Where does Gran Turismo Sport stand in the order of racing titles? (on realism and difficulty).

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo Sport' started by Crazy Taylor, Jul 16, 2018.

  1. Crazy Taylor

    Crazy Taylor

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    This got me thinking where does GTS stand in order of realism, difficulty of play (as 2 different examples) etc. For example, AC and PCars and DiRT Rally would be considered to be more realistic that GTS and Forza 7, nfs less real than GT.
    Any other ideas about this? Doesn't just have to be about circuit racing.

    TRY AND MAKE IT UNBIASED IN NOT HATING ON GAMES YOU DON'T LIKE.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2018
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  2. SPOOLMAN

    SPOOLMAN

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    Thanks to a member here who suggested changing to a softer compound for the rear tyre and harder on the front, it changed the entire feeling of the game. Cars no longer over steer like crazy and the physics feel spot on with this set up. Its a band aid affect for now but it just goes to show how much potential GT sport has if they fixed the tyre model. It would rank pretty high up there.
     
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  3. I-Runner

    I-Runner

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    Don't exchange difficulties with realism ..are not the same thing!

    More difficult many time is only more difficult ..... and nothing else.

    IR
     
  4. Crazy Taylor

    Crazy Taylor

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    May be a little misguided then. Using both as variables, one for realism, one for the game difficulty
     
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  5. VXR

    VXR

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    Yeah, if a game makes it difficult to drive when I'm quite adept at doing it with a real car, then it gets binned. Assetto Corsa on the Xbox One controller says hi.
     
  6. iFerrari

    iFerrari

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    iRacing
    rFactor 2
    Assetto Corsa
    R3E
    PCars 2
    GT Sport
    Forza

    This is my list from the most simultative to the least
     
  7. TheGeologist

    TheGeologist

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    I've only played PC2 and GTS and th differences are phenomenal. PC2 is so much more complex and difficult compared to GTS

    Never had an Xbox. Is Forza really that arcadey?
     
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  8. Crazy Taylor

    Crazy Taylor

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    Forza is on a similar level to GT. But Forza allows you to adjust difficulty to racing.
     
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  9. MikeV27

    MikeV27

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    I can only compare the games I own on this generation of consoles, but here's my list.

    AC
    Pcars 1 & 2
    Dirt Rally
    F1
    GT Sport
    Forza 5 & 6
     
  10. Downhill Dino

    Downhill Dino Premium

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    I tried Assetto Corsa on PS4 thanks to PS Now, probably one of the worst racing game experiences I've had with a controller.
     
  11. iFerrari

    iFerrari

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    It was on par with GT till Forza 4 imo, since then all cars in that game just started to slide around too much.
    PCars 2 is much more complex yeah but I tried to classify them for realism not difficulty, that game tries so hard to replicate real life that it becomes just a race car setup simultator, you need time on every car on every track to be comfortable with the driving and at that point it's not fun anymore.
     
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  12. KK78

    KK78

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    Of those I've played this gen, I'd put them in this order of realism with a mark out of 10 for difficulty

    Assetto Corsa 7/10
    Project Cars 1 & 2 6/10
    Dirt Rally 8/10
    GT Sport 4/10
    WRC 2017 5/10
    Forza series 2/10
    DriveClub 3/10
    Dirt 4 2/10
    Forza Horizon series 1/10
    NFS 1/10
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2018
  13. TheGeologist

    TheGeologist

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    Yeah PC2 was beyond frustrating. I would wreck constantly with my T150. Every time I hit the breaks, the wheel would shake like mad and I would usually crash. No matter what I did, I couldn't fix it.

    I abandoned the game once I got GTS.

    I find it funny. I can't make a lap on PC2 for the life of me, but then in GTS I'm A/S with 33 sport mode wins... two very different experiences!
     
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  14. SlipZtrEm

    SlipZtrEm Administrator

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    I haven't spent enough wheel time with iRacing to feel comfortable ranking it, but my initial impressions were quite good. I'm guessing, like a lot of the titles out there, certain car/track combos work better than others.

    There's the whole issue of input devices, too. I really don't like the wheel elitism that's so prevalent in the genre, but on the other hand, I can't argue that some games are utterly transformed with one. In terms of controller optimization, Forza and GT are still the gold standards for me, which isn't surprising seeing as how they both straddle the divide between realism and accessibility best.

