part confuses me because hasn't the near majority of cars and tracks produced for GT5 and GT6 been premium content? Obviously aside from the odd baffling exception here and there (Bugatti Veyron). It's not like creating standard quality features/content has or is a priority; especially for GT6.

Even removing the standard quality features and content, GT6 would still be a more feature rich game than the majority of racers out there (for Gran Turismo 7 though, they 100% need to scrap anything standard and go premium for everything).

I personally would not go close to saying the game is unfinished, just poorly executed. The content and quality is there, but the execution is poor like you said.

 

[jimipitbull]

I'm curious how Sony keeping their wholesale price the same is reconcilable with the already tenuous claim that Sony reached their break even point so the price went down.

Where did I say Sony reached it's break even point?

Retailers have break even points as well.

For those unaware, retailer buys x amount at a wholesale price. Once they sell y amount of copies at $z they reach a break even point. The remaining stock is profit, regardless of how much they sell it for.

 

[Tornado]

A retailer meeting a break even point is not "selling a game for less than they bought it." Plus the fact that you've mentioned Sony multiple times in reference to the idea, making it clear you aren't talking about retailers. Plus the entire concept of them lowering prices on a game (but only this game, apparently, since GTA V released earlier and still costs more) if it was still selling well at the $60 price point shows a comical lack of understanding of economics.


You can take your pick, but it's moot since it's no mystery how you would respond anyway.

 

[jimipitbull]

A retailer meeting a break even point is not "selling a game for less than they bought it." Plus the fact that you mentioned Sony multiple times in reference to the idea. Plus the entire concept of them lowering prices on a game (but only this game, apparently, since GTA V released earlier and still costs more) if it was still selling at the $60 price point shows a comical lack of understanding of economics.

Here you go making stuff up again. Try reading my above post again

 

[Tornado]

Here you go making stuff up again. Try reading my above post again

Here's a post by you on the subject:

Many products are reduced in price once certain sales targets are reached. It may have reached the break even point, so dropping price to increase sales can become more profitable.

Here's a post in that same discussion where you defended your stance, and made it clear that you were talking about Sony reaching a break even point:

Not necessarily, there are many reasons why a product can be reduced in price. 2 million physical sales may have been the break even point. Units are moving, to the tune of 40,000+ per week. (as per VGCharts, rounded down)

Here's a post where you did the same thing in this thread:

It's not evidence, so it can't be the best evidence we have.

Sony aren't giving it away for free.

Products are often discounted once the break even point is reached. Increasing sales by reducing cost can be more profitable.

Anything else?

 

[jimipitbull]

Here's a post by you on the subject:

Here's a post in that same discussion where you defended your stance, and made it clear that you were talking about Sony reaching a break even point:



Here's a post where you did the same thing in this thread:

Anything else?

Here's a post where I explain retail/wholesale/break even/profit. You seem to have missed it.

For those unaware, retailer buys x amount at a wholesale price. Once they sell y amount of copies at $z they reach a break even point. The remaining stock is profit, regardless of how much they sell it for.

 

[Tornado]

That's nice. Why isn't GTA V, which undoubtedly has sold far better than GT6 could ever have dreamed of before GT6 even released, cheaper than GT6?

 

[jimipitbull]

That's nice. Why isn't GTA V, which undoubtedly has sold far better than GT6 could ever have dreamed of before GT6 even released, cheaper than GT6?

I don't know, don't care. Possibly a higher break even point.

This thread is not about GTA V

 

[Tornado]

I don't know, don't care. Possibly a higher break even point.

Right. Has nothing to do with the fact that GTA V set basically every sales records possible and sold more in one region in one month than GT6 is "estimated" to have sold total in 3 months; and thus retailers can continue pricing it at ~$50 because people continue to buy it at that price.

It's instead all because retailers found it in their hearts and worked together to slash the price on GT6 down to ~$35 once they all had made what they decided as "enough" money.

This thread is not about GTA V

 

[Tenacious D]

Tor, you seem to derail an awful lot of threads making sure you hit last. Of course jimi, you're helping. Erm... maybe I'm helping too, seeing as I meant to run off ten minutes ago...

 

[gbypoons]

I don't know

Exactly!

 

[Johnnypenso]

Tor, you seem to derail an awful lot of threads making sure you hit last. Of course jimi, you're helping. Erm... maybe I'm helping too, seeing as I meant to run off ten minutes ago...

Correcting an inaccuracy or fallacy doesn't derail a thread.

 

[Ghoa$t]

I think jimi is going into the light. Could someone please stop him before its too late? Don't go into the jimi.

 

[HKS racer]

You can't see it you can't feel it you can't tuch it..
but..
they call it...
Update 1.05
Ladies & Gentlemen.