    So on consoles, in order of most realistic to least, IMO:
    • Assetto Corsa - Still feels so natural with a good wheel setup. a 718 Cayman S feels just like it does in the real world. The very limited environments of AC — no night, no weather — actually does it a favor in a sense, as it doesn't have to deal with the myriad variables that'd introduce. Speaking of...
    • Project CARS 2 - On consoles, it's not pretty. But some of the best sim drives I've had in the past year have been on here. One was as simple as hooning an Evo VI around in the snow to get comfy with a handbrake.
    • DiRT Rally - There are some glaring issues with the low-speed physics here, and Rally certainly flirts with the idea that difficulty equals realism. But when everything gels, this is still one of the most exhilarating drives you can have in a game.
    • Sebastien Loeb Rally EVO - Yes, really. It's the ugliest of them all, but the physics hiding underneath are fantastic. I love the feeling of weight transfer in this game.
    • Gran Turismo Sport and Forza Motorsport 7 - Both do some things better than the other, and some worse. Both have terribly simplistic tire models. GT's rally physics are laughable, but FM7 counters with magical weather-changing tires. Road cars are a weak spot in GT, while supercars and prototypes are in FM7. Forza is too slidey, but how a car feels once the rears have lost grip is oddly accurate. Both games hit what I believe is the sweet spot; any more realistic and it'd scare people away.
    • Forza Horizon 3 - The physics have become a little too simple in Horizon compared to the first game's, but they're still the best on the arcade side of the spectrum IMO. Playground Games has described them as Motorsport's with more grip, and that makes sense. There's a level of consistency that makes it easy to feel at home in any car, which can't be said about some of the others coming up...
    • Driveclub - Driveclub nails the sense of speed like nothing else. It's still to this day one of the prettiest driving games ever. I've never felt quite at home driving in this game, mostly as every car's turn-in response felt off to me, but DC earns points for not making supercars needlessly difficult to drive (looking at you, FM7 or GTS' La Ferrari).
    • The Crew 2 and Need for Speed Payback - I haven't played either enough to get to the nitty-gritty, so they're occupying the same rung for now. At this level, you don't even really get a sense of the car's basic drivetrain. The 911 GT3 RS handled consistently in TC2's demo, but not like it had an engine in the rear. Payback is much better than the oddly elastic handling in 2015, but it too is an example of a title that's more game than a representation of the car you see on the screen.
    Funnily enough, I'd actually rank something like GT3 above that bottom rung, and possibly Driveclub. As the genre has aged, the old GT games have become increasingly approachable. If it weren't for all the licensing hoops PD and Sony would have to jump through, a re-release would make an excellent complement to Sport's esport aspirations.
     
  15. Herrybo79

    Herrybo79

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    I play Assetto, PC1 & PC2, Formel 2017, Gran Turismo 1-GT Sport and Forza.
    First, only if its Difficult, doesn't mean its more simulation.

    I had the chance to drive as a Co-Pilot in a Audi LMS-8 GT4 and in the Ferrari 458 GT3 at the Nordschleife with a real Driver, was not the Ring Taxi.

    And my feeling was, that PC2 and Assetto is to Difficult to drive.
    When I talked to the other Drivers, they say also that IRacing is more difficult to race as a real car.

    What's for sure, that the Force Feedback of PC2 is amazing.
    If we talking only about Racing (Overtakes, Racefeeling) for me Gran Turismo is really great, also the Physics seems to be better as a lot of people says.

    That was my feeling when I was a Co-Pilot driver.
     
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  16. VXR

    VXR

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    Having jumped back on FM6 after GTS, I felt the car I used (M235i) was actually fairly tight on the rear end and it required a fair bit of torque to get it to unstick. Of the ones I've played, it feels most natural to me - a joypad user.
     
  17. BallPtPenTheif

    BallPtPenTheif

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    Yeah, it's pretty rickety on a controller. Without any kind of controller input smoothing, you just tap the car left and right heading into a turn just like a stiff car in GT6.

    I picked AC up and played with it for a bit and it's just excessively unplayable from the start. On the first mission you apparently have to play with the tire pressure settings just to get a car that is barely competitive. The only way to beat it is to go online and find a meta tune for that challenge. Something tells me that all of the cars and stages are that way.

    Trail braking felt similar to GT Sport but with the car being a little more twitchy as it broke in and out of traction.

    If anyone's idea of a sim is all the tuning and complexities of playing with them... then AC is clearly the best sim. If a sim, is something that simulates real world driving, then it's got quite a gap between turning it on and being playable.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2018
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  18. gtracedriver1

    gtracedriver1

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    I have played rfactor, when I used to have a PC lol. The game gfx are dated but depending on the mod and setting it is probably the best sim. Lot of racing games have used their engine and have copied their style. RBR F1 team also used advance version of rfactor if I am not mistaken. But if you playing with a controller then GTS is probably the best.
     
  19. TT92

    TT92 Premium

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    OK here goes. BTW I should add I have the Platinum Trophies for GTS, PCARS1&2, Dirt Rally and AC and only drive using a wheel so I do know these games fairly well ;-)

    Assetto Corsa is #1 for driveabilty, realism, and driving viewing position and don't forget the clutch and shifter actually works properly e.g you can actually ride the clutch. The game lacks cars and tracks and the ability to put modern tyres on old cars. The tuning is realistic too e.g you cant adjust toe or camber on a rear beam axle car. Are you reading this Kaz? ;-) Another thing to praise this game for is the audio. What great sounds some of these cars make. Wow!

    PCARS 2 is #2 especially if you like messing with weather. Great amount of cars and tracks BUT they kept messing with the tyre model as in every update they changed it and then it knocked out all you tunes! >:-( So I have no idea where it is at now as I gave up on it when GT Sport launched. This also has a shifter and clutch that actually works properly. BTW don't even get me started on their online penalty system!

    GT Sport I would rate at #3. Not very realistic as it panders more to the arcade type player with a hand controller. Th smooth graphics with a PS4 Pro on a 4K TV go a long way to helping with realism.

    PCARS 1 at #4 and I hated it and traded it on PCARS 2.

    Dirt Rally is very interesting and is a mixed bag but I would put it at #5. Yes the shifter and clutch works in this but the tarmac/bitumen tyre model and physics are just plain wrong. The game is wholly worth while just for Pykes Peak BUT the downside is you can only drive 4 cars on it :-( The older rally cars are an absolute blast where as the modern ones are just ballistic missiles with ridiculous amounts of grip.

    Drive Club. I don't really want to even talk about it as it was a fiasco from the day it was announced. I had it on pre-order for 2 years until I gave up and then Sony reneged on the free download for quite a while. So eventually I did play the free download and hated every second of it. I tried and tried to get a handle on it as the full retail version was selling very cheap but I found it just too arcady and the track scenarios were just plain fantasies.

    To sum up. I like real cars, on real world tracks with real world type physics. I hate cartoon cars that are some modeller's wet dream on fantasy tracks. I also like options of what my driving perspective is. I seems every other game besides GTS can do this. I like to have my viewpoint at the base of the windscreen so I can see the bonnet in front of me (no I do not want to sit on the roof as in GTS).

    What was great in AC was I could have this bonnet view and then mount an Android Tablet to my wheel base and set it with all the dash instrumentation with an app. Absolute heaven. This has been the most realistic view and immersive experience of all the games I have listed.

    So why do I play GTS you ask. Simple, all my friends are on it and it has the best and most stable online plus it is the prettiest by far ;-) The graphics really are superb and it is very hard going back to these other games.
     
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  20. Crazy Taylor

    Crazy Taylor

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    I did a little chart highlighting what I think.

    sketch-1531758523516.png
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2018
  21. super_gt

    super_gt

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    Where would you put LFS?just out of curiosity:)
     
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  22. Sander 001

    Sander 001

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    Yes I find PC2 not as difficult as GT Sport but PC2 feels more realistic. As far as GT3 cars
     
  23. Vader86

    Vader86

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    I've never really figured out PCars or AC, GT is more intuitive and easier to just turn on the PS4 and play it.

    AC could be a lot better, if they put some development into it just to make it more intuitive to setup.
     
  24. PrinceMG

    PrinceMG

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    Physics are good enough for its purpose in many racing games. I only enjoy playing two games: Iracing and GTS, because of the ranking (and matching) of online players. I really enjoy both the daily and FIA races in GTS because of that.

    I'm not saying GTS feels as natural as Iracing, but GTS wins because of the graphics. It makes the experience better with decent graphics.

    AC, PC and so on are also fun, but it's more fun to race equal drivers online.
     
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  25. vxr58

    vxr58

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    Tough. I suspect the games with technically the most realistic physics are actually the ones that feel the least realistic. The problem is that in real life you have many sources of feedback and far more control over the car. I love PC2 and AC but the sensation of driving doesn’t feel real to me, way too difficult to predict and control loss of traction. GT6 felt the most real to me. GTS definitely has issues with the progression of traction loss and uncontrollable oversteer.

    I think the suspension and tyre physics have been well done in recent instalments, but the handling just doesn’t feel remotely realistic, on a pad or a wheel. It’s a good franchise though, worth a try if you get the chance.

    To this day, the most enjoyable physics I’ve experienced were GT5P’s...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 17, 2018
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  26. Sven Jurgens

    Sven Jurgens Premium

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    DriveClub does have your favorite view and is a lo of fun once you get used to the weird physics. Some of my most intense adrenaline filled races have been in DriveClub:


    Totally unrealistic, heart rate 150+ bpm.

    I tried to like Project cars yet as a controller user it was a struggle from start to finish. I completed one season with all the invitationals then moved on.

    Dirt Rally is fun, especially in VR, yet sport mode wins. It's the only game I can guaranteed find a full room to race in with less than 10 minute wait time.

    For difficulty, I would say DriveClub is definitely harder than GTS (hyper cars) Some of the trophies and extended time challenges required a lot more effort than in GTS. Dirt Rally and Project cars with a controller is also much harder than GTS. Only in VR can I manage to keep the car on the road in the Pykes Peak races in Dirt Rally. I never tried Assetto Corsa since no wheel.

    As for realism, yes i can tell GTS is more realistic than DriveClub. Yet for any of the sim racers I'll have to take other's word for it. GTS is very pretty in 4K HDR, such a shame DriveClub never got a HDR update. The sun shining over wet roads right after the heavy rain lets up, so beautiful. Plus the dynamic skies in DriveClub were truly different each race. The driving physics weren't very realistic yet as a weather sim it ranks at the top!

    Hmm, I think I would have dropped to SR.B after that race in the snow, or worse :)
     
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  27. Macboyilija

    Macboyilija

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    Crazy weather model !! Just wooow !

    Got a link to that topic ?
     
  28. SPOOLMAN

    SPOOLMAN

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  29. TT92

    TT92 Premium

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    Yes, a lot of people did like DC but it just was not for me. As you admit the physics were off and I intensely disliked the lack of real world tracks or even fictional ones that resembled real world ones.

    Without trying to sound like a "wheel snob" i do not equate realism with a hand controller. To my way of thinking as soon as you use a hand controller you instantly devalue any game back to arcade type game and may as well be playing Ridge Racer or Mario Kart. Sorry, but just my opinion.

    The Rally X events were not for me online as I absolute *HATE* being the victim of some <insert swear word of choice here> who's only skill is being the dirtiest driver on the track!

    Agreed, GTS career and challenges are so easy. Also, you really should grab yourself a wheel and just see how much more immersive it really is.

    I have raced for real and rain really isn't that much fun and as such I can never understand why everyone makes such a fuss about it and wants to do it. The funny thing is I actually won some of my best races in the rain. If I ever have a choice in game I always set the weather to full sun, midday and changeability zero. I am more about the racing than watching rainbows ;-) As a side note, I just cannot comprehend the amount of aggravation wet weather would cause in GTS Sport online races. For goodness sake people can't get their braking right in the dry!!!!!!

    This why there are so many games to cater for different people's aspirations, styles, abilities and of course likes. You then have PCARS and AC that dumb down the game (no offence meant here) for hand controllers and games like NFS where it was designed around it. GTS does it quite well because it is the only one of these games where I usually cannot tell if an opponent is using a hand controller or not.

    It would be a boring old world if we all liked the same things ;-)
     
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  30. TonyJZX

    TonyJZX

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    I think GT Sport and weather is a close reflection on what we had... remember the 24 mins of Le Mans, 24 mins of Nurburgring... the changing weather in accelerated real time? That was GT6 on a console which your phone probably had better specs now.

    I'm with this guy ^^^ in that I dislike rain and night however I like the challenge and that's more important.

    IMO I think GT Sport has expanded on GT5/6 and Forza has gone the other way... Forza 7 has simplified the model from Forza 5.

    I also tried AC and PCARS2 on PC w/ an Xbox controller and you were spending more time fighting the car rather than fighting other drivers.